TQM did better than you give credit!

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I disagree. I remember Richt depending on our DBs to stay ten yards off the line of scrimmage so they could bubble screen us to death.


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That's what I meant by saying we did not have a dependable defense, unless you think Richt depending on it counts.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Quick update to what I posted above.
Lamar Jackson's 2016 season he had:
13 games
409 pass attempt
260 rush attempts.
Justin Thomas's 2014 season had:
14 games
187 passing attempts
190 rushing attempts.

With how many more plays other teams are running, I don't know how tired we should really expect our qbs to be compared to others. I realize the rushing attempts are masked a bit on plays where the qb pitches, but I don't know if that is enough to seriously tax the qb physically.

Justin Thomas didn't have comparable rushing attempts because our offense is about more than just the QB running the ball. I don't know for sure, but I imagine Tech still had more rushing yards than Louisville did. Naturally Justin doesn't compare in passing attempts, because we don't depend on the pass in our offense. We don't depend on the pass, but we still rack up the total yards.

 

[GT_05]

That's what I meant by saying we did not have a dependable defense, unless you think Richt depending on it counts.

Yes, I was being sarcastic.


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[ibeattetris]

Justin Thomas didn't have comparable rushing attempts because our offense is about more than just the QB running the ball. I don't know for sure, but I imagine Tech still had more rushing yards than Louisville did. Naturally Justin doesn't compare in passing attempts, because we don't depend on the pass in our offense. We don't depend on the pass, but we still rack up the total yards.

The context of my reply had to do with "How can a QB function properly when he is running all out on 99% plays called? When can he catch his breath?"

I am trying to highlight that QBs in other systems are running quite a lot. HUNH QB's are running and throwing on more plays and then needing to run up to the line of scrimmage. I just don't think it's fair to say that how much we ask our QB to run is worse than what other team's ask of their dual threat QB's.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

I agree with your assessment generally.

Just as a counter point though, Lamar Jackson average over 30 passing attempts a game. Cam Newton 20. Tim Tebow 15.
Tebow is definitely a fair comparison, but Cam is a stretch (the most JT averaged was 13).

My assumption though is running a HUNH offense and throwing 30+ times while rushing 17+ would be just as exhausting.

Yeah. My main point is a lot of QBs take licks, scramble a lot, get tired and beat up, and still succeed.

 

[up state jacket]

Tebow managed to do quite well at UF with these same issues. Ditto the dude from Louisville the last 2 years, ditto Cam Newton, and on and on and on.

As for CPJ....I guess he is lacking in producing a natty for us.

None of Johnson's QB have sniffed the NFL. None of QB's you mentioned ran Johnson's version of the 3-O. Try again?

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

The context of my reply had to do with "How can a QB function properly when he is running all out on 99% plays called? When can he catch his breath?"

I am trying to highlight that QBs in other systems are running quite a lot. HUNH QB's are running and throwing on more plays and then needing to run up to the line of scrimmage. I just don't think it's fair to say that how much we ask our QB to run is worse than what other team's ask of their dual threat QB's.

Well, if Tech had a Lamar Jackson or a Deshawn Watson, you might see more of what you are talking about. But unfortunately, Watson didn't give us a shot and Jackson could never have gotten in school here. We need another Joe Hamilton or Shawn Jones. But that kind of QB who can get in Tech or wants to come to Tech is rare.

 

[GTBandit22]

None of Johnson's QB have sniffed the NFL. None of QB's you mentioned ran Johnson's version of the 3-O. Try again?

How many QBs from Tech have ever played in the NFL? All time? I know Joe played for the Bucs a bit.

 

[OldJacketFan]

How many QBs from Tech have ever played in the NFL? All time? I know Joe played for the Bucs a bit.

Mike Kelly, Billy Lothridge come to mind

 

[whitegoldsphinx]

Mike Kelly, Billy Lothridge come to mind

Rick Strom was probably the longest tenured. He was the Steelers 2nd string QB for several years and I think was backup QB for some other teams as well. Also did color commentary with Wes Durham on the radio broadcasts for a while.

 

[GTRX7]

T e reason I have a problem with the passing system is multiple--1. we start under-ctr on snap 2. we fake to bback before going back which delays seeing recs 3.-the guys who can handle the ball in this Offense are shorter which means they have problem seeing over line 4-. no big TE to block or rec close to LOS 5. as you said the pass blocking gets ignored some 6. we normally have much smaller Abacks blocking MUCH bigger LBs in scheme 7. our Offense does not attract a torrent of great recs
Is this enough? you can quibble on these but the combination of problems is overwhelming

These are all valid points. And I don’t think anyone would argue that our overall offensive system is set up in such a way to allow us to maintain consistent excellence in passing. That said, many of the things you mention are the same reasons we also regularly catch teams off guard in our passing game and have been top 20 in team passing efficiency 4 of 10 years under CPJ and and top 5 in yards per pass in those same years. The system is set up to be successful in those metrics when we have a QB, line, and wide receiver core that can execute.

We certainly weren’t good last year, and I am not confident we will be this year. But I tend to attribute that more to the players than the system. Obviously it is the coaches’ job to recruit and coach, but I believe the “system” (which is what we were arguing about) is sound for what it is trying to do.

 

[ibeattetris]

Well, if Tech had a Lamar Jackson or a Deshawn Watson, you might see more of what you are talking about. But unfortunately, Watson didn't give us a shot and Jackson could never have gotten in school here. We need another Joe Hamilton or Shawn Jones. But that kind of QB who can get in Tech or wants to come to Tech is rare.

Yes. But the poster I was replying to was saying what we do is too tiring on our qbs. I am only trying to say that what we do is not more tiring than other systems that leverage dual threat qbs.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Yes. But the poster I was replying to was saying what we do is too tiring on our qbs. I am only trying to say that what we do is not more tiring than other systems that leverage dual threat qbs.

OK. I can buy that.

 

[UpperNorth]

The biggest problem with our offense isn’t X’s & O’s and whether we can develop players to the next level IMO. That’s been proven false. It’s the perception that the offense doesn’t translate to the NFL and that we can’t develop players for the pros. Give us an offense where 4 or 5 guys are future Sunday players and we’d be unstoppable and those guys would get plenty of NFL attention and our passing game would look a whole lot better.

QB under center, running back in a 3-point stance, linemen cut blocking every other play, wide-outs blocking 90% of the time. The list of negative recruiting that this offense faces is long. Which is why we have 1 four star on the offensive side right now. (Not that we ever had many, but 1 is low even for Tech).

That said, I love the offense and think it’s a good fit because recruiting will always be a challenge. Would love to have a chance at Deshaun and Lamar and Cam Newton but landing a guy like that regardless of our offensive scheme is slim.

Would also love to see what this offense could do if it were at Alabama, or Florida, or USC. Doubt that will happen.

 

[Animal02]

The biggest problem with our offense isn’t X’s & O’s and whether we can develop players to the next level IMO. That’s been proven false. It’s the perception that the offense doesn’t translate to the NFL and that we can’t develop players for the pros. Give us an offense where 4 or 5 guys are future Sunday players and we’d be unstoppable and those guys would get plenty of NFL attention and our passing game would look a whole lot better.

QB under center, running back in a 3-point stance, linemen cut blocking every other play, wide-outs blocking 90% of the time. The list of negative recruiting that this offense faces is long. Which is why we have 1 four star on the offensive side right now. (Not that we ever had many, but 1 is low even for Tech).

That said, I love the offense and think it’s a good fit because recruiting will always be a challenge. Would love to have a chance at Deshaun and Lamar and Cam Newton but landing a guy like that regardless of our offensive scheme is slim.

Would also love to see what this offense could do if it were at Alabama, or Florida, or USC. Doubt that will happen.

The NFL continues down the path they are going.....and a degree from a school like Tech may be the better option.

 

[alagold]

IMO higher on the list as to why we have had 2 losing seasons is NOT not having a good passing system (whatever that means), but because we did not have a dependable defense.

oh, I agree-I just wasn't addressing that
there are a bunch of reasons for having losing seasons in 2 of last 3 yrs

 

[year_of_the_swarm]

I am a big proponent of the option offense, and I think a lot of programs would be better off if they ran it, but one thing I will say is that the best athletes aren't going to option programs or playing quarterback anymore. You look at great Nebraska (for example) programs and they had Eric Crouch, Tommie Frazier, Scott Frost, and many others playing QB. Now-a-days those guys would be playing wide receiver, safety, etc. So Georgia Tech, Navy, Air Force, New Mexico, Georgia Southern, etc now have guys that are good athletes but not as good at the QB position as the option guys of old.

Even the best running backs aren't going to the option programs, like they did back in the day.

If last years team had:

QB: Khalil Tate
BB: SaQuon Barkley
AB: TaQuon Marshall
AB: Qua Searcy
WR: Jalen Camp
WR: Ricky Jeune

They probably would have been in the hunt if the defense was any good. This is just a player issue. If the best players come and play option football, they will be one of the best teams. The offense does cover up for lack of size and in some cases lack of overall talent (see military academies for details), but it absolutely can be elite if you have the right players.

Which begs the question.... why don't guys like Khalil Tate, Lamar Jackson, SaQuon Barkley, etc come to Georgia Tech? Perhaps academic requirements, or perhaps they feel it won't put them in the NFL. Perhaps they don't want to get hit so much. If Barkley came to Georgia Tech and ran for 2,000 yards or something he would be drafted. Lamar Jackson didn't get much respect as a QB anyway in terms of the pro scouts... Khalil Tate from Arizona will have the same problem..

 

[up state jacket]

How many QBs from Tech have ever played in the NFL? All time? I know Joe played for the Bucs a bit.

My point is he was using names that are in the NFL and didn't run Johnson's scheme. His point was useless. I am not expecting Tech to put QB's in the NFL because we don't get those types of QB's and our system doesn't help us get those types of players.

 

[gtwcf]

Tate openly petitioned not to have CKN as the coach at Arizona.

I guess the question is, did Nebraska's offense make the QBs great, or did the QBs make Nebraska great? None of those guys got much of a sniff in the NFL.

I really wish Ratliffe hadn't gotten hurt. I think he would've been a special player in our offense.

 

[LibertyTurns]

My point is he was using names that are in the NFL and didn't run Johnson's scheme. His point was useless. I am not expecting Tech to put QB's in the NFL because we don't get those types of QB's and our system doesn't help us get those types of players.

There’s always a lot of back and forth on here about the impact of our system on recruiting NFL caliber RBs and QBs. When O’Leary & Friedgen were at the helm during the glory days why didn’t we have 5* QBs and RBs lining up outside the door clamoring to get a scholarship offer? Just wondering because we NEVER seem to be able to recruit highly regardless of how good the Team is or who the coach is or what the scheme is.