Our Offense

Techster

Helluva Engineer
Messages
17,859
Who started the whole "The only way GT can compete with other schools is by using the triple option" narrative?

That's simply false. As I recall, one of the best offenses we've ever had that won us a National Championship wasn't based around the "triple option". That same offense took that coaching staff to the Super Bowl. We saw exciting QB play in that offense that eventually gave us the runner up in the Heisman (Joe Hamilton). For all crap we give Gailey, his "pro style" offense won him at least 7 games a year and took us to the ACC Championship. Outside of 2009 and 2014, 7 games a year is about what we're getting with CPJ.

Good coaches will get the most out of their talent and win games with whatever system they know best. Ross (well, Friedgen), Gailey, and CPJ knew what they wanted to do, and were/are all good coaches (though some may have issue saying that about Gailey). CPJ's offense isn't the sole reason why we're winning, it's because CPJ is just a good coach. It just so happens he's the foremost expert at what he does on offense.

You don't think if Tom Herman or a coach with a system like Art Briles, Chip Kelly, or Urban Meyer would win here, then you've been drinking too much Kool-aid. There's no doubt they probably wouldn't be pulling in 4/5 star talent like they have at their current schools, but they would recruit well enough at GT with their system to take us to bowl games consistently and win an ACC Championship once every 4-5 years. Their systems would actually attract better talent on the offensive side of the ball. QBs want to throw the ball, and skill players want to maximize their skillset catching passes and running the ball in a "NFL friendly" system. Unfortunately, that's just how recruits are these days.

The state of GA has become a hot bed for high level QBs lately, and is consistently putting out high level skill players. We get shut out of the top tier QBs during recruiting, and getting top tier skill players is few and far between. That's not a diss on the guys we're signing, it's just part and parcel of what comes with running this system. It sucks, but it's the truth when 4 and 5 star QBs would rather switch positions on the college level (Malcolm Parrish, and Nick Marshall) than play QB for us. Others (Deshaun Watson, Joshua Dobbs) won't even consider us because of our system.

I'm in no way making this about recruiting. It's just that if you say the "triple option" is the great equalizer for GT, you have to understand the sacrifice in other areas...specifically, personnel. It's not like CPJ's offense has been bad, it's actually been good to historically VERY good. Better players probably give you 2014 performances consistently. Get a more attractive system for recruits with a good coach, and GT would see similar results. I like CPJ's offense, but to say only the "triple option" offense would give GT a chance to compete ignores history and what's going on in college football today.
 

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
14,046
Who started the whole "The only way GT can compete with other schools is by using the triple option" narrative?

That's simply false. As I recall, one of the best offenses we've ever had that won us a National Championship wasn't based around the "triple option". That same offense took that coaching staff to the Super Bowl. We saw exciting QB play in that offense that eventually gave us the runner up in the Heisman (Joe Hamilton). For all crap we give Gailey, his "pro style" offense won him at least 7 games a year and took us to the ACC Championship. Outside of 2009 and 2014, 7 games a year is about what we're getting with CPJ.

Good coaches will get the most out of their talent and win games with whatever system they know best. Ross (well, Friedgen), Gailey, and CPJ knew what they wanted to do, and were/are all good coaches (though some may have issue saying that about Gailey). CPJ's offense isn't the sole reason why we're winning, it's because CPJ is just a good coach. It just so happens he's the foremost expert at what he does on offense.

You don't think if Tom Herman or a coach with a system like Art Briles, Chip Kelly, or Urban Meyer would win here, then you've been drinking too much Kool-aid. There's no doubt they probably wouldn't be pulling in 4/5 star talent like they have at their current schools, but they would recruit well enough at GT with their system to take us to bowl games consistently and win an ACC Championship once every 4-5 years. Their systems would actually attract better talent on the offensive side of the ball. QBs want to throw the ball, and skill players want to maximize their skillset catching passes and running the ball in a "NFL friendly" system. Unfortunately, that's just how recruits are these days.

The state of GA has become a hot bed for high level QBs lately, and is consistently putting out high level skill players. We get shut out of the top tier QBs during recruiting, and getting top tier skill players is few and far between. That's not a diss on the guys we're signing, it's just part and parcel of what comes with running this system. It sucks, but it's the truth when 4 and 5 star QBs would rather switch positions on the college level (Malcolm Parrish, and Nick Marshall) than play QB for us. Others (Deshaun Watson, Joshua Dobbs) won't even consider us because of our system.

I'm in no way making this about recruiting. It's just that if you say the "triple option" is the great equalizer for GT, you have to understand the sacrifice in other areas...specifically, personnel. It's not like CPJ's offense has been bad, it's actually been good to historically VERY good. Better players probably give you 2014 performances consistently. Get a more attractive system for recruits with a good coach, and GT would see similar results. I like CPJ's offense, but to say only the "triple option" offense would give GT a chance to compete ignores history and what's going on in college football today.
OK, so either the TO or a Heisman qb. Got it, thanks. ;)
 

jeffgt14

We don't quite suck as much anymore.
Messages
5,789
Location
Mt Juliet, TN
Who started the whole "The only way GT can compete with other schools is by using the triple option" narrative?

That's simply false. As I recall, one of the best offenses we've ever had that won us a National Championship wasn't based around the "triple option". That same offense took that coaching staff to the Super Bowl. We saw exciting QB play in that offense that eventually gave us the runner up in the Heisman (Joe Hamilton). For all crap we give Gailey, his "pro style" offense won him at least 7 games a year and took us to the ACC Championship. Outside of 2009 and 2014, 7 games a year is about what we're getting with CPJ.

Good coaches will get the most out of their talent and win games with whatever system they know best. Ross (well, Friedgen), Gailey, and CPJ knew what they wanted to do, and were/are all good coaches (though some may have issue saying that about Gailey). CPJ's offense isn't the sole reason why we're winning, it's because CPJ is just a good coach. It just so happens he's the foremost expert at what he does on offense.

You don't think if Tom Herman or a coach with a system like Art Briles, Chip Kelly, or Urban Meyer would win here, then you've been drinking too much Kool-aid. There's no doubt they probably wouldn't be pulling in 4/5 star talent like they have at their current schools, but they would recruit well enough at GT with their system to take us to bowl games consistently and win an ACC Championship once every 4-5 years. Their systems would actually attract better talent on the offensive side of the ball. QBs want to throw the ball, and skill players want to maximize their skillset catching passes and running the ball in a "NFL friendly" system. Unfortunately, that's just how recruits are these days.

The state of GA has become a hot bed for high level QBs lately, and is consistently putting out high level skill players. We get shut out of the top tier QBs during recruiting, and getting top tier skill players is few and far between. That's not a diss on the guys we're signing, it's just part and parcel of what comes with running this system. It sucks, but it's the truth when 4 and 5 star QBs would rather switch positions on the college level (Malcolm Parrish, and Nick Marshall) than play QB for us. Others (Deshaun Watson, Joshua Dobbs) won't even consider us because of our system.

I'm in no way making this about recruiting. It's just that if you say the "triple option" is the great equalizer for GT, you have to understand the sacrifice in other areas...specifically, personnel. It's not like CPJ's offense has been bad, it's actually been good to historically VERY good. Better players probably give you 2014 performances consistently. Get a more attractive system for recruits with a good coach, and GT would see similar results. I like CPJ's offense, but to say only the "triple option" offense would give GT a chance to compete ignores history and what's going on in college football today.
I agree. I’m not stuck on our system I just think CPJ is a very good coach and I have faith he can carry us to several more special seasons. I also think he’s reaping the effects of one huge mistake (some bad luck involved too) that I’m hoping he has learned a lesson from and that’s the 2013 recruiting class.
 

Rock

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
615
Who started the whole "The only way GT can compete with other schools is by using the triple option" narrative?

That's simply false. As I recall, one of the best offenses we've ever had that won us a National Championship wasn't based around the "triple option". That same offense took that coaching staff to the Super Bowl. We saw exciting QB play in that offense that eventually gave us the runner up in the Heisman (Joe Hamilton). For all crap we give Gailey, his "pro style" offense won him at least 7 games a year and took us to the ACC Championship. Outside of 2009 and 2014, 7 games a year is about what we're getting with CPJ.

Good coaches will get the most out of their talent and win games with whatever system they know best. Ross (well, Friedgen), Gailey, and CPJ knew what they wanted to do, and were/are all good coaches (though some may have issue saying that about Gailey). CPJ's offense isn't the sole reason why we're winning, it's because CPJ is just a good coach. It just so happens he's the foremost expert at what he does on offense.

You don't think if Tom Herman or a coach with a system like Art Briles, Chip Kelly, or Urban Meyer would win here, then you've been drinking too much Kool-aid. There's no doubt they probably wouldn't be pulling in 4/5 star talent like they have at their current schools, but they would recruit well enough at GT with their system to take us to bowl games consistently and win an ACC Championship once every 4-5 years. Their systems would actually attract better talent on the offensive side of the ball. QBs want to throw the ball, and skill players want to maximize their skillset catching passes and running the ball in a "NFL friendly" system. Unfortunately, that's just how recruits are these days.

The state of GA has become a hot bed for high level QBs lately, and is consistently putting out high level skill players. We get shut out of the top tier QBs during recruiting, and getting top tier skill players is few and far between. That's not a diss on the guys we're signing, it's just part and parcel of what comes with running this system. It sucks, but it's the truth when 4 and 5 star QBs would rather switch positions on the college level (Malcolm Parrish, and Nick Marshall) than play QB for us. Others (Deshaun Watson, Joshua Dobbs) won't even consider us because of our system.

I'm in no way making this about recruiting. It's just that if you say the "triple option" is the great equalizer for GT, you have to understand the sacrifice in other areas...specifically, personnel. It's not like CPJ's offense has been bad, it's actually been good to historically VERY good. Better players probably give you 2014 performances consistently. Get a more attractive system for recruits with a good coach, and GT would see similar results. I like CPJ's offense, but to say only the "triple option" offense would give GT a chance to compete ignores history and what's going on in college football today.


yep.. spot on.
Now the CPJ defenders will be out in full force asking questions on how you know we don't get a shot, blah blah blah.... I said the same thing 2 years ago and got roasted but it is simply the truth.
Why in the world would a 4* WR come to GT and get 2 passes a game?
4*, 5* QBs wants to go somewhere and toss the ball around.

It is a different mind set for kids today that have been touted since they were 5 and always been the super star. Is what it is.
 

Techster

Helluva Engineer
Messages
17,859
That said, the 1990 bunch was a special group. Unfortunately, I highly doubt a large portion of them would get into Tech today, same goes for a lot of O'Leary's guys. APR is a *****.

One of the things we forget when we bring up O'Leary's and Ross's recruiting with respect to todays APR standards is that education is better now than it was then. SATs scores and are higher on average...and the University System is seeing that as getting into all the GA universities (and Institutes) is far more competitve than it's ever been. This trickles down to recruits as well. Of course there will be a subset of SAs GT can't ever touch because they're not willing to do the work, but we're seeing more and more SAs wanting to be part of STEM programs, or business programs. So maybe a couple of the skill guys or DLs that played for us back then wouldn't make it now, but there are othere players GT can recruit that are just as good that would make it.

It's about 'crootin! Like I said in my post, our offense affects who we sign (that is no longer a question), and if we have a new system that attracts recruits, that means we attract SAs that would normally eliminate us right off the bat.
 

first&ten

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
880
Who started the whole "The only way GT can compete with other schools is by using the triple option" narrative?

That's simply false. As I recall, one of the best offenses we've ever had that won us a National Championship wasn't based around the "triple option". That same offense took that coaching staff to the Super Bowl. We saw exciting QB play in that offense that eventually gave us the runner up in the Heisman (Joe Hamilton). For all crap we give Gailey, his "pro style" offense won him at least 7 games a year and took us to the ACC Championship. Outside of 2009 and 2014, 7 games a year is about what we're getting with CPJ.

Good coaches will get the most out of their talent and win games with whatever system they know best. Ross (well, Friedgen), Gailey, and CPJ knew what they wanted to do, and were/are all good coaches (though some may have issue saying that about Gailey). CPJ's offense isn't the sole reason why we're winning, it's because CPJ is just a good coach. It just so happens he's the foremost expert at what he does on offense.

You don't think if Tom Herman or a coach with a system like Art Briles, Chip Kelly, or Urban Meyer would win here, then you've been drinking too much Kool-aid. There's no doubt they probably wouldn't be pulling in 4/5 star talent like they have at their current schools, but they would recruit well enough at GT with their system to take us to bowl games consistently and win an ACC Championship once every 4-5 years. Their systems would actually attract better talent on the offensive side of the ball. QBs want to throw the ball, and skill players want to maximize their skillset catching passes and running the ball in a "NFL friendly" system. Unfortunately, that's just how recruits are these days.

The state of GA has become a hot bed for high level QBs lately, and is consistently putting out high level skill players. We get shut out of the top tier QBs during recruiting, and getting top tier skill players is few and far between. That's not a diss on the guys we're signing, it's just part and parcel of what comes with running this system. It sucks, but it's the truth when 4 and 5 star QBs would rather switch positions on the college level (Malcolm Parrish, and Nick Marshall) than play QB for us. Others (Deshaun Watson, Joshua Dobbs) won't even consider us because of our system.

I'm in no way making this about recruiting. It's just that if you say the "triple option" is the great equalizer for GT, you have to understand the sacrifice in other areas...specifically, personnel. It's not like CPJ's offense has been bad, it's actually been good to historically VERY good. Better players probably give you 2014 performances consistently. Get a more attractive system for recruits with a good coach, and GT would see similar results. I like CPJ's offense, but to say only the "triple option" offense would give GT a chance to compete ignores history and what's going on in college football today.
All your points are on target. Top high school qb's and receivers are not interested in playing under johnson and his offense. Pure & simple!
 

Augusta_Jacket

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Staff member
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Augusta, Georgia
Coach adds wrinkles every single year. He even added an entire package just for one player a few years ago. I don't get what people are seeing who say CPJ is stubborn and won't change or that we need to innovate or get left behind. Yes, the core principles and plays are the same, but minor changes and nuances can really throw a defense off. Just tweaking the blocking assignments can yield huge results. We seen it time and time again.

I think when the say "adding wrinkles", they actually mean wholesale scheme change.
 

WrexRacer

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
66
Ralph's offense had option elements, although it wasn't an option offense. I remember Bowden talking about Joe running the 'wishbone' on them.

We don't need the TO to be successful. Gailey was successful running an absolutely putrid offense.

What we need right now is OL blocking.
 

Northeast Stinger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
9,716
Yes, Ralph's offense was complex and had multiple option variables built into it. I recall drives in which we ran pistol / spread, shotgun, and wishbone, all on the same drive. It helps to have players who can carry that out. A lot to execute both mentally and physically.
 

takethepoints

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Messages
5,916
Yesssss. One of the main elements in Fridgen's O in 1990 was the freeze option (basically the counter option we run today) and we ran double options to the outside all the time. The main differences between the 1990 team and Coach's 2009 and 2014 teams were a) the best corps of WRs in Tech history and b) a truly great D. I knew we were going places in 1990 after we sacked the QB 13 times in the Maryland game. Sure enough …
 
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13,443
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Augusta, GA
Yesssss. One of the main elements in Fridgen's O in 1990 was the freeze option (basically the counter option we run today) and we ran double options to the outside all the time. The main differences between the 1990 team and Coach's 2009 and 2014 teams were a) the best corps of WRs in Tech history and b) a truly great D. I knew we were going places in 1990 after we sacked the QB 13 times in the Maryland game. Sure enough …
I knew we were going places in 1990 after we sacked the QB 13 times in the Maryland game. Sure enough …
Boy, do I remember that game. That was just incredible listening to on the radio. I also thought at the time that something BIG is happening here. And, as you said, "Sure enough..."
 

jeffgt14

We don't quite suck as much anymore.
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I always wonder why Fridge wasn't more successful at Maryland. He did great his first 3 years and then nothing. Perhaps he couldn't recruit?
 

VolJacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
480
Boy, do I remember that game. That was just incredible listening to on the radio. I also thought at the time that something BIG is happening here. And, as you said, "Sure enough..."
Ken Swilling had an incredible performance against South Carolina in 1990. I was in the stands at Bobby Dodd Stadium for the game and got a sunburn.
 

jeffgt14

We don't quite suck as much anymore.
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Didn't he win ACC coach of the year the year he was fired?
Yea but he was struggling for years before that. His wins that year weren't anything to ride home on as I just looked it up.
Navy (9-4)
Morgan State (4-7)
FIU (7-6)
Duke (3-9)
BC (7-6)
Wake (3-9)
UVA (4-8)
NCSU (9-4)
ECU (6-7)

NC State was a Russell Wilson team so that's probably the best win there. Still 9 wins though.
 
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