Ahmaud Arbery murder case

Milwaukee

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One side is saying people in the neighborhood saw him attempting to break into “another” home, after he’s done so repeatedly in the past, was seen, and started running away from the scene trying to leave the neighborhood.

Other side is saying he was out for a jog and was hunted and killed because of his color and no other reason.

Wtf Georgia??

 

armeck

Jolly Good Fellow
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One side is saying people in the neighborhood saw him attempting to break into “another” home, after he’s done so repeatedly in the past, was seen, and started running away from the scene trying to leave the neighborhood.

Other side is saying he was out for a jog and was hunted and killed because of his color and no other reason.

Wtf Georgia??

This is so bad. I can't even imagine a scenario in which these guys are justified arming themselves and tracking him down like that. He was zero threat to them until they rolled up on him with guns drawn.
 

MWBATL

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This is so bad. I can't even imagine a scenario in which these guys are justified arming themselves and tracking him down like that. He was zero threat to them until they rolled up on him with guns drawn.
While I can bend my mind into imagining how this came to be, I still think it is wrong.

I can see that the police might be slow to respond. I know I have a home in a rural county where it could take 10 minutes or more for police to arrive at a scene, especially if it is not perceived as life-threatening (this was a property crime). And I can see local residents being upset that "he was gonna get away again". But still....

First thing I could hear in the video was gunshot. I did not hear any voices, I did not hear anyone asking the young man to stop running and speak to them. I did not hear any warnings. The young man is not carrying any "loot". Too big a chance of mistaken identity to just out and out shoot the dude.

I want the process to work and for a thorough investigation to take place. I want justice to be served. I do NOT want this to become yet another national political incident where folks everywhere pick sides and denounce one group or another before all the facts are known. (Ferguson, anyone?) Biden and the left need to keep their mouths shut other than calling for a thorough investigation. The GBI should conduct said investigation to reduce the chance of local influence distorting the results.

Sad, no matter the cause.
 

armeck

Jolly Good Fellow
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267
While I can bend my mind into imagining how this came to be, I still think it is wrong.

I can see that the police might be slow to respond. I know I have a home in a rural county where it could take 10 minutes or more for police to arrive at a scene, especially if it is not perceived as life-threatening (this was a property crime). And I can see local residents being upset that "he was gonna get away again". But still....

First thing I could hear in the video was gunshot. I did not hear any voices, I did not hear anyone asking the young man to stop running and speak to them. I did not hear any warnings. The young man is not carrying any "loot". Too big a chance of mistaken identity to just out and out shoot the dude.

I want the process to work and for a thorough investigation to take place. I want justice to be served. I do NOT want this to become yet another national political incident where folks everywhere pick sides and denounce one group or another before all the facts are known. (Ferguson, anyone?) Biden and the left need to keep their mouths shut other than calling for a thorough investigation. The GBI should conduct said investigation to reduce the chance of local influence distorting the results.

Sad, no matter the cause.
Even worst case scenario, and the victim had burgled a home, I don't like the idea of vigilantes arming themselves and chasing down suspects.

Why did you even mention Biden? I suppose we ought to also make sure the NRA and Trump keep their mouths shut as well?
 
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MWBATL

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Even worst case scenario, and the victim had burgled a home, I don't like the idea of vigilantes arming themselves and chasing down suspects.

Why did you even mention Biden? I suppose we ought to also make sure the NRA and Trump keep their mouths shut as well?
Fair point. On top of that, I shouldn't have mentioned Biden because that should be in a political thread. Apologies. I just happened to have seen him come out guns blazing, and I didn't notice Trump or the NRA....but that doesn't excuse my mistake. Mods feel free to modify or delete my comment....
 

MWBATL

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Even worst case scenario, and the victim had burgled a home, I don't like the idea of vigilantes arming themselves and chasing down suspects.
I think we are saying exactly the same thing....even if it give them the benefit of the doubt, it doesn't look good from that video. I am wondering who shot the video and why we could hear no voices....all I am saying is a full investigation is warranted. Nevertheless, even if he was a serial burglar and was caught in the act, I am not comfortable with vigilante justice either....

My opinion *could* change if there were repeated warnings shouted at the young man, and if he refused to stop or comply with their warnings. I am still not sure that justifies their actions, but it makes it somewhat less egregious in my view if a person knowingly takes actions which put themselves at risk. If they shouted warnings to him, he could have stopped and let the police arrive to sort everything out. As I said, I don't like it, and might still be inclined towards some level of charge even in that circumstance, but it moves from murder to something less if they really were much more reasonable than that video showed.
 

armeck

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I think we are saying exactly the same thing....even if it give them the benefit of the doubt, it doesn't look good from that video. I am wondering who shot the video and why we could hear no voices....all I am saying is a full investigation is warranted. Nevertheless, even if he was a serial burglar and was caught in the act, I am not comfortable with vigilante justice either....

My opinion *could* change if there were repeated warnings shouted at the young man, and if he refused to stop or comply with their warnings. I am still not sure that justifies their actions, but it makes it somewhat less egregious in my view if a person knowingly takes actions which put themselves at risk. If they shouted warnings to him, he could have stopped and let the police arrive to sort everything out. As I said, I don't like it, and might still be inclined towards some level of charge even in that circumstance, but it moves from murder to something less if they really were much more reasonable than that video showed.
Ok, but since when are citizens required to obey orders from non-LEOs? Again, this person could have been the worst burglar in the history of all time and I STILL can't fathom that it is ok to grab your guns, hop in your vehicle drive around till you find him, hop out and confront him, and then shoot him dead in the middle of a street. No imminent threat, no castle doctrine, no public safety issue (it has been confirmed he was unarmed).
 

MWBATL

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While I don't applaud this as a choice of mask, is it possible....just possible..... that this dude was using this as a way to protest that California now REQUIRES you to wear a mask in public places? Neither of us knows anything about the dude or why he did it...
 

armeck

Jolly Good Fellow
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While I don't applaud this as a choice of mask, is it possible....just possible..... that this dude was using this as a way to protest that California now REQUIRES you to wear a mask in public places? Neither of us knows anything about the dude or why he did it...
Requires? But they made him take it off, and let him stay without a mask and check out.
 

LibertyTurns

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This is so bad. I can't even imagine a scenario in which these guys are justified arming themselves and tracking him down like that. He was zero threat to them until they rolled up on him with guns drawn.
These guys are in some deep s. There’s no way that guy was a threat. May have been a thief, but you just don’t go around gunning down suspects even if you’re law enforcement.

While I don't applaud this as a choice of mask, is it possible....just possible..... that this dude was using this as a way to protest that California now REQUIRES you to wear a mask in public places? Neither of us knows anything about the dude or why he did it...
Dude’s an adult. He knew what he was doing. C’mon man, he’s got a right to be an idiot but if you’re going to act like a fool like that you have to be ready to suffer the consequences of public abuse. I’ll defend his right to express himself, but he’s getting publicly tarred and feathered like he deserves.
 

MWBATL

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These guys are in some deep s. There’s no way that guy was a threat. May have been a thief, but you just don’t go around gunning down suspects even if you’re law enforcement.


Dude’s an adult. He knew what he was doing. C’mon man, he’s got a right to be an idiot but if you’re going to act like a fool like that you have to be ready to suffer the consequences of public abuse. I’ll defend his right to express himself, but he’s getting publicly tarred and feathered like he deserves.
I don't disagree with either statement....LOL...I said I disagreed with the dude's choice of masks....and I don't argue that he deserves what he gets (within reason, of course). My point was exactly what you said...he has a right to express himself (even if I think he was an idiot to do it that way).
 

armeck

Jolly Good Fellow
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267
I don't disagree with either statement....LOL...I said I disagreed with the dude's choice of masks....and I don't argue that he deserves what he gets (within reason, of course). My point was exactly what you said...he has a right to express himself (even if I think he was an idiot to do it that way).
I think the dude was treated entirely too kind. He should have been asked to leave.
 

A Love Supreme

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While this is certainly in bad taste and something I wouldn't choose to do, that is hilarious, and, the guy probably did it as a joke on mask wearing.
I dont find this funny at all. It's really disturbing. Im sure you would think the same if it was a middle eastern looking man walking around with an isis flag around his face.
 

LibertyTurns

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I dont find this funny at all. It's really disturbing. Im sure you would think the same if it was a middle eastern looking man walking around with an isis flag around his face.
You’re absolutely right it’s not funny. Unfortunately in a free country objectionable behavior must be permitted/tolerated otherwise we’re no better than the fascists. Normal people should be doing what they’re doing- expressing disdain for the individual, mocking and ridiculing him, etc and responding to those that think that his behavior is ok.
 

Milwaukee

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I dont find this funny at all. It's really disturbing. Im sure you would think the same if it was a middle eastern looking man walking around with an isis flag around his face.
I’m curious as to how you would actually feel if a middle eastern looking man was walking around with an isis flag around his face? Would you still be outraged? The reason I ask is because it’s difficult to read the tone of a post, but I read yours a certain way. Almost as if you wouldn’t be upset in your scenario but he should be in the original.

Anyone screaming white power, black power, or death to America should all have their ignorant racist asses kicked imo.

The guy should’ve been jumped in the grocery store imo.
 

A Love Supreme

Ramblin' Wreck
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I’m curious as to how you would actually feel if a middle eastern looking man was walking around with an isis flag around his face? Would you still be outraged? The reason I ask is because it’s difficult to read the tone of a post, but I read yours a certain way. Almost as if you wouldn’t be upset in your scenario but he should be in the original.

Anyone screaming white power, black power, or death to America should all have their ignorant racist asses kicked imo.

The guy should’ve been jumped in the grocery store imo.
My response was because the person I responded to thought the guy with the klan hood was "hilarious." Of course I still would be upset and disturbed if a guy was walking around with an isis flag mask. My question is if he would think it would be "hilarious" or a joke in my scenario.
 
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