We Beat NCState

[lv20gt]

Shooting 40% in HS does not make you a good shooter if who you played against is mostly crap like Moses played against - he was in an extremely weak league.
I didn't see any high school film (there wasn't much available) that showed him shooting the ball with proper form or with good effect.
i simply don't think he is a good shooter. Flat out, I think he is a bad shooter, worse than Tad. I'd put him on a level with Justin Moore, maybe worse than Justin.

i love when he cuts to the basket. You have to know what you can do and not do and play to your strengths.
Every time he takes a three that is a wasted offensive possession and on a team that struggles to score you simply have to limit those.

i think you are wrong in your evaluation of him as a shooter. i don't think his form is bad because he is rushing shots. i think his form is bad because his form is bad. His form looks the same whether he has to shoot quickly or whether he has all day to shoot. Unless his shooting form is re-worked I don't think he will ever shoot over 20% from three,

How does level of competition affect open shots? Why would open shots against bad highschool teams be easier to make than open shots against ACC teams? If he shot 40% in highschool, even if they were all uncontested looks, then he's capable of making 40% here on open looks. We're not talking about why he isn't getting dunks or why he isn't getting open looks. Most of his looks have been decent shot attempts. So how does playing against ACC teams vs highschool teams make a guy a worse shooter on open looks other than something mental?

Anyways, chickenwinging a shot is a classic side effect of rushing it. The tapes he did have in highschool don't show that same problem and the % doesn't indicate an issue with form. Bad form shooters don't hit 40% even on open shots against bad teams. I really don't see why you're so adamant against the idea of him rushing his shot. He's rushing everything about his game right now, from his dribbling to his passing to his shooting. Once the game slows down for him and he starts rushing he'll start bringing is elbow in more and start making more. If it was just his shot that looked rush I might agree, but it's his entire game right now. And the experience he's getting now is invaluable in his development.

 

[OG-T]

i love when he cuts to the basket. You have to know what you can do and not do and play to your strengths.

I've looked at Moses as potential "found gold." I was hopeful he'd quickly transition, but reading between lines from Pastner, seems like Moses' basketball IQ and college-level work ethic are playing MAJOR catch up. It shows. I do think he will be a multi-threat 4 — likely by Jr year, with a jumper that needs to be respected. As for now, MY BIG COMPLAINT ABOUT MOSES is that his hands are SO WEAK. He misses so many put backs, weak hands at finishing at rim, not ready for fast passes. I remember a Lakers James Worthy interview where he said that once he hit half court, his palms were open flat like ping-pong paddles because Magic's passes would be on him so fast, there was no time to spread fingers and open hands, the ball would carom off and lead to a turnover; like being "shot ready", he was "catch ready." SOMEONE PLEASE TELL MOSES THIS!!!

 

[kg01]

Apparently the thread title needs to be changed, per Keatts/Dorn, to "Officials Beat NCState" ...

http://www.heraldsun.com/sports/college/acc/nc-state/article203068879.html

Keatts files officiating complaints after last night's game.

Doesn't really go into exactly what they're complaining about. Just generally mad, I guess.

As I've suggested, I saw a couple things I'd probably have been upset about in the game. However, each instance was a bang-bang play which I could see going uncalled.

 

[jayparr]

Just the way things translate from playing against a weak hi sch team then all of a sudden you are on the floor with better athletes, bigger athletes, and much more instinctive athletes, and much better BBIQ'S athletes. All this will carry over onto the court no matter what the player is doing whether shooting with no one nearby, shooting free throws, drives to the basket, and def. However; I will say that he has shown a glimpse or 2 of having played the game some. If he does not stop shooting it will hurt us as a team. I mean 2 for 27 that is unbelievably bad!

 

[H-Wade]

I've looked at Moses as potential "found gold." I was hopeful he'd quickly transition, but reading between lines from Pastner, seems like Moses' basketball IQ and college-level work ethic are playing MAJOR catch up. It shows. I do think he will be a multi-threat 4 — likely by Jr year, with a jumper that needs to be respected. As for now, MY BIG COMPLAINT ABOUT MOSES is that his hands are SO WEAK. He misses so many put backs, weak hands at finishing at rim, not ready for fast passes. I remember a Lakers James Worthy interview where he said that once he hit half court, his palms were open flat like ping-pong paddles because Magic's passes would be on him so fast, there was no time to spread fingers and open hands, the ball would carom off and lead to a turnover; like being "shot ready", he was "catch ready." SOMEONE PLEASE TELL MOSES THIS!!!

Yeah I've never seen so many passes bounce off of hands and go out of bounds as I did yesterday. It was weird how many times it happened, and most of the time Moses was involved though others were guilty of it, too.

 

[MiracleWhips]

Just the way things translate from playing against a weak hi sch team then all of a sudden you are on the floor with better athletes, bigger athletes, and much more instinctive athletes, and much better BBIQ'S athletes. All this will carry over onto the court no matter what the player is doing whether shooting with no one nearby, shooting free throws, drives to the basket, and def. However; I will say that he has shown a glimpse or 2 of having played the game some. If he does not stop shooting it will hurt us as a team. I mean 2 for 27 that is unbelievably bad

Yeah I've never seen so many passes bounce off of hands and go out of bounds as I did yesterday. It was weird how many times it happened, and most of the time Moses was involved though others were guilty of it, too.

lots of bad passes from guards, they were throwing passes in the knees of our bigs. Do they not know how to throw oops?

 

[RamblinRed]

How does level of competition affect open shots? Why would open shots against bad highschool teams be easier to make than open shots against ACC teams? If he shot 40% in highschool, even if they were all uncontested looks, then he's capable of making 40% here on open looks. We're not talking about why he isn't getting dunks or why he isn't getting open looks. Most of his looks have been decent shot attempts. So how does playing against ACC teams vs highschool teams make a guy a worse shooter on open looks other than something mental?

Anyways, chickenwinging a shot is a classic side effect of rushing it. The tapes he did have in highschool don't show that same problem and the % doesn't indicate an issue with form. Bad form shooters don't hit 40% even on open shots against bad teams. I really don't see why you're so adamant against the idea of him rushing his shot. He's rushing everything about his game right now, from his dribbling to his passing to his shooting. Once the game slows down for him and he starts rushing he'll start bringing is elbow in more and start making more. If it was just his shot that looked rush I might agree, but it's his entire game right now. And the experience he's getting now is invaluable in his development.

it affects it because if the guys you play against at a different level are slower and smaller it is much easier to get a an open shot and have more time to take it.
He is definitely rushing his game, i'd agree 100% with that - but i think he has a form issue with his jumper that will have to be changed for him ever to be a legit shooter and you do not.
When i watch him in warmups he uses the same 'chickenwing' motion that he does during a game. It isn't a matter of him rushing his shots in a game - imo it is a flaw in his shooting routine and he has no chance of becoming even a decent shooter unless he fixes it. The game slowing down for him will not make his shooting form better, if it did you would see a different form in practice or warmups.

There are plenty of HS shooters who never became good college shooters because they were not able to adjust their shooting motion to handle playing against college level athletes and defenses. so if you are shooting 40% against weak competition it suggests you will have a larger curve to get up to be a solid shooter.

 

[Gold1]

Love this

Ron stfu

 

[Gtbowhunter90]

Okay well, if we don't want Moses shooting the ball, lets feed him steak and PBJ sandwiches this offseason and see what he can do inside? His physicality is there. I say why not.. I agree that his whiffed a few shots last night, but I'm willing to bet we see a new Moses next year. He still has a ton of room to grow into his body!

 

[MiracleWhips]

Ron stfu

no thanks\.

Okay well, if we don't want Moses shooting the ball, lets feed him steak and PBJ sandwiches this offseason and see what he can do inside? His physicality is there. I say why not.. I agree that his whiffed a few shots last night, but I'm willing to bet we see a new Moses next year. He still has a ton of room to grow into his body!

**** no, his frame isn't meant for that

 

[Gtbowhunter90]

no thanks\.

**** no, his frame isn't meant for that

Your opinion isn't wanted on this board.

 

[g0lftime]

Some interesting aspects of the game. Cole was originally committed to UNC Wilmington when Keatts was coaching and before he took the State job. Wright is from Raleigh and his HS is just a few miles from the State campus. State has one player who was recruited and enrolled in classes at Ohio State this past summer but transferred this fall when their coach was fired. He was originally turned down by the NCAA to play this year but they petitioned 2x and they have waivered him to play this season although not allowed according to NCAA. They got a big break there. State has a starting player that was arrested earlier this season back home for assault and missed several games (I think 5) but charges magically got dropped. That is a strange mix of players on their team with different situations. I also think their big guy had some eligibility problems last year and had to sit a while before the NCAA cleared him to play in the USA. They actually have a very good team and I am a little surprised we beat them. I am really glad for our guys that they did beat a good team. They have had a tough year.
The reason Keatts filed a grievance with the refs has to do with a technical foul. He claimed that he has no idea what it was for. One of TV Teddy's finest hours.

 

[SecretAgentBuzz]

Just finished watching the game. Our guys have certainly been playing better lately, and it finally paid off with a win. Very proud of them for putting in the effort and not giving up--especially being behind most of the game. There was a few times I thought NCState might run away with it, but we fought back. JoshO is so smooth--I really wish he would look to take over. Jackson and Lammers are finally playing like seniors--am I allowed to say I like Jackson at PG? That's so strange because he is normally a TO machine, but he has stepped up his game, for sure. Cole and Moses play like freshmen, but do enough good things to keep running them out there, and I like Alston's stability, defense, and occasional drive to the basket (oh--and a big 3!). GREAT game for the Jackets. We scored 47 points in the second half! 47!

Let's keep it going, Jackets, and get some momentum going into the ACC Tourney! Go Jackets!

 

[lauraee]

Nc state are whiny as hell

Yes & their coach & idiot AD lodged a formal complaint.

 

[Techster]

They actually have a very good team and I am a little surprised we beat them. I am really glad for our guys that they did beat a good team. They have had a tough year.

GT has good players, and we should have been a better team than what our record is. Unfortunately, the snowball got rolling the wrong way this season.

Shoulda, woulda, coulda...

 

[Gold1]

no thanks\.

**** no, his frame isn't meant for that

Your mugshot ain't a good look

 

[majorQ9]

Is there a replay online yet? I want to go back and look at the techs they received

 

[H-Wade]

GT has good players, and we should have been a better team than what our record is. Unfortunately, the snowball got rolling the wrong way this season.

Shoulda, woulda, coulda...

This season has reminded me of our football season. We deserved every single game that we won - didn't have any fluke plays or get lucky at the end or anything. The worst you could say about any of our wins in either sport was the refs helped us a bit last night, and we had a buzzer beater against NW.

Contrast that with some of the games we gave away.. it's incredible.

Football - Tenn, Miami, UVA, etc...
Basketball - Grambling, Wofford, Clemson X2, etc...

Both teams were definitely better then the record indicates.

 

[Gold1]

Is there a replay online yet? I want to go back and look at the techs they received

Should be on watch ESPN

 

[g0lftime]

I totally agree that this team is much better than our record. Just a bunch of unfortunate injuries and we had trouble early with how to replace Q from last year. TJ and Okogie didn't help with their little trip either. Cole and Wright were not ready early in the season and forced to try to play Ben out of his natural position. AD had some good moments but he tended to want to try to make a play when the ball came inside so teams starting to double down on him and he was taking some tough shots plus we weren't getting any fouls called down low either. TJ is pretty good at the point. He can create havoc in the lane and he is strong. His biggest weakness is inconsistent shooting from outside. He is not very good at free throw shooting and that can hurt in a tight game late when teams start fouling if they are behind. PG is usually the guy with the ball in those situations. Jose is going to be good at getting to line and making them late. I will really miss TJ and Ben next year. TJ has been willing to do whatever the coaches have asked him to do to help the team. Just a great team player.