Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[augustabuzz]

It’s gonna be tough but IMO DC and OC got to change. Keeping most of the assistants is ok. I think it comes down to play calling and oversight of the process in order to flip the close games in our favor. It is not pure luck.

I get the feeling that the assistants are frustrated because they work hard to prepare the kids but the play calling and overall game plan has been short.

You're right. It's not pure luck. It is a process of repetitions and learning on the job. It's what allows experienced people to have patience when going through the process of watching children experiment and learn. But, one by one they learn not to panic and focus on the task rather than the outcome. At some point, they reach a critical mass of team members who have the focus and close losses become close wins and winning seasons.

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

1. One of the ways to accomplish point 2 is to make a concerted effort to fix what’s wrong with our program right now.

Your post is spot on and we absolutely cannot fire him. It will only get worse. Your bolded sentence is our only option. The AD MUST step in and and push, if CGC is not able to do it himself. Get the best assistants we can afford.

You have to work with the situation you have, not create a probable even worse situation. The only way to fix this is to bring in good coaches and leverage CGC strengths. Basicaly we need to Dabo this. Too bad we wasted 3 years before doing it. But why put off what you can start with today. Time to do a hard review of all the assistant coaches. There are some good ones and some not so good ones. But why not start the process now instead of when the season is finished and there are a lot of other teams looking for assistants

 

[Skeptic]

EVERY. FREAKIN. YEAR.

Wasn't it even more telling that the conference punching bags never got that week ... only the good teams that had a chance?

 

[Jerry the Jacket]

I was impressed with the post-game interview that Jordan Mason conducted yesterday. Watching that reminded me that these young men are achieving success in many ways other than winning football games. Everybody wants to win and that is why we play the games. Losing sucks and nobody feels that more than the players and coaches who devote so much time and energy into trying to win each and every game. I was just thinking about how much pressure these guys are under and in reading the board you can really feel it. It is palpable. I know Geoff Collins is well compensated and a grown man who knew exactly what he signed up for. It looks like his coaching methodology and philosophy is being tested and right now it is not passing muster. He appears to have an unshakeable belief that he is doing it not only the right way but in a new and unique way that will ultimately propel Tech back into National prominence in the storied game of College Football. He is almost evangelical in his belief and his promotion of his system.

He may or may not get fired. I am still holding out hope at the end of the day that he will succeed. For if he succeeds, Georgia Tech football succeeds. So I am going to quit calling for his head and do my dead level best to support him and the program. I really don't have a vote in whether he stays or goes, so the rest is just me expressing my opinion and that is what these forums are for. So I am not going to criticize anyone that chooses to jump off or on the Collins bandwagon. This season has pretty well been defined but we do have 3 more times to take the field and perform. So I am hoping that our boys and coaches will find some level of success to build on as we look to the future.

Go Jackets!

 

[Skeptic]

Your post is spot on and we absolutely cannot fire him. It will only get worse. Your bolded sentence is our only option. The AD MUST step in and and push, if CGC is not able to do it himself. Get the best assistants we can afford.

You have to work with the situation you have, not create a probable even worse situation. The only way to fix this is to bring in good coaches and leverage CGC strengths. Basicaly we need to Dabo this. Too bad we wasted 3 years before doing it. But why put off what you can start with today. Time to do a hard review of all the assistant coaches. There are some good ones and some not so good ones. But why not start the process now instead of when the season is finished and there are a lot of other teams looking for assistants

When a coach starts to blame the press, even the innocuous, message board home town press, then it is the beginning of the end. It is interesting that after 20 years of the destruction of the community press, a football coach still finds a way.

 

[Skeptic]

I was impressed with the post-game interview that Jordan Mason conducted yesterday. Watching that reminded me that these young men are achieving success in many ways other than winning football games. Everybody wants to win and that is why we play the games. Losing sucks and nobody feels that more than the players and coaches who devote so much time and energy into trying to win each and every game. I was just thinking about how much pressure these guys are under and in reading the board you can really feel it. It is palpable. I know Geoff Collins is well compensated and a grown man who knew exactly what he signed up for. It looks like his coaching methodology and philosophy is being tested and right now it is not passing muster. He appears to have an unshakeable belief that he is doing it not only the right way but in a new and unique way that will ultimately propel Tech back into National prominence in the storied game of College Football. He is almost evangelical in his belief and his promotion of his system.

He may or may not get fired. I am still holding out hope at the end of the day that he will succeed. For if he succeeds, Georgia Tech football succeeds. So I am going to quit calling for his head and do my dead level best to support him and the program. I really don't have a vote in whether he stays or goes, so the rest is just me expressing my opinion and that is what these forums are for. So I am not going to criticize anyone that chooses to jump off or on the Collins bandwagon. This season has pretty well been defined but we do have 3 more times to take the field and perform. So I am hoping that our boys and coaches will find some level of success to build on as we look to the future.

Go Jackets!

It would help if anybody knew what his "system" is. It sure does not involve game coaching.

 

[bobongo]

It would help if anybody knew what his "system" is. It sure does not involve game coaching.

It's the system of acting as though HC stands for Head Cheerleader.

 

[Sheboygan]

Your post is spot on and we absolutely cannot fire him. It will only get worse. Your bolded sentence is our only option. The AD MUST step in and and push, if CGC is not able to do it himself. Get the best assistants we can afford.

You have to work with the situation you have, not create a probable even worse situation. The only way to fix this is to bring in good coaches and leverage CGC strengths. Basicaly we need to Dabo this. Too bad we wasted 3 years before doing it. But why put off what you can start with today. Time to do a hard review of all the assistant coaches. There are some good ones and some not so good ones. But why not start the process now instead of when the season is finished and there are a lot of other teams looking for assistants

Agreed .........CGC needs an "intervention, stat " !!

 

[majorQ9]

Does the the University o f the Georgia Institute of Technology, or however it is referred to, offer any courses in logic?

ECE 2020

 

[Pointer]

Short summary: it’s not easy to fire your way to success

I’ve been watching Georgia Tech a long time; not as long as some of you, but I started following at the end of the Pepper era (and that was hard, because there wasn’t a lot of Tech on TV at the time).
As fans, we want to win, and we want to win right now, and that’s what a fan should want. Here’s some of what I’ve seen over the past 25 years that shows why we need to fix up our house

• Towards the end of O’Leary’s tenure, the offense wasn’t quite as good under Bill O’Brien as it was under Fridge, and O’Leary never got the defense in gear. In some ways, we were looking for a new coach the last few years of his coaching stand here. When his resume fiasco blew up his hire at Notre Dame, there didn’t seem to be any thought of bringing him back. O’Leary could have used a stronger AA to help his team go in the right direction. Also, as fans, many of us didn’t realize how hard it was for his staff to put a consistent winner on the field like he did. When outside coaches saw the GT situation, they probably thought “that’s not as good as a factory situation, but it’s pretty good”. We still had recruits who could remember a national title. Every outside coach understood why he’d “step up” to the Notre Dame job, though.
• We followed up with Gailey, who a lot of fans called “Gomer”. Most people were cautiously optimistic about the hire, but I don’t think a lot of coaches threw their hats into the ring to replace O’Leary. We had a great defense under Gailey, and a mostly boring offense with an all-time hall-of-fame receiver and great running backs. I’m not sure how much help Gailey was willing to take, but he could have used a lot more help adjusting from the Pros to college and managing academic progress. He had very good Hewitt years with star basketball players to shield him from the harsh glare of fans and the press. From the viewpoint of outside coaches, they saw the AA let him down when they said advisors were handling academic progress. He fought through recruiting sanctions and finally his staff brought in full recruiting classes, and some of the best we’d seen. Outside coaches saw fans get sick of him, and an AA that didn’t get the job done.
• We followed that up with Johnson. I see him going into the college football hall of fame as a coach. He turned us around quickly, then tailed off over the last few years. Other coaches might not like him, but he’s seen as an innovator, and I see him that way. In his time here, he had boosters and his own AD undercut him. Some of the problems he had here were related to actions he took, but as a coach you want to know that the AA and the AD have your back, and that they’re competent. That wasn’t the case until his last couple of years. Many fans and coaches feel like he wasn’t fired, but he wasn’t made to feel welcome in the job for about half of his tenure here.
• The least a good coach is going to expect is for the AA and the AD to have their back and support them (unless they go full Bobby Petrino, and dang if he didn’t expect the Arkansas AA to support him with guns blazing).
• In the same time that Johnson was here, Swinney was at a point that he could get fired, and the big donors at Clemson surely wouldn’t have minded at the time. Their AD called a meeting, and Swinney thought he was getting fired. The AD hosted a discussion about what they could do to support him and help turn around the program. Every coach in the country saw that happen, and saw that as the sign of a successful athletic program.
• Over on the other side of the country, Stanford had never been a strong athletic program before Harbaugh showed up there, but the AA has made that a consistent program from Harbaugh to Shaw.
• Closer to home, Clemson (mentioned earlier) and Alabama have shown what building a good AA can do for you. FSU has shown what an aimless and weak AA can do TO you, even if you’re flush with cash.
• When we hired Collins, coaches and sports journalists voiced the idea that there were very few coaching openings, and Tech had a shot at making a great and special hire just based on timing. However, most coaches did not see us as a desirable landing spot, and we didn’t have as many candidates as we’d have wanted. When Ross went to the NFL, there was huge buzz about our HC position. This time around, it wasn’t as popular to compete for.
• Whether or not other coaches respect Collins or not, they’re looking at this situation and seeing what the environment looks like and how good of a situation this is. They’re looking at “can you recruit”—and you can, even if it’s not as easy as Miami. They’re looking at “is the AA going to shelter you from the pesky annoyances that keep you from coaching or recruiting, or are they going to be a source of trouble”. They’ll look at “does the AA keep the NCAA out of my hair or do they make things worse?”. They’ll look at “do I have all the tools I have to succeed at that place?”.
• While most coaches are mostly focused on prepping for their next game and recruiting, they are looking around for a cozy home to work from, because most HC jobs are temporary, and you’re lucky to coach for more that 4 years anywhere.
• So, if Stansbury goes to donors, and amasses a big pile of cash that not only covers a buyout but also has enough cash to pay for a HC and strong assistants, we’re just resetting the clock—we won’t have a race of coaches running through our open door. Mullen isn’t leaving Florida for us, and Leach isn’t leaving Miss State for us, and we’re probably not getting Coastal Carolina’s coach either. We’re not even getting Hugh Freeze from Liberty.
• Any coach worth his salt who might consider GT is looking at what the AA and AD do right now. I would. I’d want to see the AD come in and do what’s needed to support Collins and put him on the right track for success—even if it’s bringing in the right assistants (or getting them on the right track and doing their jobs better) and taking responsibilities off of his plate so he can focus on what needs fixing. Bring in a coach whisperer to mentor him in the right direction (not saying I believe in “coach whisperers, but $hrug”).
• Basically, this is a “show some grit and make a smart and concerted effort to fix things” moment for the AA and for Collins. It’s a time for the AD to come in and help turn this around. It’s a time for every coach and athlete around the country to see that you did everything possible to help the situation before you gave up, so that they know you’re serious, and so they know that you’re not just calling in a new coach and saying “your problem, fix this on your own”.

Summary:

1. If you fire Collins, you need to attract a good or great coach.
2. To attract a good or great coach, you have to make them think this is a place where they can and will succeed and would want to be.
3. You have to make any prospective coaches think this is a good place to be before you fire Collins. Doing that after you fire Collins is too late to get them to come here.
4. We haven’t done #2 yet.
5. One of the ways to accomplish point 2 is to make a concerted effort to fix what’s wrong with our program right now.
6. This is a c*** situation, but you have to deal with the situation you’re in as it is and not as you’d like it to be.
7. The buyout is a financial issue, but job desirability is a bigger one, so we have to fix our environment here.

Very well said and a good hypothesis.

The problem is risking CGC further running the program into the dirt and turning this place into Kansas or Vandy where expectations don't matter and football is an afterthought.

With that said, tell me what coordinators you'd like to see come here if Thacker and P'Node leave. I'm not sure anyone is going to want to come here and coach under CGC.

A good reason why is that next year is his final year of the 4 years fully guaranteed contact. It will be much easier to clean house in the next two years, and I'm willing to bet not many coaches want to rebuild the rubble CGC has directly created, especially if he will still be the one in charge.

I think if we do the sensible thing and let CGC go this year (please God let this happen) or next year, any reasonable coach will see that we gave him more then enough opportunity to get something started here. Key phrase here is getting something started. When you go 3 straight seasons at 3 (possibly 4 this year) wins, it's clear you're in over you're head and any school who gives a damn about their football program has every right in the world to let you go. So in a way, we've already more then shown how reasonable we are.

We've had a guy who was willing to come here after PJ left with a proven track record. Still willing to come here. The AA is too afraid to embrace our best option and go full in, just like they did with the previous coach as you have so well detailed out.

This leads me to my last point in that comparing CGC situation to Dabo's initial years is not reasonable. Dabo's program had a pulse, he was not putting together a string of the worst back to back to back seasons in the program's history.

 

[sgreer]

Collins is a salesman and relentlessly positive, it’s working with recruits but at least half of our fanbase absolutely hates him for it. For me the best approach is to not really pay a lot of attention to his pressers. I think a LOT of our fans really related to CPJ and his FU attitude (I know i did) he was a Ahole at times but he was our Ahole and we loved him for it no matter what the record was. CGC is 180 degrees from that and it doesn’t play with the fans when we lose. I know his demeanor is good for recruiting and player relations but I really need to see him get on some players A$$ on the sideline, scream some obsenities in their face the next time they leave a WR open for a easy TD, or block freaking air and get our QB killed etc. He needs to put a little fear of the head-coach into these guys at some point.

I sat behind the Tech bench vs VT and I can assure you I saw plenty of assistants doing the dirty work and chewing some players out.

 

[SOWEGA Jacket]

We don’t need nor can afford any known coaches. It is what it is. But, there are a ton of high end football coaches at other levels of football who would gladly take these jobs. We actually tried this route with Collins, even with his 2 years of HC experience at Temple, and we simply missed. The problem was we paid him as if he was a known coach. Go find the top 3 OC’s and DC’s at different levels and interview them. They can’t be any worse than Thacker and Patenaude and maybe we run into something on the cheap. I just looked at some high level DII teams. The current head coach at Valdosta State is a guy named Gary Goff. Apparently his offenses are freaking good especially running the ball. A google search shows he makes around $140,000 per year. You don’t think he’d love an OC P5 job? There are guys like him all over this country. Meanwhile, we have Patenaude. GT needs to be smarter.

 

[JacketOff]

We don’t need nor can afford any known coaches. It is what it is. But, there are a ton of high end football coaches at other levels of football who would gladly take these jobs. We actually tried this route with Collins, even with his 2 years of HC experience at Temple, and we simply missed. The problem was we paid him as if he was a known coach. Go find the top 3 OC’s and DC’s at different levels and interview them. They can’t be any worse than Thacker and Patenaude and maybe we run into something on the cheap. I just looked at some high level DII teams. The current head coach at Valdosta State is a guy named Gary Goff. Apparently his offenses are freaking good especially running the ball. A google search shows he makes around $140,000 per year. You don’t think he’d love an OC P5 job? There are guys like him all over this country. Meanwhile, we have Patenaude. GT needs to be smarter.

Welp, this is a terrible idea

 

[bobongo]

We don’t need nor can afford any known coaches. It is what it is. But, there are a ton of high end football coaches at other levels of football who would gladly take these jobs. We actually tried this route with Collins, even with his 2 years of HC experience at Temple, and we simply missed. The problem was we paid him as if he was a known coach. Go find the top 3 OC’s and DC’s at different levels and interview them. They can’t be any worse than Thacker and Patenaude and maybe we run into something on the cheap. I just looked at some high level DII teams. The current head coach at Valdosta State is a guy named Gary Goff. Apparently his offenses are freaking good especially running the ball. A google search shows he makes around $140,000 per year. You don’t think he’d love an OC P5 job? There are guys like him all over this country. Meanwhile, we have Patenaude. GT needs to be smarter.

Everybody wants a name coach, but I'm reasonably certain that there are a number of coaches at the lower levels who can come in here and do better than what we've got at OC and DC. That's where all the name coaches came from before they made their name - the lower ranks.

 

[DavidStandingBear]

says more about your ugag family than it does about GT

Pretty rude response

 

[DavidStandingBear]

Short summary: it’s not easy to fire your way to success

I’ve been watching Georgia Tech a long time; not as long as some of you, but I started following at the end of the Pepper era (and that was hard, because there wasn’t a lot of Tech on TV at the time).
As fans, we want to win, and we want to win right now, and that’s what a fan should want. Here’s some of what I’ve seen over the past 25 years that shows why we need to fix up our house

• Towards the end of O’Leary’s tenure, the offense wasn’t quite as good under Bill O’Brien as it was under Fridge, and O’Leary never got the defense in gear. In some ways, we were looking for a new coach the last few years of his coaching stand here. When his resume fiasco blew up his hire at Notre Dame, there didn’t seem to be any thought of bringing him back. O’Leary could have used a stronger AA to help his team go in the right direction. Also, as fans, many of us didn’t realize how hard it was for his staff to put a consistent winner on the field like he did. When outside coaches saw the GT situation, they probably thought “that’s not as good as a factory situation, but it’s pretty good”. We still had recruits who could remember a national title. Every outside coach understood why he’d “step up” to the Notre Dame job, though.
• We followed up with Gailey, who a lot of fans called “Gomer”. Most people were cautiously optimistic about the hire, but I don’t think a lot of coaches threw their hats into the ring to replace O’Leary. We had a great defense under Gailey, and a mostly boring offense with an all-time hall-of-fame receiver and great running backs. I’m not sure how much help Gailey was willing to take, but he could have used a lot more help adjusting from the Pros to college and managing academic progress. He had very good Hewitt years with star basketball players to shield him from the harsh glare of fans and the press. From the viewpoint of outside coaches, they saw the AA let him down when they said advisors were handling academic progress. He fought through recruiting sanctions and finally his staff brought in full recruiting classes, and some of the best we’d seen. Outside coaches saw fans get sick of him, and an AA that didn’t get the job done.
• We followed that up with Johnson. I see him going into the college football hall of fame as a coach. He turned us around quickly, then tailed off over the last few years. Other coaches might not like him, but he’s seen as an innovator, and I see him that way. In his time here, he had boosters and his own AD undercut him. Some of the problems he had here were related to actions he took, but as a coach you want to know that the AA and the AD have your back, and that they’re competent. That wasn’t the case until his last couple of years. Many fans and coaches feel like he wasn’t fired, but he wasn’t made to feel welcome in the job for about half of his tenure here.
• The least a good coach is going to expect is for the AA and the AD to have their back and support them (unless they go full Bobby Petrino, and dang if he didn’t expect the Arkansas AA to support him with guns blazing).
• In the same time that Johnson was here, Swinney was at a point that he could get fired, and the big donors at Clemson surely wouldn’t have minded at the time. Their AD called a meeting, and Swinney thought he was getting fired. The AD hosted a discussion about what they could do to support him and help turn around the program. Every coach in the country saw that happen, and saw that as the sign of a successful athletic program.
• Over on the other side of the country, Stanford had never been a strong athletic program before Harbaugh showed up there, but the AA has made that a consistent program from Harbaugh to Shaw.
• Closer to home, Clemson (mentioned earlier) and Alabama have shown what building a good AA can do for you. FSU has shown what an aimless and weak AA can do TO you, even if you’re flush with cash.
• When we hired Collins, coaches and sports journalists voiced the idea that there were very few coaching openings, and Tech had a shot at making a great and special hire just based on timing. However, most coaches did not see us as a desirable landing spot, and we didn’t have as many candidates as we’d have wanted. When Ross went to the NFL, there was huge buzz about our HC position. This time around, it wasn’t as popular to compete for.
• Whether or not other coaches respect Collins or not, they’re looking at this situation and seeing what the environment looks like and how good of a situation this is. They’re looking at “can you recruit”—and you can, even if it’s not as easy as Miami. They’re looking at “is the AA going to shelter you from the pesky annoyances that keep you from coaching or recruiting, or are they going to be a source of trouble”. They’ll look at “does the AA keep the NCAA out of my hair or do they make things worse?”. They’ll look at “do I have all the tools I have to succeed at that place?”.
• While most coaches are mostly focused on prepping for their next game and recruiting, they are looking around for a cozy home to work from, because most HC jobs are temporary, and you’re lucky to coach for more that 4 years anywhere.
• So, if Stansbury goes to donors, and amasses a big pile of cash that not only covers a buyout but also has enough cash to pay for a HC and strong assistants, we’re just resetting the clock—we won’t have a race of coaches running through our open door. Mullen isn’t leaving Florida for us, and Leach isn’t leaving Miss State for us, and we’re probably not getting Coastal Carolina’s coach either. We’re not even getting Hugh Freeze from Liberty.
• Any coach worth his salt who might consider GT is looking at what the AA and AD do right now. I would. I’d want to see the AD come in and do what’s needed to support Collins and put him on the right track for success—even if it’s bringing in the right assistants (or getting them on the right track and doing their jobs better) and taking responsibilities off of his plate so he can focus on what needs fixing. Bring in a coach whisperer to mentor him in the right direction (not saying I believe in “coach whisperers, but $hrug”).
• Basically, this is a “show some grit and make a smart and concerted effort to fix things” moment for the AA and for Collins. It’s a time for the AD to come in and help turn this around. It’s a time for every coach and athlete around the country to see that you did everything possible to help the situation before you gave up, so that they know you’re serious, and so they know that you’re not just calling in a new coach and saying “your problem, fix this on your own”.

Summary:

1. If you fire Collins, you need to attract a good or great coach.
2. To attract a good or great coach, you have to make them think this is a place where they can and will succeed and would want to be.
3. You have to make any prospective coaches think this is a good place to be before you fire Collins. Doing that after you fire Collins is too late to get them to come here.
4. We haven’t done #2 yet.
5. One of the ways to accomplish point 2 is to make a concerted effort to fix what’s wrong with our program right now.
6. This is a c*** situation, but you have to deal with the situation you’re in as it is and not as you’d like it to be.
7. The buyout is a financial issue, but job desirability is a bigger one, so we have to fix our environment here.

Way too complicated. He just needs to stop acting like a superstar when he’s not. gT alums and fans are put off. Sure give him 7 years to learn how to coach, just stop the annoying stuff.

 

[4shotB]

We don’t need nor can afford any known coaches. It is what it is.

Go find the top 3 OC’s and DC’s at different levels and interview them. They can’t be any worse than Thacker and Patenaude and maybe we run into something on the cheap. A google search shows he makes around $140,000 per year. You don’t think he’d love an OC P5 job? There are guys like him all over this country. Meanwhile, we have Patenaude. GT needs to be smarter.

So we can't hire proven coaches per your first statement. Then should we hire somebody with the prayer that "maybe we run into something cheap who can't be any worse than what we have now?" Is that how you suggest we run a multimillion dollar business? We tried this approach with CPJ and DC's. How well did that work out for us? Do you think we are any better now in our hiring processes or have more football acumen in the building than when Paul was here? I don't care what people say about our former coach but I (and most others here) think he was a pretty bright individual. He was such a brilliant guy that his X's and O's covered up some of our systemic issues that @slugboy referenced in his brilliant post above. But to roll the dice hoping to get lucky on a guy coaching at a community college somewhere isn't a strategy anymore than buying a lottery ticket is a substitute for financial planning. It may appease the mob but it can do more longterm harm than good. Remember CPJ' defenses and playing for all those different coordinators? How much did that contribute to the ongoing conversations about "simplifying" things for our players?

Would someone take the job? Sure, most people in the age range of 25-40 with wives, kids, mortgages, etc. making $125k would love to come here and make $400-$500k like Thacker and CDP. Even if only for a year or two. We would have probably done the same if given the chance.

 

[DavidStandingBear]

So we can't hire proven coaches per your first statement. Then should we hire somebody with the prayer that "maybe we run into something cheap who can't be any worse than what we have now?" Is that how you suggest we run a multimillion dollar business? We tried this approach with CPJ and DC's. How well did that work out for us? Do you think we are any better now in our hiring processes or have more football acumen in the building than when Paul was here? I don't care what people say about our former coach but I (and most others here) think he was a pretty bright individual. He was such a brilliant guy that his X's and O's covered up some of our systemic issues that @slugboy referenced in his brilliant post above. But to roll the dice hoping to get lucky on a guy coaching at a community college somewhere isn't a strategy anymore than buying a lottery ticket is a substitute for financial planning. It may appease the mob but it can do more longterm harm than good. Remember CPJ' defenses and playing for all those different coordinators? How much did that contribute to the ongoing conversations about "simplifying" things for our players?

Would someone take the job? Sure, most people in the age range of 25-40 with wives, kids, mortgages, etc. making $125k would love to come here and make $400-$500k like Thacker and CDP. Even if only for a year or two. We would have probably done the same if given the chance.

I think I agree with you, GC needs to be better than PJ with all of his talk. I never missed a PJ radio show or press conference! I was entertained and happy to get 7 to 11 wins per year

 

[SOWEGA Jacket]

So we can't hire proven coaches per your first statement. Then should we hire somebody with the prayer that "maybe we run into something cheap who can't be any worse than what we have now?" Is that how you suggest we run a multimillion dollar business? We tried this approach with CPJ and DC's. How well did that work out for us? Do you think we are any better now in our hiring processes or have more football acumen in the building than when Paul was here? I don't care what people say about our former coach but I (and most others here) think he was a pretty bright individual. He was such a brilliant guy that his X's and O's covered up some of our systemic issues that @slugboy referenced in his brilliant post above. But to roll the dice hoping to get lucky on a guy coaching at a community college somewhere isn't a strategy anymore than buying a lottery ticket is a substitute for financial planning. It may appease the mob but it can do more longterm harm than good. Remember CPJ' defenses and playing for all those different coordinators? How much did that contribute to the ongoing conversations about "simplifying" things for our players?

Would someone take the job? Sure, most people in the age range of 25-40 with wives, kids, mortgages, etc. making $125k would love to come here and make $400-$500k like Thacker and CDP. Even if only for a year or two. We would have probably done the same if given the chance.

We can’t hire a name coach because we can’t afford it. I’m just saying we all agree that Thacker and Patenaude stink. So what are we to do? Just wait it out another 4 years? We could definitely do that. Or TStan can fire them and find some cheaper guys who are better or at least not worse. I’d love to be able to hire Venables as DC but we are broke. So where do we go? The good news is that Thacker and Patenaude are so bad that we could get 2 nobodies who could do better. And we’ve already done exactly what I said with Thacker and Patenaude. We just whiffed. Now, we gotta try again. I can tell you that dude at Valdosta State is way better than Patenaude. Heck, I could name 10 high school coaches in south Georgia who could do a better job than Patenaude.

As for your comment “is that how I suggest we run a multimillion dollar business” - of course not. But the decisions that led us to where we are sure aren’t any better than my suggestion. TStan knows he should get rid of this staff but money prevents it so the product will continue to spiral downward. Next season Bobby Dodd will be a ghost town after the first month. That’s no way to run a business either. We are broke but there are plenty of young coaches who would take a low salary that we could try. There is no magic handshake that makes a D1 coach better than a DII coach. We’ve proven that.

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

The lack of planning the what ifs, the lack of clock awareness, the lack of knowing the rules, etc etc etc

Lack of adjustments. Lack of taking what the other team gives you. It’s almost like we do not scout the other team.