Paul Johnson time frame.

[boger2337]

Honestly to end all arguments. This is it in a nutshell.

1. CPJ runs an offense that kids are actively told to avoid if they want a future in the nfl or to win. (Now is this scheme based or just a rumor that spread like wild fire and it's too far gone to repair?). I firmly believe if CPJ had a tua, or a justin fields with a decent line. We could average 40 points a game. If we mixed in a little shotgun with a true dual threat QB, then possibly the bad label of an TO QB would melt and teams would see that he can lineup under center and shotgun. Also, throw and run. (CPJ has never had this type of true dual threat talent.) Think RG3, Lamar Jackson, Justin Fields, Watson. Again I believe kids were told to avoid this out of ignorance, and now no kid is willing to take a chance to see how it would work. (By now why would a justin fields give up an nfl future for Hope's to be the best option QB tech has. He would possibly give up millions)

2. Academics have played a huge role. Every 4*, 3*, kid can play ball. But not every kid can ball and focus on school. A lot don't go to college to get an education they go as a stepping stone to the NFL, as they have 1 goal. Nfl or bust and be your sales clerk guy at your local retail store. We fail to grab those kids that make a difference on teams like Miami, Clemson, LSU, Alabama. Half their players wouldn't understand how to read their class schedule, let alone take the course.
So what does that mean? We should focus a lot more on recruiting than we have. Not only learning a players skill and academics, but their personalities. We don't have nearly enough resources for our recruiting team. That's been known and shown. Not enough boosters to boost these kids along.

3. CPJ is an enigma of his own demise. He hasn't shown ways to adapt. He has always needed "his" guys. Well it seems he either cannot recruit the kids on offense, or has difficulty fighting that stigma of the TO being horrible for a QBs career. That was the first thing he should of combated. I just feel he was happy with whatever came and learned to deal with what QBs he was able to grab. (I believe he just isn't much of a recruiter) think if you're 16-18 years old and this old white guy comes and tries to recruit you talking about education and how you're a good fit. Compared to these younger coaches who go out and tell the kids about the night life, the perks of being a player on campus, things in that nature.

Here is a question, can players on the team be involved with recruiting? Can they go out with the coach and visit these kids? That may be one way to get a kid in. Think if taquon marshall flies out to a 4* dual threat QBs house for a visit and says how much fun tech is, and how he did well, but believes this kid can be a Tech legend. That he will be remembered for decades. That tech not only needs him, but he wants to pass the torch to this kid as the future of the program.
I feel player involvement would prove fruitful.
Basically I feel CPJ is a little out of touch with today's youth. I'm only 27, and I know I dont know how to talk to a 16-17 yr old kid. They are into some weird things haha.


Just shooting from the hip, but things I've thought about

 

[iceeater1969]

Did the opposing defenses forget those learning curves and adjustments during 2014? If I remember correctly, the GT O had the best FEI of all time until they later changed the calculations. Honest question: Did the defenses figure out the offense and then just forget it during 2014?

I believe u are sincere.
Imo - it's the OL size and scheme.
We change, they change, we......


It was a great run that was fueled by our players ., our system , a major shift in ol size. The Run was shown on national TV. It came against in a set of very very very inexperienced dc.

In 14 they did not forget - they never knew.

Since u are reasonable I will bring out names and time to support my thoughts.

2014 DC experience during The Run??
1. Who was the DC for UGA, FSU, MSU? Pruitt, Kelly, the db coach.

2 What were each of them doing 5 years before ? Pruitt was recruiter for Ala, Kelly was ast coach at gt, the db coach - who knows now.

3 Did they move up to DC because of their defensive record? No. Pruitt, who is a fast talker, went to fsu as dc for the fastest talker jimbo Fisher. After one year he went to uga.
When we played uga he had 2 years experience as a DC.
When he went to uga, jimbo hired Kelly who had coached 2-3 games after Groh.
When we played FSU he had 1 years experience as a DC
When we played MSU the very good DC had quit just before the game , so the DC at the game had O years experience.
TOTAL = 3 YEARS
Total games against our OFFENSE = 0.
They had no idea how to stop us.

3. What are the DC doing now? Talky Pruit moved on to Tennessee, Kelly? the dc?

Now to the good and what might have been!
OUR OFFENSE
How did we catch fire?;.
First half of 14 we sputtered but JT won in the clutch. We lost to not good Duke and unc!!! . THEN WE GOT GOING AGAINST Pitt, UVA, and Ncst. After that we had the RUN.
What was different?
In previous years we cut blocked a ton due to our smallish o l. To counter this the DC had their d l get back off the line so they could - defend the cut block and protect the MLB. In 14 COACH had moved us to a powerful ol. In 3 4 quarter, the ol attacked the tired dl w drive blocks. COACH saw this and added Shamire to make our ol NFL size.
NO ONE HAD SEEN THIS - Genius!
If we had not lost to Duke and unc - we could have made the playoffs. LET THAT SINK IN!

THEY ADJUST
In 15 they adjusted. At ND - same basic OL, but now dl is closer and almost never covering Shamire or joe . The fact that were even larger did not help. The third adjustment is blatant defensive holding.
Our massive ol in 15 was no longer effective.
Coach adjusts.
With the youth movement ( Bryan burned redshirt( 2 each 6 5 300lb plus Rs seniors tackles did not return for 16) and when we started 3 true freshman ol

In 16 and 17 we have smaller ol than 14 and 15, but bigger than the legacy ol.

Our present OL is big enough to drive block and still fast enough to school block or go down field. The dirty of passing in 17caused us to not see the change. The only game we played to the ol potential was vt.

Opinion on 18
the 18 season will be decided by the retooled ol and the referees.

With passing becoming effective , how dominant can we become dominant at l o s ? I say very!

And

WILL the refs call downfield cut blocking on the ol? (Center and a young guard are doing it past 5 yds) . So far so good, but we need to be cautious at uga.



I maybe biased by my love for our offense;. but i am optimistic we will gel on O and D and make a RUN whipping some mia and uga axx! All the pieces are there and Coach is an offensive genius.

Thank you for reading.

Imo the next change will include a lot more effective passing (Carter and camp).

I say
No decisions can be made till uga at earliest

And now .Go Jackets.

 

[wvGT11]

Honestly to end all arguments. This is it in a nutshell.

1. CPJ runs an offense that kids are actively told to avoid if they want a future in the nfl or to win. (Now is this scheme based or just a rumor that spread like wild fire and it's too far gone to repair?). I firmly believe if CPJ had a tua, or a justin fields with a decent line. We could average 40 points a game. If we mixed in a little shotgun with a true dual threat QB, then possibly the bad label of an TO QB would melt and teams would see that he can lineup under center and shotgun. Also, throw and run. (CPJ has never had this type of true dual threat talent.) Think RG3, Lamar Jackson, Justin Fields, Watson. Again I believe kids were told to avoid this out of ignorance, and now no kid is willing to take a chance to see how it would work. (By now why would a justin fields give up an nfl future for Hope's to be the best option QB tech has. He would possibly give up millions)

2. Academics have played a huge role. Every 4*, 3*, kid can play ball. But not every kid can ball and focus on school. A lot don't go to college to get an education they go as a stepping stone to the NFL, as they have 1 goal. Nfl or bust and be your sales clerk guy at your local retail store. We fail to grab those kids that make a difference on teams like Miami, Clemson, LSU, Alabama. Half their players wouldn't understand how to read their class schedule, let alone take the course.
So what does that mean? We should focus a lot more on recruiting than we have. Not only learning a players skill and academics, but their personalities. We don't have nearly enough resources for our recruiting team. That's been known and shown. Not enough boosters to boost these kids along.

3. CPJ is an enigma of his own demise. He hasn't shown ways to adapt. He has always needed "his" guys. Well it seems he either cannot recruit the kids on offense, or has difficulty fighting that stigma of the TO being horrible for a QBs career. That was the first thing he should of combated. I just feel he was happy with whatever came and learned to deal with what QBs he was able to grab. (I believe he just isn't much of a recruiter) think if you're 16-18 years old and this old white guy comes and tries to recruit you talking about education and how you're a good fit. Compared to these younger coaches who go out and tell the kids about the night life, the perks of being a player on campus, things in that nature.

Here is a question, can players on the team be involved with recruiting? Can they go out with the coach and visit these kids? That may be one way to get a kid in. Think if taquon marshall flies out to a 4* dual threat QBs house for a visit and says how much fun tech is, and how he did well, but believes this kid can be a Tech legend. That he will be remembered for decades. That tech not only needs him, but he wants to pass the torch to this kid as the future of the program.
I feel player involvement would prove fruitful.
Basically I feel CPJ is a little out of touch with today's youth. I'm only 27, and I know I dont know how to talk to a 16-17 yr old kid. They are into some weird things haha.


Just shooting from the hip, but things I've thought about

Some good points there, and a couple of thoughts

1) CPJ knows full well there is a crutch with going to GT. He has mentioned multiple times that in his pitch to recruits he brings up if they want a solid education / degree or if they want to play under the spotlight of 90,000 etc. We do send a lot of guys to the NFL, but also we graduate more players than most schools and a lot of those players have real degrees that can be used if they choose not to purse the NFL.
So whether it's the TO or the school who knows.
I just don't think this fantasy of sticking in a young couch someone like a young Dabo is going to change much. We might attract more players to the offense , but remember these kids are probably also competing for Georgia , Alabama , Auburn and the likes

2) I would like to see CPJ adapt the To to more of what Auburn has run in the past, Its totally do able ?

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

I believe u are sincere.
Imo - it's the OL size and scheme.
We change, they change, we......


It was a great run that was fueled by our players ., our system , a major shift in ol size. The Run was shown on national TV. It came against in a set of very very very inexperienced dc.

In 14 they did not forget - they never knew.

Since u are reasonable I will bring out names and time to support my thoughts.

2014 DC experience during The Run??
1. Who was the DC for UGA, FSU, MSU? Pruitt, Kelly, the db coach.

2 What were each of them doing 5 years before ? Pruitt was recruiter for Ala, Kelly was ast coach at gt, the db coach - who knows now.

3 Did they move up to DC because of their defensive record? No. Pruitt, who is a fast talker, went to fsu as dc for the fastest talker jimbo Fisher. After one year he went to uga.
When we played uga he had 2 years experience as a DC.
When he went to uga, jimbo hired Kelly who had coached 2-3 games after Groh.
When we played FSU he had 1 years experience as a DC
When we played MSU the very good DC had quit just before the game , so the DC at the game had O years experience.
TOTAL = 3 YEARS
Total games against our OFFENSE = 0.
They had no idea how to stop us.

3. What are the DC doing now? Talky Pruit moved on to Tennessee, Kelly? the dc?

Now to the good and what might have been!
OUR OFFENSE
How did we catch fire?;.
First half of 14 we sputtered but JT won in the clutch. We lost to not good Duke and unc!!! . THEN WE GOT GOING AGAINST Pitt, UVA, and Ncst. After that we had the RUN.
What was different?
In previous years we cut blocked a ton due to our smallish o l. To counter this the DC had their d l get back off the line so they could - defend the cut block and protect the MLB. In 14 COACH had moved us to a powerful ol. In 3 4 quarter, the ol attacked the tired dl w drive blocks. COACH saw this and added Shamire to make our ol NFL size.
NO ONE HAD SEEN THIS - Genius!
If we had not lost to Duke and unc - we could have made the playoffs. LET THAT SINK IN!

THEY ADJUST
In 15 they adjusted. At ND - same basic OL, but now dl is closer and almost never covering Shamire or joe . The fact that were even larger did not help. The third adjustment is blatant defensive holding.
Our massive ol in 15 was no longer effective.
Coach adjusts.
With the youth movement ( Bryan burned redshirt( 2 each 6 5 300lb plus Rs seniors tackles did not return for 16) and when we started 3 true freshman ol

In 16 and 17 we have smaller ol than 14 and 15, but bigger than the legacy ol.

Our present OL is big enough to drive block and still fast enough to school block or go down field. The dirty of passing in 17caused us to not see the change. The only game we played to the ol potential was vt.

Opinion on 18
the 18 season will be decided by the retooled ol and the referees.

With passing becoming effective , how dominant can we become dominant at l o s ? I say very!

And

WILL the refs call downfield cut blocking on the ol? (Center and a young guard are doing it past 5 yds) . So far so good, but we need to be cautious at uga.



I maybe biased by my love for our offense;. but i am optimistic we will gel on O and D and make a RUN whipping some mia and uga axx! All the pieces are there and Coach is an offensive genius.

Thank you for reading.

Imo the next change will include a lot more effective passing (Carter and camp).

I say
No decisions can be made till uga at earliest

And now .Go Jackets.

This is pretty good food for thought. The only minor point where I'm inclined to disagree with you is that VT was the only game where OL played to their potential last year. The opening game vs UT was probably their best game. They OWNED the LOS the entire game.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

Things that make you go hmmmmm, CPJ's records against:

Power 5/Independents - 58-53
Group 5 - 7-2
DII or lower - 13-0

and, if you want to throw out years 1&2 which were with Gailey's players the record drops to 41-48 against Power 5/Independents

Group 5 - Losses to BYU (twice) and USF - 7-3?

 

[AE 87]

I agree with your points. But I think you're glossing over two things:

1) Win-Loss record is too simplistic, as you say. But if you're going to use PPD to say the offense is working, you have to be fair and acknowledge that the statistics for everything else have been quite poor. Defense has been consistently awful by nearly every statistical measure. Special teams have been a weakness overall most of his tenure. Butker was great, but otherwise ST have been weak.

2) His offense works and that's great. But CPJ is our Head Coach not our OC. He's responsible for everything: offense, defense, ST, recruiting, personnel, discipline, retention, media relations. I like CPJ. I support CPJ. My first choice for our HC next year is [an improved] CPJ. But the one thing that really sticks in my craw is when he calls the defense or the STs "them" or "those guys". The offense is always "we" from him. I get that he wants to hire someone to run those phases and forget about them so he can be a glorified OC. But it hasn't worked. As HC, the buck stops with him. He may not be satisfied with mediocre defense (or ST, or recruiting, or....), but he's never been willing to sacrifice what he wants: time/hands on with the Offense; to work on that side. Hiring yet another DC to see if this one sticks seems like the definition of insanity. Why not try hiring an OC and let CPJ use his massive football IQ on helping the D? In other words, focusing his attention where the team needs it- like every other HC.

If CPJ were just the OC and our offense was that good, we'd all be saying 'fire the HC and promote CPJ!' But he's not...

Well, you may be right that I glossed over them, but I didn't ignore them. When I talked about him replacing DC's, I was tacitly speaking about his ownership of the whole team and not just the offense. In my comment at the end, I said that we really need CNW to work out because (as I've said elsewhere) we've got to play well on both sides of the ball to be consistently competitive.

I am sympathetic to your snark, and I also wonder whether there is a negative impact on our D from CPJ focusing his attention on the O. That's why I made my comment about the need for CNW to work out. However, I also think that this complaint against CPJ can be over-done. CPJ reportedly was not able to hire his DC of choice when he first arrived because of finances, hired Groh as a replacement in part because most of his compensation was being paid by UVA, and hired Roof on the cheap initially because of Roof's desire to come back home. Frankly, none of us know for sure how much the AD and finances affected those hires.

In other words, I'm sympathetic to complaints about CPJ with respect to him not fielding a competitive D. I agree that he's responsible for that also. I think that he's shown that he also sees this by his willingness to do what he can to improve that side of the ball also. Even head coaches that are not also offensive coordinators make that decision like when CU replaced Kevin Steele with Venables after the 2011 season. Your comment, "I get that he wants to hire someone to run those phases and forget about them so he can be a glorified OC" seems to me to be simply an ignorant rant. Anyone who pays attention to college football knows that Coordinator hires are a significant part of any HC's job, and anyone who pays attention to GT football knows that CPJ has not been completely hands off on D.

With respect to your suggestion that CPJ should hire an OC, I think the facts are that our current budget doesn't make that likely any time soon. In 2017, the pool for GT's assistant coaches was 2.9 million. By comparison, the pool for u[sic]ga's assistants was 4.6 million. I think the highest paid coach on the offensive side of the ball in 2017 was Sewak at less than $300,000, about $500,000 dollars less than a competitive OC salary. CPJ being both HC and OC is a huge benefit for us financially.

In my opinion, if we want GT to be consistently competitive with the top 10, and regularly top 25, we need to hire the best coaches. I really disagree with any suggestion that we could rely on improved recruiting for this. However, as my last paragraph notes, we are not close to the budget for that. IIuc, Dabo makes a lot more than our entire staff combined.

 

[smokey_wasp]

Group 5 - Losses to BYU (twice) and USF - 7-3?

BYU is Independent. So, the two must be USF and....(sorry to mention it) MTSU.

And "DII or lower" should read FCS or what was called Division IAA, I assume. We don't play division II ever.

 

[year_of_the_swarm]

Posted this in another thread, but it really belongs on this thread.

CPJ has been coach of the year what, 4-7 times in his career? His offense that you hate so much put 63 on Bowling Green, 50 on South Florida... in years past its put 56 on NC State, 49 on Mississippi State, 56 on Pittsburgh, 68 on North Carolina, 56 on Virginia, 56 on Syracuse, etc..

The defense is the current problem, has nothing to do with the offense. The offense would be even more productive if the defense put them on the field more, created more turnovers, field position, etc.

People need to be very careful about this kind of thing... Don't make the Texas or Nebraska mistake, and many other programs have made it too. Nebraska fired a guy with a 75% win percentage and have been a total dumpster fire with like 8 different coaches since. They are 0-4 this year and are lucky they aren't 0-5 because another game got cancelled. They went out and hired the next big guy, Scott Frost, out of UCF.

Kentucky is an interesting model to look at. Stoops has been there 6 years... He gets an automatic one year contract extension any time he wins 7 games in a year. They are committing to football. They have recognized he is a good coach and are with him for the long haul apparently, and I will bet that pays off for them. At most schools Stoops would have already been fired for not winning the national championship at KENTUCKY in 2-3 years.

Georgia Tech has a great coach. Its not even disputable. The accomplishments speak for themselves. Stick with it..

On top of all that.. the talent on the team leads me to believe they are poised for BIG things in the next two years.

 

[year_of_the_swarm]

Honestly to end all arguments. This is it in a nutshell.

1. CPJ runs an offense that kids are actively told to avoid if they want a future in the nfl or to win. (Now is this scheme based or just a rumor that spread like wild fire and it's too far gone to repair?). I firmly believe if CPJ had a tua, or a justin fields with a decent line. We could average 40 points a game. If we mixed in a little shotgun with a true dual threat QB, then possibly the bad label of an TO QB would melt and teams would see that he can lineup under center and shotgun. Also, throw and run. (CPJ has never had this type of true dual threat talent.) Think RG3, Lamar Jackson, Justin Fields, Watson. Again I believe kids were told to avoid this out of ignorance, and now no kid is willing to take a chance to see how it would work. (By now why would a justin fields give up an nfl future for Hope's to be the best option QB tech has. He would possibly give up millions)

2. Academics have played a huge role. Every 4*, 3*, kid can play ball. But not every kid can ball and focus on school. A lot don't go to college to get an education they go as a stepping stone to the NFL, as they have 1 goal. Nfl or bust and be your sales clerk guy at your local retail store. We fail to grab those kids that make a difference on teams like Miami, Clemson, LSU, Alabama. Half their players wouldn't understand how to read their class schedule, let alone take the course.
So what does that mean? We should focus a lot more on recruiting than we have. Not only learning a players skill and academics, but their personalities. We don't have nearly enough resources for our recruiting team. That's been known and shown. Not enough boosters to boost these kids along.

3. CPJ is an enigma of his own demise. He hasn't shown ways to adapt. He has always needed "his" guys. Well it seems he either cannot recruit the kids on offense, or has difficulty fighting that stigma of the TO being horrible for a QBs career. That was the first thing he should of combated. I just feel he was happy with whatever came and learned to deal with what QBs he was able to grab. (I believe he just isn't much of a recruiter) think if you're 16-18 years old and this old white guy comes and tries to recruit you talking about education and how you're a good fit. Compared to these younger coaches who go out and tell the kids about the night life, the perks of being a player on campus, things in that nature.

Here is a question, can players on the team be involved with recruiting? Can they go out with the coach and visit these kids? That may be one way to get a kid in. Think if taquon marshall flies out to a 4* dual threat QBs house for a visit and says how much fun tech is, and how he did well, but believes this kid can be a Tech legend. That he will be remembered for decades. That tech not only needs him, but he wants to pass the torch to this kid as the future of the program.
I feel player involvement would prove fruitful.
Basically I feel CPJ is a little out of touch with today's youth. I'm only 27, and I know I dont know how to talk to a 16-17 yr old kid. They are into some weird things haha.


Just shooting from the hip, but things I've thought about

I will take a shot at this...

1.) I agree with you on this one, which is why he needs to modernize a little and go with the shotgun version. On that note, the new coach at Georgia Southern, Bob Debesse, would be a very nice hire for offensive coordinator. His option offense is modeled out of the shotgun, incorporates a little more passing, and I think is more appealing to great athletes. If Paul Johnson was going to hire an OC, it needs to be this guy. You can still run the ball, but this is clearly the more modern/versatile version of the triple option that would attract better recruits. You can appeal to better QB's, but you can really make your pitch to NFL caliber running backs in this offense.

New Mexico, one of the worst programs in the nation historically, became REALLY good on offense with this offense.

Bob DeBessee (In his first year at Georgia Southern)
---In 2016, the Lobos blitzed several school records on the way to leading the nation in rushing yards per game, a first in program history. It also marked the fifth time in five seasons UNM has finished in the top-10 in rushing nationally, and overall it marked the 10th time it’s happened in program history.
---The Lobo offense was prolific, scoring 48 rushing touchdowns, breaking the previous school record of 42, which was set in 1971 and tied in 2015. Those 48 touchdowns paved the way for a school record 477 points, and a school record 36.7-points per game scoring average. The Lobos also broke the school record for total offense, racking up an astonishing 5,939 yards. The team also set records for yards per play for the season (6.85) and for single-game total offense yards per play, as the team averaged 13.53 per play against Wyoming with 691 yards on just 51 plays.
UNM also led the nation in rushing plays of 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 and 70 yards or more, and UNM running back Teriyon Gipson led the nation in yards per attempt, averaging 8.75 yards per carry.
---In the 2015 season, the Lobos led the nation in total plays of 60 or more yards (11) and 70 or more yards (7). The Lobos added a deadly aerial attack as well and the team threw three touchdown passes of 80 or more yards in the final five games of the season, the most 80-yard completions in the history of UNM for a single season. The Lobo rushing attack again finished in the top 10 nationally.
---In the 2014 season, UNM once again finished in the top five in rushing nationally, finishing fourth, averaging 310.4 yards per game. The Lobos were the only team in the nation to have finished in the top five from 2012-14 with an average of 300 yards or more, and that was all under DeBesse.
---UNM ranked in the top three nationally in most runs of 20, 30, 40, 50 and 60 yards for the season, leading the nation in most 50 and 60 yard rushes (14 and 10 respectively).

 

[smokey_wasp]

Posted this in another thread, but it really belongs on this thread.

CPJ has been coach of the year what, 4-7 times in his career? His offense that you hate so much put 63 on Bowling Green, 50 on South Florida... in years past its put 56 on NC State, 49 on Mississippi State, 56 on Pittsburgh, 68 on North Carolina, 56 on Virginia, 56 on Syracuse, etc..

The defense is the current problem, has nothing to do with the offense. The offense would be even more productive if the defense put them on the field more, created more turnovers, field position, etc.

People need to be very careful about this kind of thing... Don't make the Texas or Nebraska mistake, and many other programs have made it too. Nebraska fired a guy with a 75% win percentage and have been a total dumpster fire with like 8 different coaches since. They are 0-4 this year and are lucky they aren't 0-5 because another game got cancelled. They went out and hired the next big guy, Scott Frost, out of UCF.

Kentucky is an interesting model to look at. Stoops has been there 6 years... He gets an automatic one year contract extension any time he wins 7 games in a year. They are committing to football. They have recognized he is a good coach and are with him for the long haul apparently, and I will bet that pays off for them. At most schools Stoops would have already been fired for not winning the national championship at KENTUCKY in 2-3 years.

Georgia Tech has a great coach. Its not even disputable. The accomplishments speak for themselves. Stick with it..

On top of all that.. the talent on the team leads me to believe they are poised for BIG things in the next two years.

What does Nebraska firing a coach with a 75 percent winning percentage have to do with our coach with a 57 percent (and dropping) winning percentage? A coach who is 19-22 over the last 3 and a half seasons?

And Stoops is our model? He has managed to go 7-6 (4-4) in a complete dumpster fire of a division.

 

[smokey_wasp]

I will take a shot at this...

1.) I agree with you on this one, which is why he needs to modernize a little and go with the shotgun version. On that note, the new coach at Georgia Southern, Bob Debesse, would be a very nice hire for offensive coordinator. His option offense is modeled out of the shotgun, incorporates a little more passing, and I think is more appealing to great athletes. If Paul Johnson was going to hire an OC, it needs to be this guy. You can still run the ball, but this is clearly the more modern/versatile version of the triple option that would attract better recruits. You can appeal to better QB's, but you can really make your pitch to NFL caliber running backs in this offense.

New Mexico, one of the worst programs in the nation historically, became REALLY good on offense with this offense.

Bob DeBessee (In his first year at Georgia Southern)
---In 2016, the Lobos blitzed several school records on the way to leading the nation in rushing yards per game, a first in program history. It also marked the fifth time in five seasons UNM has finished in the top-10 in rushing nationally, and overall it marked the 10th time it’s happened in program history.
---The Lobo offense was prolific, scoring 48 rushing touchdowns, breaking the previous school record of 42, which was set in 1971 and tied in 2015. Those 48 touchdowns paved the way for a school record 477 points, and a school record 36.7-points per game scoring average. The Lobos also broke the school record for total offense, racking up an astonishing 5,939 yards. The team also set records for yards per play for the season (6.85) and for single-game total offense yards per play, as the team averaged 13.53 per play against Wyoming with 691 yards on just 51 plays.
UNM also led the nation in rushing plays of 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 and 70 yards or more, and UNM running back Teriyon Gipson led the nation in yards per attempt, averaging 8.75 yards per carry.
---In the 2015 season, the Lobos led the nation in total plays of 60 or more yards (11) and 70 or more yards (7). The Lobos added a deadly aerial attack as well and the team threw three touchdown passes of 80 or more yards in the final five games of the season, the most 80-yard completions in the history of UNM for a single season. The Lobo rushing attack again finished in the top 10 nationally.
---In the 2014 season, UNM once again finished in the top five in rushing nationally, finishing fourth, averaging 310.4 yards per game. The Lobos were the only team in the nation to have finished in the top five from 2012-14 with an average of 300 yards or more, and that was all under DeBesse.
---UNM ranked in the top three nationally in most runs of 20, 30, 40, 50 and 60 yards for the season, leading the nation in most 50 and 60 yard rushes (14 and 10 respectively).

CPJ will retire long before he ever hires an OC or changes to shotgun. Zero chance. But hey, I like the sound of this DeBessee guy. lol

 

[year_of_the_swarm]

What does Nebraska firing a coach with a 75 percent winning percentage have to do with our coach with a 57 percent (and dropping) winning percentage? A coach who is 19-22 over the last 3 and a half seasons?

And Stoops is our model? He has managed to go 7-6 (4-4) in a complete dumpster fire of a division.

I am saying the grass isn't always greener on the other side, and Georgia Tech has very good football coach. The Nebraska example is relevant because they fired Frank Solich, who was a good football coach, thinking they could bring in someone else and immediately start winning more. More than the 75% clip he was already winning at, I guess. And they are a total dumpster fire.

If Paul Johnson was tanking the program, or showing that he isn't a good football coach, that is one thing. But that is not the case here.

Consistency will pay off in the long run, if you have a good coach. GTech has a good coach, and should stick with him. It may take Woody 2 more seasons to really fix the defense, and that that point Tech will be primed for a good run.

 

[smokey_wasp]

I am saying the grass isn't always greener on the other side, and Georgia Tech has very good football coach. The Nebraska example is relevant because they fired Frank Solich, who was a good football coach, thinking they could bring in someone else and immediately start winning more. More than the 75% clip he was already winning at, I guess. And they are a total dumpster fire.

If Paul Johnson was tanking the program, or showing that he isn't a good football coach, that is one thing. But that is not the case here.

Consistency will pay off in the long run, if you have a good coach. GTech has a good coach, and should stick with him. It may take Woody 2 more seasons to really fix the defense, and that that point Tech will be primed for a good run.

I have defended CPJ for years and I think he was a great hire for us for a long time. But you say "If Paul Johnson was tanking the program, or showing that he isn't a good football coach, that is one thing. But that is not the case here."

A couple of points: As to whether he is tanking the program, I think the rest of this year will answer that question. If we play better, reel off some wins, maybe make a bowl game, then no. If the season continues the way it has, it would be hard to argue that it doesn't constitute tanking the program over a 4 year period. We could point to 2016 as a bright spot, but we finished 5th in the Coastal and if Searcy hadn't improvised his way into the endzone against uga, the TaxSlayer Bowl probably would have passed us over and we would have ended up in Shreveport and remember 2016 as a "meh" year.

To the second point, Is he showing he's not a good coach? Well, I do think he is and always has been a good football coach, but do we look anywhere near a well-coached football team over the last season and a half? Constant blown 2nd half leads, constant special teams gaffes, an offense that went scoreless for a half against a pretty bad Pitt team? Missed assignments every week? Now, maybe he just doesn't have good assistants anymore, but again, he hired them.

I hope we turn it around starting at Louisville this week. I think CPJ pretty much has to, honestly.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

BYU is Independent. So, the two must be USF and....(sorry to mention it) MTSU.

And "DII or lower" should read FCS or what was called Division IAA, I assume. We don't play division II ever.

Ah yes, MTSU. I apparently had blocked that...er, forgot about that one lol. I thought BYU was Mtn West when we played 'em?

 

[smokey_wasp]

Ah yes, MTSU. I apparently had blocked that...er, forgot about that one lol. I thought BYU was Mtn West when we played 'em?

Independent since 2011. I had to look it up, myself.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

I am saying the grass isn't always greener on the other side, and Georgia Tech has very good football coach. The Nebraska example is relevant because they fired Frank Solich, who was a good football coach, thinking they could bring in someone else and immediately start winning more. More than the 75% clip he was already winning at, I guess. And they are a total dumpster fire.

If Paul Johnson was tanking the program, or showing that he isn't a good football coach, that is one thing. But that is not the case here.

Consistency will pay off in the long run, if you have a good coach. GTech has a good coach, and should stick with him. It may take Woody 2 more seasons to really fix the defense, and that that point Tech will be primed for a good run.

I respect that opinion but, right now, it's been 2 of 3 losing seasons and missed bowls in a row. We absolutely need to see how the season plays out but another losing season would be 3 of 4 and would absolutely meet the definition of a program being tanked. I'd also argue that to be so deficient in football fundamentals in the 11th year of a coach isn't the best indicator that said coach is a 'good football coach' but whatever. Also, to not have any sort of uptick in recruiting over that same period is a good indication that the football coach may not be as good as thought of either.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

Independent since 2011. I had to look it up, myself.

wow - what a dumb move that was! (BYU's independence, not your research of it lol)

 

[takethepoints]

Honestly to end all arguments. This is it in a nutshell.

1. CPJ runs an offense that kids are actively told to avoid if they want a future in the nfl or to win. (Now is this scheme based or just a rumor that spread like wild fire and it's too far gone to repair?). I firmly believe if CPJ had a tua, or a justin fields with a decent line. We could average 40 points a game. If we mixed in a little shotgun with a true dual threat QB, then possibly the bad label of an TO QB would melt and teams would see that he can lineup under center and shotgun. Also, throw and run. (CPJ has never had this type of true dual threat talent.) Think RG3, Lamar Jackson, Justin Fields, Watson. Again I believe kids were told to avoid this out of ignorance, and now no kid is willing to take a chance to see how it would work. (By now why would a justin fields give up an nfl future for Hope's to be the best option QB tech has. He would possibly give up millions)

2. Academics have played a huge role. Every 4*, 3*, kid can play ball. But not every kid can ball and focus on school. A lot don't go to college to get an education they go as a stepping stone to the NFL, as they have 1 goal. Nfl or bust and be your sales clerk guy at your local retail store. We fail to grab those kids that make a difference on teams like Miami, Clemson, LSU, Alabama. Half their players wouldn't understand how to read their class schedule, let alone take the course.
So what does that mean? We should focus a lot more on recruiting than we have. Not only learning a players skill and academics, but their personalities. We don't have nearly enough resources for our recruiting team. That's been known and shown. Not enough boosters to boost these kids along.

3. CPJ is an enigma of his own demise. He hasn't shown ways to adapt. He has always needed "his" guys. Well it seems he either cannot recruit the kids on offense, or has difficulty fighting that stigma of the TO being horrible for a QBs career. That was the first thing he should of combated. I just feel he was happy with whatever came and learned to deal with what QBs he was able to grab. (I believe he just isn't much of a recruiter) think if you're 16-18 years old and this old white guy comes and tries to recruit you talking about education and how you're a good fit. Compared to these younger coaches who go out and tell the kids about the night life, the perks of being a player on campus, things in that nature.

Here is a question, can players on the team be involved with recruiting? Can they go out with the coach and visit these kids? That may be one way to get a kid in. Think if taquon marshall flies out to a 4* dual threat QBs house for a visit and says how much fun tech is, and how he did well, but believes this kid can be a Tech legend. That he will be remembered for decades. That tech not only needs him, but he wants to pass the torch to this kid as the future of the program.
I feel player involvement would prove fruitful.
Basically I feel CPJ is a little out of touch with today's youth. I'm only 27, and I know I dont know how to talk to a 16-17 yr old kid. They are into some weird things haha.

OK, one at a time:

1. I've often heard this and I think it is predicated on two false assumptions. First, it assumes that if we had a different O we would get more skilled people at QB. But that further assumes that our admission standards and curriculum would change as well. If I'm a highly recruited shotgun QB, I'm only going to be interested in Tech if I want an engineering degree. Remember that other schools that offer a more varied curriculum and and easier path to graduation will still exist and still be recruiting me. I haven't seen any evidence to indicate that a different O will open the flood gates for 5* recruits. Second, it assumes that we can't get good athletes at QB. But we have and the main reason is that we offered them a chance to play QB instead of being shunted off into "athlete" limbo. Shoot, we have one of those - Graham - waiting in the wings right now. Also, it assumes that the star system is an invariable gage of athletic prowess. I doubt that. We usually recruit "dual QB" types and they are regularly rated lower then more traditional QB types because they are dual purpose backs.

2. When you're right, you're right.

3. Multiple part answer: a) This is always something you hear about coaches who use a system offense or defense. They want players who fit the scheme and go after them rather then other more highly rated players. Coach wants players who fit for a reason. and that gives us opportunities to pick up athletes of quality that can be efficient in our O. Doesn't work on D, more's the pity. b) Most of the recruiting is done by assistants who are much younger then Coach. He is usually the guy who sells the parents after the players are already at the cusp. And that works; over and over we hear from players and their folks that they liked how Coach was a straight shooter and that their sons would get a good education. c) "… think if you're 16-18 years old and this old white guy comes and tries to recruit you talking about education and how you're a good fit. Compared to these younger coaches who go out and tell the kids about the night life, the perks of being a player on campus, things in that nature." Tech's best selling point is the value of the education you'll get there. Also, I doubt seriously if any coach goes into a kid's home and talks about what a good time he'll have in the hearing of his parents; they leave that to the players during visits. d) Yes, during the visits and on social media the players recruit. And pretty successfully too. When Tech gets a player to visit, they often sign up. Of course, we get players who are already leaning our way to visit, so this is no surprise.

Well … another too long: don't read. Sorry.

 

[GTRX7]

I respect that opinion but, right now, it's been 2 of 3 losing seasons and missed bowls in a row. We absolutely need to see how the season plays out but another losing season would be 3 of 4 and would absolutely meet the definition of a program being tanked. I'd also argue that to be so deficient in football fundamentals in the 11th year of a coach isn't the best indicator that said coach is a 'good football coach' but whatever. Also, to not have any sort of uptick in recruiting over that same period is a good indication that the football coach may not be as good as thought of either.

I largely agree with this, but hate the argument of "fundamentals in the 11th year." While it may be CPJ's 11th year, it isn't like it is the player's 11th year. Every single year, his most experienced players leave and he has to teach brand new guys the system. That was just as true in his 5th year as his 11th.

I think that, by and large, our upperclassmen on offense have shown pretty good fundamentals this year (e.g., Steward, Cooper, Bryan, Lynch, etc.). The fundamentls issues have largely been at QB, BB, and in some spots on O line -- not uncoincidentally, the positions where we have seen loads of injuries and transfers.

I see the retention of players as a bigger issue for CPJ than teaching fundamentals. If Mills, Marshall, and Benson are starting at B-back, I think we would be more than solid there. Same at O line if we could just stay healthy. I also think that one of Ratliff, Jay Jones, or Lucas Johnson would be starting this Friday if still here and healthy. Heck, even a Matthew Jordan would likely show better fundamentals than Marshall -- though maybe less dynamic ability.

 

[iceeater1969]

This is pretty good food for thought. The only minor point where I'm inclined to disagree with you is that VT was the only game where OL played to their potential last year. The opening game vs UT was probably their best game. They OWNED the LOS the entire game.

Thanks for the kind reply.

Sorry but I would like to give a minor response.
Yes , we were great but I think if u check u will see Tennesse d l was way back off the l o s. Our new lean 285# ol guys got off ball and hit them w full head of steam . A few teams like usf tried this but most of them are up close. What I saw in the gt game was on 2 drives our 285#" guys were quick AND STRONG enough to handle Settles and another NFL guy. This put vt off balance and gave T marshall his best passing game.

To honor a Great game we both love (even though thier coach was behind the curve). Look at Will Drive block, then braun coming for first defender, then Lee coming to lead the way. ! What if this was a called blocking scheme for a very L o n g pass play.

This scheme can be so good.