Coronavirus Thread

[RamblinRed]

WOW. I knew that La. was reeling, but I still would have thought that NYC was worse. This also confirms that Ga. may be the next hot spot. Scary.

Not really that shocked. The 3 Georgia counties are around Albany which is already well known as a huge hot spot.
The areas in LA are actually not small counties like in GA. They are mostly the parishs around New Orleans.

Mortality rates will likely be worse in smaller, rural communities as the virus spreads to them (and since we can't test enough people it will spread). They tend to be older, less healthy then more populated areas with less hospital beds per capita. Just a really bad mix.

This is an interesting article on a tech company offering the government help in tracking cellphones. In particular in the video they show how they can track cell phones that were in FL on specific days and where they have gone to since then. Gives you a sense of where all the springbreakers are headed.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/04/tech/location-tracking-florida-coronavirus/index.html

 

[GoldZ]

In early March it was thought that 25-30% of infected people failed to become symptomatic at all, or very mildly so. More recently a few small studies are showing some 50% are symptom free. If so, it would seem imo, perhaps ignorantly so, that the 97% still vulnerable figure in the Washington model is significantly flawed.

The real threat to the 2020 season is, once a player becomes ill, it's over until 2021.

OTOH, if South Korea or Taiwan had CFB, they would probably have at least a partial 2020 season (assuming closed borders, but then they would be starving, as we will if we keep up this current level of shutdown).

 

[RamblinRed]

Last time i checked Canada and Latin America were still foreign.. it's irrelevant which non-American countries are being shipped to while Americans are dying here. If the 3M CEO objects to putting America first ,then 3M should consider firing him!

I disagree with this. This is a very short-sighted rationale. This is not a US problem. This is a World problem. If we don't all work together then it will be worse for all of us.
If you prevent companies from filling orders they have with other Countries, then other countries may choose not to allow their companies to provide you with things you need (and given how heavily we rely on other countries for the supplies to produce medication that would be a very bad thing).

we need to work more closely with other countries, not shut them out.

Taking a closed approach will backfire spectacularly.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I mean, the NCAA and all the other non- professional sports wouldn’t be there by definition.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I disagree with this. This is a very short-sighted rationale. This is not a US problem. This is a World problem. If we don't all work together then it will be worse for all of us.
If you prevent companies from filling orders they have with other Countries, then other countries may choose not to allow their companies to provide you with things you need (and given how heavily we rely on other countries for the supplies to produce medication that would be a very bad thing).

we need to work more closely with other countries, not shut them out.

Taking a closed approach will backfire spectacularly.

Please tell all that to the nattering nabob of negativity in the media and Congress.

Seriously though, this is a failure of leadership. You fill all existing short term orders then you tell everyone else you’re booked if you can fill from the US.

 

[ramblinwreckguru]

I have a major gripe about my wife's place of business. My wife works as a cashier at a grocery store and is easily within 3 feet of hundreds of customers a day and has been told by her supervisors that she cannot wear any type of face covering while cashiering. This is just wrong on so many levels and I'm debating whether or not to make her quit a job that she loves.

 

[takethepoints]

A bonanza of relevant posts today.

First, how to handle purchases of stuff and, especially, food at home. From Dr. Jeff VanWingen:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/20...ring-the-coronavirus-crisis?detail=emaildkbow

This has a lot of very useful ideas I hadn't thought of. The separation of counter space into "clean" and "dirty" sides and treating groceries and take-out before they move to the clean side is a one of those and a damn good one. But the whole film is full of good information. And, as VanWingen points out, this takes time, but God knows we've got plenty of that.

Second, how to shop for groceries, from a grocery worker:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/20...during-the-COVID-19-pandemic?detail=emaildkre

Short film: make a list, only touch what's on it, and get in and out as fast as you can. Good advice.

Third, a short primer on why the national stockpile got depleted:

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/...-medical-stockpile-unprepared-for-coronavirus

Short article: it comes down to budget decisions dictated by the sequestration legislation. Nobody in either party wanted to do it, but once the sequestration was in place, the stockpile seemed to be a vulnerable line item. One of the few pieces of good legislative work - and bi-partisan too boot - out of the first Trump administration Congress was to deep six sequestration. The whole idea forced decisions nobody at either end of Pennsylvania Avenue wanted to make.

 

[GT_EE78]

I disagree with this. This is a very short-sighted rationale. This is not a US problem. This is a World problem. If we don't all work together then it will be worse for all of us.
If you prevent companies from filling orders they have with other Countries, then other countries may choose not to allow their companies to provide you with things you need (and given how heavily we rely on other countries for the supplies to produce medication that would be a very bad thing).
we need to work more closely with other countries, not shut them out.
Taking a closed approach will backfire spectacularly.

There may be exceptions when exporting some things while importing others (those cases probably wouldn't be receiving directives under DPA)
in case you didn't notice we were talking about 3M, beyond them and if applicable;our leaders and manufacturers must put America first.period.
If a company exports products deemed essential (in defiance of DPA) their leaders should be punished to the maximum extent that the law allows.

 

[RonJohn]

Please tell all that to the nattering nabob of negativity in the media and Congress.

Seriously though, this is a failure of leadership. You fill all existing short term orders then you tell everyone else you’re booked if you can fill from the US.

What he said is basically what 3M has said: They have increased deliveries to the US mostly from importing more from facilities outside the US. If the US prevents exporting to other countries, other countries might prevent exports to the US. If a trade war like that does happen, it would have a very large net-negative impact on the US.

I don't know how many N95 or surgical masks the US needs, how many are produced in the US, nor how many are imported to the US. I don't know if 3M's concerns are likely or not. I would like it if someone in the press would research and publish actual data about the issue. All I have seen are corporate statements and political banter. It is difficult to know what is happening if you only have access to what other people say about what is happening.

 

[takethepoints]

And the bonanza continues! I've talked here about the experience of WW2 and the control of production by the government in a crisis. But I was talking in general and reasoning from the results. Here's a paper explaining how the government actually did it:

https://rooseveltinstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/RI_WWII_Working-Paper_202003-1.pdf

This is extremely revealing in the present situation and, in particular, explains why the constant harping on "public-private alliances" by the Trump administration have led to the present chaos with supply. As Bossie and Mason point out, the problem is risk: private companies are reluctant to take it and governments are pretty much there to absorb it. Once FDR and co. found out that private corporations wouldn't - it wasn't that they couldn't - deliver on time, they essentially converted the economy into JPL; i.e. a private corporation with one customer. Sometimes the government paid for, built, and ran production, but usually it directed the flow of goods and … well, why keep listen to me? Read the paper. It's extremely informative.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Not really that shocked. The 3 Georgia counties are around Albany which is already well known as a huge hot spot.
The areas in LA are actually not small counties like in GA. They are mostly the parishs around New Orleans.

Mortality rates will likely be worse in smaller, rural communities as the virus spreads to them (and since we can't test enough people it will spread). They tend to be older, less healthy then more populated areas with less hospital beds per capita. Just a really bad mix.

This is an interesting article on a tech company offering the government help in tracking cellphones. In particular in the video they show how they can track cell phones that were in FL on specific days and where they have gone to since then. Gives you a sense of where all the springbreakers are headed.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/04/tech/location-tracking-florida-coronavirus/index.html

I had a doctor's appt this week, and the doctor told me that Atlanta was about to "explode" with new cases of the virus.

I just don't like the government being able to track out locations. This whole crisis is fast becoming way too Orwellian.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I disagree with this. This is a very short-sighted rationale. This is not a US problem. This is a World problem. If we don't all work together then it will be worse for all of us.
If you prevent companies from filling orders they have with other Countries, then other countries may choose not to allow their companies to provide you with things you need (and given how heavily we rely on other countries for the supplies to produce medication that would be a very bad thing).

we need to work more closely with other countries, not shut them out.

Taking a closed approach will backfire spectacularly.

Based on the interview with the Florida FEMA agent on Thursday, 3M wasn't just filling earlier orders; they were taking new cash-only orders, and when the FEMA agent stated that he would pay cash for what we needed, he was told no. That sure sounds to me like they are placing other countries' immediate needs over our immediate needs, and I'm sorry, but that's just wrong.

 

[LibertyTurns]

Based on the interview with the Florida FEMA agent on Thursday, 3M wasn't just filling earlier orders; they were taking new cash-only orders, and when the FEMA agent stated that he would pay cash for what we needed, he was told no. That sure sounds to me like they are placing other countries' immediate needs over our immediate needs, and I'm sorry, but that's just wrong.

Early on 3M didn’t want to ramp production. They were leveraging screwing the American people to gain an advantage in product liability protection. I get 3M’s position, but start producing and act on good faith you’ll get the protection you need. That’s what my company did when help was requested. We didn’t give the hospitals the finger like 3M did.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

What he said is basically what 3M has said: They have increased deliveries to the US mostly from importing more from facilities outside the US. If the US prevents exporting to other countries, other countries might prevent exports to the US. If a trade war like that does happen, it would have a very large net-negative impact on the US.

I don't know how many N95 or surgical masks the US needs, how many are produced in the US, nor how many are imported to the US. I don't know if 3M's concerns are likely or not. I would like it if someone in the press would research and publish actual data about the issue. All I have seen are corporate statements and political banter. It is difficult to know what is happening if you only have access to what other people say about what is happening.

I hope when this is all over, the world will **** on China just like they did to us. Seriously, no apologies, no shame, no helping, no sharing of data - they’ve done close to nothing. Bring back manufacturing and give them the finger.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I hope when this is all over, the world will **** on China just like they did to us. Seriously, no apologies, no shame, no helping, no sharing of data - they’ve done close to nothing. Bring back manufacturing and give them the finger.

AMEN !!!!!

 

[Studdard63]

If it were not for this "right wing news" that you mention, the whole affair would never have been revealed. Once again, Fox News comes through, while all the other news sources are simply interested in slamming the President.

Well, Obama is no longer in office so Fox News has something else to do besides slam the President 24/7.

 

[Studdard63]

Last time i checked Canada and Latin America were still foreign.. it's irrelevant which non-American countries are being shipped to while Americans are dying here. If the 3M CEO objects to putting America first ,then 3M should consider firing him!

They produced over 10 million more for the US last month but ignore that part. Do you really want to get in a trade war over medical supplies in the middle of pandemic...bold move.

 

[LibertyTurns]

They produced over 10 million more for the US last month but ignore that part. Do you really want to get in a trade war over medical supplies in the middle of pandemic...bold move.

Warren Buffet’s company BYD is making 150M per month & if you combine what Bill Gates & Elon Musk produces over there it’s around 3ooM per month. That’s just 2 companies.

China total mask production is 110M per day, that’s 3.3B per month. They were cranking out 600M per month 6 weeks ago. They’re sending us .3% of their additional production. Wow, let’s throw them all a parade.

 

[Studdard63]

What does this have to do with “right wing news”?

OF COURSE they have shipped masks around the world. It’s their business. But we don’t have enough here - they probably don’t overseas either - but it’s an American headquartered company who has heard pleas from Governors like Cuomo for weeks. I don’t see what this has to do with your complaint if right win anything.

A right wing news website “Breitbart” has an article that fails to paint a complete picture, failing to mention that 3M produced over 10 million more masks last month for the US. They are just interested in triggering right wingers into a blame game.

 

[Studdard63]

Warren Buffet’s company BYD is making 150M per month & if you combine what Bill Gates & Elon Musk produces over there it’s around 3ooM per month. That’s just 2 companies.

China total mask production is 110M per day, that’s 3.3B per month. They were cranking out 600M per month 6 weeks ago. They’re sending us .3% of their additional production. Wow, let’s throw them all a parade.

I don’t think a parade is necessary but leaving out all the facts is unnecessary and expected from Breitbart.