Les Miles Met w/ Ted Roof in January

[Skeptic]

How do you measure a DC? If it's by the production of his defense, you statement "anywhere" is false. Any other measure is purely subjective.

On January 10, 2012, Roof was hired by new head coach Bill O'Brien as defensive coordinator at Penn State. Due to the Jerry Sanduskychild sex abuse scandal, on July 24, 2012 the National Collegiate Athletics Association (NCAA) sanctioned Penn State with a four-year postseason ban, loss of 40 scholarships over a four-year period and allowed players to transfer without having to sit out a year. Despite the difficult conditions of the program, Roof led the defense to rank second in the Big Ten Conference in scoring defense, led the league in sacks, ranked first in red-zone defense and third in turnover margin. Nationally, Penn State ranked tied for first in red-zone defense, 15th in sacks,[14] 16th in scoring defense,[15] 23rd in rushing defense, 28th in pass efficiency defense and 29th in total defense.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Roof

Btw, you don't have to be "a slave to statistics" to do a 30 second web search.

Thanks. And from the web one gets all those statistics, Wikipedia no less. Regardless, it darkens the mystery of why he cannot produce a reasonable defense at GT. Seems like a low bar, just give 'em a fighting chance. Particularly given that the offense gives the D plenty of rest on the sidelines, whereas a team like Clemson runs an up-tempo offense that sometimes has the D back on the field almost immediately. As I said before, I can't explain it, and imagine what Johnson's 8-year record at Tech might have been if just four or five of those teams had a "reasonable" defense.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Thanks. And from the web one gets all those statistics, Wikipedia no less. Regardless, it darkens the mystery of why he cannot produce a reasonable defense at GT. Seems like a low bar, just give 'em a fighting chance. Particularly given that the offense gives the D plenty of rest on the sidelines, whereas a team like Clemson runs an up-tempo offense that sometimes has the D back on the field almost immediately. As I said before, I can't explain it, and imagine what Johnson's 8-year record at Tech might have been if just four or five of those teams had a "reasonable" defense.

It's easy to explain. Lesser players, especially Dline and LB's. Winning the 1-on-1's on the LOS is paramount. Teams that do, usually win. We don't.

 

[Techster]

Right. And his salary before that interview was ~500k, iirc.

That raise was from last spring....iirc...

http://www.myajc.com/news/sports/college/notes-raise-extension-for-techs-roof/nkMTs/

Lesson here: If a coach uses someone else as leverage, always let him go...especially at GT:

Paul Hewitt and the Knicks: De facto lifetime contract!
Chan Gailey and the Miami Dolphins: 5 year extension!
Ted Roof and LSU??! Overpaid for the product...

 

[dressedcheeseside]

That raise was from last spring....iirc...

http://www.myajc.com/news/sports/college/notes-raise-extension-for-techs-roof/nkMTs/

Lesson here: If a coach uses someone else as leverage, always let him go...especially at GT:

Paul Hewitt and the Knicks: De facto lifetime contract!
Chan Gailey and the Miami Dolphins: 5 year extension!
Ted Roof and LSU??! Overpaid for the product...

Why are we over paying Ted? Who else is gonna perform better with the same players for equal money?

 

[yellojello]

Why are we over paying Ted? Who else is gonna perform better with the same players for equal money?

Why do we always make the same argument everytime a coach is questioned? It's not like Ted Roof is the lone DC that can lead us to the promised land. He may be able to, but many more are capable of equal, if not better performance. For the record, his track record, whether at GT or elsewhere, isn't particularly stellar.

 

[TVan]

Honestly I know Roof is a Tech man and absolutely loves Tech, but CPJ has a track record that doesn't include great defenses. He seems to burn through DC's pretty quick. Would make me pause if I were roof

I think he only fired two DC's. Never fired any at navy or georgia southern. So I would not say he burns through them.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Why do we always make the same argument everytime a coach is questioned? It's not like Ted Roof is the lone DC that can lead us to the promised land. He may be able to, but many more are capable of equal, if not better performance. For the record, his track record, whether at GT or elsewhere, isn't particularly stellar.

Who? Name somebody who knows GT inside and out like Ted. You can't recruit GT unless you know GT. We need players more than we need fancy schemes. We've been snake bit along the DL, none of which is TR's fault.

Why are we so quick to bring the hook when we don't like performance when the reasons for the performance are staring us in the face and we can't see them?

I'm waiting to see a true Roof/Pelton DL that's not put together with bailing wire and duck tape. That's all we've seen so far because that's all that R and P have had to work with.

When the current freshmen (next season sophs) DL are seniors and we still suck upfront, I'll be ready for a change.

 

[BuzzStone]

Keep in mind most games we played this past year would have been very different if it wasn't for the defense. Take the Thursday night VT game, defense all but won that game for us.

 

[33jacket]

Thanks. And from the web one gets all those statistics, Wikipedia no less. Regardless, it darkens the mystery of why he cannot produce a reasonable defense at GT. Seems like a low bar, just give 'em a fighting chance. Particularly given that the offense gives the D plenty of rest on the sidelines, whereas a team like Clemson runs an up-tempo offense that sometimes has the D back on the field almost immediately. As I said before, I can't explain it, and imagine what Johnson's 8-year record at Tech might have been if just four or five of those teams had a "reasonable" defense.

that was teds only top 30 defense in his career as a DC which spans 8-9 years. The prior year that same D ranked the same. The next year after ted left that same d ranked about the same too IIRC

he is not a great DC IMO. If you are a DC for a decade at big schools and only fielded one top 30 D...that says alot.

Tenuta had a top 30 D here every year but one IIRC. And BTW, with our O, Tenuta would have had the same D's rankings etc if not better.

no excuse. Everyone wants to JUST point at players but its far more than just that.

 

[33jacket]

Who? Name somebody who knows GT inside and out like Ted. You can't recruit GT unless you know GT. We need players more than we need fancy schemes. We've been snake bit along the DL, none of which is TR's fault.

Why are we so quick to bring the hook when we don't like performance when the reasons for the performance are staring us in the face and we can't see them?

I'm waiting to see a true Roof/Pelton DL that's not put together with bailing wire and duck tape. That's all we've seen so far because that's all that R and P have had to work with.

When the current freshmen (next season sophs) DL are seniors and we still suck upfront, I'll be ready for a change.

why are you saying current freshman. Ted has been here 3 years. Next year, his true seniors will have been his first class recruits playing in his system for 4 years.

And I don't agree you need to know GT inside and out like Ted to work here. We have had a ton of great assistants and recruiters that were not GT people in this program that did well for us. Charles Kelly. Giff Smith. BJ Marie. Andy McCollum; just to name a few that bring in top notch kids and great for our program. So I think this is overblown to a degree....heck; sure there are things you have to learn...but its not like you can't do well here if you aren't from here.

IMO, Cheese, you are the classic fan that gives Ted more of a pass because he played here....which is fine, you are entitled to your opinion, but he is not a good DC IMO.

 

[Techster]

Why are we over paying Ted? Who else is gonna perform better with the same players for equal money?

Of all the reasons to keep a coach, the "who else is gonna do better" excuse is the worst one. As others have pointed out before me, there are plenty of candidates that have already, and there are plenty out there.

BTW, Dave Braine's explanation for why he extended Gailey's contract was pretty much exactly your reasoning for keeping Roof. As we can see it was wrong.

Come on, buddy. You're better than that.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

@dressedcheeseside is the type of fan that looks in from the outside, with little first hand knowledge of particular details, and chooses not to make definitive opinions based on few facts. He is entitled to that opinion as are haters of coach X,y,z.

It's funny because I'm a Tenuta fan and used to have similar arguments with fans that disliked his scheme (giving up big plays, not able to stop M. Ryan, etc.) at that time.

Fact is fans on the outside don't know shat. There is a reason Roof is thought highly of in the coaching community and it ain't because he has nice hair. Call it cronyism if you want but Myles doesn't have personal ties to Roof that I know of.

 

[ATL1]

I do believe Tenuta is on the market.. Yeah Yeah
Giff Smith will be available soon too, but doesn't look like he wants to return to college.

Two more seasons should give an ample sample size of what Ted is capable of doing as a DC @ GT. So far not impressive.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Talent on D the last 8 years. Who here thinks we have had top 30 talent on D? We have had a few studs here and there. But looking at the whole unit for each of the last 8...or 16 if you want....how many times has that unit had top 30 talent across the board? Top 30 production seems to be the gold standard here. So I'm curious to see what years people think we have failed to reach that standard due to coaching alone.

 

[AE 87]

Talent on D the last 8 years. Who here thinks we have had top 30 talent on D? We have had a few studs here and there. But looking at the whole unit for each of the last 8...or 16 if you want....how many times has that unit had top 30 talent across the board? Top 30 production seems to be the gold standard here. So I'm curious to see what years people think we have failed to reach that standard due to coaching alone.

Fwiw, I think almost every healthy senior starter on D has made an NFL roster for the last two years.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

I'm not just talking about departing seniors. Or the best couple players each year on the unit. Rank the unit as a whole. If you say top 30, that's great, you have stipulated we have inferior coaching.

 

[AE 87]

I'm not just talking about departing seniors. Or the best couple players each year on the unit. Rank the unit as a whole. If you say top 30, that's great, you have stipulated we have inferior coaching.

I was just offering data. Is it your point that we are less talented on D than most ACC teams?

 

[dressedcheeseside]

I was just offering data. Is it your point that we are less talented on D than most ACC teams?

For me, most definitely. We are built on project players. Most of those projects have not been panning out lately. It's impossible to know if that's due to coaching or lack of talent.

Also, even if our guys maximize their talent by their senior year, the majority of the two deep won't be seniors.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

Of all the reasons to keep a coach, the "who else is gonna do better" excuse is the worst one.

Come on, buddy. You're better than that.

Come on buddy, if your gonna quote me, don't leave important parts out to suit your agenda.

I said "with the same players" and "for the same money".

So.... I'm still waiting for some names...

 

[Techster]

Come on buddy, if your gonna quote me, don't leave important parts out to suit your agenda.

I said "with the same players" and "for the same money".

So.... I'm still waiting for some names...

Dude, you do realize this is the college game, right? You can't say who can do better with the "same players" since:

1. You have to coach up the previous coaches players. That is your job as a coach. If you can't do that, then...

2. You need to recruit players who are better than what you inherited if you can't "coach up" the players already on the roster.

Let's look at an example of someone who did something more with the talent he inherited, and we don't have to look far: Charles Kelly

Everyone remember the defensive debacle of the 2011 season before Groh was fired? Our defense ruined what could have been a great season because we had one of the best offenses in GT history. We could not stop anyone. Well, Groh was let go and Kelly was elevated to DC. This is what he did:

• Kelly came to FSU after seven years as a special teams and defensive backs coach at Georgia Tech. He was elevated to interim defensive coordinator in the sixth game of the 2012 season when the Yellow Jackets had a 2-4 record. After taking over as defensive coordinator, Kelly helped Georgia Tech finish 5-3 (7-7 overall), including a Hyundai Sun Bowl victory over USC. Kelly’s defense limited the high-powered Trojan offense to 205 yards and seven points in the bowl win.

• One of the biggest improvements in Tech’s defense the last eight games of the season was its play in the second half, specifically in the fourth quarter. In the first six games of the season, Tech allowed an average of 13.3 points in the fourth quarter and in overtime, compared to just 3.9 points in the fourth quarter the final eight games of the season. The Yellow Jackets did not allow a fourth-quarter point in each of their final four games (Duke, Georgia, FSU and USC). The defense shut out both FSU and USC in the second half of those games. Opponents scored 44.2 percent of their points in the fourth quarter and in OT through the first six games of the season, compared to just 14.4 percent of their points in the fourth quarter over the final eight games.

Ted Roof inherited a veteran group of players in 2015. Every single member of the defensive backfield, and defensive line were starters in 2014, and our 2 LBs in the 4-2-5 (PJ Davis and Tyler Stargel) got extensive snaps in 2014. What were the results?

Total defense: 45
Scoring Defense: 56
Rushing defense: 60
Passing defense: 38

ACC rankings:
Total defense: 9
Scoring Defense: 11
Rushing defense: 8
Passing defense: 10

So who would do better at GT for the money GT ? Well, look at the rankings, and look at the highest paid coordinators in the game (http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/football/assistant). It may be harder to answer the question "Who wouldn't be better?!" The list of viable candidates is pretty easy because Roof is one of the higher paid DCs in the game (about #15 highest paid DC), and a lot of the guys who don't get paid as much had better performing defenses. Oh, that list also includes guys like the aforementioned Charles Kelly ($583K), Geoff Collins ($701K) who both are familiar with GT's recruiting challenges. You want another guy for bonus round? Try Dale Pehrson (Preston Pehrson's father) at Navy (NAVY!!!) who had the 26th ranked total defense in the nation after taking over for Buddy Green. But that's Navy...no coach there could recruit and coach in the ACC, right? Oops...sorry CPJ.

The other part: Recruiting. Are you saying we should give Roof credit for coaching the squad he mostly recruited? You don't see the problem with that? If he can't coach up the players he inherited, AND he can't coach up the players he personally recruited...well, isn't GT screwed either way, then with Roof?

Sorry man...not sure about you. In the real world, when you pay a premium for something, you expect premium returns. I don't go to the Capital Grill and order an expensive Rib Eye and get a piece of chopped steak from Longhorn. I don't go to the Mercedes dealership and pay for a SL500 AMG and get a Toyota Corolla. You're one of the biggest drum beaters that GT doesn't have a lot of resources....well, wouldn't it be smart then of GT to make the most of the resources it has? Roof is one of the highest paid DCs not only in all of college football, but in all the P5 conferences. GT doesn't get the highest ranked SAs, but the guys we get aren't chopped liver either (just look at the guys on defense who have been drafted or signed with an NFL team since Roof has been here). Roof doesn't need a top 10 defense at GT...no one expects that. But can we at least get a top 30 defense? The answer so far is, better not hold your breath...