Coronavirus Thread

[bobongo]

Lockdown has been eased too soon in the US - and was never strict enough - warns Dr Fauci as he slams young people hitting beaches, bars and protests who risk infecting the vulnerable amid 'disturbing' spike in cases to over 52,000 a day

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...n-eased-soon-never-strict-warns-Dr-Fauci.html

From the article:
"Dr Fauci, the White House's top virus adviser, said the 'very disturbing' new rise in cases is being caused in part by the fact that the US never got its first wave under control - only locking down around 50 per cent of the country compared to 97 per cent as happened in most of Europe where daily infections are now very low.

 

[LibertyTurns]

Well I was wrong on Friday’s number as I way overshot but nailed today: 11,458. Here comes 12k.

 

[FredJacket]

Lockdown has been eased too soon in the US - and was never strict enough - warns Dr Fauci as he slams young people hitting beaches, bars and protests who risk infecting the vulnerable amid 'disturbing' spike in cases to over 52,000 a day

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...n-eased-soon-never-strict-warns-Dr-Fauci.html

From the article:
"Dr Fauci, the White House's top virus adviser, said the 'very disturbing' new rise in cases is being caused in part by the fact that the US never got its first wave under control - only locking down around 50 per cent of the country compared to 97 per cent as happened in most of Europe where daily infections are now very low.

Admittedly, I've basically disengaged in this thread. It's been nice. Not picking on you @bobongo but these quotes trigger me. Specifically... the term "lockdown" ...it has never been defined. Which isn't a problem (using it subjectively) until folks start saying 50% (in US) v 97% (in Europe). ?? How are those numbers measured or observed? Folks throw that word lockdown around & I am certain if 10 of us honestly tried to say what it means (or looks like), you'd get 10 different answers. I'd say 0% of US or EU was ever locked down...by my definition. Lockdown means no movement (see how elementary schools use it). No movement isn't realistic... so lockdown becomes meaningless unless I missed a new definition relative to covid response.

I'm sure the US has responded & implemented & complied in a relatively "less than" way than Europe... but putting any number (%) to it isn't telling us anything... at least not me.

Bottom line... I am left not knowing or having much useful relevant info. It is all very muddied immediately.

 

[bobongo]

Admittedly, I've basically disengaged in this thread. It's been nice. Not picking on you @bobongo but these quotes trigger me. Specifically... the term "lockdown" ...it has never been defined. Which isn't a problem (using it subjectively) until folks start saying 50% (in US) v 97% (in Europe). ?? How are those numbers measured or observed? Folks throw that word lockdown around & I am certain if 10 of us honestly tried to say what it means (or looks like), you'd get 10 different answers. I'd say 0% of US or EU was ever locked down...by my definition. Lockdown means no movement (see how elementary schools use it). No movement isn't realistic... so lockdown becomes meaningless unless I missed a new definition relative to covid response.

I'm sure the US has responded & implemented & complied in a relatively "less than" way than Europe... but putting any number (%) to it isn't telling us anything... at least not me.

Bottom line... I am left not knowing or having much useful relevant info. It is all very muddied immediately.

50% of the country was locked down as opposed to 97% of Europe, and that is at least part of the reason for the disturbing spike in cases we are seeing, according to Dr. Fauci. Coupled with the fact that the lockdown was eased too soon.

He said it, not me. He's the top Administration coronavirus advisor, and director of the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Diseases of the National Institutes of Health. He's been referred to by many on here as the top expert in his field, if not the top expert.

 

[FredJacket]

50% of the country was locked down as opposed to 97% of Europe, and that is at least part of the reason for the disturbing spike in cases we are seeing, according to Dr. Fauci. Coupled with the fact that the lockdown was eased too soon.

He said it, not me. He's the top Administration coronavirus advisor, and director of the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Diseases of the National Institutes of Health. He's been referred to by many on here as the top expert in his field, if not the top expert.

My comment wasn't directed at you. I don't know what we did 50% of or how Europe managed to do 97% of it... I don't believe Dr Fauci does either. Doesn't make him an idiot or someone who I should not listen to... but in this case, he's not helping ME understand the problem he's observed.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

50% of the country was locked down as opposed to 97% of Europe, and that is at least part of the reason for the disturbing spike in cases we are seeing, according to Dr. Fauci. Coupled with the fact that the lockdown was eased too soon.

He said it, not me. He's the top Administration coronavirus advisor, and director of the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Diseases of the National Institutes of Health. He's been referred to by many on here as the top expert in his field, if not the top expert.

What 50% was not locked down and how do you define that?

 

[RonJohn]

50% of the country was locked down as opposed to 97% of Europe, and that is at least part of the reason for the disturbing spike in cases we are seeing, according to Dr. Fauci.

He said it, not me. He's the top Administration coronavirus advisor, and director of the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Diseases of the National Institutes of Health. He's been referred to by many on here as the top expert in his field, if not the top expert.

The article didn't provide that as a quote. In fact they attribute him to saying that the US never got the first wave under control. Then they use a dash and state that the US only locked down 50% vs 97% for Europe. It doesn't appear that they actually attribute those percentages to Fauci.

Also regarding the numbers, seven states in the US did not issue stay at home orders. Seven of fifty is not fifty percent. Those seven states only make up 13.6% of the geographic area of the US, so they don't make up 50% of the area. None of those has a large population, so they don't make up 50% of the population.

As @FredJacket was asking, where does 50% come from? Where does 97% come from? What is DailyMail's definition of lockdown?

 

[Deleted member 2897]

The article didn't provide that as a quote. In fact they attribute him to saying that the US never got the first wave under control. Then they use a dash and state that the US only locked down 50% vs 97% for Europe. It doesn't appear that they actually attribute those percentages to Fauci.

Also regarding the numbers, seven states in the US did not issue stay at home orders. Seven of fifty is not fifty percent. Those seven states only make up 13.6% of the geographic area of the US, so they don't make up 50% of the area. None of those has a large population, so they don't make up 50% of the population.

As @FredJacket was asking, where does 50% come from? Where does 97% come from? What is DailyMail's definition of lockdown?

Some of that has been BS from the beginning. In my state we issued stay at home orders on March 15th-ish. We were never given credit for it for like 30 more days until we increased the fine for violation. It all appears arbitrary to me.

 

[RonJohn]

Some of that has been BS from the beginning. In my state we issued stay at home orders on March 15th-ish. We were never given credit for it for like 30 more days until we increased the fine for violation. It all appears arbitrary to me.

The SC governor closed some schools on 3/13.
On 3/19, he issued an order to help unemployment claims and that enabled public university presidents to allow people the consider non-essential to work from home.
On 3/21 he issued an order that allowed sealed alcohol to-go from restaurants, and asked for PPE donations from construction companies.
On 3/23 he issued an order that permitted police to break up large groups.
On 3/30 he closed beach access.
On 3/31 he issued an order closing non-essential businesses, which had a list of such business types.
On 4/6 he issued the "Home or Work" order.

SC might have been similar to Georgia in that many local authorities had closed bars, restaurants, etc and had issued stay at home orders weeks before the governor issued one state wide. However, looking through the governor's website and his orders, SC was not under a state issued shutdown for business until 3/31, and then not directed by the state to stay at home until 4/6.

 

[RonJohn]

The article didn't provide that as a quote. In fact they attribute him to saying that the US never got the first wave under control. Then they use a dash and state that the US only locked down 50% vs 97% for Europe. It doesn't appear that they actually attribute those percentages to Fauci.

Also regarding the numbers, seven states in the US did not issue stay at home orders. Seven of fifty is not fifty percent. Those seven states only make up 13.6% of the geographic area of the US, so they don't make up 50% of the area. None of those has a large population, so they don't make up 50% of the population.

As @FredJacket was asking, where does 50% come from? Where does 97% come from? What is DailyMail's definition of lockdown?

I did find an article from the Hill that does attribute those percentages to Fauci, but it doesn't quote him just paraphrase. I would need to find a video of the testimony to understand exactly what he said.

Also, I looked at the cell phone mobility report from Apple, and I don't see a 97% drop in Europe, even in Italy. I see a much larger than 50% drop in the US. What he actually said and where the data comes from are important.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

The SC governor closed some schools on 3/13.
On 3/19, he issued an order to help unemployment claims and that enabled public university presidents to allow people the consider non-essential to work from home.
On 3/21 he issued an order that allowed sealed alcohol to-go from restaurants, and asked for PPE donations from construction companies.
On 3/23 he issued an order that permitted police to break up large groups.
On 3/30 he closed beach access.
On 3/31 he issued an order closing non-essential businesses, which had a list of such business types.
On 4/6 he issued the "Home or Work" order.

SC might have been similar to Georgia in that many local authorities had closed bars, restaurants, etc and had issued stay at home orders weeks before the governor issued one state wide. However, looking through the governor's website and his orders, SC was not under a state issued shutdown for business until 3/31, and then not directed by the state to stay at home until 4/6.

It’s totally understandable why outsiders just don’t know. In SC, the governor doesn’t like to make state dictums unless he has to. Where I live, our beaches are Isle of Palms and Sullivan’s Island. Not only were those beaches closed in March, they set up physical checkpoints and didn’t even allow traffic to enter the city limits unless you lived or worked there. We had a Chinese lockdown!

And so on. It makes it very difficult for people who don’t live here to keep up I’m sure. But yea, you have to dig deeper - for example, our state doesn’t mandate masks, but all the cities and towns do.

 

[ramblinwreckguru]

50% of the country was locked down as opposed to 97% of Europe, and that is at least part of the reason for the disturbing spike in cases we are seeing, according to Dr. Fauci. Coupled with the fact that the lockdown was eased too soon.

He said it, not me. He's the top Administration coronavirus advisor, and director of the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Diseases of the National Institutes of Health. He's been referred to by many on here as the top expert in his field, if not the top expert.

This was the man who also said that mask wearing by non medical personnel was not necessary and then magically flip flopped 2 months later. Not sure we can believe what he says. He could flip flop at any time, and I'm sure there will be a lot of flip flopping after 11/4.

 

[bobongo]

This was the man who also said that mask wearing by non medical personnel was not necessary and then magically flip flopped 2 months later. Not sure we can believe what he says. He could flip flop at any time, and I'm sure there will be a lot of flip flopping after 11/4.

Under the bus.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

This was the man who also said that mask wearing by non medical personnel was not necessary and then magically flip flopped 2 months later. Not sure we can believe what he says. He could flip flop at any time, and I'm sure there will be a lot of flip flopping after 11/4.

The Surgeon General was on all the weekend shows begging people to wear masks. This is the same guy who said unconditionally they do nothing a few months ago. This is what happens when you don’t let science dictate your recommendations and actions.

 

[RonJohn]

It’s totally understandable why outsiders just don’t know. In SC, the governor doesn’t like to make state dictums unless he has to. Where I live, our beaches are Isle of Palms and Sullivan’s Island. Not only were those beaches closed in March, they set up physical checkpoints and didn’t even allow traffic to enter the city limits unless you lived or worked there. We had a Chinese lockdown!

And so on. It makes it very difficult for people who don’t live here to keep up I’m sure. But yea, you have to dig deeper - for example, our state doesn’t mandate masks, but all the cities and towns do.

And almost every town in Georgia had restrictions and curfews in place one to two weeks before Kemp issued a statewide mandate in Georgia.

You are correct in that not having a statewide stay at home order does not mean that everyone is doing whatever they want to. However, just because businesses, cities, and counties are doing things does not mean that the state government is doing things. Your statement earlier was that state orders were in place much earlier, but only accepted by the media when harsher penalties were put in place. That simply isn't true. I provided a timeline of state orders based on the SC governor's website which lists his orders.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

And almost every town in Georgia had restrictions and curfews in place one to two weeks before Kemp issued a statewide mandate in Georgia.

You are correct in that not having a statewide stay at home order does not mean that everyone is doing whatever they want to. However, just because businesses, cities, and counties are doing things does not mean that the state government is doing things. Your statement earlier was that state orders were in place much earlier, but only accepted by the media when harsher penalties were put in place. That simply isn't true. I provided a timeline of state orders based on the SC governor's website which lists his orders.

As it pertains to stay at home orders, it absolutely is true. Even when they increased the fines, the media couldn’t stand how he called the order “stay at Home Or Work” - “Why can’t you just call it stay at home so we can get out of the news” LOLOLOLOL. IIWII.

Your reading of our state is wrong. Sorry, it just IWII. From the very first part where he “closed some schools” to the very end. All schools were closed March 15th. And so on.

 

[RonJohn]

As it pertains to stay at home orders, it absolutely is true. Even when they increased the fines, the media couldn’t stand how he called the order “stay at Home Or Work” - “Why can’t you just call it stay at home so we can get out of the news” LOLOLOLOL. IIWII.

Your reading of our state is wrong. Sorry, it just IWII. From the very first part where he “closed some schools” to the very end.

Your reading of every other state is wrong. In Georgia, the exact same thing that happened in SC happened here. Schools shutdown statewide on 3/13. Some areas immediately issued local stay at home orders. The beaches outside of Savannah were shut down by the local government. By about 3/23 an extreme majority of the cities and counties in Georgia had issued stay at home orders and curfews. Local governments were doing the exact same things that local governments in SC were doing. SC wasn't ahead of the country.

I wan't "reading" your state. I was reading the SC governor's webpage and citing his orders as he lists them, and on the dates that he lists that he issued them. Local governments were doing a lot, I am sure. The governor, not so much.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Your reading of every other state is wrong. In Georgia, the exact same thing that happened in SC happened here. Schools shutdown statewide on 3/13. Some areas immediately issued local stay at home orders. The beaches outside of Savannah were shut down by the local government. By about 3/23 an extreme majority of the cities and counties in Georgia had issued stay at home orders and curfews. Local governments were doing the exact same things that local governments in SC were doing. SC wasn't ahead of the country.

I wan't "reading" your state. I was reading the SC governor's webpage and citing his orders as he lists them, and on the dates that he lists that he issued them. Local governments were doing a lot, I am sure. The governor, not so much.

I wasn’t reading every other state.

I was referring to your assertions about S.C. It is wrong. The last day students went into school was March 13th. The governor closed all schools and colleges. And so on. IIWII.

 

[RonJohn]

I wasn’t reading every other state.

I was referring to your assertions about S.C. It is wrong. The last day students went into school was March 13th. The governor closed all schools and colleges. And so on. IIWII.

I didn't make assertions about what was happening in SC. I simply stated what orders the governor issued and when he issued them. I got that list straight from the SC governor's own press releases.

I do understand that many local governments and businesses shut down before the governor's orders. The same thing happened in Georgia. I do think the media misrepresented this issue and insinuated that states without statewide shutdown orders were wide open. I just don't understand your contentions that SC was weeks ahead of other states. Businesses and local governments all over the country began shutting things down in mid March.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Your reading of every other state is wrong. In Georgia, the exact same thing that happened in SC happened here. Schools shutdown statewide on 3/13. Some areas immediately issued local stay at home orders. The beaches outside of Savannah were shut down by the local government. By about 3/23 an extreme majority of the cities and counties in Georgia had issued stay at home orders and curfews. Local governments were doing the exact same things that local governments in SC were doing. SC wasn't ahead of the country.

I wan't "reading" your state. I was reading the SC governor's webpage and citing his orders as he lists them, and on the dates that he lists that he issued them. Local governments were doing a lot, I am sure. The governor, not so much.

I am in Augusta, and we did not get any "orders" to do or not do anything. There were recommendations, but definitely no "orders".