QB battle

Rock

Ramblin' Wreck
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615
Because you have shown confidence in MJ being the starter that is unwavering. Nothing wrong with it but given the choice between MJ, TM or LJ and knowing what you know which one of the three would most likely lead us downfield?
I agree with you that every position has that happen. It happened a whole bunch with Vad when he was here. I am not knocking you just stating the obvious. Again though, only Candeto and CPJ really know who starts that first drive. Whoever it is will be the guy and I hope we score with him.


LOL. of course I have confidence.

But.... I have also said I am 100% behind CPJ's decision as well.
If someone beats him out, good. that means that person gives up the best chance to win and MJ needs to step it up.
(it's not all praise. We prob get on him harder than the coaches)
 

Rock

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
615
Haha thank you, scraped it together really quickly just as a way to visualize. Curious, which parts do you disagree with? I think my most controversial take there is JJ higher ceiling than JeT, but CPJ himself said he might be the most talented QB he has ever coached. If he puts it all together, there is no reason he can't be as good as Justin. For as good as Justin was, he was not perfect. JJ could certainly reach that (though he may not).
I think MJ is extremely limited as a passer and that is why he will not have a high ceiling, this offense is unquestionably at its best when a defense has to respect the deep passing game, if MJ is not capable of making the throws, it handicaps the offense.
LJ has a low floor simply due to lack of time in the system/knowledge. Per all reports, TM has been the best in practice so I'll give him the nod.

Just out of curiosity, why?

From what I have seen, I think TM is limited in passing. I have seen his workouts a few times.
 

nod

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
711
If all things are equal, Lucas has advantage being taller, Coach Johnson has noted issues in the past with Thomas and Washington not being able to see passing lanes over the line. Both had happy feat in pocket, just so they could see.
Not going to be deciding factor but it gives Lucas a little advantage.
 

Eastman

Helluva Engineer
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1,289
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Columbia, SC
I get what you're saying, but competition is a good thing. Nothing makes a player work harder, pay better attention, get there a little earlier, stay there a little later, basically go the extra mile than somebody nipping at their heels or having somebody a smidgeon in front of you. Competition is the best motivator in the world. If anything will see our young qb's reach their full potential, it's competition and the real chance to play.

Having a bunch of guys all capable also gives the coach way more options on game day and incase of ******. (not gonna say it :censored:)

This. And I would add that it puts pressure on every play you run in practice because you desperately want to win the position. That is a great thing because the QB position has to handle the most pressure.
 

SlawDog

Banned
Messages
295
That's gonna happen no matter what.
People don't get their way and the other guy can't do anything right.

nature of the beast.
I just hope it's a good punt, lol.
I give Tech fans more credit than that. Perhaps you are just projecting in the psychoanalytical sense
 

kg01

Get-Bak! Coach
Featured Member
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15,171
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Atlanta
Just out of curiosity, why?

From what I have seen, I think TM is limited in passing. I have seen his workouts a few times.

No bias there? :whistle: (just messing with you)

I don't think we've seen enough from any of the QB's to know their limitations at this point. I think both TM and Rock, Jr. will play early then one will emerge as the starter early on in the season.

There, that's my boring take. :rolleyes: Y'all can commence yelling at each other. :cigar:
 

Rock

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
615
No bias there? :whistle: (just messing with you)

I don't think we've seen enough from any of the QB's to know their limitations at this point. I think both TM and Rock, Jr. will play early then one will emerge as the starter early on in the season.

There, that's my boring take. :rolleyes: Y'all can commence yelling at each other. :cigar:

Nah no bias.. Can TM get better sure. Can MJ..absolutely.
and I agree. We haven't seen enough from any of them yet.
And you are wrong about that
 

kg01

Get-Bak! Coach
Featured Member
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Nah no bias.. Can TM get better sure. Can MJ..absolutely.
and I agree. We haven't seen enough from any of them yet.
And you are wrong about that

I know. Was just a continuation of me pulling your chain. Success?
 

Philhutch80

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
221
LOL. of course I have confidence.

But.... I have also said I am 100% behind CPJ's decision as well.
If someone beats him out, good. that means that person gives up the best chance to win and MJ needs to step it up.
(it's not all praise. We prob get on him harder than the coaches)

We are on the same page just coming at it from different perspectives. For someone to beat out MJ means the bar has been raised. I like MJ but with the variety of talent and nobody knowing will happen this year makes these conversations endless on perspectives. Ultimately it's about winning the game rather than 'the championship of life' and CPJ wants to go 4-0 against the SEC-least. I support that.
 

SlawDog

Banned
Messages
295
I am curious. Does anyone else think one may start, but not get the majority of snaps for the entire game? Maybe mj starts due to experience and then one other gets worked in and takes over... could be possible way to ease a less experienced guy into a big game.
This absolutely could happen but is only going to happen if CPJ believes who he has in the game, everyone not just the QB, will result in the team winning.
 

305jacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
477
Just out of curiosity, why?

From what I have seen, I think TM is limited in passing. I have seen his workouts a few times.
I don't think TM is a much better passer to be honest. He may actually be more limited, I haven't seen much besides the scrimmages so I don't know. I am going off of reports and what I have seen.

I was in Miami for that game 2 years ago where MJ played (he wasn't ready so I will limit how much fault I put in him) and it was not pretty at all. Even against VT, he was 2/7. He won us the game by running, not passing. I have always liked MJ too, if he starts vs Tenn I will be content and hoping he gets the job done. However he has done nothing to prove to me he has what it takes to establish himself as a passing threat, and I think that could really hurt us as defenses adjust. I have full confidence in him though to run the offense, make correct reads, and be a tough runner.
 

Rock

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
615
I don't think TM is a much better passer to be honest. He may actually be more limited, I haven't seen much besides the scrimmages so I don't know. I am going off of reports and what I have seen.

I was in Miami for that game 2 years ago where MJ played (he wasn't ready so I will limit how much fault I put in him) and it was not pretty at all. Even against VT, he was 2/7. He won us the game by running, not passing. I have always liked MJ too, if he starts vs Tenn I will be content and hoping he gets the job done. However he has done nothing to prove to me he has what it takes to establish himself as a passing threat, and I think that could really hurt us as defenses adjust. I have full confidence in him though to run the offense, make correct reads, and be a tough runner.

Miami was his first action in a monsoon. I don't count that one.
He was 3-9 vs VT and I agree it could have been better. He needs to set his feet and throw like he can.
He has the arm strength, just needs to set properly and throw it.
 

305jacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
477
Miami was his first action in a monsoon. I don't count that one.
He was 3-9 vs VT and I agree it could have been better. He needs to set his feet and throw like he can.
He has the arm strength, just needs to set properly and throw it.
I agree he has the arm strength, size and tools to get it done. If he can be coached up and set and properly throw it. I will be his #1 fan and support him.

Also he was 2/7 vs VT and 3/9 on the season. (1/2 vs Vandy with the 1 completion being a 77 yard touchdown to Clinton Lynch and the other pass being an interception in the endzone on an awful fade pass).
 

ilovetheoption

Helluva Engineer
Messages
2,816
Haha thank you, scraped it together really quickly just as a way to visualize. Curious, which parts do you disagree with? I think my most controversial take there is JJ higher ceiling than JeT, but CPJ himself said he might be the most talented QB he has ever coached. If he puts it all together, there is no reason he can't be as good as Justin. For as good as Justin was, he was not perfect. JJ could certainly reach that (though he may not).
I think MJ is extremely limited as a passer and that is why he will not have a high ceiling, this offense is unquestionably at its best when a defense has to respect the deep passing game, if MJ is not capable of making the throws, it handicaps the offense.
LJ has a low floor simply due to lack of time in the system/knowledge. Per all reports, TM has been the best in practice so I'll give him the nod.

So, I'm not as high on JJ as the rest of us. For starters, I KNOW this is a small sample size, and I KNOW I could be entirely wrong, I KNOW this...but I watched the spring game, and JJ was more than unimpressive as a passer.

Like the ball security is one thing. You can improve that, but you can't become a passer.

Throwing is not passing. JJ has a strong arm, nobody contests that, but he missed BADLY on a couple of throws that should have been easy completions. What's worse is that they weren't just inaccurate throws, they were the wrong KIND of throws.

This is the spring game:

Here are JJ's throws
1:07:36 This isn't just a little off..this is bazooka'd over he head of an open receiver. He didn't need to drill this. This is an easy pitch and catch. (for comparison, look at 1:29:00)
1:15:42 I mean....again, that's not a misread, which you can work on, or a defender made a great play...that's just an airball.
1:34:30 Meh. This is a deep miss, which happens. This one doesn't bother me as much.
1:37:40 Nice. This is a deep out, which means you need to bazooka it in there, and he did.
1:40:00 Runs around in the backfield and finds a guy underneath. Playground play, and his biggest passing play of the night.
1:41:47 Runs around in the backfield and lobs it up for an interception. Playground play, and his worst passing play of the night.

That's not being a passer, and it doesn't scream to me "this guy is going to develop into even a Justin Thomas level passer, who can at least hit an open A back streaking down the seam when the defense overcommits to stop the run".

It looks like a dude who doesn't have the passing instincts (something that I think you don't generally develop this late in your career) to ever be even a marginal passer.

You can't base a passing game around "run around and see if somebody gets open". That's backyard stuff.

This is why i'm not sold on JJ as the future.
 

Silk3

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
926
So, I'm not as high on JJ as the rest of us. For starters, I KNOW this is a small sample size, and I KNOW I could be entirely wrong, I KNOW this...but I watched the spring game, and JJ was more than unimpressive as a passer.

Like the ball security is one thing. You can improve that, but you can't become a passer.

Throwing is not passing. JJ has a strong arm, nobody contests that, but he missed BADLY on a couple of throws that should have been easy completions. What's worse is that they weren't just inaccurate throws, they were the wrong KIND of throws.

This is the spring game:

Here are JJ's throws
1:07:36 This isn't just a little off..this is bazooka'd over he head of an open receiver. He didn't need to drill this. This is an easy pitch and catch. (for comparison, look at 1:29:00)
1:15:42 I mean....again, that's not a misread, which you can work on, or a defender made a great play...that's just an airball.
1:34:30 Meh. This is a deep miss, which happens. This one doesn't bother me as much.
1:37:40 Nice. This is a deep out, which means you need to bazooka it in there, and he did.
1:40:00 Runs around in the backfield and finds a guy underneath. Playground play, and his biggest passing play of the night.
1:41:47 Runs around in the backfield and lobs it up for an interception. Playground play, and his worst passing play of the night.

That's not being a passer, and it doesn't scream to me "this guy is going to develop into even a Justin Thomas level passer, who can at least hit an open A back streaking down the seam when the defense overcommits to stop the run".

It looks like a dude who doesn't have the passing instincts (something that I think you don't generally develop this late in your career) to ever be even a marginal passer.

You can't base a passing game around "run around and see if somebody gets open". That's backyard stuff.

This is why i'm not sold on JJ as the future.

Lol so you come to conclusion he cant pass from 1 spring game where he was playing hurt? Im not saying hes a good passer or anything but idk if thats fair game to make that conclusion.
 

alentrekin

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
876
Location
California
It looks like a dude who doesn't have the passing instincts (something that I think you don't generally develop this late in your career) to ever be even a marginal passer.
IMO overstated and contrary to what our coach and players have said about him.

I agree that he looked wild, but (as a former catcher) I wouldn't go this far on one bad outing. His arm action is fine (not as pure as LJs but better than the other two) and the reports have been that he can throw.
 
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