Next Up - Revenge - Hopefully Sweet

[TheAnonymous404]

I missed most of the arguments you had in the past week, but I know you’ve definitely brought up some controversial points. I can tell you that the GTAA’s financial situation is in far worse shape than how it is in your made up concoction of finances. Georgia Tech’s football revenue accounts for nearly the entire budget of GT athletics. The GTAA is over $100M in debt, with an unstable money maker in football. There’s absolutely no reason to press a basketball move when there’s no guarantee the situation will get any better in the coming years. You keep saying that you want to reallocate funds from AI 2020 into the basketball program, but apparently don’t realize how far behind GT’s facilities are as a whole compared to other P5 schools. The Edge building looks like it was built in the 70s, inside and out. RCS is no where near the facility or should be when it houses a perennial top 25 baseball team. O’Keefe is in desperate need of an upgrade also.

Also, with the threat of NCAA violations, academic recruiting hindrances, and a mediocre fan base, what makes you think GT will be able to lure some top coach right now anyway?

Again, I love the sensationalism, but I would like to remind you that this is just a sports board and truly nothing on here is a real controversial issue. I can debate with folks without losing my mind. In regards to the 100m dollars of debt, I would love to see where you came up with that figure truly I think that figure is severely exaggerated possibly outright fictitious. The Patriots used our football facilities just fine on their way to a Super Bowl victory. We also had an indoor practice facility before our friends up the road in Athens. I am sure some of the facilities do need to be updated, but I am sorry the harsh reality is revenue driving sports come first for me. At any school, basketball and football drive revenue, and that revenue is used to support the non-revenue sports. In regards to Russ Chandler, I have been to multiple games, and it is a fine venue for what it is college baseball. We are competitive enough in college baseball, and our money may be better spent on brining our basketball program up to the same level. Additionally, while the O'Keefe center may need an upgrade, I don't understand why we couldn't play some of the volleyball matches in McCamish if we are all really champions of holding our women's sports programs on the same level as our men's. Far too many people on this board are scared to express their opinions, seriously guys get a grip its just sports boards try not to take it so *amn personal because I certainly do not.

 

[lv20gt]

Statistically my guy. Statistically. I said on paper it doesn’t look that strange. Multiple times.

And yet you just hand wave the statistical talk way and not address it.

 

[JacketOff]

Again, I love the sensationalism, but I would like to remind you that this is just a sports board and truly nothing on here is a real controversial issue. I can debate with folks without losing my mind. In regards to the 100m dollars of debt, I would love to see where you came up with that figure truly I think that figure is severely exaggerated possibly outright fictitious. The Patriots used our football facilities just fine on their way to a Super Bowl victory. We also had an indoor practice facility before our friends up the road in Athens. I am sure some of the facilities do need to be updated, but I am sorry the harsh reality is revenue driving sports come first for me. At any school, basketball and football drive revenue, and that revenue is used to support the non-revenue sports. In regards to Russ Chandler, I have been to multiple games, and it is a fine venue for what it is college baseball. We are competitive enough in college baseball, and our money may be better spent on brining our basketball program up to the same level. Additionally, while the O'Keefe center may need an upgrade, I don't understand why we couldn't play some of the volleyball matches in McCamish if we are all really champions of holding our women's sports programs on the same level as our men's. Far too many people on this board are scared to express their opinions, seriously guys get a grip its just sports boards try not to take it so *amn personal because I certainly do not.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...tball-s-top-teams-are-built-on-crippling-debt
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...tball-s-top-teams-are-built-on-crippling-debt

This article from 2017 shows GTAA’s debt at over $200M. GTAA has run at a deficit for 2 straight years.

I’m not sure why you assume people are taking your posts personal. There’s certainly nothing in my post that seems personal. But anyway...
Most basketball programs at football schools are just trying to pay for themselves. Hardly any basketball programs turn a profit. GT is not Duke or Kansas. Any significant money that will be made by GT athletics will come from the football program. Sure, the Patriots used GT’s facilities for a week. That doesn’t mean they’re anywhere near up to par with any of the schools Tech is competing against. Also, having an indoor facility first doesn’t make it superior in any way. There’s not even a 100yard practice football field on campus anywhere. The training room in Edge looks like it hasn’t been updated since the 80s. There was even an old jukebox in there that provided music. Literally, a jukebox. Like one from a bar scene in a movie set in the 70s.

Russ Chandler is dwarfed by better facilities all around “baseball country” in the South and West Coast. Nearly every P5 school besides the B1G (and even some of those) have much better facilities than RCS. I don’t mean the stadium itself which also needs an update, I mean the player and coach areas. That’s getting a well deserved update this offseason.

Volleyball plays in O’Keefe because it actually provides a great atmosphere and home court advantage. O’Keefe sells out pretty regularly, and it gets loud. Moving those matches to McCamish takes away all of that atmosphere and makes the matches sterile and unexciting.

Is GT basketball in a good place right now? No, absolutely not. Does that mean there needs to be immediate action and change? No. Like I said. There’s no need to rush a move. Wait for the NCAA stuff to play out, see who will be available, look at how stable the football program is. Then make a move. Making a move out of angst will almost never work out.

 

[JacketOff]

And yet you just hand wave the statistical talk way and not address it.

I didn’t hand wave and stats away. You brought up percentages that are skewed because the integers you’re working with in the data set are physically small. Any numerical increase or decrease will look huge as a percentage when the numbers you’re working with are <20. I’m done conversing about it though. Tech fouled more than they usually do, ND fouled less. End of story.

 

[GTFLETCH]

Coach Josh Pastner really sucks without his BFF Ron Bell helping him... We need a new coach really fast....SMH... Where are all the guys who said 2-3 years ago that Pastner was the answer????

 

[sidewalkGTfan]

Yep. We play good basketball when we have our full roster. But it feels like over the past few years we’ve had our full roster like 20% of the time.

Our record with a full roster, this season, is below .500.

 

[lv20gt]

I didn’t hand wave and stats away. You brought up percentages that are skewed because the integers you’re working with in the data set are physically small. Any numerical increase or decrease will look huge as a percentage when the numbers you’re working with are <20. I’m done conversing about it though. Tech fouled more than they usually do, ND fouled less. End of story.

lol? Bringing up percentages to skew things. Here's my first post.

So they were 3.5 fouls less than their average and we were 4 more than ours. Or, let me put that another way. They fouled 28% less than their average and we fouled 21% more than our average.

GT averages 18 FTA per game. We shot 12. ND averages 16.5 FTA per game. They shot 28.

ND's opponents on average foul them 15.9 time per game. GT had 22.

GT's opponents average 17.9 fouls per game. ND had 9.

And yes, you're hand waving away them shooting 11.5 more freethrows than average, getting called for 9 fewer fouls than our opponents usually do, and us getting called for 6 more fouls than ND's opponents usually do as just a couple of calls here our there.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Why you feel sorry for pastner?

Because I think he is a good guy and I am a fan of our program.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Our record with a full roster, this season, is below .500.

With a small sample and 3 losses against Top 10 teams where we had a chance to win 2 of them late.

I don’t see how anybody can watch how we’ve played while missing starters to how we’ve played with a normal roster and say they compare.

 

[GTbball2016]

With a small sample and 3 losses against Top 10 teams where we had a chance to win 2 of them late.

I don’t see how anybody can watch how we’ve played while missing starters to how we’ve played with a normal roster and say they compare.

It’s definitely better but not nearly good enough for a “best team of his tenure”. The outside shooting is abysmal, as we get dominated on the perimeter nearly every game.

 

[CINCYMETJACKET]

Coach Josh Pastner really sucks without his BFF Ron Bell helping him... We need a new coach really fast....SMH... Where are all the guys who said 2-3 years ago that Pastner was the answer????

Don't know. I like Pastner, and want him to succeed at GT. He hasn't gotten the job done thus far. But our first choice, Bryce Drew, who spurned us for Vanderbilt, is no longer coaching at Vandy. Not sure if that's a condemnation of our administration's coaching search, or our inability to make a quick change while Vandy did. Either way, I still support the basketball program and hope for the best.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Don't know. I like Pastner, and want him to succeed at GT. He hasn't gotten the job done thus far. But our first choice, Bryce Drew, who spurned us for Vanderbilt, is no longer coaching at Vandy. Not sure if that's a condemnation of our administration's coaching search, or our inability to make a quick change while Vandy did. Either way, I still support the basketball program and hope for the best.

Brian Gregory and Paul Hewitt haven’t been tearing it up either.

 

[sidewalkGTfan]

With a small sample and 3 losses against Top 10 teams where we had a chance to win 2 of them late.

I don’t see how anybody can watch how we’ve played while missing starters to how we’ve played with a normal roster and say they compare.

Are we a better team when we have our full compliment of players? Absolutely, as is every team.

Do I think we would be a tourney team if he we had our full roster all season? Possibly....but based off what I’ve seen, I would’ve put my money on it being a no. This team can’t play consistent enough for 2 games in a row to believe they could’ve won 20 games in a season.

 

[Wrecked]

Brian Gregory and Paul Hewitt haven’t been tearing it up either.

Given all the money we have given Hewitt he doesn't need to work.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Are we a better team when we have our full compliment of players? Absolutely, as is every team.

Do I think we would be a tourney team if he we had our full roster all season? Possibly....but based off what I’ve seen, I would’ve put my money on it being a no. This team can’t play consistent enough for 2 games in a row to believe they could’ve won 20 games in a season.

I can’t think of any team over the last 3-4 years that has 1-3 of their starters out half the season every year. Lammers, Tadric, Okogie, Haywood, Alvarado’s dislocated elbow, this year’s stuff. It goes on and on. It’s ridiculous.

 

[Wrecked]

Are we a better team when we have our full compliment of players? Absolutely, as is every team.

Do I think we would be a tourney team if he we had our full roster all season? Possibly....but based off what I’ve seen, I would’ve put my money on it being a no. This team can’t play consistent enough for 2 games in a row to believe they could’ve won 20 games in a season.

Fully healthy we absolutely should have been a tourney team. This is Pastner's best team and the fact we are at 10-12 is partly due to injuries. But the lack of quality depth is a huge issue and that rests squarely on the coach. I expect to go 8-1 if fully healthy. If this team finishes below .500 I want him gone regardless of our financial "issues"

 

[TheAnonymous404]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...tball-s-top-teams-are-built-on-crippling-debt

This article from 2017 shows GTAA’s debt at over $200M. GTAA has run at a deficit for 2 straight years.

I’m not sure why you assume people are taking your posts personal. There’s certainly nothing in my post that seems personal. But anyway...
Most basketball programs at football schools are just trying to pay for themselves. Hardly any basketball programs turn a profit. GT is not Duke or Kansas. Any significant money that will be made by GT athletics will come from the football program. Sure, the Patriots used GT’s facilities for a week. That doesn’t mean they’re anywhere near up to par with any of the schools Tech is competing against. Also, having an indoor facility first doesn’t make it superior in any way. There’s not even a 100yard practice football field on campus anywhere. The training room in Edge looks like it hasn’t been updated since the 80s. There was even an old jukebox in there that provided music. Literally, a jukebox. Like one from a bar scene in a movie set in the 70s.

Russ Chandler is dwarfed by better facilities all around “baseball country” in the South and West Coast. Nearly every P5 school besides the B1G (and even some of those) have much better facilities than RCS. I don’t mean the stadium itself which also needs an update, I mean the player and coach areas. That’s getting a well deserved update this offseason.

Volleyball plays in O’Keefe because it actually provides a great atmosphere and home court advantage. O’Keefe sells out pretty regularly, and it gets loud. Moving those matches to McCamish takes away all of that atmosphere and makes the matches sterile and unexciting.

Is GT basketball in a good place right now? No, absolutely not. Does that mean there needs to be immediate action and change? No. Like I said. There’s no need to rush a move. Wait for the NCAA stuff to play out, see who will be available, look at how stable the football program is. Then make a move. Making a move out of angst will almost never work out.

Or maybe there is another possibility that it was a general comment and not directed solely at you my friend, again nothing on this board should be taken personally. I am glad that you are able to agree with me on that. I appreciate the article that you posted from 2017. Here are my takeaways: many other programs operate with a significant debt and are still able to invest in their programs. We are not going to get rid of $200 M dollars of debt overnight, and certainly whether we keep Pastner or not isn't going to change that number significantly. I appreciate you brining up the debt as a point to the argument, but I see other programs are able to operate with similar or greater debts. Certainly, I think at Tech we can be smart enough to figure out how to operate with some debt. Also, there are factors that have changed since 2017 such as the revenue that we now have from the ACC network, which is projected to continue to increase. We can also gained revenue from hosting outside events such as the Hawks, Dream and Atl United since 2017. I don't think we can operate in fear of that debt because I don't think we are going to fix that anytime soon. It is something that we are simply going to have to chip away at for a while. We should explore options like hosting high school football playoffs since its no longer at Mercedes Benz, and we let that slide to Georgia State. My point is we can find alternative ways to generate revenue in addition to added revenue from the ACC network. Also, I suggest we find a way to sell real jerseys, not some generic knock off jersey that looks like crap. We should also explore the possibility of what alcohol sales would do at sporting events. I just don't like the learned helplessness because of this or that obstacle that we can't be good because I think we can find a way to excel in athletics and academics.

In regards to the football facility, it doesn't need to be 100 yards, and its looks just fine too me https://ramblinwreck.com/sports/genrel/facilities/brock-football-practice-facility/ . To your point we are not a football powerhouse, so yes our facility won't be as nice as some other programs, but it certainly doesn't hinder the team from running practice. I value coaches over facilities, so I would rather invest there first. I disagree with you about the state of the baseball program, we hosted a HOME regional series with a chance to go to the CWS. I would love to have that same competitiveness in Men's basketball, and I have seen enough to know Pastner isn't the guy to get it done. I'm not suggesting rash action either, the next coaching hire is a vital decision for this program. I just don't want us to miss out on a guy that could really turn this program around because we are scared. If we don't find that guy, then buy all means ride it out with Pastner, but I think at the very least we can explore our options because the results this season are simply not palatable for me.

 

[cyclejacket]

I think you are really overselling the “dire financial situation of our program”. Honestly, it’s pretty negative to get on here and post what we can’t afford when the pledges for the edge center and renovation of many of our athletics facilities suggest we may not need to “pinch our pennies” as you have suggested. Also, we are expected to received increasing revenue from the ACC network. We all understand that you want to wait a year to fire Pastner, and you have valid points. Others of us simply disagree. I believe that it’s not a question about not having funds, but how we allocate the funds we do have. Again, I think there is a real debate about when to move on from Pastner, and if we should continue our NCAA appeal. If there is a desirable coach out there now, we need to be willing to pull the trigger and not be scared to do it. Seriously, do you get some kinda of financial kickback from keeping Pastner around for one more year?

You realize pledges to the Edge Center and AI2020 are made with the expectation that is where our gifts will be spent. Maybe AD Discretionary but I don't see a slot for "Buy Out Underperforming Basketball Coach. Not sure how many more times you think you need to post this before we get the idea you don't like the way Stansbury is financing sports operations.

 

[smokey_wasp]

I put this one in the L column when Devoe wasn't warming up. At this point, iiwi

 

[TheAnonymous404]

You realize pledges to the Edge Center and AI2020 are made with the expectation that is where our gifts will be spent. Maybe AD Discretionary but I don't see a slot for "Buy Out Underperforming Basketball Coach. Not sure how many more times you think you need to post this before we get the idea you don't like the way Stansbury is financing sports operations.

I actually think Stansbury is doing a fine job given the situation he is dealing with. Again, we are over budget on our operations funds in the 2020 athletic fund per https://www.atfund.gatech.edu/athletics-initiative-2020-0, so there is some flexibility in how we use the funds raised despite the commonly held believes on this board that this budget is set in stone. I hope Stansbury has the cojones to make the necessary changes, and I believe that he does. There is never going to be a specific line item in the budget for "underperforming basketball coach", but certainty we shouldn't wait for that to make up our minds about how we feel about a coach. I don't see how *hitting on me for wanting some change is productive. Your opinion is your opinion and quite frankly I don't give a *hit. Are you ok with where this program has fallen to because I am not? This is a part of the problem, it is ok to have some expectations for our sports programs, and you don't have to have some grand plan to fix everything. I really don't understand why we look for every damn reasons why we can't do stuff and are not talking about how we can change things. Seriously, that is simply a losing attitude.