Coronavirus Thread

[Northeast Stinger]

I’m assuming you mean we don’t have one, which is false.

None that I can tell.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

None that I can tell.

At one point, FEMA had an elaborate website that detailed how a bunch of federal agencies were coordinating 24x7 with a bunch of state and local agencies and hospitals. The net of it is not a single patient went without a ventilator. They even intercepted other people’s orders for supplies when one area was low enough they had an emergency.

There are numerous examples like this. Doesn’t mean everything has gone well. They’re all but begging people to wear masks and socially distance right now but many Americans are ornery.

Some people’s personal affiliations blind them into thinking our response is the best in the world, whether the facts say so or not. And some others are the inverse. That to me has been the biggest problem in the pandemic.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

At one point, FEMA had an elaborate website that detailed how a bunch of federal agencies were coordinating 24x7 with a bunch of state and local agencies and hospitals. The net of it is not a single patient went without a ventilator. They even intercepted other people’s orders for supplies when one area was low enough they had an emergency.

There are numerous examples like this. Doesn’t mean everything has gone well. They’re all but begging people to wear masks and socially distance right now but many Americans are ornery.

Some people’s personal affiliations blind them into thinking our response is the best in the world, whether the facts say so or not. And some others are the inverse. That to me has been the biggest problem in the pandemic.

Communication has been terrible then.

State by state and city by city there has been a totally different attitude about whether masks are required in public or not, the size of crowds, and which types of businesses should or should not be open. Even in my small town the response has been different from person to person and business to business. And in each case they will quote a different government official whether the president or the governor.

Also puzzled that you say no shortage of ventilators. Would you also say that every hospital had plenty of PPE?

I just don’t see the same kind of nationally coordinated effort that we have seen in some other countries.

 

[bobongo]

You just have to look at the numbers. Most of those European countries had 40,000 deaths months ago, and all said they had thousands and thousands of deaths uncounted due to full hospitals. People were left at home to die. All of this they publicly state. Per capita, their deaths were incredibly worse than ours without New York City. New York City was very similar. It’s pretty easy to see, watch, and quantify. Antibody tests in NYC and those countries confirm massive levels of contagion.

We didn’t have a single person not get a ventilator who needed one. We have no reports of people dying by the thousands at home.

Indeed, and I'm not denying they had a bigger problem, although I will point out that their population is 1/3 bigger than ours, so you have to factor that in as well. The question is, why do they now, right now, have 4,000 cases a day when we have 57,000? Is it because they shut down more severely than we did, or is it because they had a bigger problem initially? I would contend that it has much more to do with their efforts at containment. The other "factor" doesn't make sense, because they still haven't reached anywhere remotely near herd immunity. Had they just sat there and let it rip, the curve would still be skyrockets instead of going down precipitously, as it did when they shut down. It just doesn't make sense that the reason they don't have as big a problem now is that they had a bigger problem previously.

The reason they have 4,000/day and we have 57,000/day is they shut down harder and longer than we did.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Communication has been terrible then.

State by state and city by city there has been a totally different attitude about whether masks are required in public or not, the size of crowds, and which types of businesses should or should not be open. Even in my small town the response has been different from person to person and business to business. And in each case they will quote a different government official whether the president or the governor.

Also puzzled that you say no shortage of ventilators. Would you also say that every hospital had plenty of PPE?

I just don’t see the same kind of nationally coordinated effort that we have seen in some other countries.

Whether or not we had enough PPE is all different topic than if we had a national strategy. Same with masks. The federal government says unconditionally we should all wear masks. Whether or not people wear them is also a different topic.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Indeed, and I'm not denying they had a bigger problem, although I will point out that their population is 1/3 bigger than ours, so you have to factor that in as well. The question is, why do they now, right now, have 4,000 cases a day when we have 57,000? Is it because they shut down more severely than we did, or is it because they had a bigger problem initially? I would contend that it has much more to do with their efforts at containment. The other "factor" doesn't make sense, because they still haven't reached anywhere remotely near herd immunity. Had they just sat there and let it rip, the curve would still be skyrockets instead of going down precipitously, as it did when they shut down. It just doesn't make sense that the reason they don't have as big a problem now is that they had a bigger problem previously.

The reason they have 4,000/day and we have 57,000/day is they shut down harder and longer than we did.

For what it is worth, there has yet to be any scientific evidence that herd immunity is even possible with this disease. In theory there might be but no evidence at all.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Whether or not we had enough PPE is all different topic than if we had a national strategy. Same with masks. The federal government says unconditionally we should all wear masks. Whether or not people wear them is also a different topic.

Whether or not we had enough PPE is all different topic than if we had a national strategy. Same with masks. The federal government says unconditionally we should all wear masks. Whether or not people wear them is also a different topic.

President has said more than once that people ought to be free not to wear masks. So, again, the national policy has been poorly communicated though admittedly the last few weeks they’ve done much better. Also, admittedly, there was a lot of confusion over whether states should open up or not and when. The president again gave conflicting and mixed messages about that.

I’m willing to be convinced there is a national policy (so I am not trying to be argumentative) it is just easier for me to say what Vietnam’s national policy is than what America’s is. Signal to noise ratio may be a factor.

 

[Techster]

On top of Covid in Florida, now there's this.

The earth and every living organism is fighting back against humans. Humans are the worst parasites on the planet...we deserve everything that's coming our way.

 

[FredJacket]

The earth and every living organism is fighting back against humans. Humans are the worst parasites on the planet...we deserve everything that's coming our way.

You win the largest broad brush possible award. Yours covers all of humanity.

 

[MWBATL]

For what it is worth, there has yet to be any scientific evidence that herd immunity is even possible with this disease. In theory there might be but no evidence at all.

Nor any evidence that herd immunity will not be possible. All we know is that the scientists all say it is likely. But, yes, no evidence as yet......

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/ar...r-than-previously-thought#Further-refinements

https://reason.com/2020/07/01/covid...han-antibody-tests-suggest-say-2-new-studies/

but who knows?

 

[MWBATL]

The earth and every living organism is fighting back against humans. Humans are the worst parasites on the planet...we deserve everything that's coming our way.

At last, the over-population issue comes to the fore. It is ultimately at the root of most climate change issues, and many other progressive issues. We need to restrict humanity’s ability to reproduce within tight limits.

 

[GT_EE78]

> some of this should be common sense, but that's often too much to hope for(seems to vary by age and other factors)
According to the Texas Medical Association, the activities included in the chart were ranked by physicians from the TMA COVID-19 Task Force and the TMA Committee on Infectious Diseases. Be informed. Know your risk. Stay safe. pic.twitter.com/t6G71wAHU6

 

[LibertyTurns]

We had 9,999 positive cases in Florida reported on Sunday. Miami Dade & metro areas are now almost half of Florida’s cases by themselves. We’re getting some reports of hospitals being at full ICU capacity. Interesting that some similarly sized hospitals a few miles away are at 70% capacity. Must be a micro hotspot area within a hotspot. It’s still crickets at our local hospital though.

More bad news our positive rate is creeping up, even where I live. We’re testing like crazy also, now it’s taking 4-5 days to get results back. I here supplies of testing reagent are running thin. That’s not good news because China owns that market.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Self-extermination would seem an obvious starting point.

 

[jacketup]

> some of this should be common sense, but that's often too much to hope for(seems to vary by age and other factors)
According to the Texas Medical Association, the activities included in the chart were ranked by physicians from the TMA COVID-19 Task Force and the TMA Committee on Infectious Diseases. Be informed. Know your risk. Stay safe. pic.twitter.com/t6G71wAHU6


View attachment 8513

The risk of death doesn't just "seem to vary" by age, it does vary. The latest CDC statistic shows 156 total deaths in the 5-24 age group (school age) out of a population of over 80 million. The risk of death to people under 55 and people in good health isn't substantially greater than the flu--if it is greater. There is a risk of getting many viruses to which that chart applies.

And the chart isn't wholly accurate and is somewhat misleading. There is a big difference between an outdoor sports stadium on a sunny day and an indoor area. There is also a big difference between an amusement park in the daytime (if you keep your hands clean) and working out at gym. Why is an amusement park an 8 and a playground a 4?

For most age groups the risk death of traveling in a car is much higher than death from the virus, and then add in the risk of serious injury from traveling in a car. Yet we don't stop people from driving.

There is a lack of common sense in all of this, but it goes beyond this subjective chart. Unfortunately, the lack of common sense from public's reaction--fueled by the media-- has lead to government action on the state and local level that is ruining our economy.

 

[Techster]

You win the largest broad brush possible award. Yours covers all of humanity.

LOL...

 

[bobongo]

At last, the over-population issue comes to the fore. It is ultimately at the root of most climate change issues, and many other progressive issues. We need to restrict humanity’s ability to reproduce within tight limits.

I did my part.

 

[GT_EE78]

The risk of death doesn't just "seem to vary" by age, it does vary. The latest CDC statistic shows 156 total deaths in the 5-24 age group (school age) out of a population of over 80 million. The risk of death to people under 55 and people in good health isn't substantially greater than the flu--if it is greater. There is a risk of getting many viruses to which that chart applies.

And the chart isn't wholly accurate and is somewhat misleading. There is a big difference between an outdoor sports stadium on a sunny day and an indoor area. There is also a big difference between an amusement park in the daytime (if you keep your hands clean) and working out at gym. Why is an amusement park an 8 and a playground a 4?

For most age groups the risk death of traveling in a car is much higher than death from the virus, and then add in the risk of serious injury from traveling in a car. Yet we don't stop people from driving.

There is a lack of common sense in all of this, but it goes beyond this subjective chart. Unfortunately, the lack of common sense from public's reaction--fueled by the media-- has lead to government action on the state and local level that is ruining our economy.

my bad(I forgot to include)>The Texas Medical Association has released a chart explaining which behaviors put you at risk of getting COVID-19.
So,it's not risk of death.
I'd still agree with you that the chart is too vague in spots(and lacks supporting data), they must have thought it needed to be simple for gen-Y.if thats 20somethings

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Nor any evidence that herd immunity will not be possible. All we know is that the scientists all say it is likely. But, yes, no evidence as yet......

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/ar...r-than-previously-thought#Further-refinements

https://reason.com/2020/07/01/covid...han-antibody-tests-suggest-say-2-new-studies/

but who knows?

Interesting and hopeful but the caveat remains even from those involved in the study that no proof yet that this will protect against infection. Also not peer reviewed.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

Nor any evidence that herd immunity will not be possible. All we know is that the scientists all say it is likely. But, yes, no evidence as yet......

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/ar...r-than-previously-thought#Further-refinements

https://reason.com/2020/07/01/covid...han-antibody-tests-suggest-say-2-new-studies/

but who knows?

Interesting. If the common cold provides some immunity, we have a pseudo-vaccine. Just get a damn cold and be done with it. I doubt it's that easy ......