Las Vegas Mass Casualty Attack

[WreckinGT]

No I just read the news. That’s old news. Stop posting old news. Read articles from the last day or two.

I did. Care to share the articles that you have read that confirmed that the sheriff was lying?

 

[WreckinGT]

LOLOLOLOLOL. It’s a hammer issue. It’s a rental truck issue. It’s a knife issue. LOLOLOLOLOL.

You could surround me by literally a million guns and I would never shoot anybody. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

Yep. If the Parkland shooter had used a hammer I’m sure he would have killed 17 people.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

These crisis actor conspiracy theories are crazy and are very disrespectful to the children that went through this tragic event. They are being promoted by conservative right wing websites. A Florida Republican state reps aide got fired for spreading these lies.
https://www.snopes.com/2018/02/20/right-wing-media-david-hogg/

And Democrats have been saying to shoot NRA funded Republicans. So what.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I did. Care to share the articles that you have read that confirmed that the sheriff was lying?

LOLOLOLOLOL. He wasn’t lying, grow up. That was the reporting right after the incident. I’m talking about days later after more time had passed. Use GOOGLE. The last article I read was the Sun Sentinel.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Yep. If the Parkland shooter had used a hammer I’m sure he would have killed 17 people.

More people are killed with hammers than AR-15s. Facts suck. If guns didn’t exist, I’m sure he would have found a way to drive through a crowd of students in his car. I hope you never drive by any WalMarts, Gun Stores, Targets, Lowe’s, or Home Deppts - sounds like you don’t believe you can control yourself from the temptation to kill a bunch of people given the right opportunity.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

These crisis actor conspiracy theories are crazy and are very disrespectful to the children that went through this tragic event. They are being promoted by conservative right wing websites. A Florida Republican state reps aide got fired for spreading these lies.
https://www.snopes.com/2018/02/20/right-wing-media-david-hogg/

Last night there was a CNN Townhall, and only one question out of the nine was from someone who fell to the right of the political spectrum. Don’t you find that odd? Well come to find out CNN was handing out pre-scripted questions. There is a high school student on camera at the event saying they denied his question and handed him a scripted one about gun control. He declined the opportunity to ask that one instead.

This does not excuse the behavior of the moon bats, but when this type of scripted political garbage happens all the time, it certainly feeds them.

 

[WreckinGT]

LOLOLOLOLOL. He wasn’t lying, grow up. That was the reporting right after the incident. I’m talking about days later after more time had passed. Use GOOGLE. The last article I read was the Sun Sentinel.

I did use google and I did read the Sun Sentinel article. Neither have confirmed that the guard wasn't there. You must have read a hidden special article and we would all love a link to it.

 

[WreckinGT]

More people are killed with hammers than AR-15s. Facts suck. If guns didn’t exist, I’m sure he would have found a way to drive through a crowd of students in his car. I hope you never drive by any WalMarts, Gun Stores, Targets, Lowe’s, or Home Deppts - sounds like you don’t believe you can control yourself from the temptation to kill a bunch of people given the right opportunity.

You are going off the deep end at this point. There is basically no proof at all that mass shooters will go grab cars and start running over people if they can't get guns. Here is a good article that you can read about someone who planned to be a school shooter but never went through with it simply because he didn't have easy access to guns.

http://time.com/5167365/i-was-almos...eartfelt-letter-about-mental-health-and-guns/

 

[WreckinGT]

Last night there was a CNN Townhall, and only one question out of the nine was from someone who fell to the right of the political spectrum. Don’t you find that odd? Well come to find out CNN was handing out pre-scripted questions. There is a high school student on camera at the event saying they denied his question and handed him a scripted one about gun control. He declined the opportunity to ask that one instead.

This does not excuse the behavior of the moon bats, but when this type of scripted political garbage happens all the time, it certainly feeds them.

If you think everything that happened last night at the town hall was scripted then you obviously didn't watch it. There were kids there that watched their best friends die in front of them. There were parents who lost their children. If the best that you can come up with is hur hur evil CNN planned this as a political stunt then you are showing an incredible amount of disrespect to them. Even Rubio had the guts to show up and look them in the face and talk to them. Too bad for him that the other members of his party are heartless cowards who hide behind computer screens making up conspiracy theories to discredit them and trash them.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

If you think everything that happened last night at the town hall was scripted then you obviously didn't watch it. There were kids there that watched their best friends die in front of them. There were parents who lost their children. If the best that you can come up with is hur hur evil CNN planned this as a political stunt then you are showing an incredible amount of disrespect to them. Even Rubio had the guts to show up and look them in the face and talk to them. Too bad for him that the other members of his party are heartless cowards who hide behind computer screens making up conspiracy theories to discredit them and trash them.

I didn’t say that, please stop putting words in my mouth.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

You are going off the deep end at this point. There is basically no proof at all that mass shooters will go grab cars and start running over people if they can't get guns. Here is a good article that you can read about someone who planned to be a school shooter but never went through with it simply because he didn't have easy access to guns.

http://time.com/5167365/i-was-almos...eartfelt-letter-about-mental-health-and-guns/

I think you just accidentally argued against yourself. There are in fact cases around the world including the United States, where people have used other weapons like knives and cars to kill large groups of people. Also, you do realize that that person’s lack of access to guns is exactly my argument in all this right? Right? The kid in that article, and the kid that just shut up the high school in Florida, are exactly the type of people that should never have guns. The regular old lawful people with no mental illness or history of violence are not the ones that all of you need to be focused on.

I continue to find it funny that the conclusion of all these articles like your commentary and the one you just link to want to ban 80% of all guns. No matter how good your intentions might be, I’m here to tell you that that will never happen – never never never never, so you might as well start focusing on real solutions.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I did use google and I did read the Sun Sentinel article. Neither have confirmed that the guard wasn't there. You must have read a hidden special article and we would all love a link to it.

Google doesn’t hide things. You are a silly man.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/parkland/florida-school-shooting/fl-florida-school-shooting-20180215-story,amp.html

“I have been told by a couple of sources that the SRO was either called off campus responding to something happening or it could have been his day off,” she said.

It can’t be any more clear than that.

Also, noticed that 4 years ago the voters approved upgrades to school security, including things that would have helped prevent this shooting, but the school district has yet to do anything about it. Sad.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I think you can tackle both at the same time. This isn't a city or a state issue. Its a gun issue.

And if there were no guns, it would be a knife issue. And if there were no knives, it would be an (bow and) arrow issue. And if there were no arrows, it would be a club issue...and so on, and so on.

It's not a gun issue, it's a people issue. As I see it, the problem is not the tool of choice, but the choice of the person using the tool. Mass shootings is a very different issue than general gun violence. The approaches to solving them will be unrelated.

Banning semi-automatic weapons will not solve this issue. Single shot, reloading (i.e. revolver or pump action or bolt action) are just as deadly to those who get shot as a semi-automatic weapon. They're probably more dangerous because there's better aim and less rapid fire.

Banning weapons from specific locations will not solve this issue. Just like a lock is there to keep an honest person out, location bans are their to keep law-abiding people from carrying a weapon into those areas. A criminal or someone with ill-intent is not going to heed the warning that weapons are not allowed in a facility.

There are solutions. I don't necessarily know what those solutions are, but I would start with enforcing the current laws. Any new laws will be just as effective as the current laws if they're not enforced or the consequences enforced.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

And if there were no guns, it would be a knife issue. And if there were no knives, it would be an (bow and) arrow issue. And if there were no arrows, it would be a club issue...and so on, and so on.

It's not a gun issue, it's a people issue. As I see it, the problem is not the tool of choice, but the choice of the person using the tool. Mass shootings is a very different issue than general gun violence. The approaches to solving them willbe related.

Banning semi-automatic weapons will not solve this issue. Single shot, reloading (i.e. revolver or pump action or bolt action) are just as deadly to those who get shot as a semi-automatic weapon. They're probably more dangerous because there's better aim and less rapid fire.

Banning weapons from specific locations will not solve this issue. Just like a lock is there to keep an honest person out, location bans are their to keep law-abiding people from carrying a weapon into those areas. A criminal or someone with ill-intent is not going to heed the warning that weapons are not allowed in a facility.

There are solutions. I don't necessarily know what those solutions are, but I would start with enforcing the current laws. Any new laws will be just as effective as the current laws if they're not enforced or the consequences enforced.

I think you both are right, but you are ultimately most correct. It is a guns issue in that if they didn't exist, criminals would find other means to commit mayhem, but I would argue they would be much less successful. They would still use knives and cars and so on, yes. But those aren't as deadly as quickly.

Where he is wrong, as is nearly the entire anti-gun crowd is this ignorance (I don't mean to be rude but that's what it is) that 'banning assault weapons' will help. First, there is no such thing as assault weapons. They are murder weapons. Second, if you use their made up term, it would include all guns. Semi-automatics are 80% of what people buy. Furthermore, go to youtube and look up videos of bolt action and pump action guns - they can shoot just as quickly. One of the most popular handguns holds 17 bullets. So if you truly want to outlaw what you consider 'assault weapons', what you're really saying is to ban and confiscate all guns. That will never ever ever ever ever ever happen. Even if I agreed with that sentiment and wanted to do it I would still say that. Because the process of amending the Constitution for something that the vast majority of Americans want to keep (the 2nd Amendment) would never make it through.

A big piece of this in my opinion, is that people on the left politically don't want to admit that the breakdown of the family and traditional values is responsible for so many of these acts of violence. But science is right there to back it up. Mental illness, violence, shootings, ending up in prison, drugs - you're 10-20 times more likely if you weren't raised in a 2 parent family. But that doesn't fit the narrative of the left that marriage and family and Christian morals don't matter. They just want to yell in our face that praying to God does nothing.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I think you both are right, but you are ultimately most correct. It is a guns issue in that if they didn't exist, criminals would find other means to commit mayhem, but I would argue they would be much less successful. They would still use knives and cars and so on, yes. But those aren't as deadly as quickly.

Where he is wrong, as is nearly the entire anti-gun crowd is this ignorance (I don't mean to be rude but that's what it is) that 'banning assault weapons' will help. First, there is no such thing as assault weapons. They are murder weapons. Second, if you use their made up term, it would include all guns. Semi-automatics are 80% of what people buy. Furthermore, go to youtube and look up videos of bolt action and pump action guns - they can shoot just as quickly. One of the most popular handguns holds 17 bullets. So if you truly want to outlaw what you consider 'assault weapons', what you're really saying is to ban and confiscate all guns. That will never ever ever ever ever ever happen. Even if I agreed with that sentiment and wanted to do it I would still say that. Because the process of amending the Constitution for something that the vast majority of Americans want to keep (the 2nd Amendment) would never make it through.

A big piece of this in my opinion, is that people on the left politically don't want to admit that the breakdown of the family and traditional values is responsible for so many of these acts of violence. But science is right there to back it up. Mental illness, violence, shootings, ending up in prison, drugs - you're 10-20 times more likely if you weren't raised in a 2 parent family. But that doesn't fit the narrative of the left that marriage and family and Christian morals don't matter. They just want to yell in our face that praying to God does nothing.

You've just repeated everything I've said in this thread. Unless you ban everything outside of black powder rifles, someone can go on a rampage and create mass murder with any type of firearm. Also, unless a Constitutional amendment is passed reversing the 2nd Amendment, that's not going to happen. So, let's get to the root of the problem instead of trying to put a band-aid on it. And yes, enforcing the current laws (including those charging current gun owners with the proper/safe keeping of the weapons they own) will go a long way to reduce access to those who have no business touching firearms.

 

[UgaBlows]

I’m not anti-gun, i own guns and enjoy shooting them, but i think some common sense legislation would help make it harder for insane people and criminals to get guns. Even if better background checks don’t completely solve the problem, what do they hurt? Also, i believe that it’s a fact that kids have escaped at Sandy Hook and Parkland while the shooters reloaded, every second counts in those situations so high capacity mags DO make a difference. Making schools safer with better security and armed guards and teachers won’t solve anything imo, all a shooter would have to do is wait down the road and ambush schoolbus’s full of kids as they leave the property. I hate being scared for my kids everyday while they are at school, i hope these attacks can be addressed somehow and greatly reduced. I get that cars, hammers and mcdonalds kills people too, but school and church are places that one shouldn’t have to worry about dying violently.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I’m not anti-gun, i own guns and enjoy shooting them, but i think some comon sense legislation would help make it harder for insane people and criminals to get guns. Even if better background checks don’t completely solve the problem, what do they hurt? Also, i believe that it’s a fact that kids have escaped at Sandy Hook and Parkland while the shooters reloaded, every second counts in those situations so high capacity mags DO make a difference. Making schools safer with better security and armed guards and teachers won’t solve anything imo, all a shooter would have to do is wait down the road and ambush schoolbus’s full of kids as they leave the property. I hate being scared for my kids everyday while they are at school, i hope these attacks can be addressed somehow and greatly reduced. I get that cars, hammers and mcdonalds kills people too, but school and church are places that one shouldn’t have to worry about dying violently.

I agree with everything you've said here too. I'm not an advocate for no legislation; I want effective laws. But I'm also not an advocate of reactionary knee-jerk legislation driven by fear. Laws for laws' sake aren't going to solve the problem.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I’m not anti-gun, i own guns and enjoy shooting them, but i think some comon sense legislation would help make it harder for insane people and criminals to get guns. Even if better background checks don’t completely solve the problem, what do they hurt? Also, i believe that it’s a fact that kids have escaped at Sandy Hook and Parkland while the shooters reloaded, every second counts in those situations so high capacity mags DO make a difference. Making schools safer with better security and armed guards and teachers won’t solve anything imo, all a shooter would have to do is wait down the road and ambush schoolbus’s full of kids as they leave the property. I hate being scared for my kids everyday while they are at school, i hope these attacks can be addressed somehow and greatly reduced. I get that cars, hammers and mcdonalds kills people too, but school and church are places that one shouldn’t have to worry about dying violently.

I agree with everything you said too. I might nit-pick the capacity argument, but you're probably headed where I am going too - I don't think we need 50-100+ magazines. But at the end of the day, if you can carry 200 bullets you can carry 200 bullets. Someone can change a magazine in 2 seconds. I think arguing that the 2 seconds is material compared to the rest of the incident is going to get us very far. I have no argument around 10-20 bullet magazines. If someone's wife is in the house and 3 guys are trying to break in, I don't want her to have to worry about her aim - she should be able to rain down holy terror. Its kind of back to the argument around 'assault weapons'. You can learn to fire any gun about as fast as you can pull the trigger.

 

[UgaBlows]

Most of these nutjobs aren’t exactly navy seals and probably can’t change mags that quick, plus adrenaline etc can cause mistakes, basically any pause can give people a chance to break cover or rush the shooter.

 

[A Love Supreme]

And Democrats have been saying to shoot NRA funded Republicans. So what.

What Democratic lawmaker said that?