Possible D Staff

[Augusta_Jacket]

I wouldn't discount Cutcliffe's accomplishments at Duke. Duke was a disaster zone when Cutcliffe took over, and now he's gotten them to a point they're making Bowl games regularly, and they're recruiting well. Duke was nowhere near the situation CPJ walked into.

David Shaw is in his 7th season at Stanford taking over for Jim Harbaugh. He's doing a really good job there.

Pat Fitzgerald at Northwestern has a done a REALLY good job there. He hasn't won a B1G championship, but he's also not playing with a full deck of cards just like GT.

Just running names off the top of my head without really digging into it...

My only knock on Cutcliffe is the OOC SoS. He doesn't normally schedule tough out of conference, and I really don't blame him, all things considered. Shaw, and Harbaugh before him, benefit from Stanfords decision to pour money into the program. It's amazing what you can do when you properly fund a program. Fitzgerald has been great for NW. I could definitely see him doing even better elsewhere.

 

[Techster]

My only knock on Cutcliffe is the OOC SoS. He doesn't normally schedule tough out of conference, and I really don't blame him, all things considered. Shaw, and Harbaugh before him, benefit from Stanfords decision to pour money into the program. It's amazing what you can do when you properly fund a program. Fitzgerald has been great for NW. I could definitely see him doing even better elsewhere.

Stanford has endowments for their coaches. So that means donors are funding their coaches salaries and a lot of the coaching money goes elsewhere in the program. That's just a brilliant by Stanford donors....THAT is how you apply your prestigious degree! lol

Also, not many people realize this, but Phil Knight, yup, the same Nike Phil Knight of Oregon, is also a graduate of Stanford (MBA). He donates just as much money to Stanford as he does to Oregon.

We need a Phil Knight....and donors willing to endow coaching positions...

 

[dressedcheeseside]

I agree with your statement as a whole but would add that others that have the fruits of the factory schools ( that could out perform their recruiting) would never come here with one hand tied behind their back. Atl produced a legit list as most people on here act like Paul is the only answer. I defend PJ because he wants to be here and question how many that could do it here would do it here. Everyone in the sports media love Saban and Meyer. Those two would only consider around 5 or less programs and I suggest that many many others would never consider Tech . In addition to not considering coming here, they would consider it as career suicide. I dont have any answers to the problems that we face but trust that our new coordinator will be an improvement over Ted and that PJ will stay restless. PJ can be called many things but passive is not one of them. This message was a response to Augusta Jacket.

Click the “reply” button when responding to a specific poster next time.

 

[jacketup]

But my point is CPJ is one of the best in the business. There’s a reason he’s doing something at GT that most other coaches haven’t even done at other schools.

47-46 FBS record over the last 8 years and he is "one of the best in the business" ? One AP top 25 team in those 8 years. Losing records in 2 of the 8 years, and losing records vs. FBS in 5 of the 8 years.

Is Paul Johnson your dad? He hasn't come close to O'Leary's five consecutive years of AP top 25 finishes. The only reason his record isn't 47-47 is a hurricane.

One of the best in the business? At the FCS level, I agree with you. At the P5 level he is solidly mediocre, and his record proves it. 47-46. No debate.

People who are happy with Johnson either don't think Tech can do any better than occasionally having a good team to go along with a bunch of bad to mediocre teams, or they are satisfied with mediocrity. Such people don't think much of Tech. They have that in common with Georgia fans.

In July of 1989 Bobby Ross said his goal was to win a national championship. Tech fans scoffed. Same reasons--academics, blah blah. Bobby Ross believed. Why can't Tech fans? What is wrong with you people?

 

[ATL1]

47-46 FBS record over the last 8 years and he is "one of the best in the business" ? One AP top 25 team in those 8 years. Losing records in 2 of the 8 years, and losing records vs. FBS in 5 of the 8 years.

Is Paul Johnson your dad? He hasn't come close to O'Leary's five consecutive years of AP top 25 finishes. The only reason his record isn't 47-47 is a hurricane.

One of the best in the business? At the FCS level, I agree with you. At the P5 level he is solidly mediocre, and his record proves it. 47-46. No debate.

People who are happy with Johnson either don't think Tech can do any better than occasionally having a good team to go along with a bunch of bad to mediocre teams, or they are satisfied with mediocrity. Such people don't think much of Tech. They have that in common with Georgia fans.

In July of 1989 Bobby Ross said his goal was to win a national championship. Tech fans scoffed. Same reasons--academics, blah blah. Bobby Ross believed. Why can't Tech fans? What is wrong with you people?

I'm with you. You got to have belief and want to.

 

[Techster]

I'm with you. You got to have belief and want to.

I'm playing the long game here. GT will one day get the right guy who knows how to sell all the benefits of GT and Atlanta, and has a system that not only wins, but is attractive to fans and recruits.

Hopefully, when that happens, the same people who keep bringing up APR, Calculus, and STEM will be the first in line to admit they should have demanded more. It really bothers me when I'm on campus and I walk around the surrounding Midtown area that our fans act like GT has nothing to offer SAs but impossible course loads and class full of nerds.

GT CAN have the best of both worlds.

 

[tech_wreck47]

I wouldn't discount Cutcliffe's accomplishments at Duke. Duke was a disaster zone when Cutcliffe took over, and now he's gotten them to a point they're making Bowl games regularly, and they're recruiting well. Duke was nowhere near the situation CPJ walked into.

David Shaw is in his 7th season at Stanford taking over for Jim Harbaugh. He's doing a really good job there.

Pat Fitzgerald at Northwestern has a done a REALLY good job there. He hasn't won a B1G championship, but he's also not playing with a full deck of cards just like GT.

Just running names off the top of my head without really digging into it...

I’m not discrediting cutcliffe, I was just saying he hasn’t done as well as CPJ.

Also David Shaw has way better recruiting classes, my argument was, what coach has done as well with recruiting classes in the 40’s like GT?

I’m not doubting there are other coaches with “lesser” players doing well. My point is just to say CPJ is a very good coach and not many if any have had the success of him with what he has to deal with at GT. This argument is more to those who think CPJ is not a good coach. I’m just showing proof of the fact that he is.

 

[tech_wreck47]

47-46 FBS record over the last 8 years and he is "one of the best in the business" ? One AP top 25 team in those 8 years. Losing records in 2 of the 8 years, and losing records vs. FBS in 5 of the 8 years.

Is Paul Johnson your dad? He hasn't come close to O'Leary's five consecutive years of AP top 25 finishes. The only reason his record isn't 47-47 is a hurricane.

One of the best in the business? At the FCS level, I agree with you. At the P5 level he is solidly mediocre, and his record proves it. 47-46. No debate.

People who are happy with Johnson either don't think Tech can do any better than occasionally having a good team to go along with a bunch of bad to mediocre teams, or they are satisfied with mediocrity. Such people don't think much of Tech. They have that in common with Georgia fans.

In July of 1989 Bobby Ross said his goal was to win a national championship. Tech fans scoffed. Same reasons--academics, blah blah. Bobby Ross believed. Why can't Tech fans? What is wrong with you people?

Best in the business for recruiting in the 40’s and other restraints he has. Sorry if I didn’t make that clear.

And yea O’Leary coached when the ACC was at its high, when Duke was making acccg appearances lol. That’s apples to oranges.

And I’m happy with CPJ because I understand football and understand the issue goes above CPJ which I can prove.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Stanford has endowments for their coaches. So that means donors are funding their coaches salaries and a lot of the coaching money goes elsewhere in the program. That's just a brilliant by Stanford donors....THAT is how you apply your prestigious degree! lol

Also, not many people realize this, but Phil Knight, yup, the same Nike Phil Knight of Oregon, is also a graduate of Stanford (MBA). He donates just as much money to Stanford as he does to Oregon.

We need a Phil Knight....and donors willing to endow coaching positions...

I'm playing the long game here. GT will one day get the right guy who knows how to sell all the benefits of GT and Atlanta, and has a system that not only wins, but is attractive to fans and recruits.

We need the items in your first post to happen so that the second can become a reality. My contention isn't ONLY academics, it's that without the funding to drive success, we will only be making periodic runs when lightning strikes. We can overcome the academic hurdles, but if you look at the schools who have consistently, it's because they funded their program to compete with the big boys.

 

[Techster]

We need the items in your first post to happen so that the second can become a reality. My contention isn't ONLY academics, it's that without the funding to drive success, we will only be making periodic runs when lightning strikes. We can overcome the academic hurdles, but if you look at the schools who have consistently, it's because they funded their program to compete with the big boys.

IMO, the money is there. GT just needs a better way of asking for it, or give donors a better reason to give it. If you don't believe me: Brock Indoor Facility, McCamish Paviillion, Zelnak Basketball Center, etc. GT gets the money when it needs to. In fact, GT got an indoor facility in Atlanta before UGA got one out in the cow paddies.

Posters more tied into the program have alluded to the fact that GT the school works against GT the Athletics Dept in terms of raising funds. If that's the case, GT the school is only hurting itself.

 

[croberts]

47-46 FBS record over the last 8 years and he is "one of the best in the business" ? One AP top 25 team in those 8 years. Losing records in 2 of the 8 years, and losing records vs. FBS in 5 of the 8 years.

Is Paul Johnson your dad? He hasn't come close to O'Leary's five consecutive years of AP top 25 finishes. The only reason his record isn't 47-47 is a hurricane.

One of the best in the business? At the FCS level, I agree with you. At the P5 level he is solidly mediocre, and his record proves it. 47-46. No debate.

People who are happy with Johnson either don't think Tech can do any better than occasionally having a good team to go along with a bunch of bad to mediocre teams, or they are satisfied with mediocrity. Such people don't think much of Tech. They have that in common with Georgia fans.

In July of 1989 Bobby Ross said his goal was to win a national championship. Tech fans scoffed. Same reasons--academics, blah blah. Bobby Ross believed. Why can't Tech fans? What is wrong with you people?

Yes and both coaches you mentioned had problems with the Hill or GT limitations and moved to greener pastures. They are not unique in that regard as one of our own (Bill Curry) also left to go to his mentors hated rival to have a shot at playing on a level playing field. Please,please continue your posts! This reminds me of switching back and forth from one cable news network to the next. Each side telling half the truth but both coming up with the opposite conclusions. Maybe people would take you seriously if you would leave out the YOUR DADDY and Ga BS part. Maybe not.

 

[JDjacket]

Stanford has endowments for their coaches. So that means donors are funding their coaches salaries and a lot of the coaching money goes elsewhere in the program. That's just a brilliant by Stanford donors....THAT is how you apply your prestigious degree! lol

Also, not many people realize this, but Phil Knight, yup, the same Nike Phil Knight of Oregon, is also a graduate of Stanford (MBA). He donates just as much money to Stanford as he does to Oregon.

We need a Phil Knight....and donors willing to endow coaching positions...

I actually did some digging into this last year because I was reading about Phil Knight. From what I gathered he does donate to both schools, but his donations to Oregon are directly tied to the athletics program while his massive donations to Stanford are earmarked for Academics and the business school. Maybe he gives general donations that are still a lot to athletics, but his major donations are to Academics. I thought that has to suck for a fan of Stanford sports that the same rich guy building Oregon athletics isn't building yours. I guess by getting donations for academics, stanford can shift more money to athletics if they want, so in a way he's still helping.

 

[croberts]

I'm playing the long game here. GT will one day get the right guy who knows how to sell all the benefits of GT and Atlanta, and has a system that not only wins, but is attractive to fans and recruits.

Hopefully, when that happens, the same people who keep bringing up APR, Calculus, and STEM will be the first in line to admit they should have demanded more. It really bothers me when I'm on campus and I walk around the surrounding Midtown area that our fans act like GT has nothing to offer SAs but impossible course loads and class full of nerds.

GT CAN have the best of both worlds.

I want to believe this with all my heart. I know PJs system is not the only one that can work here. I also know that if someone was all those things, everyone including Texas A&M would be willing to pay him 7.5m a year after a 5 year ride in Atlanta. I never like to bring up limitations but I will never act like they have no bearing on our results. We seem to have only two camps on this site. Those that think they have very little impact or no impact and those that think they cant be overcome. I ride that fence, often bothered by both sides of the argument. I have pulled for Dodd and every coach since. Every hire (including Lewis ) was a good hire when made. His name is often left out of discussions but is often looked at as the low water mark. We all know that OLeary applied for the job but lost out to then National Coach of the Year BL. Point is, I'm sure our next head coach hire will be a good one on paper. Until that time, I'm hoping that Woody will be the answer for our unique head coach who coaches at a very unique Institution.

 

[steebu]

FWIW, which isn't very much, CJT was a press box guy, so that's not a necessary condition for a good defense at GT. I don't care one way or another if the DC is on the field. Most probably aren't; most OC's either. Venables and Foster are on the field though, so there you go.

I was about to say this.

Venables and Foster are on the field. Mel Tucker is on the field. Kirby was on the field when he was Saban's DC. KnuckleTurd (Saban's current DC) is on the field.

Mike Stoops coaches from the box. His defenses get torched regularly for 50-burgers by Okie State, Baylor, and West Virginia.

There's no correlation. There really isn't. But anecdoctal evidence makes me insist that I'd rather have our coordinators on the ground grabbing jerseys and looking kids in the eyes. I spent a lot of time watching old-school Joe Lee Dunn develop a blitizing 3-3-5 defense with a bunch of undersized kids to great success. He said he preferred to be on the field because it was a "feel" thing.

At this point, tho, I don't care where the DC is - if he's watching the broadcast from his house while dropping a deuce but calling a heck of a game I'd be happy.

 

[Lavoisier]

Well analysts/shadow staff aren't allowed on the field so the bigger teams will have the 3-4 guys that spent the previous 12 months prepping for the opponent in the press box signaling to the actual position coach what to do on defense. And then that's relayed to the DC. If you don't have multiple people dedicated to game plan for a single team then sometimes it's better to have the DC up there so he can huddle with his guys better.

 

[SidewalkJacket]

47-46 FBS record over the last 8 years and he is "one of the best in the business" ? One AP top 25 team in those 8 years. Losing records in 2 of the 8 years, and losing records vs. FBS in 5 of the 8 years.

Is Paul Johnson your dad? He hasn't come close to O'Leary's five consecutive years of AP top 25 finishes. The only reason his record isn't 47-47 is a hurricane.

One of the best in the business? At the FCS level, I agree with you. At the P5 level he is solidly mediocre, and his record proves it. 47-46. No debate.

People who are happy with Johnson either don't think Tech can do any better than occasionally having a good team to go along with a bunch of bad to mediocre teams, or they are satisfied with mediocrity. Such people don't think much of Tech. They have that in common with Georgia fans.

In July of 1989 Bobby Ross said his goal was to win a national championship. Tech fans scoffed. Same reasons--academics, blah blah. Bobby Ross believed. Why can't Tech fans? What is wrong with you people?

I've been so on and off the board lately and try not to get dragged into these offseason debates that repeat themselves every year, but I'll bite today.

Paul Johnson's GT record is 76-54. You don't get to cherry pick 8 of his 10 years, or only count FBS games, or whatever ridiculous criteria you want to choose to make your point. His four best years are 11 wins, 11 wins, 9 wins, and 9 wins. He has led GT to three ACC championship appearances, won an ACC title, beaten UGAg three times in an era when they are far better than they were under Donnan, and has wins against 4 (off the top of my head) top-5 teams.

George O'Leary's GT record was 52-32. His four best years were 10 wins, 9 wins, 8 wins, and 7 wins. He did not win an ACC title game. He beat UGAg three times, as well. He had one top-5 win.

I loved O'Leary. He was great for GT at the time. Some of his best players could not get into GT today.

I cannot convince you to love Paul Johnson. You won't, no matter what results GT football experiences. But your arguments are illogical, biased, not supported by facts, and not shared by most on this board who understand Georgia Tech football, football in general, and the landscape of college football in 2017.

Happy New Year!

 

[neb llarmus]

Bill Snyder at KSU is the closest comparison, IMO.

Snyder does it with junior college transfers. Not an option at Tech.

 

[Techster]

I've been so on and off the board lately and try not to get dragged into these offseason debates that repeat themselves every year, but I'll bite today.

Paul Johnson's GT record is 76-54. You don't get to cherry pick 8 of his 10 years, or only count FBS games, or whatever ridiculous criteria you want to choose to make your point. His four best years are 11 wins, 11 wins, 9 wins, and 9 wins. He has led GT to three ACC championship appearances, won an ACC title, beaten UGAg three times in an era when they are far better than they were under Donnan, and has wins against 4 (off the top of my head) top-5 teams.

George O'Leary's GT record was 52-32. His four best years were 10 wins, 9 wins, 8 wins, and 7 wins. He did not win an ACC title game. He beat UGAg three times, as well. He had one top-5 win.

I loved O'Leary. He was great for GT at the time. Some of his best players could not get into GT today.

I cannot convince you to love Paul Johnson. You won't, no matter what results GT football experiences. But your arguments are illogical, biased, not supported by facts, and not shared by most on this board who understand Georgia Tech football, football in general, and the landscape of college football in 2017.

Happy New Year!

Just an FYI.

CPJ has coached 129 total games over 10 years at GT for an average of 12.9 games played per year.

O'Leary coached 82 games (I didn't count the 3 games he was interim...just to make math easy) over 7 years at GT for an average of 11.7 games played per year.

TIFWIW.

 

[SidewalkJacket]

Just an FYI.

CPJ has coached 129 total games over 10 years at GT for an average of 12.9 games played per year.

O'Leary coached 82 games (I didn't count the 3 games he was interim...just to make math easy) over 7 years at GT for an average of 11.7 games played per year.

TIFWIW.

I'm aware. My opinion of neither coach's success is changed by that fact. There are enough other factors to support the CPJ>CGO'L theory.

 

[Techster]

I'm aware. My opinion of neither coach's success is changed by that fact. There are enough other factors to support the CPJ>CGO'L theory.

I think CPJ gets the edge over O'Leary, but you also have to consider:

O'Leary took over a dumpster fire at GT after Lewis, and had a winning record in his 2nd year. He did win an ACC title, GT was Co-Champion in 1998. GT also came in tied for 2nd in the ACC twice in an era before conference championship games...so there's a very good chance GT would have played for the ACC Championships in 1999 and/or 2000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_Coast_Conference_football_champions

CPJ walked into a team with a LOT of future NFL draft picks, and a team that already had a long bowl streak going. I'm not taking anything away from 2008 and 2009, and CPJ deserves every bit of credit for coaching those guys to 9 and 11 wins, but the circumstances were totally different for CPJ and OLeary.