Bebe arrested ...

[Whiskey_Clear]

What kind of vehicle - got rid of my jeep Cherokee- unstable.

How do we know the speed when crash started? I had a ticket where the cop lied about the speed. Used basic algebra to prove it. How the heck do u have an accurate speed just before crash.?

Before we get to motive or intrinsic personal deficiencies like low grade in calculus class we need lots of physical facts. Driving a car that turns over is a pretty damning fact but let's associated facts come out. Could be better and could be a lot worse.

Shocking I know, but they use math to estimate it. Factors include length of skid marks, impact damage, distance rolled/ number of rolls.

And in the case of modern cars they can just pull the computer and see it exactly.

 

[iceeater1969]

Shocking I know, but they use math to estimate it. Factors include length of skid marks, impact damage, distance rolled/ number of rolls.

And in the case of modern cars they can just pull the computer and see it exactly.

Are u just saying more general stuff or do u know specifics on this case.
Did you use your engineering degree to morph into accident investigation career.

Cheese went into teaching.

I ended up as a pipeline project director. I can tell u the facts are usually not clear cut pointing to a sole cause.
In 99 00 2 construction seasons of 6 month - 1000 vehicles driving all over nd, Minnesota, Iowa, I'll. Amazingly few bad wrecks. But lots of safety guys and insurance and police reports tell me wait till all data is filed and witnesses interviewed.

Best one -- ( it wasnt the guys working for a e s dad.) Got a report of minor damage to rear bumper on survey suburban while at restaurant. A few weeks later got a report of suburban w panel damage. This report had no date of accident nor location. After having it checked found that it was a part of original accident.
My survey guys ran into each other at a bar parking lot . The thought of them getting out of truck and looking at the damage still makes me laugh.

 

[Animal02]

Are u just saying more general stuff or do u know specifics on this case.
Did you use your engineering degree to morph into accident investigation career.

Cheese went into teaching.

I ended up as a pipeline project director. I can tell u the facts are usually not clear cut pointing to a sole cause.
In 99 00 2 construction seasons of 6 month - 1000 vehicles driving all over nd, Minnesota, Iowa, I'll. Amazingly few bad wrecks. But lots of safety guys and insurance and police reports tell me wait till all data is filed and witnesses interviewed.

Best one -- ( it wasnt the guys working for a e s dad.) Got a report of minor damage to rear bumper on survey suburban while at restaurant. A few weeks later got a report of suburban w panel damage. This report had no date of accident nor location. After having it checked found that it was a part of original accident.
My survey guys ran into each other at a bar parking lot . The thought of them getting out of truck and looking at the damage still makes me laugh.

Lots of rambling with no point. Whiskey does not need an engineering degree to know how police determine estimated speed in a case like that, including use the computer in the car. He didn't say what the speed of the car was. He answered HOW......and you go off like it is some secret process that no one else would know.
BTW,. Knowing WC, he will know a bit about accident investigations.

 

[GT_05]

What kind of vehicle - got rid of my jeep Cherokee- unstable.

How do we know the speed when crash started? I had a ticket where the cop lied about the speed. Used basic algebra to prove it. How the heck do u have an accurate speed just before crash.?

Before we get to motive or intrinsic personal deficiencies like low grade in calculus class we need lots of physical facts. Driving a car that turns over is a pretty damning fact but let's associated facts come out. Could be better and could be a lot worse.

Almost all cars built since 2013 (96%) have an event data recorder (EDR) which records many items that can be used to prove a case against you, or for you, in court.

https://www.nhtsa.gov/research-data/event-data-recorder




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[forensicbuzz]

What kind of vehicle - got rid of my jeep Cherokee- unstable.

How do we know the speed when crash started? I had a ticket where the cop lied about the speed. Used basic algebra to prove it. How the heck do u have an accurate speed just before crash.?

Before we get to motive or intrinsic personal deficiencies like low grade in calculus class we need lots of physical facts. Driving a car that turns over is a pretty damning fact but let's associated facts come out. Could be better and could be a lot worse.

This is easy to determine if there was an accident. The black box records a ton of information going back 4 seconds before the triggering incident. That’s plenty of time to not only know how fast he was going, but depending on the age of the vehicle, it will give decelerations both in direction of travel and laterally. It records braking, traction control, steering wheel movement, etc. Today’s cars are so computerized, an accident reconstructionist can create an animation reproducing the accident.

 

[iceeater1969]

For the non serious wrecks which my men were involved took about a week for police report. For serious ones it took as much as a month for our attorneys to get a copy. Our attorneys had investigators that analyzed the report for possible flaws.

Sorry I gave u guys heartburn about the black box. It will clearly give the dynamic data.

Before we form opinions we also need the full interviews w driver and passenger with a timeline, phone records, toxicology. Can go from distracted driving to big time issues that may be further investigated.

The recent employment issues which he has been critical will come later.

I hope it's a simple but serious accident.

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

For the non serious wrecks which my men were involved took about a week for police report. For serious ones it took as much as a month for our attorneys to get a copy. Our attorneys had investigators that analyzed the report for possible flaws.

Sorry I gave u guys heartburn about the black box. It will clearly give the dynamic data.

Before we form opinions we also need the full interviews w driver and passenger with a timeline, phone records, toxicology. Can go from distracted driving to big time issues that may be further investigated.

The recent employment issues which he has been critical will come later.

I hope it's a simple but serious accident.

Speed calculations aren’t necessary in simple fender benders. They are used in serious accident investigations which can take a while to complete, more than the week you waited for a standard accident report.

I know a guy who used to work in an accident investigation unit (AIU) at a fairy large department. They do use a lot of math for certain calculations. I believe there are always some unknown certainties. But they come close enough to those certainties to establish evidence beyond a reasonable doubt in court.

In the case of “black boxes” in cars . They do record data as others have mentioned and obtaining a search warrant for it after an accident such as this is simple.

I agree in waiting for facts before rushing to judgment. I fairly strongly believe the authorities will obtain those facts in this incident.

What can’t be argued is that he made a stupid mistake. And he’s very damn lucky no fatalities occurred. He’s also lucky only the occupants of his vehicle were hurt. If a third party had been injured they would own his *** in civil court and he would be needing that degree most likely.

 

[Technut1990]

The law is the law but this would be a misdemeanor in at least 45 states. No DUI drugs or alcohol, 70 MPH on a 6 lane road ? In Georgia he would get several tickets and go home until his court date.

 

[Technut1990]

I wonder if that is due to the injured parties pressing charges?

These are State charges, passengers in cars don’t press criminal charges, they file civil suits

 

[Animal02]

The law is the law but this would be a misdemeanor in at least 45 states. No DUI drugs or alcohol, 70 MPH on a 6 lane road ? In Georgia he would get several tickets and go home until his court date.

Have you looked at the road....less than a mile in an urban area and it takes a turn where the wreck happened....70 mph is extremely reckless.

 

[Technut1990]

Have you looked at the road....less than a mile in an urban area and it takes a turn where the wreck happened....70 mph is extremely reckless.

No animal I haven’t seen the road but I’ve seen plenty of reckless driving. There is also a law, at least in Georgia, that is titled “ to fast for conditions”. It’s a misdemeanor. Georgia law says that where two different crimes are established by the same fact pattern the prosecutor MUST prosecute the lowest chargeable crime. So in Georgia at least, reckless driving based on road/ lane conditions automatically reduces to speeding or to fast for conditions when the defense files the motion.

 

[GT_05]

The law is the law but this would be a misdemeanor in at least 45 states. No DUI drugs or alcohol, 70 MPH on a 6 lane road ? In Georgia he would get several tickets and go home until his court date.

He was driving double the speed limit. The number of lanes does not matter.


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[GT_05]

Georgia law says that where two different crimes are established by the same fact pattern the prosecutor MUST prosecute the lowest chargeable crime. So in Georgia at least, reckless driving based on road/ lane conditions automatically reduces to speeding or to fast for conditions when the defense files the motion.

*too

You say there is a law in Georgia that states the prosecutor MUST prosecute the lowest chargeable crime but does that law also state that they cannot prosecute the higher level charges as well? There is a law in Georgia called “serious injury by vehicle” which rests on proving reckless driving and/or driving while intoxicated. Serious injury by vehicle is a felony.

Regardless, he has lots of money to hire a great legal team. I doubt he does any time. Maybe fines and community service. He has definitely opened himself up for a civil suit that will likely reach into the seven figures.




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[gthxxxx]

I really don't get where the mindset comes from that reckless driving isn't that bad and only results in a fine. Its degree of severeness (and range of penalties) overlaps with DUI. Maybe people are confusing the charge of reckless driving with a lower speeding charge?

 

[Animal02]

No animal I haven’t seen the road but I’ve seen plenty of reckless driving. There is also a law, at least in Georgia, that is titled “ to fast for conditions”. It’s a misdemeanor. Georgia law says that where two different crimes are established by the same fact pattern the prosecutor MUST prosecute the lowest chargeable crime. So in Georgia at least, reckless driving based on road/ lane conditions automatically reduces to speeding or to fast for conditions when the defense files the motion.

Too fast for conditions is typically applied when drive at or under the speed limit when conditions warrant otherwise ....traffic congestion, ice etc. You can charge someone with speeding if they are going 45 in a 55 zone and end of sliding on ice causing an accident.
He was driving over twice the legal speed...that is dangerously reckless.
And it would not be the "same fact pattern" plus the fact that it is Colorado, not Georgia.

 

[wrmathis]

Too fast for conditions is typically applied when drive at or under the speed limit when conditions warrant otherwise ....traffic congestion, ice etc. You can charge someone with speeding if they are going 45 in a 55 zone and end of sliding on ice causing an accident.
He was driving over twice the legal speed...that is dangerously reckless.
And it would not be the "same fact pattern" plus the fact that it is Colorado, not Georgia.

Also, they fact he injured someone is why it’s a felony. If he had wrecked and was the only person involved, probably not a felony

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

Almost all cars built since 2013 (96%) have an event data recorder (EDR) which records many items that can be used to prove a case against you, or for you, in court.

https://www.nhtsa.gov/research-data/event-data-recorder




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Did not know that. Interesting for the next time my wife tries to claim that a tree just mysteriously appeared while she was backing up at church.

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

*too

You say there is a law in Georgia that states the prosecutor MUST prosecute the lowest chargeable crime but does that law also state that they cannot prosecute the higher level charges as well? There is a law in Georgia called “serious injury by vehicle” which rests on proving reckless driving and/or driving while intoxicated. Serious injury by vehicle is a felony.

Regardless, he has lots of money to hire a great legal team. I doubt he does any time. Maybe fines and community service. He has definitely opened himself up for a civil suit that will likely reach into the seven figures.




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A "civil suit"? A dream come true for a trial lawyer. The felony charge may be the least of his worries.

 

[Technut1990]

Also, they fact he injured someone is why it’s a felony. If he had wrecked and was the only person involved, probably not a felony

The felony comes from his speed WITH injuries in the accident, it is not a felony or a crime to injure someone in a car wreck unless you are violating the law at the time

 

[Technut1990]

Too fast for conditions is typically applied when drive at or under the speed limit when conditions warrant otherwise ....traffic congestion, ice etc. You can charge someone with speeding if they are going 45 in a 55 zone and end of sliding on ice causing an accident.
He was driving over twice the legal speed...that is dangerously reckless.
And it would not be the "same fact pattern" plus the fact that it is Colorado, not Georgia.

Ok Animal