Ahmaud Arbery murder case

[FredJacket]

@kg01 You have the patience of Job. I appreciate your perspective.

 

[MWBATL]

No, you're trying to make a point and to do it you need to ignore the context of the conversation that was going on before you got involved.

I'll choose to no longer be a party to this little game you're playing because it's purposely misleading and beneath us.

I am not sure we (white folks) can fully understand or appreciate how it feels to be the minority in these circumstances. Given that, I can understand how you are reacting (in theory, at least).

There is indeed some frustration at times because there are clearly cases of black racism as well, and there tends to be a tolerant attitude about it, when I think all of us would agree that ALL racism should be stamped out no matter what. Being tolerant about black racism out of "white guilt" is a mistake and compounds the problem of trying to achieve a just society as envisioned by Dr. King.

But that is a sidebar to what appears to be an obvious case of injustice here.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I am not sure we (white folks) can fully understand or appreciate how it feels to be the minority in these circumstances. Given that, I can understand how you are reacting (in theory, at least).

There is indeed some frustration at times because there are clearly cases of black racism as well, and there tends to be a tolerant attitude about it, when I think all of us would agree that ALL racism should be stamped out no matter what. Being tolerant about black racism out of "white guilt" is a mistake and compounds the problem of trying to achieve a just society as envisioned by Dr. King.

But that is a sidebar to what appears to be an obvious case of injustice here.

Well its unfortunate when people like Lebron James tweet that he's hunted down by murderers every single day. That sort of paranoid hyperbole doesn't help. It does show you how top of mind this issue is to people like him though. But there's no sense in comments like that, which ultimately hurt the case he's trying to make.

 

[684Bee]

Well its unfortunate when people like Lebron James tweet that he's hunted down by murderers every single day. That sort of paranoid hyperbole doesn't help. It does show you how top of mind this issue is to people like him though. But there's no sense in comments like that, which ultimately hurt the case he's trying to make.

And it’s an absolutely bs and dangerous claim. That man is worshipped by white folks everywhere he goes. Then a 0.01% incident happens somewhere to someone else and he says something like that.

 

[GT_EE78]

There are actually people out there trying to justify what these guys did. If these guys walk I’m gonna lose my sh*t.

i'd expect that we will learn more as this case nears trial. Link contains letter from DA Barnhill about the video and case after he recused himself. https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthe...52fa09cdc974b970b79/optimized/full.pdf#page=1

 

[Deleted member 2897]

i'd expect that we will learn more as this case nears trial. Link contains letter from DA Barnhill about the video and case after he recused himself. https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthe...52fa09cdc974b970b79/optimized/full.pdf#page=1

Reading that document completely and utterly disgusts me. I find that DA and anybody else who bastardizes our laws repugnant, especially given they have seen that video. "A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge." That is patently false in this case. Any even partial investigation would show they have no proof this guy had anything to do with anything. Second, the stand your ground laws absolutely do not permit you to go pick a fight with someone and then if they fight back you can pull out your gun and kill them. The only deadly force threat here was the guy fighting for his life when a pickup truck of armed white guys blocked the road, his ability to pass, and had guns drawn.

Thank God for this document being published. Its sick though.

 

[kg01]

Reading that document completely and utterly disgusts me. I find that DA and anybody else who bastardizes our laws repugnant, especially given they have seen that video. "A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge." That is patently false in this case. Any even partial investigation would show they have no proof this guy had anything to do with anything. Second, the stand your ground laws absolutely do not permit you to go pick a fight with someone and then if they fight back you can pull out your gun and kill them. The only deadly force threat here was the guy fighting for his life when a pickup truck of armed white guys blocked the road, his ability to pass, and had guns drawn.

Thank God for this document being published. Its sick though.

I'd imagine their 'stand your ground' claim will go similarly to the guy in FL who picked the fight in that handicap parking spot case. There, iirc, they rejected his claim based on the fact that he did indeed initiate the altercation.

The question in this current situation is what happens to the officials participating in the cover-up. Which likely would've been successful had the video not come out. Particularly curious to see how the Barnhill guy ends up. Not only did he choose not to act. He tried to muddy the waters on his way out with his statement.

On Lebron's statement, I get it. Sounds ridiculous coming from someone in his position. I don't think he believes "he" is hunted down or whatever. I do think he believes his statement gave attention to the situation in Brunswick. Even if it motivated one person in power to apply pressure to have justice done, the ridiculous statement was worth it.

 

[Boaty1]

And it’s an absolutely bs and dangerous claim. That man is worshipped by white folks everywhere he goes. Then a 0.01% incident happens somewhere to someone else and he says something like that.

Exactly The data shows this is an isolated incident and the claim that blacks are victims of racial violence at a rate that poses any type of real threat to them should be shouted down. If blacks are being hunted down by white people, what does that say about what they are doing to white people as they are at least twice as likely to kill than be killed? What if white people talked about how scared they were of black people or claimed they were being hunted down? Can you imagine the reaction to those statements?

Real conversations on race can't be "shut up white boy and listen." That will never work for the majority of people nor should it. We have to get out of this idea that identity to certain groups is the most important thing, and get back to the notion that we are INDIVIDUALS!

This case does not paint a picture of the nation at large. It is about 3 individuals. 1 victim. 2 perpetrators. That's it!

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I'd imagine their 'stand your ground' claim will go similarly to the guy in FL who picked the fight in that handicap parking spot case. There, iirc, they rejected his claim based on the fact that he did indeed initiate the altercation.

The question in this current situation is what happens to the officials participating in the cover-up. Which likely would've been successful had the video not come out. Particularly curious to see how the Barnhill guy ends up. Not only did he choose not to act. He tried to muddy the waters on his way out with his statement.

On Lebron's statement, I get it. Sounds ridiculous coming from someone in his position. I don't think he believes "he" is hunted down or whatever. I do think he believes his statement gave attention to the situation in Brunswick. Even if it motivated one person in power to apply pressure to have justice done, the ridiculous statement was worth it.

The Director of National Intelligence forced Schiff to release the 50+ private interview transcripts he has kept under wraps over the last couple of years. Turns out, while folks like Brennan and Clapper were on all the major networks trumpeting Russian Collusion, under oath in front of their committees they were saying literally “I never saw any direct empirical evidence that the Trump campaign or someone in it was plotting/conspiring with the Russians to meddle with the election.” That's a copy/paste from their testimony transcript in July of 2019. When you have dirty cops at the top of the CIA and FBI getting referred for prosecution, lying under oath, and nothing happens to them, imagine a DA and law enforcement from Brunswick and how easy it is for them to just look the other way and shrug and say "its legal, lets move on". This type of rampant injustice is obnoxious. And keep in mind, the DA had the video. And still no investigation, nobody called in the state investigators...nothing. As the family and community, how do you not just want to punch a hole in a wall when this type of ridiculous behavior goes on? Someone MUST hold folks like the DA accountable, and his trampling of the laws. What he wrote in his recusal request were direct contradictions of laws based on the evidence in the case.

 

[forensicbuzz]

And it’s an absolutely bs and dangerous claim. That man is worshipped by white folks everywhere he goes. Then a 0.01% incident happens somewhere to someone else and he says something like that.

Can you show me how you arrived at this statistic? I find it very interesting.

 

[684Bee]

Can you show me how you arrived at this statistic? I find it very interesting.

No way to. I'm just using a very low number to represent the % of times that an interaction between a white male and a black male ends up with the white male shooting and killing the black male.

What happened with the way these imbeciles chose to handle the situation the other day is horrible, and should be, and is being, roundly condemned.

What I'm also sick of is taking this "0.01%" example and making it out like white men are hunting down and killing black men. That is also dangerous, because it just continues to engender this wrong-headed belief that black males are in danger just walking around in their every day lives. That couldn't possibly be further from the truth. Are they in danger when they engage in criminal behavior and resist arrest? Yes, just like anyone else is. But this notion of "driving while black" or "walking around while black" puts you in danger is asinine.

 

[FredJacket]

No way to. I'm just using a very low number to represent the % of times that an interaction between a white male and a black male ends up with the white male shooting and killing the black male.

What happened with the way these imbeciles chose to handle the situation the other day is horrible, and should be, and is being, roundly condemned.

What I'm also sick of is taking this "0.01%" example and making it out like white men are hunting down and killing black men. That is also dangerous, because it just continues to engender this wrong-headed belief that black males are in danger just walking around in their every day lives. That couldn't possibly be further from the truth. Are they in danger when they engage in criminal behavior and resist arrest? Yes, just like anyone else is. But this notion of "driving while black" or "walking around while black" puts you in danger is asinine.

Just some advice. The highlighted part is all you need to say. The rest is poor form & arguing the wrong thing at the wrong time.

 

[forensicbuzz]

No way to. I'm just using a very low number to represent the % of times that an interaction between a white male and a black male ends up with the white male shooting and killing the black male.

What happened with the way these imbeciles chose to handle the situation the other day is horrible, and should be, and is being, roundly condemned.

What I'm also sick of is taking this "0.01%" example and making it out like white men are hunting down and killing black men. That is also dangerous, because it just continues to engender this wrong-headed belief that black males are in danger just walking around in their every day lives. That couldn't possibly be further from the truth. Are they in danger when they engage in criminal behavior and resist arrest? Yes, just like anyone else is. But this notion of "driving while black" or "walking around while black" puts you in danger is asinine.

I understand what you're saying. I just don't believe you are in a position to actually know what you're talking about. You know how you feel, but until you are actually on the other side, I don't think you can truly understand. I'm not trying to criticize or pick an argument; these are just my opinions.

I'm a 51 year old white man, born of a Southern mother and West Coast father, who has lived all over the world, including the Middle East. I'm sure I have my prejudices, but I work hard not to prejudge anyone or any situation. At times it is very hard. However, I have to say that the older I get, the more I realize that my experiences are my own and that no one else can truly understand what I feel or why. I would posit that as white men, there is no way we can begin to understand what a black man may feel.

 

[RonJohn]

The question in this current situation is what happens to the officials participating in the cover-up. Which likely would've been successful had the video not come out.

The first DA in this case has been involved in some other very interesting cases:

• She basically allowed defense attorneys for two police officers to present the case the to grand jury when the officers shot a lady with no real reason and then laughed about it on camera.
• She then repeatedly asked for one of those officers to be released from jail when he: threatened his ex-wife and later was in an armed stand-off with the police. She refused to have the police arrest him when he violated a restraining order and threatened his ex-wife in public view of others. Two days after that threat, he killed his ex-wife.
• Currently, DNA evidence has proven that a convicted man in jail for 20 years is innocent. She has been slow to take any action to release him, or even review the case.

These are only the things that have been publicly reported. With these things being reported, it is likely that there are other things of questionable activities in her office.

 

[LibertyTurns]

Reading all the comments above I’ll add a couple of points from a dude that’s configured more like a pound puppy than most of you:

1955 Rosa Parks decided she wanted a different seat on a bus. We were drinking in different water fountains, sleeping in different hotels, etc back then. If you are 75, maybe you remember those days.

A. We did not pass Civil Rights legislation until 1964. If you’re older than 60, you probably remember it.
B. Watts riots were in 1965, Chicago in ‘66, there was the long hot summer of ‘67 (Boston, Buffalo, Milwaukee, Newark, Cincinnati, etc)
C. Dr Martin Luther King was assassinated in 1968. Maybe you remember if you were 55? DC, Chicago, Baltimore, etc were very violent again.
D. 1972 there was a riot on the Kitty Hawk. Maybe you were there if you are 66?
E. 1992 was the Rodney King beating. Hell, you barely have to be over 30 to remember this.
F. Next decade we’re in 20o5 and a bunch of neo Nazi started a riot in Toledo.
G. 2014 was Ferguson.

Sorry left out the 80’s, 1980 the KKK started a riot by a drive by shooting in Chattanooga.

I have a 70 yo black woman working for me that grew up as a sharecropper’s daughter. Dirt floor poor.

We had a powerful member of the US Senate in office until 2010 that was a Klan member. That was only 10 years ago. Nobody ran him off, in fact people voted for him even though he hated them. 65 years ago a man who was probably in the Klan became President.

Some of this stuff is not too long ago. Think about that when you’re telling people not to think the way they’re thinking.

 

[Lotta Booze]

What happened with the way these imbeciles chose to handle the situation the other day is horrible, and should be, and is being, roundly condemned.

What I'm also sick of is taking this "0.01%" example and making it out like white men are hunting down and killing black men.

But that's what happened in this instance. There is no "making it out like". That's what happened.

That is also dangerous, because it just continues to engender this wrong-headed belief that black males are in danger just walking around in their every day lives.

But that's what happened.

That couldn't possibly be further from the truth. Are they in danger when they engage in criminal behavior and resist arrest? Yes, just like anyone else is. But this notion of "driving while black" or "walking around while black" puts you in danger is asinine.

That is NOT what happened.

And before you go back to citing statistics on white on black vs black on white killings, since you do seem so familiar with those statistics, can you tell us how times when the victim was white and the killer was not that the killer was released with no charges under presumed innocence and an assumption that the victim was in the wrong and deserved it?

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I saw photographs of the man and his father who were arrested today for the murder. I'm sorry, but those two guys look to me like white trash rednecks.

 

[Lotta Booze]

Gross

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Gross
View attachment 8298

Holy ****! That group had 900 members yesterday. That is some scary crap right there.

 

[stech81]

I saw photographs of the man and his father who were arrested today for the murder. I'm sorry, but those two guys look to me like white trash rednecks.

So they are uga fans ?