Dave Patenaude's Offense

JacketOff

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When is it you’re talking about, when Osborne stepped down? And they never ran a 3O based offense under Osborne either.
Lol. This dude literally has no idea what he’s talking about, he just doesn’t like CGC is all. But he is somewhat right. Nebraska did run a version of the 3O through 2003, but their 3O was based way closer to a pro-style offense than what CPJ and his protégés run. They ran the 3O out of the I-formation, with blocking schemes not much different than what a tradition pro style offense would’ve ran at the time. Their offense was almost never run out of the wishbone or flexbone, and their linemen were much more well versed in pass blocking than what CPJ’s style of the 3O required. You can actually watch highlights of their games and see that they were running read options and RPOs in 2003 that are the basis of modern spread style offenses. You can watch 2003 Nebraska highlights and probably not know that they were considered an “option team” if you weren’t already aware. They basically ran a modern offense primarily in the I instead of the shotgun. CPJ’s style of the 3O is instantly recognizable as different, and it’s very easy to see that the basis and fundamentals of the offenses are different. This guy just loves CPJ and hates CGC, which is ok honestly. But it gets annoying. Especially when he’s harping over something he’s clearly not well versed in.

Watch these highlights and tell me that Nebraska is running the same offense that CPJ does. But here’s a hint: they’re not.
Also, take note of the body styles and size of their OL. It’s not even remotely close to what GT had in 2019. And like I said in a previous post, Nebraska was one of the best teams in the country at the time. Not a mediocre ACC team that had a losing record against P5 teams.
 

WreckinGT

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Lol. This dude literally has no idea what he’s talking about, he just doesn’t like CGC is all. But he is somewhat right. Nebraska did run a version of the 3O through 2003, but their 3O was based way closer to a pro-style offense than what CPJ and his protégés run. They ran the 3O out of the I-formation, with blocking schemes not much different than what a tradition pro style offense would’ve ran at the time. Their offense was almost never run out of the wishbone or flexbone, and their linemen were much more well versed in pass blocking than what CPJ’s style of the 3O required. You can actually watch highlights of their games and see that they were running read options and RPOs in 2003 that are the basis of modern spread style offenses. You can watch 2003 Nebraska highlights and probably not know that they were considered an “option team” if you weren’t already aware. They basically ran a modern offense primarily in the I instead of the shotgun. CPJ’s style of the 3O is instantly recognizable as different, and it’s very easy to see that the basis and fundamentals of the offenses are different. This guy just loves CPJ and hates CGC, which is ok honestly. But it gets annoying. Especially when he’s harping over something he’s clearly not well versed in.

Watch these highlights and tell me that Nebraska is running the same offense that CPJ does. But here’s a hint: they’re not

lol. You have no idea what you are talking about. Keep digging though. Your extreme hate for CPJ is blinding you. You aren't going to find an exact copy of any offense. We weren't even running a 3O the last few years comparable to the earlier seasons. Nebraska was running a heavy option offense throwing the ball less than we did in 2014 and 2015. To you that is a pro style offense. lol.
 

JacketOff

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3,009
lol. You have no idea what you are talking about. Keep digging though. Your extreme hate for CPJ is blinding you. You aren't going to find an exact copy of any offense. We weren't even running a 3O the last few years comparable to the earlier seasons. Nebraska was running a heavy option offense throwing the ball less than we did in 2014 and 2015. To you that is a pro style offense. lol.
My hate for CPJ??? Lmaaooo. I’ve literally never said anything bad about CPJ on this board. I think CPJ is an excellent coach, but his time had passed. I never said Nebraska ran a pro style offense either. I said the fundamentals and foundation of their offensive scheme was much more similar to a pro style than to CPJs lmao. Watch the offensive linemen. It’s extremely easy to see how different the offenses are. How many Nebraska linemen end up laying on the bellies after the snap? None of them. Their blocking schemes were based on a pro style offense. Watch a CPJ run team. On running plays just about every OL hits the dirt unless there’s a guard pulling somewhere.

Like dude, if you’re still confused on how different the situations are then I don’t know what to tell you. CPJ has a Twitter. You can always slide in his DMs and ask if he wants to go out with you. Other than that I don’t know what to tell you. You’re the only person on this board that seems to think there was some kind of hidden super powers in the offense last year. It’s not true. There’s factual information trying to tell you that it’s not true. There’s numerical and visual data to show you it’s not true. If you don’t believe after all of this, then maybe it’s you that’s wrong.
 

jojatk

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Yeah, I’m not sure the concept that guys can learn fast if taught well is all that crazy. Again, Nebraska went from a triple option to a west coast offense and ran it with a 3 star guy recruited to play in an option offense. Their two most recent recruiting classes were ranked 39th and 41st. They managed to actually improve on offense having several 400+ and 500+ yard games and averaging more points per game than they did the year before. How did they accomplish such an impossible feat? They weren’t a great team by any means but they had no problem with their monumental transition on offense.
I'm genuinely confused on this Nebraska thing. They went away from that I-formation option they used under Osborne and Solich, that was similar in concept to what CPJ tried to do with his version of the option, when they hired Bill Callahan back in 2004 and he installed a west coast offense. He lasted four years and then they hired Bo Pellini and they went to a shotgun spread offense and used it and variations of it until he was fired and they brought in Mike Riley who ran a "multiple" offense that was not a triple option. When they fired him they hired Scott Frost who brought his no-huddle spread from UCF to Nebraska. Their offense wasn't very good under Riley but it had been pretty OK the few years before that with the shotgun spread. When Frost came in they improved a bit but then again they had a 4* QB who was the #7 rated dual-threat QB in the country and had been committed to Cal-Berkley and Tennessee at various points before deciding on Nebraska. They weren't bad in 2018 but last year they regressed a bunch. They were 4-8 in 2017, they were 4-8 in 2018 which was Frost's first year, and they were 5-7 last year.

Their only transition was going from the shotgun spread to a "multiple" offense that was OK the first year and then got worse for the next two years. So they brought in Scott Frost who runs, guess what, a version of a spread option. His is no-huddle. And they brought in a highly regarded freshman QB who did well. Then year two happened and they regressed. Expectations were higher this year with Martinez (QB) in his third year. Remember, he was a highly recruited QB out of HS being recruited as a QB by other P5 teams.

Anyway I honestly don't see Nebraska as a monumental transition in modern times. Their big transitions happened in 2004 and 2008. From about 2004 - 2011 their recruiting classes were generally rated in the 20s nationally. According to 247 recruiting 2012 they were 32nd, 2013 they were 22nd, 2014 they were 35th, 2015 they were 30th, 2016 they were 26th, 2017 they were 23rd, 2018 they were 23rd, 2019 they were 17th. According to Rivals 2012/25th, 2013/17th, 2014/32nd, 2015/31st, 2016/24th, 2017/20th, 2018/21st, 2019/15th, and so far in 2020 they are rated 17th. So I'm not sure where your numbers of 39th and 41st are coming from.

I'm not even arguing your overall point right now. I'm just trying to figure out how Nebraska is analogous to GT in any way, shape, or form. And in 2014 and 2015 Nebraska threw for way more yards/game than we did in those two years so again, I'm very confused about what you're saying. To me they don't seem to be analogous at all. And FWIW I liked our offense under CPJ and am glad we had him as a coach.
 
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WreckinGT

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3,193
My hate for CPJ??? Lmaaooo. I’ve literally never said anything bad about CPJ on this board. I think CPJ is an excellent coach, but his time had passed. I never said Nebraska ran a pro style offense either. I said the fundamentals and foundation of their offensive scheme was much more similar to a pro style than to CPJs lmao. Watch the offensive linemen. It’s extremely easy to see how different the offenses are. How many Nebraska linemen end up laying on the bellies after the snap? None of them. Their blocking schemes were based on a pro style offense. Watch a CPJ run team. On running plays just about every OL hits the dirt unless there’s a guard pulling somewhere.

Like dude, if you’re still confused on how different the situations are then I don’t know what to tell you. CPJ has a Twitter. You can always slide in his DMs and ask if he wants to go out with you. Other than that I don’t know what to tell you. You’re the only person on this board that seems to think there was some kind of hidden super powers in the offense last year. It’s not true. There’s factual information trying to tell you that it’s not true. There’s numerical and visual data to show you it’s not true. If you don’t believe after all of this, then maybe it’s you that’s wrong.
If you want to search through tape and watch every play hoping to spin the blocking in a heavy option offense into the same blocking schemes used at the NFL level then be my guest. Should be good for a laugh.

Also, I am on record here wanting CPJ to leave before he ever announced he was retiring and wanting to hire Collins, although I would have been fine with Elliot as well. I don't really defend CPJ as much here as his players, many of which are still on the team. They aren't the terrible brain dead talentless nobodies that you guys have decided they are. It was possible to coach them up last year. We didn't do it.
 

lv20gt

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5,584
They did get coached up. What you don't seem to comprehend is that coaching doesn't just happen over night. There is a reason most OLmen redshirt and don't make an impact until at least their rs sophomor year. That's because the position takes reps and experience and that isn't something you can expedite. Considering our previous offense wasn't getting guys reps in what we we were going to do to expect them to be able to make that transition in a year is beyond ridiculous, especially with the injuries to compound the issue. And yeah, there will be exceptions. But those guys were exceptions when they were in this offense and were the exceptions when they left. The same reason we didn't have 5 mason's on our OL when he was here is the same reason it's stupid to point to him as proof that everyone can make that transition smoothly. It wasn't the coaching that allowed Shaq to transition smoothly. It was his talent. Same with Braun and even then he saw a significant decrease in level of play in the new offense. There's no reason to point to players who were big exceptions while they were playing here as the standard for what you think a normal OL transition will be.

As far as the option things go, just because an offense uses option concepts in terms of reads/pitches doesn't mean the OL is doing similar things. If you want to make comparisons then you should be focusing on the blocking concepts instead of the read portion.
 

WreckinGT

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3,193
They did get coached up. What you don't seem to comprehend is that coaching doesn't just happen over night. There is a reason most OLmen redshirt and don't make an impact until at least their rs sophomor year. That's because the position takes reps and experience and that isn't something you can expedite. Considering our previous offense wasn't getting guys reps in what we we were going to do to expect them to be able to make that transition in a year is beyond ridiculous, especially with the injuries to compound the issue. And yeah, there will be exceptions. But those guys were exceptions when they were in this offense and were the exceptions when they left. The same reason we didn't have 5 mason's on our OL when he was here is the same reason it's stupid to point to him as proof that everyone can make that transition smoothly. It wasn't the coaching that allowed Shaq to transition smoothly. It was his talent. Same with Braun and even then he saw a significant decrease in level of play in the new offense. There's no reason to point to players who were big exceptions while they were playing here as the standard for what you think a normal OL transition will be.

As far as the option things go, just because an offense uses option concepts in terms of reads/pitches doesn't mean the OL is doing similar things. If you want to make comparisons then you should be focusing on the blocking concepts instead of the read portion.
Our offensive line was rated the worst in the country. Our offense was ranked 127th in total offense. It was ranked 124th in scoring offense. We set records for punts and three and outs. We were getting shut out for the first time in decades. There was no coaching up there. You aren't going to convince me that we have the best offensive coaching staff in college football and that better results than that were simply impossible. It's an asinine argument. Like my comment that got all of this started, we have shown some improvement this week and I hope it continues. It doesn't really erase what was a pretty disastrous job of offensive coaching last year was.
 

GCdaJuiceMan

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Our offensive line was rated the worst in the country. Our offense was ranked 127th in total offense. It was ranked 124th in scoring offense. We set records for punts and three and outs. We were getting shut out for the first time in decades. There was no coaching up there. You aren't going to convince me that we have the best offensive coaching staff in college football and that better results than that were simply impossible. It's an asinine argument. Like my comment that got all of this started, we have shown some improvement this week and I hope it continues. It doesn't really erase what was a pretty disastrous job of offensive coaching last year was.
Did you bet on the over of 3.5 wins for us? I’m so lost as to why last year matters anymore. We went 3-9 and pulled in a top 27 or 24 recruiting class. Last year was brutal, no doubt about it. Admin was convinced it was going to be bad when they handed over a 7 year contract. It is what it is at this point. Have to hope we see improvements throughout the rest of this year. Although minor we did see improvement on the OL last year.
 

lv20gt

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5,584
Our offensive line was rated the worst in the country. Our offense was ranked 127th in total offense. It was ranked 124th in scoring offense. We set records for punts and three and outs. We were getting shut out for the first time in decades. There was no coaching up there.

Man, you really believe coaching only affects the here and now and don't realize that coaching is a process that often takes years and years to get to the desired result.
 

JacketOff

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3,009
Our offensive line was rated the worst in the country. Our offense was ranked 127th in total offense. It was ranked 124th in scoring offense. We set records for punts and three and outs. We were getting shut out for the first time in decades. There was no coaching up there. You aren't going to convince me that we have the best offensive coaching staff in college football and that better results than that were simply impossible. It's an asinine argument. Like my comment that got all of this started, we have shown some improvement this week and I hope it continues. It doesn't really erase what was a pretty disastrous job of offensive coaching last year was.
Bro, in 2018 under your offensive mastermind of CPJ, Tech ranked 74th in total offense, 28th in red zone offense, and 70th in scoring offense. Keep in mind, this was a team in year 11 of CPJ, that started 5 seniors on offense (including at QB) , 5 juniors, and 1 redshirt freshman on opening week. That’s one (1) underclassmen starting. That team played Georgia in week 12 with 5 seniors starting, 3 juniors, 2 RS freshmen, and 1 sophomore. For the most part, that teams key pieces (especially the most experienced players) stayed healthy throughout the entire year. That team, with offensive mastermind CPJ at the helm, put up below average offensive numbers.

Last year’s team started game 1 with 5 seniors, 1 junior, 3 sophomores, and 2 freshmen. Half of last year’s offense in week one(!!) were underclassmen, as opposed to just 1 guy in 2018. That team ended the year against Georgia with 2 seniors, 2 juniors, 5 sophomores, and 2 freshmen starting. 7 of the offensive starters were underclassmen by the end of the year last year, as opposed to just 3 by the end of 2018. Add in the fact the we were literally starting walk-ons on the OL, in addition to completely changing the fundamental base of the offense, WHY WOULD YOU EXPECT ANYTHING DIFFERENT THAN ABYSMAL OFFENSE?!?! You’ve got some kind of weird fantasy land in your head if you expected a team with very little returning production from an already below average 2018 performance to perform better on offense than in the bottom tier of the country. Add in the injuries and the inexperience, there’s not a single coach that would’ve been able to produce much more on the offensive side of the ball than what Tech did last year.

I’m completely dumbfounded by how incessant and ridiculous your posts are. CPJ put up a below average offense in 2018, yet you think it’s possible to match or improve on that after changing the fundamentals of the offense while playing with one of the youngest teams in the country? I mean, that’s stupid.
 

WreckinGT

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Bro, in 2018 under your offensive mastermind of CPJ, Tech ranked 74th in total offense, 28th in red zone offense, and 70th in scoring offense. Keep in mind, this was a team in year 11 of CPJ, that started 5 seniors on offense (including at QB) , 5 juniors, and 1 redshirt freshman on opening week. That’s one (1) underclassmen starting. That team played Georgia in week 12 with 5 seniors starting, 3 juniors, 2 RS freshmen, and 1 sophomore. For the most part, that teams key pieces (especially the most experienced players) stayed healthy throughout the entire year. That team, with offensive mastermind CPJ at the helm, put up below average offensive numbers.

Last year’s team started game 1 with 5 seniors, 1 junior, 3 sophomores, and 2 freshmen. Half of last year’s offense in week one(!!) were underclassmen, as opposed to just 1 guy in 2018. That team ended the year against Georgia with 2 seniors, 2 juniors, 5 sophomores, and 2 freshmen starting. 7 of the offensive starters were underclassmen by the end of the year last year, as opposed to just 3 by the end of 2018. Add in the fact the we were literally starting walk-ons on the OL, in addition to completely changing the fundamental base of the offense, WHY WOULD YOU EXPECT ANYTHING DIFFERENT THAN ABYSMAL OFFENSE?!?! You’ve got some kind of weird fantasy land in your head if you expected a team with very little returning production from an already below average 2018 performance to perform better on offense than in the bottom tier of the country. Add in the injuries and the inexperience, there’s not a single coach that would’ve been able to produce much more on the offensive side of the ball than what Tech did last year.

I’m completely dumbfounded by how incessant and ridiculous your posts are. CPJ put up a below average offense in 2018, yet you think it’s possible to match or improve on that after changing the fundamentals of the offense while playing with one of the youngest teams in the country? I mean, that’s stupid.
Bro, dude, honcho, amigo, Im completely dumbfounded that you can't comprehend that going from 400+ ypg on average to 285 ypg on average, and going from 33.6 ppg to 16.7 ppg is an incredibly significant drop. My daughters kindergarten class may have room for you if you want to work on basic math skills. We were all expecting a drop in production. We weren't expecting to completely fall off a cliff and look like possibly the worst offense in the history of the program. Pretending that we couldn't have possibly done anything different to be better than the train wreck we were is completely stupid.
 

smokey_wasp

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Bro, dude, honcho, amigo, Im completely dumbfounded that you can't comprehend that going from 400+ ypg on average to 285 ypg on average, and going from 33.6 ppg to 16.7 ppg is an incredibly significant drop. My daughters kindergarten class may have room for you if you want to work on basic math skills. We were all expecting a drop in production. We weren't expecting to completely fall off a cliff and look like possibly the worst offense in the history of the program. Pretending that we couldn't have possibly done anything different to be better than the train wreck we were is completely stupid.

And we have been over 400 yards every game this year, and you're still mad. Did our staff get that much better at coaching or was last year a band-aid year? We've all come to terms with it.
let it go GIF
 

GTFLETCH

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2,639
So there is a lot of talk on the board about not understanding what offensive scheme we are running. Some feel we look lost and there is no scheme. Here is some information to clear things up for us, maybe it will also allow many here to understand better where we are, where we are going, and why we are struggling.

Popular NCAA Offensive Schemes

Triple option -
I don't really need to explain, right?!

Power Run - 2-3 back sets , 1-3 TE, play action passing, fullback and Hbacks used

Spread Option - Shotgun, normally 1 RB, no huddle, uptempo, short passes or screens to get ball out quickly, tons of 3-4-or-5 wide sets.

Pro Style - Multiple sets including single backs, I formation, shotgun, 50/50 balls for run to set up pass game, lots of motioning and lots of people getting the ball.

Confusion Cause
CGC kept saying we will run an NFL style offense. So, people thought Pro style was coming. What he meant was he will run an offense that allows players to develop and showcase themselves for the NFL draft. Meaning our offense will be schemed to showcase the necessary abilities and skills of the players to get the right attention.

Dave Patenaude's Offensive Scheme Is...
Spread Option

Pat has a scheme that is a spread Option offense based around the run. This does not mean we will always run, it means we will have to run effectively to set up the pass game he wants. By utilizing an effective run game, you create a numbers advantage where you can pass over the opponents head consistently. Not genius football. He does utilize RPO a lot as well, which requires the QB to make the right read AND the line to block for the run well. So we move on to the part that is hard to swallow for most Tech fans...

Why We Are Struggling
We have an inexperienced QB coupled with an OLine that is being transitioned to pass block AND the OLine is injured and has new and walk on players.

What does this mean?

Well the QB is suppose to make the RPO read, right? Well inexperience is leading to late decisions. See the QBs holding the ball too long sometimes before giving or pulling. Also, the RPO requires the QB and receivers be in sync. This is why the WR aren't even looking sometimes when we throw, they read the D different than the QB. Add to it that we are not blocking well for the run OR pass and we fall apart.

The remedy is better blocking on the line along with experience of the guys playing together and learning not only the playbook but what each other is going to see play in and play out. This is why we keep seeing the run game causing three n outs. PNodes offense requires the run to click to be effective, else, they pass rush constant and we fall flat because we can't keep em honest. Also, we can't keep tempo for the same reasons mentioned above and that is a huge part of what makes this work.
Plus Coach Patenaude play calling is still a work in progress... He is learning... you can tell this is is first P-5 job.... Hopefully his play calling can grow with the offense...
 

YJMD

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1,628
I like the direction of the offense, but I think Venables is going to make us start fighting about things again. That really wouldn't be fair.

I do hope we don't try to be conservative in fear of mistakes. Last year we didn't have a snowball's chance to do much on offense regardless. This year I think we need to be willing to make a bunch of checks at the line else we'll get swarmed in the backfield and struggle to get any kind of run going. Gotta stretch them out and take what's there instead of trying to force anything.
 

Scubapro

Banned
Messages
717
Plus Coach Patenaude play calling is still a work in progress... He is learning... you can tell this is is first P-5 job.... Hopefully his play calling can grow with the offense...
This is a good thing to hope for but watching his play calling at CC, I don't think he learned a thing.
Billy Lewis scored 35+ versus Maryland, Duke, Baylor, and Wake in '93
This was an improvement over the previous year when he only scored 30+ once and against western Carolina
Patenaude has a lot of ground to make up with a portion of the fan base and rightly so.
It's ok to question his ability and enjoy the win.
 
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UgaBlows

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😂 best thread ever. Dude is literally mad that GT won this weekend. Like 10 toes down, backed in a corner, obnoxiously making no sense but still trying to piss on the staff about the 2019 campaign. 😂 Ya love to see it.
He seems to hate CGC and Pnut more than he loves GT
 

slugboy

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Staff member
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11,724
Here are the last 4 years, offense and defense. I didn’t go 5 years back because, even though it was a great year, there’s really nothing left from that year, and it’s not really the trajectory of the program over the last few years.

Maybe I’ll graph or chart it, but in terms of total raw numbers, we’re looking better this year. 2019 was bad, and it’s arguable that it didn’t have to be that bad on offense or defense, but the offensive line was in rough shape to put it mildly. They’re closing in on being an average OL this year, with a possibility of being a good one in upcoming years. (Defense is not thrilling me, at a high-level glance).

2017:
PassRushTotaFirsPenaTurn
SplitGCmpAttPctYdsTDAttYdsAvgTDPlaysYdsAvgPassRushPenTotNo.YdsFumIntTot
Offense113.910.736.484.30.957.5307.45.32.768.2391.65.72.915.31.319.54.035.80.90.51.4
Defense1117.830.358.9200.61.533.9153.64.51.464.2354.35.59.08.50.818.33.836.00.40.50.9
Difference-13.9-19.6-22.5-116.3-0.6+23.6+153.8+0.8+1.3+4.0+37.3+0.2-6.1+6.8+0.5+1.2+0.2-0.2+0.50.0+0.5

[thead] [/thead]

2018:
PassRushTotaFirsPenaTurn
SplitGCmpAttPctYdsTDAttYdsAvgTDPlaysYdsAvgPassRushPenTotNo.YdsFumIntTot
Offense134.39.744.483.80.557.3325.15.73.567.0408.86.13.016.81.421.23.836.71.00.31.3
Defense1318.127.964.7211.31.834.0158.34.71.761.9369.66.09.69.60.920.24.335.30.90.91.8
Difference-13.8-18.2-20.3-127.5-1.3+23.3+166.8+1.0+1.8+5.1+39.2+0.1-6.6+7.2+0.5+1.0-0.5+1.4+0.1-0.6-0.5

[thead] [/thead]


2019
PassRushTotaFirsPenaTurn
SplitGCmpAttPctYdsTDAttYdsAvgTDPlaysYdsAvgPassRushPenTotNo.YdsFumIntTot
Offense1210.322.446.1133.91.237.3152.64.11.059.7286.54.85.38.31.615.14.841.10.80.81.7
Defense1216.727.660.4207.71.544.8215.64.82.372.4423.35.88.811.91.822.65.043.70.80.61.3
Difference-6.4-5.2-14.3-73.8-0.3-7.5-63.0-0.7-1.3-12.7-136.8-1.0-3.5-3.6-0.2-7.5-0.2-2.60.0+0.2+0.4

[thead] [/thead]

2020:
PassRushTotaFirsPenaTurn
SplitGCmpAttPctYdsTDAttYdsAvgTDPlaysYdsAvgPassRushPenTotNo.YdsFumIntTot
Offense417.331.554.8239.31.542.5213.85.02.374.0453.06.110.011.50.822.39.872.01.02.03.0
Defense420.535.857.3259.52.343.8189.34.31.879.5448.85.610.810.81.022.58.067.31.50.82.3
Difference-3.2-4.3-2.5-20.2-0.8-1.3+24.5+0.7+0.5-5.5+4.2+0.5-0.8+0.7-0.2-0.2+1.8+4.7-0.5+1.2+0.7

[thead] [/thead]


Provided by CFB at Sports Reference: View Original Table
Generated 10/12/2020.
 
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