What needs to happen for you to want to keep CPJ?

What needs to happen for you to want to keep CPJ?

  • Keep him no matter what

    Votes: 158 61.7%

  • Fire him no matter what

    Votes: 14 5.5%

  • At least 8 wins

    Votes: 64 25.0%

  • Beat uga

    Votes: 20 7.8%
  • Total voters
    256
Old South Stands

Old South Stands

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
244
I joined the Bbuzzoff site years ago because I was frustrated with the direction of Tech football and with Coach Gailey not being able to turn the corner (e.g., win critical, season-defining games and beat UGA at least once). I was looking for a group of alumni online who wanted to find a new coach, and came across that site by accident. Coach Gailey was a very talented recruiter and brought in some good NFL talent, but was a poor game manager. (But then so was Pepper Rodgers, and I really liked Pepper; he at least beat Georgia). The problem I had with Coach Gailey wasn't so much the on-the-field performance, but a lack of zeal for his job. He seemed a poor fit for Tech. My initial gut reaction when he appeared at his first press conference as coach was that Tech made the wrong hiring decision and that fans would be stuck with him for five or six more years until people finally realized it. It never seemed like Coach Gailey ever truly wanted to be at Tech; it almost seemed like he was just collecting a pay check at times. Never really sold the public on the Tech program.

My thoughts on Coach Paul Johnson are different... I don't particularly want him gone. Like Gailey, his teams have a knack for losing critical, season-defining games, and he hasn't beaten Georgia -- except for his inaugural season in '08. And like Gailey, his teams sometimes find ways to win that occasional, unlikely game they shouldn't have won. But Coach Johnson has a zeal for Tech that CCG didn't have, and I think CPJ overall represents the program and the school very well. Unlike Gailey, CPJ has a much more brilliant football mind, at least where offense is concerned, but doesn't have the recruiting talents that Gailey had. And when you can't get the players you need, it makes it very hard to bring decent assistant coaches in... which in turn makes it hard to get talented players, etc. Considering that the Hill puts little importance on the football program and will not give the AD the waivers it needs to bring in better athletes, there's really little CPJ can do. Firing him or pressuring him to leave won't correct the situation when you don't have the proper support coming from the Hill. Remember the years leading up to the '90 season, Tech had a president in the person of Pat Crecine who valued athletics almost as much as academics -- was really fired up about Tech's athletic traditions and was willing to give the AD the tools they needed to win. Not so today.

So unless Tech completely collapses the rest of the way this season, there's no cogent reason to fire CPJ. He represents the school well, does as well as he can under the circumstances, and graduates his players. And in the end, what does a winning football program really matter when there are much bigger problems we all face? The billionaires seem to have decided that either Hillary or Jeb (or some other similar person) is going to be our next president; as in elections past, the news outlets are going make it all seem inevitable and thereby condition us to vote accordingly; neither party is likely to get rid of obamacare or fix the border; ISIS is raging out of control, and then there's ebola and the interovirus. Compared to these things (and to the eternal things of God), does it really matter how our alma mater does on the gridiron? <--- trying to convince myself daily of this...
 
dressedcheeseside

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
14,218
nodawgs said:
TJ Barnes was a converted OLineman and project from the get go. Not many successful 6'8 interior defensive linemen for pad level reasons.
Click to expand...
Blue Chip players are extremely hard to get. Blue chip DL's are the hardest of the blue chips to get. Blue chip DT's the hardest of the blue chip DL's to get. Do the math. Where we've gotten good DT's in the past is when we've developed somebody that was overlooked by the factories.
 

nodawgs

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
366
dressedcheeseside said:
And according you we're no better off changing coaches so what's the point?
Click to expand...
Gailey was a poor hire. Pro style offenses don't work in the college game unless you have superior talent. The CPJ hire was good in theory, but has hurt us in the long run. CPJ was hired to do more with what we had. Instead he has done the same with less. Face it Cutcliffe was right.
 
dressedcheeseside

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
14,218
Old South Stands said:
I joined the Bbuzzoff site years ago because I was frustrated with the direction of Tech football and with Coach Gailey not being able to turn the corner (e.g., win critical, season-defining games and beat UGA at least once). I was looking for a group of alumni online who wanted to find a new coach, and came across that site by accident. Coach Gailey was a very talented recruiter and brought in some good NFL talent, but was a poor game manager. (But then so was Pepper Rodgers, and I really liked Pepper; he at least beat Georgia). The problem I had with Coach Gailey wasn't so much the on-the-field performance, but a lack of zeal for his job. He seemed a poor fit for Tech. My initial gut reaction when he appeared at his first press conference as coach was that Tech made the wrong hiring decision and that fans would be stuck with him for five or six more years until people finally realized it. It never seemed like Coach Gailey ever truly wanted to be at Tech; it almost seemed like he was just collecting a pay check at times. Never really sold the public on the Tech program.

My thoughts on Coach Paul Johnson are different... I don't particularly want him gone. Like Gailey, his teams have a knack for losing critical, season-defining games, and he hasn't beaten Georgia -- except for his inaugural season in '08. And like Gailey, his teams sometimes find ways to win that occasional, unlikely game they shouldn't have won. But Coach Johnson has a zeal for Tech that CCG didn't have, and I think CPJ overall represents the program and the school very well. Unlike Gailey, CPJ has a much more brilliant football mind, at least where offense is concerned, but doesn't have the recruiting talents that Gailey had. And when you can't get the players you need, it makes it very hard to bring decent assistant coaches in... which in turn makes it hard to get talented players, etc. Considering that the Hill puts little importance on the football program and will not give the AD the waivers it needs to bring in better athletes, there's really little CPJ can do. Firing him or pressuring him to leave won't correct the situation when you don't have the proper support coming from the Hill. Remember the years leading up to the '90 season, Tech had a president in the person of Pat Crecine who valued athletics almost as much as academics -- was really fired up about Tech's athletic traditions and was willing to give the AD the tools they needed to win. Not so today.

So unless Tech completely collapses the rest of the way this season, there's no cogent reason to fire CPJ. He represents the school well, does as well as he can under the circumstances, and graduates his players. And in the end, what does a winning football program really matter when there are much bigger problems we all face? The billionaires seem to have decided that either Hillary or Jeb (or some other similar person) is going to be our next president; as in elections past, the news outlets are going make it all seem inevitable and thereby condition us to vote accordingly; neither party is likely to get rid of obamacare or fix the border; ISIS is raging out of control, and then there's ebola and the interovirus. Compared to these things (and to the eternal things of God), does it really matter how our alma mater does on the gridiron? <--- trying to convince myself daily of this...
Click to expand...
Football is our diversion from all the stuff in your last paragraph (God excluded). That's why we're so passionate in our discussions.
 

nodawgs

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
366
dressedcheeseside said:
Blue Chip players are extremely hard to get. Blue chip DL's are the hardest of the blue chips to get. Blue chip DT's the hardest of the blue chip DL's to get. Do the math. Where we've gotten good DT's in the past is when we've developed somebody that was overlooked by the factories.
Click to expand...
Darell Robertson and Daryl Richard were not overlooked by the factories. Please stop with the excuses.
 
dressedcheeseside

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
14,218
nodawgs said:
Darell Robertson and Daryl Richard were not overlooked by the factories. Please stop with the excuses.
Click to expand...
I don't know about Robertson and his offer list and he was a good player but I don't recall him making All ACC much less All America. Richard was an elite student, he came to GT for more than just football. Let's go find us a whole pack of Scholarly elite DT's, Yay! Is that all you can come up with in the past 15 years?
 
Whiskey_Clear

Whiskey_Clear

Banned
Messages
10,486
nodawgs said:
CPJ is the HC. He is ultimately responsible for the offense, defense, and special teams. Firing a 3rd DC is not going to solve the problem. CPJ has had 7 years to right the ship. How many more does he need?
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I never said he isn't accountable. He is for the entire program. And I'm probably almost as frustrated with our D as most everyone else is. But he is a genius on O. Consistently calls great games. He made changes to fix ST..apparently succeeded. Made changes to fix D...hasn't panned out yet. I think it's easier to fix that last thing than rebuild the whole damn ship.
I know you hate the O however so I can see why we disagree on the issue.
 

nodawgs

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
366
dressedcheeseside said:
I don't know about Robertson and his offer list and he was a good player but I don't recall him making All ACC much less All America. Richard was an elite student, he came to GT for more than just football. Let's go find us a whole pack of Scholarly elite DT's, Yay! Is that all you can come up with in the past 15 years?
Click to expand...
That's 2 more than CPJ has been able to get in the last 7. Mansfield Wrotto wasn't to bad either. CPJ has whiffed on plenty on the recruiting trail btw. I'm sure it wasn't for what Cutcliffe mentioned though...
 
Whiskey_Clear

Whiskey_Clear

Banned
Messages
10,486
And I think this debate is healthy...but the timing probably coulda been better :). Don't get me wrong...I think it is most appropriate after a tough loss...just not an hour or two after it
 

nodawgs

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
366
Whiskey_Clear said:
I never said he isn't accountable. He is for the entire program. And I'm probably almost as frustrated with our D as most everyone else is. But he is a genius on O. Consistently calls great games. He made changes to fix ST..apparently succeeded. Made changes to fix D...hasn't panned out yet. I think it's easier to fix that last thing than rebuild the whole damn ship.
I know you hate the O however so I can see why we disagree on the issue.
Click to expand...
Fire another DC and give him another 7 years. That will work.
 
Henrymcg

Henrymcg

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
93
nodawgs said:
Darell Robertson and Daryl Richard were not overlooked by the factories. Please stop with the excuses.
Click to expand...
North Carolina's best defensive player was committed to Georgia Tech and then turned away at the last minute (for whatever reason) ..

It's getting more difficult to find players
 
Whiskey_Clear

Whiskey_Clear

Banned
Messages
10,486
What we need to do to fix D this year belongs on another thread. As for next year, we lose Green on the line. And I think he is our best DT. So all is not rosy next year. And it is asking a lot to expect big contributions from true Crosby on the Los. I gotta believe we will still be better overall because worse doesn't seem very possible. Simply finding someone opposite Freeman next year could solve many woes. I believe JHD and Whitehead might both be able.
 
dressedcheeseside

dressedcheeseside

Helluva Engineer
Messages
14,218
Whiskey_Clear said:
What we need to do to fix D this year belongs on another thread. As for next year, we lose Green on the line. And I think he is our best DT. So all is not rosy next year. And it is asking a lot to expect big contributions from true Crosby on the Los. I gotta believe we will still be better overall because worse doesn't seem very possible. Simply finding someone opposite Freeman next year could solve many woes. I believe JHD and Whitehead might both be able.
Click to expand...
JHD and Whitehead play the same position as Freeman.
 
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