Paul Johnson time frame.

[iceeater1969]

That is a lot to digest. I love your analysis of "lets look at the last 5 years, but ignore the best year, and then add 8 wins to the coach we are comparing him to." lol.

I feel like I have to say this in every thread, but I guess it bears repeating. EVERYBODY agrees that, if you only look at the last last three years, they have been unacceptable. LITERALLY EVERY SINGLE PERSON on this board agrees the last three years have been unacceptable. It is just that some are willing to give him more time to get it turned back around based on his past success, including in '14 and '16.

Also, lets not pretend Carson only played Alabama, Notre Dame, and Georgia 12 games every year. Tech played 3 or more teams like Tulane, Duke, Army, Texas Christian, and Navy every single year in those years too.

YEA WE PLAYED USC, TENNESSE, AUBURN, ETC.

NEVER PLAYED
Alcorn , Elon, Presbyterian are sure wins.

Comparison valid.

Your points are weak.

FCS wins makes coaches happy because u are happy.

 

[AE 87]

I haven't read most of this thread. Here are the opinions that I dismiss:
1) the idea that people who want to keep CPJ are just settling for mediocrity.
.... a) In my opinion, people who make posts like that are just settling for mediocrity when it comes to using their own brains.
.... b) My reason for saying this is that (i) CPJ just replaced a DC who is a Tech-legend, father of a then player, "like an uncle" to two more, and a good recruiter. He would not do that if he was settling for mediocrity. In fact, he's replaced our DC a few times trying to find the right match -- clearly an indication that he's not satisfied with mediocrity
.... c) and (ii) they are often supporting their view of our program's status with a simplistic use of win-loss record as a measure of the status of our program with blinders to other factors (like injuries, closeness of games, and competition) -- This simplistic
.... d) and (iii) that some say that offense has become mediocre which brings me to ...
2) the idea that CPJ's offense has been the problem
.... a) the effectiveness stats for our offense are clear -- over the last ten years we have averaged top 10 in points/drive against BCS AQ or Pwr5 opponents.
.... b) that's a small group of schools
3) the use of win-loss record as a measure of the success of our offense (see my last two points)

Still, with all that being said, I do agree that wins and losses are the ultimate measure. There is always the rare loss which might be more enjoyable than a frustrating victory, but for the most part we need our team to win. Right now, I still think that CPJ is the best coach for us going forward. I say this for the reasons implied above:
1) His offense works and keeps us competitive from that side of the ball
2) He is not satisfied with mediocre defense and has been consistently working to find defensive success that matches our offensive success
3) He embraces GT with our strengths and challenges and graduates football players as Tech men

However, I think we really need CNW to work-out. We have not been nearly as efficient on D this year as I thought we would be. I think the rational position would be to give it all next year to see if it works out, but we really need to see significant improvement next year.

Just my 2cents Go Jackets

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

yet the offensive stats with a Clemson exception, and the always are, don't reflect that. Leading the nation in rushing? Somebody didn't catch up. It is just not that simple.

I think everyone has forgotten that on Tech's first offensive possession against Clemson, we moved the ball right down the field.....until 1) Taquon fumbled and 2) we had a false start. If those 2 things had not happened, I really believe we would have scored. Now would that have changed the final result? Probably not, but it would have least provided some much needed momentum and confidence.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I haven't read most of this thread. Here are the opinions that I dismiss:
1) the idea that people who want to keep CPJ are just settling for mediocrity.
.... a) In my opinion, people who make posts like that are just settling for mediocrity when it comes to using their own brains.
.... b) My reason for saying this is that (i) CPJ just replaced a DC who is a Tech-legend, father of a then player, "like an uncle" to two more, and a good recruiter. He would not do that if he was settling for mediocrity. In fact, he's replaced our DC a few times trying to find the right match -- clearly an indication that he's not satisfied with mediocrity
.... c) and (ii) they are often supporting their view of our program's status with a simplistic use of win-loss record as a measure of the status of our program with blinders to other factors (like injuries, closeness of games, and competition) -- This simplistic
.... d) and (iii) that some say that offense has become mediocre which brings me to ...
2) the idea that CPJ's offense has been the problem
.... a) the effectiveness stats for our offense are clear -- over the last ten years we have averaged top 10 in points/drive against BCS AQ or Pwr5 opponents.
.... b) that's a small group of schools
3) the use of win-loss record as a measure of the success of our offense (see my last two points)

Still, with all that being said, I do agree that wins and losses are the ultimate measure. There is always the rare loss which might be more enjoyable than a frustrating victory, but for the most part we need our team to win. Right now, I still think that CPJ is the best coach for us going forward. I say this for the reasons implied above:
1) His offense works and keeps us competitive from that side of the ball
2) He is not satisfied with mediocre defense and has been consistently working to find defensive success that matches our offensive success
3) He embraces GT with our strengths and challenges and graduates football players as Tech men

However, I think we really need CNW to work-out. We have not been nearly as efficient on D this year as I thought we would be. I think the rational position would be to give it all next year to see if it works out, but we really need to see significant improvement next year.

Just my 2cents Go Jackets

We may not have been overall as efficient as you expected, but since we already have as many forced turnovers as we got all of last year, something is obviously working. And I think it will only get better.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I think everyone has forgotten that on Tech's first offensive possession against Clemson, we moved the ball right down the field.....until 1) Taquon fumbled and 2) we had a false start. If those 2 things had not happened, I really believe we would have scored. Now would that have changed the final result? Probably not, but it would have least provided some much needed momentum and confidence.

Well technically IIRC TaQuon got injured and knocked out of the game for a minute...then everything seemed to go downhill. I think the NFL doesn’t count sacks against rushing totals - if we had that against Clemson we would hve had like 240 yards rushing. Not great, but by far our best in years.

We stopped Bryant extremely well. We couldn’t do anything to slow down Lawrence.

 

[MacDaddy2]

Things that make you go hmmmmm, CPJ's records against:

Power 5/Independents - 58-53
Group 5 - 7-2
DII or lower - 13-0

and, if you want to throw out years 1&2 which were with Gailey's players the record drops to 41-48 against Power 5/Independents

 

[GTNavyNuke]

Personally, I am a much bigger fan of that chart that occasionally gets posted with each individual season broken out by coach. As has been noted about five bigillion times, while Gailey and CPJ now have a similar "averages," I value a mix of higher highs and lower lows over a string of average seasons. CPJ has averaged 10.3 wins in his three best season and 4.6 wins in his three worst seasons, while Gailey averaged 7.6 wins in his three best seasons and 7 wins in his three worst seasons. Personally, I see a big difference there. Value that difference however you want, but I know which one I would choose.

(NOTE: this is not a statement that the last four years have been good enough or that he should be retained if we have another losing season, just a comment on the comparison made in your chart.)

So you like this better?

It's just facts and everyone likes different things. Tonight I'd like __________.

 

[biggtfan]

So let me pose thusly: The SI piece quotes Johnson that, even as the triple option grows in popularity, his version is the last vestige of the under-center options. The Navy coach now is apparently visiting shotgun option teams for ideas he and Ivin Jasper can incorporate into an already expanded option, and Bob Davie has done the same at New Mexico. So what if Johnson began visiting and sending coaches to these places and there was even the hint of getting your wish: shotgun, more passing, different kind of option though still option? Anybody be more tolerant? Or do you just want the coach gone? (I would just like to frame the argument better. So which is it?)

I would be more tolerant.

 

[Jacket in Dairyland]

yet the offensive stats with a Clemson exception, and the always are, don't reflect that. Leading the nation in rushing? Somebody didn't catch up. It is just not that simple.

I used to think that our rushing yardage was impressive too. But it is just a statistic now , and is not translating to wins. The adjustments by opposing Ds are coming in the red zone and crunch time during games. Somebody asked in another thread where all the death marches are lately ? That is what I am talking about. Could it be just bad line play , inability to pass consistently , penalties , poor decisions by the QB ? Sure , I guess . But I think there has been a certain learning curve about CPJ tendencies , too. This weekend will be interesting, considering the fact that UL players and coaches have had very little exposure to the TO. They surely can't simulate it in practice very well. If we play " clean "football , we should hang 40 on them. Let's see what happens.

 

[SteamWhistle]

Gailey brought in 3- 4 stars right before he was let go, Derick Morgan, Morgan Burnett, and Jonathan Dwyer to give us the #15 recruiting class. Does anyone else miss how fun these guys were to watch? These three players are arguably 3 of the top 5 players Tech has had on the roster under Paul Johnson

Chan Actually brought in more than 3 5 stars, Johnathan Dwyer, Derrick Morgan, Morgan Burnett, Josh Nesbit, Nick Claytor, and Jason Peters were all 4 stars in his final class.

 

[SteamWhistle]

We currently have 9 guys on our team rated 4-stars by at least one agency, that are Sophomores or younger.

Only 3 on 247 Compostie which is the best because it’s all of them combined.

 

[RonJohn]

I used to think that our rushing yardage was impressive too. But it is just a statistic now , and is not translating to wins. The adjustments by opposing Ds are coming in the red zone and crunch time during games. Somebody asked in another thread where all the death marches are lately ? That is what I am talking about. Could it be just bad line play , inability to pass consistently , penalties , poor decisions by the QB ? Sure , I guess . But I think there has been a certain learning curve about CPJ tendencies , too. This weekend will be interesting, considering the fact that UL players and coaches have had very little exposure to the TO. They surely can't simulate it in practice very well. If we play " clean "football , we should hang 40 on them. Let's see what happens.

Did the opposing defenses forget those learning curves and adjustments during 2014? If I remember correctly, the GT O had the best FEI of all time until they later changed the calculations. Honest question: Did the defenses figure out the offense and then just forget it during 2014?

 

[Skeptic]

I used to think that our rushing yardage was impressive too. But it is just a statistic now , and is not translating to wins. The adjustments by opposing Ds are coming in the red zone and crunch time during games. Somebody asked in another thread where all the death marches are lately ? That is what I am talking about. Could it be just bad line play , inability to pass consistently , penalties , poor decisions by the QB ? Sure , I guess . But I think there has been a certain learning curve about CPJ tendencies , too. This weekend will be interesting, considering the fact that UL players and coaches have had very little exposure to the TO. They surely can't simulate it in practice very well. If we play " clean "football , we should hang 40 on them. Let's see what happens.

What I would love to see, what I want to see, is one of those long, clock-chewing drives in the first half ending in a score, and then the defense getting a 3-and-out and not letting Louisville streak down the field to retaliate, a couple of more scores in the half, then take the second half kickoff and drive the field to score again. The way we used to, that the team was so good at that Johnson said at halftime one game that we had a two score lead -- 10 points if I remember -- and since we were getting the kickoff, he thought they could score again to open it up some. Nobody talks that way now. Friday, Louisville, the glorious days of yesteryear. That would be perfect.

 

[1939hotmagic]

Things that make you go hmmmmm, CPJ's records against:

Power 5/Independents - 58-53
Group 5 - 7-2
DII or lower - 13-0

and, if you want to throw out years 1&2 which were with Gailey's players the record drops to 41-48 against Power 5/Independents

A minor note of correction: Tech, under CPJ, never played a Division 2 opponent. Tech has played several FCS (formerly known as Div. 1-AA) teams.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Only 3 on 247 Compostie which is the best because it’s all of them combined.

Tre Swilling is a 4-star on both Rivals and ESPN, but a 3-star on 247. That’s just 1 example.

247 shmee47.

 

[MacDaddy2]

A minor note of correction: Tech, under CPJ, never played a Division 2 opponent. Tech has played several FCS (formerly known as Div. 1-AA) teams.

I really meant to type that - will correct and thanks!

 

[MacDaddy2]

Things that make you go hmmmmm, CPJ's records against:

Power 5/Independents - 58-53
Group 5 - 7-2
DIAA or lower - 13-0

and, if you want to throw out years 1&2 which were with Gailey's players the record drops to 41-48 against Power 5/Independents

 

[Jacket in Dairyland]

What I would love to see, what I want to see, is one of those long, clock-chewing drives in the first half ending in a score, and then the defense getting a 3-and-out and not letting Louisville streak down the field to retaliate, a couple of more scores in the half, then take the second half kickoff and drive the field to score again. The way we used to, that the team was so good at that Johnson said at halftime one game that we had a two score lead -- 10 points if I remember -- and since we were getting the kickoff, he thought they could score again to open it up some. Nobody talks that way now. Friday, Louisville, the glorious days of yesteryear. That would be perfect.

EXACTLY !!

 

[Jacket in Dairyland]

Did the opposing defenses forget those learning curves and adjustments during 2014? If I remember correctly, the GT O had the best FEI of all time until they later changed the calculations. Honest question: Did the defenses figure out the offense and then just forget it during 2014?

No. BUT that was 4 years ago. Something has changed since then. Maybe several things.

 

[BCJacket]

I haven't read most of this thread. Here are the opinions that I dismiss:
1) the idea that people who want to keep CPJ are just settling for mediocrity.
.... a) In my opinion, people who make posts like that are just settling for mediocrity when it comes to using their own brains.
.... b) My reason for saying this is that (i) CPJ just replaced a DC who is a Tech-legend, father of a then player, "like an uncle" to two more, and a good recruiter. He would not do that if he was settling for mediocrity. In fact, he's replaced our DC a few times trying to find the right match -- clearly an indication that he's not satisfied with mediocrity
.... c) and (ii) they are often supporting their view of our program's status with a simplistic use of win-loss record as a measure of the status of our program with blinders to other factors (like injuries, closeness of games, and competition) -- This simplistic
.... d) and (iii) that some say that offense has become mediocre which brings me to ...
2) the idea that CPJ's offense has been the problem
.... a) the effectiveness stats for our offense are clear -- over the last ten years we have averaged top 10 in points/drive against BCS AQ or Pwr5 opponents.
.... b) that's a small group of schools
3) the use of win-loss record as a measure of the success of our offense (see my last two points)

Still, with all that being said, I do agree that wins and losses are the ultimate measure. There is always the rare loss which might be more enjoyable than a frustrating victory, but for the most part we need our team to win. Right now, I still think that CPJ is the best coach for us going forward. I say this for the reasons implied above:
1) His offense works and keeps us competitive from that side of the ball
2) He is not satisfied with mediocre defense and has been consistently working to find defensive success that matches our offensive success
3) He embraces GT with our strengths and challenges and graduates football players as Tech men

However, I think we really need CNW to work-out. We have not been nearly as efficient on D this year as I thought we would be. I think the rational position would be to give it all next year to see if it works out, but we really need to see significant improvement next year.

Just my 2cents Go Jackets

I agree with your points. But I think you're glossing over two things:

1) Win-Loss record is too simplistic, as you say. But if you're going to use PPD to say the offense is working, you have to be fair and acknowledge that the statistics for everything else have been quite poor. Defense has been consistently awful by nearly every statistical measure. Special teams have been a weakness overall most of his tenure. Butker was great, but otherwise ST have been weak.

2) His offense works and that's great. But CPJ is our Head Coach not our OC. He's responsible for everything: offense, defense, ST, recruiting, personnel, discipline, retention, media relations. I like CPJ. I support CPJ. My first choice for our HC next year is [an improved] CPJ. But the one thing that really sticks in my craw is when he calls the defense or the STs "them" or "those guys". The offense is always "we" from him. I get that he wants to hire someone to run those phases and forget about them so he can be a glorified OC. But it hasn't worked. As HC, the buck stops with him. He may not be satisfied with mediocre defense (or ST, or recruiting, or....), but he's never been willing to sacrifice what he wants: time/hands on with the Offense; to work on that side. Hiring yet another DC to see if this one sticks seems like the definition of insanity. Why not try hiring an OC and let CPJ use his massive football IQ on helping the D? In other words, focusing his attention where the team needs it- like every other HC.

If CPJ were just the OC and our offense was that good, we'd all be saying 'fire the HC and promote CPJ!' But he's not...