Swarm Makeover

John

Peacekeeper
Staff member
Messages
2,102
There only have been four people that got themselves banned from the political forum and strangely enough, the feedback we keep getting out from 75% of those people.

How about we get some feedback about our "Orwellian" moderating from outside of that small circle of people?

Why can’t the Mods just move or delete those posts instead of punishing the community? You have the ability to warn and even ban people who break the rules.
What makes you think we didn't try? When we warn/ban people, it's moderator bias, right? Or is that only when we send you one?

Chill out. Things are okay. Don't get so stressed. This is just the internet; there are bigger things in life.
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,890
There only have been four people that got themselves banned from the political forum and strangely enough, the feedback we keep getting out from 75% of those people.

How about we get some feedback about our "Orwellian" moderating from outside of that small circle of people?


What makes you think we didn't try? When we warn/ban people, it's moderator bias, right? Or is that only when we send you one?

Chill out. Things are okay. Don't get so stressed. This is just the internet; there are bigger things in life.
So do you see the connection? You only warn certain people and not others is what you’re saying here. I was banned from the political forum for being excessively argumentative........for repeatedly telling another site member to stop picking fights. I have been warned for calling out someone’s racist comment and it was misread by the moderators that I had said it. You’ve told me multiple times you wanted to ban me (most recently from the lounge altogether) but the other Mods came to my defense...for the most tangential reach of political references. Like today’s that other people made. It had literally nothing to do with politics in the discussion.

I had nothing to do with any of these recent political squabbles, so I’m not sure why you act like I did. I’m actually defending the other members here. Who you apparently don’t ever warn. Why do warn and ban some people, but apparently not others and instead close threads? It’s like you don’t even seem to understand the complaints here.

Chill out. Things are okay. Don't get so stressed.

I mean, we were all having a nice day and apparently you all got stressed out - why I have no idea.
 

John

Peacekeeper
Staff member
Messages
2,102
So do you see the connection? You only warn certain people and not others. I was banned from the political forum for being excessively argumentative.......
I think you should stop making assumptions about how that was decided.

By the way, probably stop with the backseat moderating? People just don't take being moderated lightly certainly not from someone who is not a moderator. It's not your job to call out people. If you really want to help the moderators: 1) send a report, and 2) let us decide what action to take. I think those are simple asks.

I had nothing to do with any of these recent political squabbles, so I’m not sure why you act like I did.
Because you started this side-discussion and you and the two others that keep liking each others posts are the only ones complaining? To give you some credit, I do think you have attempted to steer clear of political angles but a few of you guys have a hard time not getting triggered when someone posts something even slightly political.

Again, chill out. Take a walk or something. Locking the corona thread isn't the end of the world and we may even open it back up after everyone involved in the flurry today calms down a bit.
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,890
I think you should stop making assumptions about how that was decided.

By the way, probably stop with the backseat moderating? People just don't take being moderated lightly certainly not from someone who is not a moderator. It's not your job to call out people. If you really want to help the moderators: 1) send a report, and 2) let us decide what action to take. I think those are simple asks.


Because you started this side-discussion and you and the two others that keep liking each others posts are the only ones complaining? To give you some credit, I do think you have attempted to steer clear of political angles but a few of you guys have a hard time not getting triggered when someone posts something even slightly political.

Again, chill out. Take a walk or something. Locking the corona thread isn't the end of the world and we may even open it back up after everyone involved in the flurry today calms down a bit.
I didn’t start the side discussion. I wasn’t breaking the rules. I am not irate. I wasn’t banned or warned. This whole thing is bizarre. Why are you telling me to chill out and go for a walk? As best I can tell, the community was well behaved today. Unless I missed it, I didn’t see any cursing, political discussion, out of bounds commentary. All I’m doing is trying to figure out why today’s decisions were made. If everyone was already calm, how would you measure our new level of calm when the thread is now locked?

I mean IIWII at this point. I hope you have a good weekend. Come Monday, please think back through all this and take another look at it. I kindly request you don’t essentially punish the rest of us for the actions of a few, whom I would argue were not out of bounds in the first place.
 

Supersizethatorder-mutt

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,662
Location
Augusta, GA
I think you should stop making assumptions about how that was decided.

By the way, probably stop with the backseat moderating? People just don't take being moderated lightly certainly not from someone who is not a moderator. It's not your job to call out people. If you really want to help the moderators: 1) send a report, and 2) let us decide what action to take. I think those are simple asks.


Because you started this side-discussion and you and the two others that keep liking each others posts are the only ones complaining? To give you some credit, I do think you have attempted to steer clear of political angles but a few of you guys have a hard time not getting triggered when someone posts something even slightly political.

Again, chill out. Take a walk or something. Locking the corona thread isn't the end of the world and we may even open it back up after everyone involved in the flurry today calms down a bit.
I have reported some posts that were either obviously political in a non-political thread or every bit as personally offensive to me as some of mine apparently were to others. Was any action taken on my reports? Not just NO, but HELL NO !!! You want to know what "Orwellian" things are done here? What you posted 30 minutes ago is a prime example of that. You completely devalue the opinions of a small number, simply because they are a small number. In a free society, the opinions of even a small number of people should be every bit as important as any larger group. If they are not, then the administrators of such a policy are demonstrating a bias, whereby they same only "our" opinion matters; "yours" does not. Today, apparently someone didn't like actual current events being discussed, because there was a difference of opinion about the event itself, then it was decided that the only way to stop it was to delete the entire thread. Once again, the ugly head of political correctness and intolerance towards differing view rears its ugly head, and you are ok with it.
 

John

Peacekeeper
Staff member
Messages
2,102
I didn’t start the side discussion.
This is your post... in a thread titled "Swarm Makeover". People are making suggestions about how the site works on mobile or about the new design. Your post complaining about a moderator action in an unrelated thread is not a side discussion?

You seem frustrated and stressed, that's why I was suggesting you chill out.
 

Supersizethatorder-mutt

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,662
Location
Augusta, GA
If you are going to enforce political correctness and not allow unlimited free speech, then why not get rid of The Swarm Lounge and all non-sports-related threads completely? That sure seems to be the only fair and equitable solution.
 

John

Peacekeeper
Staff member
Messages
2,102
Once again, the ugly head of political correctness and intolerance towards differing view rears its ugly head, and you are ok with it.
I think both of you guys will be better off if you guys are okay with not having any control over how this community is run or moderated. Because you don't. That should be ok.

Provide feedback as you are doing now but don't get pissed if we don't agree with your viewpoint or we don't take action right away. I don't at all mind the criticism but man some of you guys think you run this place. 🙂
 

4shotB

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
1,821
Today, apparently someone didn't like actual current events being discussed, because there was a difference of opinion about the event itself, then it was decided that the only way to stop it was to delete the entire thread.
Let's be factually correct here. The thread was locked and not deleted. People interested in the topic were instructed to post and respond in the "Corona" thread in the political topics forum as many of the posts in the locked thread were political in nature. This after numerous attempts and requests posted within the very same thread for people to refrain from doing so. So the thread was not deleted, just redirected. Post all you want up there. But please know that other site rules do apply even in that forum.
 

Supersizethatorder-mutt

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,662
Location
Augusta, GA
I think both of you guys will be better off if you guys are okay with not having any control over how this community is run or moderated. Because you don't. That should be ok.

Provide feedback as you are doing now but don't get pissed if we don't agree with your viewpoint or we don't take action right away. I don't at all mind the criticism but man some of you guys think you run this place. 🙂
None of us think we "run this place", but it is obvious to some of us also that those who DO "run this place" don't "run" it in an equitable manner.
 

Supersizethatorder-mutt

Helluva Engineer
Messages
12,662
Location
Augusta, GA
Let's be factually correct here. The thread was locked and not deleted. People interested in the topic were instructed to post and respond in the "Corona" thread in the political topics forum as many of the posts in the locked thread were political in nature. This after numerous attempts and requests posted within the very same thread for people to refrain from doing so. So the thread was not deleted, just redirected. Post all you want up there. But please know that other site rules do apply even in that forum.
You apparently conveniently forget that some of us were banned from the political threads. Whether our removal was justified or not is at least somewhat questionable, but the fact remains that when a non-political discussion was going on and some people got their feelings hurt, or whatever their problem was, you locked it down.
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,890
This is your post... in a thread titled "Swarm Makeover". People are making suggestions about how the site works on mobile or about the new design. Your post complaining about a moderator action in an unrelated thread is not a side discussion?

You seem frustrated and stressed, that's why I was suggesting you chill out.
Sorry, I thought you were saying I initiated the side discussion that lead to the Coronavirus thread getting locked. I wanted to discuss the locking of a thread, so the site design thread was the closest of applicability I could find.
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,890
Let's be factually correct here. The thread was locked and not deleted. People interested in the topic were instructed to post and respond in the "Corona" thread in the political topics forum as many of the posts in the locked thread were political in nature. This after numerous attempts and requests posted within the very same thread for people to refrain from doing so. So the thread was not deleted, just redirected. Post all you want up there. But please know that other site rules do apply even in that forum.
The reason I complained about this action is that in my opinion (a) the people whose actions caused the thread to be locked can continue the discussion on another thread, (b) some of the people who had nothing to do with it cannot or may not want to venture into the political area, (c) I may have missed some content that got deleted, but I didn’t see any content worthy of locking the thread.

Im not mad, stressed out, irate, or anything else. I’m just disappointed, because we have site rules that are inconsistently applied. I felt rather than punish everyone else for something they didn’t do, you could either warn those few people (I don’t think they deserve a warning anyway), or move or delete those posts.
 
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4shotB

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
1,821
(c) I may have missed some content that got deleted, but I didn’t see any content worthy of locking the thread.

Im not mad, stressed out, irate, or anything else. I’m just disappointed, because we have site rules that are inconsistently applied. I felt rather than punish everyone else for something they didn’t do, you could either warn those few people (I don’t think they deserve a warning anyway), or move or delete those posts.
Unless you are on the thread 24/7 there is a good chance you do not see all the posts so it IS indeed likely you (and others) missed the content leading to the thread being locked. Those get moved to the recycle bin and are not visible to readers so I get why people wonder what happened. Quite frankly, I feel there were enough warnings (individually and in general) in advance. This was not a quick strike or "one off" reaction. You may disagree and I have no problem with that.

As far as unfair, unjust or uneven moderation goes I do not feel it is a productive use of my time to debate that with you but I respect your right to have and voice that opinion.Regards.
 

bwelbo

Helluva Engineer
Messages
11,890
Unless you are on the thread 24/7 there is a good chance you do not see all the posts so it IS indeed likely you (and others) missed the content leading to the thread being locked. Those get moved to the recycle bin and are not visible to readers so I get why people wonder what happened. Quite frankly, I feel there were enough warnings (individually and in general) in advance. This was not a quick strike or "one off" reaction. You may disagree and I have no problem with that.

As far as unfair, unjust or uneven moderation goes I do not feel it is a productive use of my time to debate that with you but I respect your right to have and voice that opinion.Regards.
Fair enough on my possibly missing content. There are site rules here. If you post political content, you can get warned. Multiple warnings can lead to a timeout of varying length. The Mods have the power, just like a referee in a soccer game. If someone isn’t following the rules, you can give that person or people a yellow card and then a red card. I just wish we would do that instead of canceling the game. We’ve done it before and it solves the problem. You can’t keep violating the rules if you can’t post. That way you don’t get the annoying problem of having to keep moving or deleting content.
 

LibertyTurns

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,709
Just my opinion: It’s John’s board and he sets the rules. If you don’t like it move elsewhere to a board that fits your style. Otherwise be subjected to John’s rules. Maybe start one up if you feel the need? John has amassed a number of moderators. They help John enforce the rules. I’m sure they like babysitting a bunch of adults yammering on a message board. That being said, there’s the snitch and the anti-snitch crowd and they pretty much fall into political buckets. At work I always tell my leaders: Pay more attention to the guy not saying anything and get him to talk. He’s sitting on the answer not the constant complainer.

1. Honestly three pages of you’re a liar & I’m not is probably not favored by anyone. I’m sure the Mods are normally working or spending time with their families & it isn’t until they get off work they see “reports”. Collateral damage ensues. Anyone doing this can’t tell me they didn’t know they were getting irritating. You don’t need a Mod to tell you.

2. There’s a left leaning bias on here. One, they’re probably way more apt to complain so those on the moderate side get nuked or deleted way more often. Two, their back & forth is usually pretty comical so moderates just laugh or heckles them. Get over it if you don’t like it. It’s the political cancel culture and our society is now relatively intolerant of anything that’s not defined as mainstream (fairly left). This board is no different. If you’re not with them 100% you’re on the other side even if you agree with half of what they say.

3. Every damn topic practically has some inflammatory undertone. You either like the new football regime or you’re the old regime’s fanboy that just wants mediocrity at everyone else’s expense. You like the new regime’s style & you got gold colored glasses on & don’t understand how life works. Just a sports variant of the political cancel culture.

I don’t like the walled off political section because I’m a 1st amendment guy but this is a private board not a government run one. Private board, private rules. It must be maddening trying to moderate a board of GT fans because by and large we’re educated and opinionated. I’m not sure how many posts there are per day but there’s no way Moderators are reading all of them. Hence John’s comments above.

I personally find it interesting how people can look at the same scenario & arrive at wildly different conclusions. In my opinion this board is no better at understanding trends and identifying root causes then deriving good solutions that work than the general population which is fascinating.

Thank you all for giving us a place to blow some time.
 

GT_EE78

Helluva Engineer
Messages
2,459
Provide feedback as you are doing now but don't get pissed if we don't agree with your viewpoint or we don't take action right away. I don't at all mind the criticism but man some of you guys think you run this place. 🙂
No, I don't have any illusions that i run the place. I hope that you and the other mods will reconsider your one strike rule for that political section. To me that seems too harsh, I hope you and mods will have a change of heart about that.. especially since how it's being regulated is rather unclear. I didn't attack any fellow members yet was banned and not given any reason,even when i asked.
.
Trying to follow your self-moderate rules doesn't always work either. I created a poll/thread regarding governors performance during coronavirus and even requested that users limit discussion to virus policies to avoid political discussion.Yet i was still given a warning for having created it.
 

forensicbuzz

Helluva Engineer
Messages
3,323
Location
North Shore, Chicago
I'm all for straight-up dropping any font that breaks the rules. @LibertyTurns, I've put a bunch of wacko fonts on "ignore," so I don't see a lot of the garbage, but there's no way this forum leans left. I've been on here since close to the beginning, and it has predominately been a right-leaning forum. I agree with @John that @bwelbo should "go for a walk." Not for any other reason than I think he spends way too much time on this forum. It seems like 2/3 of the comments in the Lounge are from him. It can't be healthy to spend that much time on an internet message board. No offense intended.
 
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