Coronavirus Thread

[bobongo]

What "reopening" exactly is suggested to be "rolled back".

My point is that MSN wrote the article with terminology the excites liberals and infuriates conservatives. I don't describe myself as either. I just see this as a liberal news organization pandering to it's audience. Does MSN want to provide information to an informed public to assist society, or do they want to incite arguments between "their side" and the "other side"? I'm pretty sure I know the answer to that question, I just think it is pitiful that both "sides" would rather incite and complain about the other "side" rather than have constructive discussions.

Here's a link to the document. It's 359 pages long. It goes state by state, in alphabetical order. Happy reading!:

Exclusive: White House document shows 18 states in coronavirus 'red zone'

A White House document says 18 states are in the “red zone” for coronavirus cases. Eleven states are in the “red zone” for test positivity.

publicintegrity.org

 

[bobongo]

Time to disband the task force. It’s not something being open that is the problem - it is people’s behavior.

Well it isn't my task force. Maybe you need to write Washington, D.C.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Here's a link to the document. It's 359 pages long. It goes state by state, in alphabetical order. Happy reading!:

Exclusive: White House document shows 18 states in coronavirus 'red zone'

A White House document says 18 states are in the “red zone” for coronavirus cases. Eleven states are in the “red zone” for test positivity.

publicintegrity.org

For TLDNR - it goes state by state and is worthless. For the worst states in RED, it recommends not going to bars or gyms. That’s about it. About 98% is copy/paste from one state to the next to wear a mask, keep your distance, and limit gatherings. Yay, thanks task force!

 

[RonJohn]

Here's a link to the document. It's 359 pages long. It goes state by state, in alphabetical order. Happy reading!:

Exclusive: White House document shows 18 states in coronavirus 'red zone'

A White House document says 18 states are in the “red zone” for coronavirus cases. Eleven states are in the “red zone” for test positivity.

publicintegrity.org

I already read thru the document. At least the GA section. Thank you for pointing me to information that I was already able to find from your earlier post.

I also searched the document for "roll back" and "reopening". I didn't find those terms in the document anywhere. I wonder why MSN used those terms instead of the terms in the actual document?

 

[bobongo]

I already read thru the document. At least the GA section. Thank you for pointing me to information that I was already able to find from your earlier post.

I also searched the document for "roll back" and "reopening". I didn't find those terms in the document anywhere. I wonder why MSN used those terms instead of the terms in the actual document?

To my mind a more pertinent and important question would be, "Why wasn't the report made openly public by the Administration that produced it, instead of having to be exposed by the Center for Public Integrity?" But of course, maybe you just don't want to see it.

The reason the term "roll back" is used is for purposes of synthesization and brevity, I would imagine. If you object to the terminology, the whole document is there for you to read and decide for yourself. Since you object to MSN, how about "stricter coronavirus measures", as characterized by the New York Post? I would imagine that exact terminology is also not found verbatim in the report:

White House urges stricter coronavirus measures for 18 states in unpublished report

The report, dated July 14 and obtained by the non-profit Center for Public Integrity, said the states were in the “red zone” for COVID-19 cases.

nypost.com

From the article:
The document has been shared within the federal government but did not appear to be posted publicly.

Dr. Ashish Jha, director of the Harvard Global Health Institute, told the center he thought the information and recommendations were positive and should be shared with the public.

“The fact that it’s not public makes no sense to me,” Jha said Thursday. “Why are we hiding this information from the American people? This should be published and updated every day.”

 

[Deleted member 2897]

To my mind a more pertinent and important question would be, "Why wasn't the report made openly public by the Administration that produced it, instead of having to be exposed by the Center for Public Integrity?" But of course, maybe you just don't want to see it.

The reason the term "roll back" is used is for purposes of synthesization and brevity, I would imagine. If you object to the terminology, the whole document is there for you to read and decide for yourself. Since you object to MSN, how about "stricter coronavirus measures", as characterized by the New York Post? I would imagine that exact terminology is also not found verbatim in the report:

White House urges stricter coronavirus measures for 18 states in unpublished report

The report, dated July 14 and obtained by the non-profit Center for Public Integrity, said the states were in the “red zone” for COVID-19 cases.

nypost.com

From the article:
The document has been shared within the federal government but did not appear to be posted publicly.

Dr. Ashish Jha, director of the Harvard Global Health Institute, told the center he thought the information and recommendations were positive and should be shared with the public.

“The fact that it’s not public makes no sense to me,” Jha said Thursday. “Why are we hiding this information from the American people? This should be published and updated every day.”

It was probably never published because it’s worthless. A middle school student could have provided more value.

 

[bobongo]

It was probably never published because it’s worthless. A middle school student could have provided more value.

So who to believe, you or the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute?

Dr. Ashish Jha, director of the Harvard Global Health Institute, told the center he thought the information and recommendations were positive and should be shared with the public.

“The fact that it’s not public makes no sense to me,” Jha said Thursday. “Why are we hiding this information from the American people? This should be published and updated every day.”

 

[Deleted member 2897]

So who to believe, you or the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute?

Dr. Ashish Jha, director of the Harvard Global Health Institute, told the center he thought the information and recommendations were positive and should be shared with the public.

“The fact that it’s not public makes no sense to me,” Jha said Thursday. “Why are we hiding this information from the American people? This should be published and updated every day.”

I didn’t publish anything, stop trolling and picking fights.

You should read the document, there is nothing of value in it. In the “RED” states in the worst condition, it recommends limiting gatherings to 10 people and not going to bars or the gym. That’s it. Then there’s a bunch of copy/paste stuff across the board about masks and hygiene.

The fact that Harvard guy is so butthurt says more about him than you. You should email him and get his thoughts about why he thinks that information is secret, unknown, and needs to be shared.

 

[herb]

So who to believe, you or the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute?

Dr. Ashish Jha, director of the Harvard Global Health Institute, told the center he thought the information and recommendations were positive and should be shared with the public.

“The fact that it’s not public makes no sense to me,” Jha said Thursday. “Why are we hiding this information from the American people? This should be published and updated every day.”

Is he more reputable than the Head of the CDC? I was just told yesterday, probably rightfully so, that we shouldn't believe his statements about the reason for the spread. Can we get a clearinghouse for who to believe and when?

 

[takethepoints]

that’s the most embarrassing document I may have ever read in my life. What’s the assumption, that the gathering of people you insert to get your answer are crowded into a phone booth?

Well, the data are purely precautionary. If you wear a mask and keep your distance, a, say, 28% chance that someone in a gathering of 10 people is infected is not an estimate of whether you will contact or contract the virus. In fact, the chances of that would, I think, be pretty low. Oth, at 74 it isn't a risk I'm willing to take. Further, the risk estimates explode (as they should in a state where the rate of infection per 100K people is increasing at the same pace as Texas) as the size of the gathering grows. Yet another reason to not attend any Tech football games this fall, provided they allow fans in the stands.

Oh, and the new look sucks.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Well, the data are purely precautionary. If you wear a mask and keep your distance, a, say, 28% chance that someone in a gathering of 10 people is infected is not an estimate of whether you will contact or contract the virus. In fact, the chances of that would, I think, be pretty low. Oth, at 74 it isn't a risk I'm willing to take. Further, the risk estimates explode (as they should in a state where the rate of infection per 100K people is increasing at the same pace as Texas) as the size of the gathering grows. Yet another reason to not attend any Tech football games this fall, provided they allow fans in the stands.

Oh, and the new look sucks.

where I live, a gathering of 100 people says the chances of picking up the virus are well over 99%. I’ve been to two gatherings (running races) of about 100 people and a high school graduation that had 1000 people. And I have not gotten it yet. We went on vacation to Florida and stayed at a hotel where there were probably constantly 100 people around the pool and on their section of the beach, and we didn’t get it. And there are 4 of us in our family. According to that formula, we would have a better chance of being abducted by aliens. The only thing I can come up with is that their assumption is based upon that gathering crowding into a small space like a phone booth. Well duh! LOL. No matter the crowd size, don’t gather indoors around anybody close to you.

 

[FredJacket]

where I live, a gathering of 100 people says the chances of picking up the virus are well over 99%. I’ve been to two gatherings (running races) of about 100 people and a high school graduation that had 1000 people. And I have not gotten it yet. We went on vacation to Florida and stayed at a hotel where there were probably constantly 100 people around the pool and on their section of the beach, and we didn’t get it. And there are 4 of us in our family. According to that formula, we would have a better chance of being abducted by aliens. The only thing I can come up with is that their assumption is based upon that gathering crowding into a small space like a phone booth. Well duh! LOL. No matter the crowd size, don’t gather indoors around anybody close to you.

You make me laugh. ...& don't do that thing you do where you yell at people a guy who isn't arguing with you. I literally mean... & only mean... you made me laugh with this.

 

[RonJohn]

To my mind a more pertinent and important question would be, "Why wasn't the report made openly public by the Administration that produced it, instead of having to be exposed by the Center for Public Integrity?" But of course, maybe you just don't want to see it.

The reason the term "roll back" is used is for purposes of synthesization and brevity, I would imagine. If you object to the terminology, the whole document is there for you to read and decide for yourself. Since you object to MSN, how about "stricter coronavirus measures", as characterized by the New York Post? I would imagine that exact terminology is also not found verbatim in the report:

Do you believe that I am a right-wing believe nothing that a liberal media organization publishes type of person? If you have read my posts, it should be obvious that I am not. I have been extremely negative about media reporting from both liberal leaning and conservative leaning news organizations. I advocate people getting information from many different sources of different biases while ignoring the biased writing, and then searching for the source material. You didn't notice, but in the post that you responded to with a link to the document I had actually quoted the document.

My complaint about the wording of the MSN headline is that it is worded precisely the way that a liberal would argue ideological points with a conservative. Would you rather have people look objectively at what is happening and discuss how to proceed, or would you rather have liberals say:"ROLL BACK REOPENING BECAUSE THOSE GOVERNORS ARE IDIOTS." and conservatives respond:"I CAN GO FISHING BY MYSELF IF I WANT TO AND I'M NOT GONNA WEAR A MASK EITHER."?

As it is, some people are looking at slivers of the data and declaring that this is the Armageddon. Other people who would typically call someone a "snowflake" because they are concerned about the rising cost of college are now saying that wearing a mask is so physically difficult that they can't breathe and are going to die if they wear it longer than 5 minutes. Neither side of the "debate" is about science. It is all about continuing the liberal vs conservative debate that has been going on for years.

 

[bobongo]

I didn’t publish anything, stop trolling and picking fights.

You should read the document, there is nothing of value in it. In the “RED” states in the worst condition, it recommends limiting gatherings to 10 people and not going to bars or the gym. That’s it. Then there’s a bunch of copy/paste stuff across the board about masks and hygiene.

The fact that Harvard guy is so butthurt says more about him than you. You should email him and get his thoughts about why he thinks that information is secret, unknown, and needs to be shared.

You didn't publish anything? I never said you did. But you said the document produced by the task force was "worthless". I simply pointed out that the head of the Harvard Global Health Institute, that "Harvard guy", begs to differ. I'm neither trolling nor picking a fight. Maybe Anthony Fauci could cast some light on the subject:

MSN

www.msn.com

Or most any other epidemiologist, for that matter.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

You didn't publish anything? I never said you did. But you said the document produced by the task force was "worthless". I simply pointed out that the head of the Harvard Global Health Institute, that "Harvard guy", begs to differ. I'm neither trolling nor picking a fight. Maybe Anthony Fauci could cast some light on the subject:

MSN

www.msn.com

Or most any other epidemiologist, for that matter.

I never said anything about you personally. I referenced that document to point out how worthless it is, as it is devoid of anything new. You responded by basically calling me ignorant. You didn’t use those words, but that was the gist of it. I asked you three times to read the document you yourself posted. Here is #4 - I’d love to learn something new - please reference any state and tell me something in it that is new and helpful. Or reference any single thing anybody else says is new and helpful. I couldn’t help but notice that Harvard guy didn’t point to anything. You can pick any state on any part of the document you want. Totally your choice.

Fauci is also the guy who publicly today warned of the consequences of not getting kids back into schools. He said there is a possibility we have over 2 million deaths. He said we shouldn’t shut down international travel. These are smart people, but they are not immune to debate.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

You just can't even make up crap like this ---
A person who died in a motorcycle accident was added to Florida’s COVID-19 death count, according to a state health official. FOX 35 News found this out after asking Orange County Health Officer Dr. Raul Pino whether two coronavirus victims who were in their 20s had any underlying conditions. One of his answers surprised us. “The first one didn’t have any. He died in a motorcycle accident,” Pino said. Dr. Pino was asked if the man’s data was removed. “I don’t think so. I have to double-check,” Pino said. “We were arguing, discussing, or trying to argue with the state. Not because of the numbers — it’s 100…it doesn’t make any difference if it’s 99 — but the fact that the individual didn’t die from COVID-19…died in the crash. But you could actually argue that it could have been the COVID-19 that caused him to crash. I don’t know the conclusion of that one.”

 

[Deleted member 2897]

You just can't even make up crap like this ---
A person who died in a motorcycle accident was added to Florida’s COVID-19 death count, according to a state health official. FOX 35 News found this out after asking Orange County Health Officer Dr. Raul Pino whether two coronavirus victims who were in their 20s had any underlying conditions. One of his answers surprised us. “The first one didn’t have any. He died in a motorcycle accident,” Pino said. Dr. Pino was asked if the man’s data was removed. “I don’t think so. I have to double-check,” Pino said. “We were arguing, discussing, or trying to argue with the state. Not because of the numbers — it’s 100…it doesn’t make any difference if it’s 99 — but the fact that the individual didn’t die from COVID-19…died in the crash. But you could actually argue that it could have been the COVID-19 that caused him to crash. I don’t know the conclusion of that one.”

HA HA HA HA HA!

In South Carolina, every day we have a separate category of presumed positive tests and presumed deaths. What those are, are people who actually TESTED NEGATIVE at least once, sometimes multiple times. But they displayed similar symptoms. This stuff gets real funny sometimes (in a not funny way). I mean, George Floyd was a COVID-19 death.

 

[bobongo]

I never said anything about you personally. I referenced that document to point out how worthless it is, as it is devoid of anything new. You responded by basically calling me ignorant. You didn’t use those words, but that was the gist of it.

No, I didn't use those words. I neither said nor implied anything of the kind. I simply cast light on the fact that your argument isn't so much with me as it is with the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute.

As far as the document is concerned, the point is that it was not made public, and it should have been IMO. I read it. No, there wasn't anything in the recommendations that has not already been discussed, but often when things are made public they have more impact, especially when they emanate from the White House Task Force. That was the point, which you once again pointedly ignored. Now, we all like transparency, don't we? I think we both know why the report wasn't released, and it has nothing to do with its intrinsic worth.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

No, I didn't use those words. I neither said nor implied anything of the kind. I simply cast light on the fact that your argument isn't so much with me as it is with the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute.

As far as the document is concerned, the point is that it was not made public, and it should have been IMO. I read it. No, there wasn't anything in the recommendations that has not already been discussed, but often when things are made public they have more impact, especially when they emanate from the White House Task Force. That was the point, which you once again pointedly ignored. Now, we all like transparency, don't we? I think we both know why the report wasn't released, and it has nothing to do with its intrinsic worth.

LOL. I have zero argument with the guy from Harvard. Not sure where you get that from. My argument has always been with the worthless document.

I think it wasn’t released because it’s an embarrassment. It had no value. There is nothing new in it. It’s pointless. The organization should be ashamed someone spent time on it. If I were in charge, that’s why I wouldn’t release it - it’s an indictment on the competency of the organization.

 

[Milwaukee]

You just can't even make up crap like this ---
A person who died in a motorcycle accident was added to Florida’s COVID-19 death count, according to a state health official. FOX 35 News found this out after asking Orange County Health Officer Dr. Raul Pino whether two coronavirus victims who were in their 20s had any underlying conditions. One of his answers surprised us. “The first one didn’t have any. He died in a motorcycle accident,” Pino said. Dr. Pino was asked if the man’s data was removed. “I don’t think so. I have to double-check,” Pino said. “We were arguing, discussing, or trying to argue with the state. Not because of the numbers — it’s 100…it doesn’t make any difference if it’s 99 — but the fact that the individual didn’t die from COVID-19…died in the crash. But you could actually argue that it could have been the COVID-19 that caused him to crash. I don’t know the conclusion of that one.”

This has been happening since day 1. We’re a bunch of idiots, I’ve never been more embarrassed to be American than I have during this pandemic. The sky is not falling. The posters here overreacting and spreading misinformation has set this site back years, they’re flat out lying on this site with their fear porn and have been called on it numerous times.