Paul Johnson time frame.

[Animal02]

Animal - we can agree to disagree. I am not so sure if we could have been marginally successful or not. We had a TREMENDOUS following (almost like the ND of the south) through the 1960's, and Dodd took us out of the SEC in 1963.

Vandy NEVER had any traditional success. We had a lot of it prior to the 1970s. I agree with you that competing would still be very difficult, even if we got a little bump in recruiting, but I do think our fans would be more interested (win or lose) in seeing us play Auburn, for example, than Virginia. Also, I don't want to "fill the stands" with opposing fans, but if we had 5000-7000 of them instead of 2500, it would help the bottom line.

Dodd foresaw the future wrt pro football and how it would change the game.
Duke, Army and Navy also had very successful programs up to the 60s.......because it was the best choice for a successful career path once you got out of school. Now, the NFL $$$$ are in every 18 y.o's eyes.

 

[Animal02]

I don't think we would be another Vandy, but we wouldn't be another Alabama either. We would probably be as good as SC, Mizzou, KY generally, and the Miss schools.

We might land a couple of kids that wanted to play in the "almighty sec" but the same negative recruiting would still be taking place....and we would be as relevant as Vandy in the sec.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

We might land a couple of kids that wanted to play in the "almighty sec" but the same negative recruiting would still be taking place....and we would be as relevant as Vandy in the sec.

I think if we had never left the SEC, the years between then and now would have been completely different from the way they turned out, and IMO we would never have dropped as low as Vandy. That, of course, would have depended on the coaches we hired

 

[TheSilasSonRising]

Dodd foresaw the future wrt pro football and how it would change the game.
Duke, Army and Navy also had very successful programs up to the 60s.......because it was the best choice for a successful career path once you got out of school. Now, the NFL $$$$ are in every 18 y.o's eyes.

CBD foresaw nothing as regards to the future.

I can still remember seeing the AJC article where he and John O’Neill said, “we will ALWAYS sell our 35,000 season tickets no matter who we play.”

 

[slugboy]

https://lastwordoncollegefootball.com/2018/10/17/the-growing-problem-of-college-football-attendance/

Same reasons they are everywhere else

I'm amazed how many teenagers would rather watch "Overwatch" than traditional sports.

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

CPJ is a part of it but not the entire problem.

I can agree with this. People get bored when it does not look like most years are going to be like 2014. That is the nature of how people are. Honestly if most years were looking like 2014 then there would be a large group complaining that we are not making the playoffs and we need a new coach to get us over the hump. .

 

[Animal02]

CBD foresaw nothing as regards to the future.

I can still remember seeing the AJC article where he and John O’Neill said, “we will ALWAYS sell our 35,000 season tickets no matter who we play.”

Which has nothing to do the point I was making.

 

[Animal02]

I think if we had never left the SEC, the years between then and now would have been completely different from the way they turned out, and IMO we would never have dropped as low as Vandy. That, of course, would have depended on the coaches we hired

Think we were lower than Vandy in the late 70s early 80s.

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

I'm amazed how many teenagers would rather watch "Overwatch" than traditional sports.

Going to get worse. I may not live to see it, but I think all sports will see a drop off.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Think we were lower than Vandy in the late 70s early 80s.

Yeah, because of terrible coaching hires.

 

[AlabamaBuzz]

Yeah, because of terrible coaching hires.

Agreed, SS, and on top of that, think about it, that was when we went "independent" and had NO conference ties. I still think if we never get out of the SEC, we never drop to Vandy's level, unless they had a very, very good year.

Think about it - I can hear kids saying now, "a top tier education and getting to play SEC football at a decent level" - this WOULD get us a few more guys, in my opinion.

 

[AlabamaBuzz]

Agreed, SS, and on top of that, think about it, that was when we went "independent" and had NO conference ties. I still think if we never get out of the SEC, we never drop to Vandy's level, unless they had a very, very good year.

Think about it - I can hear kids saying now, "a top tier education and getting to play SEC football at a decent level" - this WOULD get us a few more guys, in my opinion.

There is a reason UGAG always black balled us from re-entering, because they knew it would help our recruiting somewhat. This would be ONE less negative point these 4 star kids have to hear.

 

[1956]

Since NC is bringing back Brown why dont we bring back Ross. he is only in his early 80s I believe and has not been out of coaching much longer than brown. Im only kidding, I actually have mixed feelings about replacing CPJ.

 

[MikeJackets1967]

Since NC is bringing back Brown why dont we bring back Ross. he is only in his early 80s I believe and has not been out of coaching much longer than brown. Im only kidding, I actually have mixed feelings about replacing CPJ.

Or bring back Bill Curry

 

[orientalnc]

Like a lot people on this board, I want us to win more than we seem to able to sustain. That said, uga and Clemson are, for the moment, way ahead of us. In the short term, nothing will change that. Firing Johnson, or encouraging him to retire or resign, will not hasten our equality with either program.

So, let's compare the last ten years with the ACC teams we compete with every year. Here are the number of wins for each team. I left out Louisville and Pitt since they have not been in the ACC for ten years.

Clemson 109
FSU 97
VT 85
GT 84
Miami 79
NCSU 71
UNC 68
Duke 62
Cuse 56
BC 55
Wake 50
UVA 45

I think FSU has slipped to the point they are below us. If that is the case, what is the argument against CPJ? Is it recruiting or results?

 

[Lavoisier]

My argument is mostly about how we've lost games the past two years rather than the fact we lost, and I'm someone that thinks Paul Johnson should stay especially if we win our bowl. If we went out and played good, clean, fundamental ball and lost to the better team then so be it. But we've lost so many games the past two seasons because we couldn't kick a FG, we couldn't handle a snap, our RBs put the ball on the ground multiple times, we can't cover kickoffs etc. Basic fundamental stuff you learn in Pop-Warner just isn't there in some games and that is frustrating as hell to watch.

 

[wvGT11]

Exactly,

This is what I was trying to point out earlier.
When the argument comes up about needing new coach / offensive scheme because a standard pro offense is better, the numbers don't show that. Schools like FSU, VT, Miami, and even Duke now out recruit us and have better funding yet their programs aren't any better overall.

So I really don't think it's the option that hurts us over all.

Like a lot people on this board, I want us to win more than we seem to able to sustain. That said, uga and Clemson are, for the moment, way ahead of us. In the short term, nothing will change that. Firing Johnson, or encouraging him to retire or resign, will not hasten our equality with either program.

So, let's compare the last ten years with the ACC teams we compete with every year. Here are the number of wins for each team. I left out Louisville and Pitt since they have not been in the ACC for ten years.

Clemson 109
FSU 97
VT 85
GT 84
Miami 79
NCSU 71
UNC 68
Duke 62
Cuse 56
BC 55
Wake 50
UVA 45

I think FSU has slipped to the point they are below us. If that is the case, what is the argument against CPJ? Is it recruiting or results?

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[BleedGoldNWhite21]

for the love of god, stop comparing ANYTHING to Chan Gailey. I'm glad he's gone and don't want him back. There are other people who can coach here, you know? There are also plenty of offenses being run right now that are scoring more than 17 pts vs UVA.

Our #s were inflated this year by games vs BG, Loserville, and VPI. The O got mostly stymied vs Pitt, Duke, Miami, and UVA, and obviously the 2 elite teams we played. Plummeting home attendance #s shows that people are losing interest in watching us, for whatever reason. I suspect losing and boredom are big factors.

You can make that argument about everyone in the country. Every team’s stats are inflated by a few big games. Not to mention Miami doesn’t even belong in this category. Miami is ranked 15th in the country in scoring defense and 2nd in the country in total defense. They have a good defense. The third best we faced all year and we made enough plays to win. Also the BG game doesn’t count in points per play. Points per play only takes Power 5 games in account.

No one is saying the offense is perfect, but no offense is. Blaming the option is easy because it’s “different” which makes it feel like a palpable excuse for arm chair football geniuses to point out similar to how on every football team has fans that always blame the QB for losses because everyone watching the game knows what a QB does every play unlike most positions. It’s easy to say “that option just doesn’t do it” or “QB made a bad pass” when in reality there’s a million factors going on during the play that may have caused that bad pass that the average football fan doesn’t know or care about.

PS: No argument about the defense. Are you saying we should fire CNW and get yet-another DC in here? It should be obvious by now what/who the problem is.

I’m saying what I’m saying. If CPJ should be fired it’s because he hasn’t been able to field a decent defense. There is no subtext to that statement. Personally, I like CNW and think after a 7(possibly 8) win season, it makes more sense to see if the defense can improve next year without firing the head coach. If you make the wrong coaching decision it can kill a program. Even for a factory school. Look how quickly and easily Florida dropped hiring Muschamp. They still haven’t sniffed the success they had under Meyer and he left 8 years ago. Replacing CPJ isn’t necessarily going to be easy. I’d rather see what TS, CPJ and CNW can do together in more than one season without taking that leap. There’s no obvious candidates that are better than CPJ right now. And when I say “obvious” I mean candidates who would actually take the Tech job.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Also the BG game doesn’t count in points per play. Points per play only takes Power 5 games in account.

Correct me if I am wrong, but it was my understanding the the advanced stats dismiss games against FCS opponents like Alcorn St, but count games against non-P5 opponents such as BG and USF.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

..... Replacing CPJ isn’t necessarily going to be easy. I’d rather see what TS, CPJ and CNW can do together in more than one season without taking that leap. There’s no obvious candidates that are better than CPJ right now. And when I say “obvious” I mean candidates who would actually take the Tech job.

All along, I've been of the belief that CPJ is here thru 2020 so I believe you'll get at least 2 more seasons of this Triumverate.

I disagree about 'candidates that'd take the Tech job' though. Given the salary we pay and the near-complete lack of expectations from our fanbase + being in Atlanta in a highly-talented state to recruit from makes the GT job more palatable than a lot of GT fans think.

I guess We'll find out after 2020.