Option Football

[Augusta_Jacket]

All this talk of scheme vs recruiting...

 

[Richard7125]

People are acting like if a coach runs the same offense and defense and recruits the same, they will get the same results. I completely disagree with that and will use Geoff Collins as my primary example. There are some coaches that a really good and there are other coaches that are really bad.

 

[JacketFan137]

Interesting take on that @lv20gt. I would suggest that the recruiting aspects seem to be moving further out of control from the coaching staffs though. NIL Funding and Recruiting Inducements are now being done in the open. I don't see how a non-factory school, that is intent on being a SCHOOL first, will ever compete regularly for the kind of talent that you need to out athlete the top 15-20 teams in any given year WITHOUT huge money backing the recruiting aspect.

If you can't do that than Conference Championships are out of the question. Which leads me to look at what you CAN control, and that brings me back to scheme based systems. That doesn't argue for or against the HC being the one responsible, but I do think the path forward for GT is through an identity based scheme on Offense.

i don’t think anyone is opposing an identity based scheme offense. i don’t think it would be hard to get everyone on board with running what we see at tennessee, ole miss, ohio state etc

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

i don’t think it would be hard to get everyone on board with running what we see at tennessee, ole miss, ohio state etc

Would you have issue with the Chadwell offense?

 

[yeti92]

evolving their own offense. And hate to break it to you, nobody is really innovating in CFB, what we see today has been done for decades, things ebb/flow.

But if you think we don't need recruiting to beat clemson and georgia, then cool.

You must be in remarkably good shape to be moving goalposts around so often.

 

[JacketFan137]

Would you have issue with the Chadwell offense?

no and i’ve said him and deion are my two favorites for the hire multiple times on here. i just have some questions about chadwells lack of recruiting ability shown thus far

 

[yeti92]

no and i’ve said him and deion are my two favorites for the hire multiple times on here. i just have some questions about chadwells lack of recruiting ability shown thus far

How does Chadwell's "lack of recruiting ability thus far" compare to Dell McGee's recruiting at Ga Southern?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Question: Was Dell McGee demoted at uga? Until 2018 he was assistant head coach and running backs coach. Since 2019 he's been run game coordinator and running backs coach.

Also, why has he been in pretty much the same position for 6 years and only just now being considered for a HC job? It would seem that an assistant of that caliber at a factory like uga would have been poached already. At least as an OC.

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

Interesting take on that @lv20gt. I would suggest that the recruiting aspects seem to be moving further out of control from the coaching staffs though. NIL Funding and Recruiting Inducements are now being done in the open. I don't see how a non-factory school, that is intent on being a SCHOOL first, will ever compete regularly for the kind of talent that you need to out athlete the top 15-20 teams in any given year WITHOUT huge money backing the recruiting aspect.

If you can't do that than Conference Championships are out of the question. Which leads me to look at what you CAN control, and that brings me back to scheme based systems. That doesn't argue for or against the HC being the one responsible, but I do think the path forward for GT is through an identity based scheme on Offense.

I would add "And Defense" Why not have both?

 

[stigs02jrt]

Interesting take on that @lv20gt. I would suggest that the recruiting aspects seem to be moving further out of control from the coaching staffs though. NIL Funding and Recruiting Inducements are now being done in the open. I don't see how a non-factory school, that is intent on being a SCHOOL first, will ever compete regularly for the kind of talent that you need to out athlete the top 15-20 teams in any given year WITHOUT huge money backing the recruiting aspect.

If you can't do that than Conference Championships are out of the question. Which leads me to look at what you CAN control, and that brings me back to scheme based systems. That doesn't argue for or against the HC being the one responsible, but I do think the path forward for GT is through an identity based scheme on Offense.

OK, but Deion is the unicorn of recruiting. He can immediately compete for top players, even at a non factory school like tech.

If we can't get a unicorn recruiter, we'll need a unicorn offensive guru like Kiffin or Heupel or similar (not sure chadwell qualifies).

Of the unicorn choices, I'd think Deion our most likely get. And if we can't get a unicorn, we just gotta hope we get someone who offers a little of both, and I just don't think that moves the needle to perennial top 25 program.

 

[kittysniper101]

i don’t disagree that we haven’t put up enough money into the football program. even with collins he wasn’t given the support and backing that many other coaches in our own conference get. everyone knows our facilities are middle of the road.

i don’t care who the coach is tech football needs more money and investment if we are serious about competing in the p5 level with our biggest rivals being uga and clemson.

i just disagree with this notion of starving out the program because it was paul or the option. that just makes no sense whatsoever and hurts literally every party involved. just seems like the constant retelling of this story with literally zero tangible proof is turning this into some paul bunyan tale of bravery

I mean several public records have been presented to you that support the argument. Here’s another for good measure, Paul mentions he considered retirement earlier because it wasn’t fun working under the previous AD at 5:25 in his retirement press conference.

The extent to which resources were withheld is certainly up for debate, but all it takes is a couple closed pocket books and ego driven decisions to put us way behind. It looks like you only joined the board last year, but you need only open any thread in which the option is mentioned to see the sharp reactions it brings. To think those making monetary contributions to the program would be so different from the makeup of this board seems a flawed assumption to me.

 

[SoMsJacket]

You’re right about #4... it’s highly subjective and largely worthless because each program should evaluate their needs; not rely on a third party publication for fans. That’s kind of my point. Where we stand in terms of recruiting is far less important than our development program.
As for my # 3,I can’t dispute your assertion that we are “capable,” we just haven’t done it, ever. I said our schedule, not our league, but even still, we are not going to consistently out recruit Clem, FSU, Miami, and UNC. And if we do, What does that get us? Absent improvement in a lot of other areas, not much.
I don’t think we really disagree, for what it’s worth. Recruiting has to be a part of the solution... I just don’t believe the assertion of many here who believe it’s the primary part.

We are pretty much in agreement. We can recruit with the top teams in our league. Not over night, but it can be built thru winning and providing a viable path to the NFL. But, based on my experience coaching baseball and soccer at the select level, It's hard to take a mid-level talented player and make him a 5 star talent. Side note, I have coached several players that have gone on to major SEC programs and I have seen the talent level it takes to succeed. Bottom line, ITS ABOUT THE JIMMYS AND THE JOES.

 

[RonJohn]

Bottom line, ITS ABOUT THE JIMMYS AND THE JOES.

How has that worked for Miami? It takes more than ONLY Jimmys and Joes.

 

[lv20gt]

Question: Was Dell McGee demoted at uga? Until 2018 he was assistant head coach and running backs coach. Since 2019 he's been run game coordinator and running backs coach.

Also, why has he been in pretty much the same position for 6 years and only just now being considered for a HC job? It would seem that an assistant of that caliber at a factory like uga would have been poached already. At least as an OC.

I think wiki might be a bit messed up. It has 2019 OC for UGA being Monken, but he wasn't hired until a jan 2020.

Anyways, Coley was the OC in 2019 but relieved of his play calling duties after a mediocre year. He then became the assistant head coach. It is not presented as a promotion. I would guess that forced McGee out of that spot and so he became run game coordinator. My guess is that it wasn't really a demotion but just shuffling titles around.

To your second question, I would guess he has been considered for a HC job at a lower level but has passed on it. Why? Well, he's making 800k which is on par with what we are paying Long, so I think it's likely that he wants to stay at a good position until he gets something that is a clear upgrade which he may not view a D2 head coaching job or even OC at many places.

 

[stigs02jrt]

How has that worked for Miami? It takes more than ONLY Jimmys and Joes.

How has that worked for Bama, Georgia, OSU, ND, Michigan, Clemson, LSU, Oregon, Penn State, USC, Oklahoma etc. the past 10 years?

 

[tomknight]

....

Deion will fill seats and bring 4 stars in year 1. Success is not his biggest recruiting tool. It's his name. Will he leave after 4 years? Maybe, but that would mean he did well and tech might be a more desirable coaching destination for the next hire.
....

why do you keep saying this? what evidence is there of this? are you gonna say he's friends with rappers and movie stars, so that automatically takes us to the football nirvana?

i don't get it. he can't sell at GT what he sells at JSU.

 

[jgtengineer]

Paul could have had more. He was his own worst enemy.

Doubtful, the people her were against him were against in in 2008 and never thawed.

 

[RonJohn]

How has that worked for Bama, Georgia, OSU, ND, Michigan, Clemson, LSU, Oregon, Penn State, USC, Oklahoma etc. the past 10 years?

Have those schools had ONLY recruiting? Or have they also paid for and had top notch coaching?

The mutts were in the top ten recruiting under Richt. They were in the discussion frequently, but they always failed at some point. Is there any chance that the reason they failed is that they didn't have discipline, and they didn't have coaches that could get them ready for a game without special uniforms? Now they have bumped their recruiting up a little bit, but the biggest thing I have noticed is that every player does what he is supposed to do. They don't have 5 star athletes running around the field trying to make Sports Center top ten. They have 5 star athletes that do what coaches instructed them to do, and they are in the correct place at the correct time for their 5 star abilities to make a real difference. Under Richt, they were making 5 star athlete tackles and beating their chest like they just won the game, when in fact they were losing by double digits to a non P5 team and the tackle was after a 20 yard first down run. As much as it bothers me, those 5 star athletes now do what they are supposed to do, and coaches instruct them what to do and prepare them very well for the games.

 

[stigs02jrt]

why do you keep saying this? what evidence is there of this? are you gonna say he's friends with rappers and movie stars, so that automatically takes us to the football nirvana?

i don't get it. he can't sell at GT what he sells at JSU.

rappers and movie stars? LOL, is that his selling point to get kids to play in Jackson, MS?

Maybe you don't understand this yet, but Deion has become a phenomenon in the black community because of what he's doing at JSU. Maybe the biggest black hero in CFB right now? If he came to the capital of black America, the town where he became a superstar, to the school that graduates the most black engineers, you don't think the players will come here? You don't think he could "sell" that?

Well then I guess we disagree.

 

[ilovetheoption]

fundamentally the “pitch man” is just not the same since it’s a pass play.

at the end of the day it is all semantics but this was something we lacked with paul johnson’s offense and should have have been implemented. i just don’t think our qbs outside of thomas were consistent enough passers to run anything like this

It's exactly the same