Jeff Sims

[4shotB]

No one is moving the chains at all!

This brawl is not one of these new-fangled 55 - 48 shootouts where moving the chains is necessary and field goals are looked upon as a step backwards if not with outright scorn and derision. We are looking at an old school, duke it out in the mud over field position, punt on 3rd down, 3 yards and a cloud of dusk palaver here. Neither side asks or expects to receive no quarter in these affairs.

 

[ChicagobasedJacket]

No excuses, just facts. These clips are cherry picked, I would be willing to have a discussion with you if you also showed the same amount of great throws he's made which hes made quite a few, many in clutch situations. You claim to be a fan of Yates, however, pushing the narrative that he cant make the same throws as Sims is once again wrong. Sims legs and arm strength are what gives him more upside. Yates however is a better game manager and makes better decisions with the ball. I personally put more weight on taking care of the ball than the other attributes.

What great throws has Yates made? He doesn’t turn it over but he hasn’t stretched the field. It’s obvious Yates is the better game manager but we aren’t winning with a game manager

 

[Gtswifty81]

Interception numbers came from here:

Jeff Sims 2020 Stats per Game - NCAAF - ESPN

The 2020 NCAAF season stats per game for Jeff Sims of the Arizona State Sun Devils on ESPN. Includes full stats, per opponent, for regular and postseason.

www.espn.com

Had to dig into stats for each game to get fumbles. And I did only count fumbles lost as a fumble not lost doesn't count as a TO. But this is what I had:

Date	Opponent	Outcome	INT	FUM	Total
09/12/2020​	FSU	W	2​	0​	2​
09/19/2020​	UCF	L	2​	1​	3​
09/26/2020​	SYR	L	4​	0​	4​
10/09/2020​	LOU	W	0​	0​	0​
10/17/2020​	CLEM	L	1​	2​	3​
10/24/2020​	BC	L	1​	1​	2​
10/31/2021​	ND	L	0​	1​	1​
11/28/2020​	DUKE	W	1​	0​	1​
12/05/2020​	NC ST	L	0​	0​	0​
12/10/2020​	PITT	L	2​	0​	2​
09/04/2021​	NIU	L	0​	1​	1​
09/25/2021​	UNC	W	0​	0​	0​
10/02/2021​	PITT	L	2​	0​	2​
10/09/2021​	DUKE	W	2​	0​	2​
10/23/2021​	UVA	L	1​	0​	1​
10/30/2021​	VT	L	1​	1​	2​

Sims is more of a high risk high reward QB at this point in his career and I think most people would agree. Yates is definitely more careful with the ball but makes less big plays than Sims which I also think most people would agree with. I don’t think Sims turnovers on offense are really our issue as I think he generates more offense than he gives up with turnovers which I know is debatable.

I’d definitely like to have a few less turnovers but at this stage of Sims development his turnovers don’t surprise me. I think our defense generating turnovers is more of our issue. I think we are ranked 50th in turnovers lost on offense and 102nd in turnovers gained on defense so our turnover margin is 84th. We aren’t good enough to overcome 84th in turnover margin. If we could change that statistic we probably could have two more wins even with as bad as we’ve looked at times.

 

[bobongo]

Sims is more of a high risk high reward QB at this point in his career and I think most people would agree. Yates is definitely more careful with the ball but makes less big plays than Sims which I also think most people would agree with. I don’t think Sims turnovers on offense are really our issue as I think he generates more offense than he gives up with turnovers which I know is debatable.

I’d definitely like to have a few less turnovers but at this stage of Sims development his turnovers don’t surprise me. I think our defense generating turnovers is more of our issue. I think we are ranked 50th in turnovers lost on offense and 102nd in turnovers gained on defense so our turnover margin is 84th. We aren’t good enough to overcome 84th in turnover margin. If we could change that statistic we probably could have two more wins even with as bad as we’ve looked at times.

Speaking for myself, I'm glad to have both of them. As has been pointed out, Sims turned the ball over 16 times in his first 8 games and 10 times in his last 8. Hopefully, that improvement will continue. Love Yates coming off the bench and would like to see more of him at times. There are occasions when the starter could benefit from a little time off the field. And I have faith that Yates could very well win us some games given the chance and enough playing time under his belt.

 

[bobongo]

What great throws has Yates made? He doesn’t turn it over but he hasn’t stretched the field. It’s obvious Yates is the better game manager but we aren’t winning with a game manager

I remember him threading the needle on a fourth down play when we absolutely had to have it. Can't remember which game and can't find the clip, but it was one of those thrown into double coverage where he normally would have thrown the ball away except that it was fourth down and we had to have it. He's made numerous good throws (too bad you can't remember them), but that one sticks out as the best one.

You'll find some good throws here:



And here:

 

[bobongo]

This brawl is not one of these new-fangled 55 - 48 shootouts where moving the chains is necessary and field goals are looked upon as a step backwards if not with outright scorn and derision. We are looking at an old school, duke it out in the mud over field position, punt on 3rd down, 3 yards and a cloud of dusk palaver here. Neither side asks or expects to receive no quarter in these affairs.

Well, some are trying to tear down one QB to build up the other. Me, I think both have talent and both have the potential to win.

 

[4shotB]

Well, some are trying to tear down one QB to build up the other. Me, I think both have talent and both have the potential to win.

No worries...I wasn't paying much attention so I don't know whose "side" anyone is on and I agree with two points A) I am glad to have both guys and feel like Yates is in the Tim Byerly class as a 1b type of guy who is more than just serviceable and B) I don't like zero-sum games either when comparing players, coaches, etc.

 

[WreckinGT]

Sims is more of a high risk high reward QB at this point in his career and I think most people would agree. Yates is definitely more careful with the ball but makes less big plays than Sims which I also think most people would agree with. I don’t think Sims turnovers on offense are really our issue as I think he generates more offense than he gives up with turnovers which I know is debatable.

I’d definitely like to have a few less turnovers but at this stage of Sims development his turnovers don’t surprise me. I think our defense generating turnovers is more of our issue. I think we are ranked 50th in turnovers lost on offense and 102nd in turnovers gained on defense so our turnover margin is 84th. We aren’t good enough to overcome 84th in turnover margin. If we could change that statistic we probably could have two more wins even with as bad as we’ve looked at times.

I think people underestimate how a turnover flips a game sometimes. Against UVA we looked unstoppable in the beginning. Three scores in a row, on their 25 coming in for another score. Bad interception thrown. After that, 4 punts in the next 5 drives. None of those drives go for more than 5 plays. Against Duke, we look unstoppable on the first two drives. Third drive intercepted. We punt or get intercepted on 7 of the next 9 drives. Turnovers can kill a teams momentum and swing confidence the other direction. That's happening too much to us.

 

[orientalnc]

I think people underestimate how a turnover flips a game sometimes. Against UVA we looked unstoppable in the beginning. Three scores in a row, on their 25 coming in for another score. Bad interception thrown. After that, 4 punts in the next 5 drives. None of those drives go for more than 5 plays. Against Duke, we look unstoppable on the first two drives. Third drive intercepted. We punt or get intercepted on 7 of the next 9 drives. Turnovers can kill a teams momentum and swing confidence the other direction. That's happening too much to us.

The other side of that coin is the opponent's defense made whatever adjustments they needed to stop us.

We are not performing well on defense and that puts a lot of pressure on the offense to be almost mistake free. They are not there yet. In CGC's tenure the offense is making noticeable improvements week over week. So, I do not understand the griping about Sims' play. He and Gibbs and Mason, and more recently, Sanders, are keeping games close. I am not as convinced the defense is holding up their side of the line. Football intricacies are not my thing, so I do not know what or who is the problem. But trying to hang the blame for our losses on the one guy playing above expectations is not fair.

 

[InsideLB]

A QB's supporting cast matters and it matters A LOT.

Anyone remember VT QB Logan Thomas? He had a great freshman campaign and it looked like VT was SET at QB. Problem was that VT had awesome recievers, an excellent, veteran OL, and really good RBs that year.

When the supporting cast mostly moved on the next year Logan Thomas became a pretty meh QB.

With respect to Sim's supporting cast this season, I'd grade them as:

OL - C minus (Prior to injuries to top 3 guards and 1 starting OT I'd give the line a B to B-. We were able to run the ball fairly consistently and give Sims some time more often than not).

WR- B minus (Not a bad group overall. Has some playmaking ability. Separation can be an issue, drops have been a problem at times. With better protection it might be easier to grade. Generally when the ball is there they make the grab and we've had some big plays).

RB - A- (Gibbs is a plus receiving RB. Mason and Smith adequate). Mason is good in pass pro. Gibbs will get there.

 

[iceeater1969]

Well crap I knew the answer you didn't give me time to answer it

The old spit my coffee.

This is offseason quality posting.

Logic-
80% of population can't understand it.
Of the remaining 20 %, 80% of them will refuse to change there mind even when wrong. 80/20/4.

Love your rhetorical twist.

 

[Ibeeballin]

A QB's supporting cast matters and it matters A LOT.

Anyone remember VT QB Logan Thomas? He had a great freshman campaign and it looked like VT was SET at QB. Problem was that VT had awesome recievers, an excellent, veteran OL, and really good RBs that year.

When the supporting cast mostly moved on the next year Logan Thomas became a pretty meh QB.

With respect to Sim's supporting cast this season, I'd grade them as:

OL - C minus (Prior to injuries to top 3 guards and 1 starting OT I'd give the line a B to B-. We were able to run the ball fairly consistently and give Sims some time more often than not).

WR- B minus (Not a bad group overall. Has some playmaking ability. Separation can be an issue, drops have been a problem at times. With better protection it might be easier to grade. Generally when the ball is there they make the grab and we've had some big plays).

RB - A- (Gibbs is a plus receiving RB. Mason and Smith adequate). Mason is good in pass pro. Gibbs will get there.

Swap Gibbs and Mason on pass pro.

 

[WreckinGT]

The other side of that coin is the opponent's defense made whatever adjustments they needed to stop us.

We are not performing well on defense and that puts a lot of pressure on the offense to be almost mistake free. They are not there yet. In CGC's tenure the offense is making noticeable improvements week over week. So, I do not understand the griping about Sims' play. He and Gibbs and Mason, and more recently, Sanders, are keeping games close. I am not as convinced the defense is holding up their side of the line. Football intricacies are not my thing, so I do not know what or who is the problem. But trying to hang the blame for our losses on the one guy playing above expectations is not fair.

That would just mean that teams with really bad defenses are finding ways to shut us down in the middle of games, coincidentally right after turnovers. That wouldn't be a great sign either. I would never argue that the offense is a bigger problem than the defense but our offense isn't good by any stretch and isn't above critique.

 

[ScGold]

I love what our back-up brings to the game. Look back, you see I've always touted the "it" factor he brings. But, let's be real, it's not our offensive output or the turnovers that have been the reason we've lost games. In my opinion, we're probably not in most of these games if not for Sims's ability at QB. I think if we want to talk about games lost versus games won, we're talking about the wrong side of the ball.

OL has not made his life easy!!

 

[forensicbuzz]

Well, some are trying to tear down one QB to build up the other. Me, I think both have talent and both have the potential to win.

LOL! No one was tearing down Yates to build up Sims. Every comment @Ibeeballin made about Yates's deficiencies was in response to why Sims was starting over him and why the coaches continued to play Sims over Yates. He wasn't demonstrative about Yates's inabilities until others (present company included) asked for proof or attacked him when he offered examples of what he was saying. @Ibeeballin never said Yates was bad, that was someone else's projection.

A couple of fonts have gone on "ignore" since that interchange because it's obvious they have no football knowledge and have nothing useful to contribute.

 

[WreckinGT]

LOL! No one was tearing down Yates to build up Sims. Every comment @Ibeeballin made about Yates's deficiencies was in response to why Sims was starting over him and why the coaches continued to play Sims over Yates. He wasn't demonstrative about Yates's inabilities until others (present company included) asked for proof or attacked him when he offered examples of what he was saying. @Ibeeballin never said Yates was bad, that was someone else's projection.

A couple of fonts have gone on "ignore" since that interchange because it's obvious they have no football knowledge and have nothing useful to contribute.

Did you miss the whole "Pick a game Yates would’ve led us to victory post KSU" comment? Saying, we couldn't possibly win another game with this guy playing QB isn't exactly a compliment.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Did you miss the whole "Pick a game Yates would’ve led us to victory post KSU" comment? Saying, we couldn't possibly win another game with this guy playing QB isn't exactly a compliment.

Agreed, it seems harsh. But, I don't think he meant what you all are reading into that.

We've beaten Duke and UNC. In the UNC game Yates was struggling to move the ball. There's nothing to lead us to believe that was going to change that day. Duke required a heroic effort and some luck at the end of the game to win that one. We've lost every other game.

The discussion was about Yates and Sims. Can you honestly say that Yates would have led us to a win against UNC based on what we saw? Would he have made that throw at the end of the Duke game? Take away the turnovers, would that have changed the complexion of the other games? Probably not.

Tell me, what does Yates have in his repertoire that would have changed the outcome of any of our losses? Game management? I don't think that would have mattered with our defense. What can Yates do that Sims can't do that would have won any of the 6 games we've lost? In my mind, that was the question @Ibeeballin was asking.

To me, he wasn't trashing our backup QB, he was saying that Yates didn't have anything that would have changed the outcomes of those games. I infered that he believes Sims gave us a more tangible chance to win. I agree with him. I think the only outcome of those games if Yates would have played instead of Sims is that we would have lost against UNC, might have lost against Duke, and the other games would have not been as close.

 

[alagold]

Our biggest problem is a defense that gives up too many yds and pts.Our 2nd problem is a an Off that can't make a 1st down consistently--4 for 15 ain't going to make it.TOs are probably third.

 

[Ibeeballin]

Agreed, it seems harsh. But, I don't think he meant what you all are reading into that.

We've beaten Duke and UNC. In the UNC game Yates was struggling to move the ball. There's nothing to lead us to believe that was going to change that day. Duke required a heroic effort and some luck at the end of the game to win that one. We've lost every other game.

The discussion was about Yates and Sims. Can you honestly say that Yates would have led us to a win against UNC based on what we saw? Would he have made that throw at the end of the Duke game? Take away the turnovers, would that have changed the complexion of the other games? Probably not.

Tell me, what does Yates have in his repertoire that would have changed the outcome of any of our losses? Game management? I don't think that would have mattered with our defense. What can Yates do that Sims can't do that would have won any of the 6 games we've lost? In my mind, that was the question @Ibeeballin was asking.

To me, he wasn't trashing our backup QB, he was saying that Yates didn't have anything that would have changed the outcomes of those games. I infered that he believes Sims gave us a more tangible chance to win. I agree with him. I think the only outcome of those games if Yates would have played instead of Sims is that we would have lost against UNC, might have lost against Duke, and the other games would have not been as close.

They knew exactly what i was saying and inferring. Some just have an axe to grind

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

Sims is more of a high risk high reward QB at this point in his career and I think most people would agree. Yates is definitely more careful with the ball but makes less big plays than Sims which I also think most people would agree with. I don’t think Sims turnovers on offense are really our issue as I think he generates more offense than he gives up with turnovers which I know is debatable.

I’d definitely like to have a few less turnovers but at this stage of Sims development his turnovers don’t surprise me. I think our defense generating turnovers is more of our issue. I think we are ranked 50th in turnovers lost on offense and 102nd in turnovers gained on defense so our turnover margin is 84th. We aren’t good enough to overcome 84th in turnover margin. If we could change that statistic we probably could have two more wins even with as bad as we’ve looked at times.

Given the current state of this football team, Jeff Sims is the least of our worries.