New regime goal posts

[bass ackwards]

We should stay with the bright yellow ones.

 

[LibertyTurns]

Didn’t the championship game feature two true Freshman QBs last year. Isn’t Clemp’s Lawrence a freshman? Why the hell can’t any GT player excel in his first year? Certainly after a year riding the pine you should have gotten smarter, stronger, etc. Didn’t Lil’ Joe play as a freshman. We act like some of this stuff is impossible. We ran what man to consider a limited offense. Now we’re running something different it should not only be new but better. Why would you trade new for worse? Woody regressed the D. Certainly we should expect a better D, correct? Everything lines up for the winnable games we should win. We’ll lose Clemp, etc. The toss up games are still toss ups. With better conditioning, etc we should be able to win one of the 50-50 games that didn’t go out way.

I can’t believe we’re talking about losing to Citadel and Temple. Crazy. Do some of you think we hired a moron and a staff of idiots?

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

Yes, maybe, or maybe not. Ross won 2 games the first year at Tech and 3 the second. Many here have said the transition to a new offensive scheme using players who were recruited to another scheme will take time, and I can believe that.


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It’s still football. We aren’t yanking players off the b-ball court and suiting them up. The transition shouldn’t be horrible. If it is we probably chose poorly.

I’ll tolerate 1 horrible year. Not two. One horrible followed by 6-6 ok. Third year better not be horrible again though. That would be less than mediocre results and I’ve been assured even mediocre isn’t acceptable.

 

[smokey_wasp]

Ultimately, I want 6-7 wins to be the floor, 8-9 to be the expectation, with the occasional 10 plus and I think all that is doable.

For the first couple of years, its tough to say. CGC is not inheriting a bunch of FCS scrubs as some have absurdly claimed. But he is inheriting a program that made bowls 2 of the last 4 years and is a game under .500 during that time. And the transition will be significant, though yes, some are overstating it. If we are around 6-6, 5-7 the first two years and there is an uptick in recruiting, I will say things are going well.

If we put up a couple of 4-8's with no improvement in recruiting rank, something will have gone wrong.

 

[A Love Supreme]

I definitely expect Collins to graduate players at the same rate CPJ did. As a result I expect to average the same amount of wins per year.

 

[MWBATL]

I think when our OL aren't in a 3 point stance, weight ~75% forward, they will be a whole lot more effective at pass blocking. I don't think this is going to be as big an issue as y'all are making it out to be. A guy like Parker Braun will be effective in any scheme.

I think our O Line pass blocking has been unfairly maligned the last couple of years. First of all, MOST teams have quick, short passes in their playbook and rarely throw the bomb. All we do is 5 step drops and wait for our receivers to "go deep". Most O lines in college can't pass pro when the other team KNOWS that's what the play is going to be. I suspect we will find the pass pro is much better when we incorporate a short passing game with three step drops and a quick throw.

 

[Animal02]

It’s still football. We aren’t yanking players off the b-ball court and suiting them up. The transition shouldn’t be horrible. If it is we probably chose poorly.

I’ll tolerate 1 horrible year. Not two. One horrible followed by 6-6 ok. Third year better not be horrible again though. That would be less than mediocre results and I’ve been assured even mediocre isn’t acceptable.

Outside of another injury filled disaster, we should not fall below .500

 

[Campbeae]

Over a ten year window

1 big bowl game/CFP
3 trips to ACC championship game
Consistently in top 3/4 of ACC coastal
6-6 or better record in all years

This is generally what we have been able to accomplish over three last 3 decades

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

So the consensus thus far seems to be to do about as well, maybe a tad better, than the last guy.

Is everyone now accept mediocrity or have only the pragmatists chimes in?

Clear to me. Why have all those who previously screamed about embracing mediocrity refused to chime in? Has pragmatism finally dawned on them?

 

[LibertyTurns]

@Whiskey_Clear They’re missing a pair. That situation always presents itself when it’s time to make a decision.

 

[RonJohn]

Why have all those who previously screamed about embracing mediocrity refused to chime in? Has pragmatism finally dawned on them?

It is hard to win an internet "argument" when you actually use logic and reasoning. The way you win an internet "argument" is to scream very loudly about a single out of context "fact" that supports your position. Then an hour later when that same "fact" doesn't support your position, you scream very loudly about a different out of context "fact" and ignore all reference to your previous statements.

 

[RamblinRed]

My expectation for next year is to be 6-6 +-1. Yr 2 could easily be worse than yr 1 due to scheduling.

Starting yr 3 I will start really paying attention and deciding how things are going (sort of like the basketball team where Yr 4 and 5 have to be the payoffs).

Long term I largely expect what we have had for the last 20+ years. Hopefully slightly better but i'll be surprised if its alot better.

i think both 'sides' are purposely underplaying the other side to push their argument up.
This was not a very good offense this year. The last 4 games it avg 277 ypg and 4.7 ypp. Basically whenever this offense played a team with a competent defense it struggled, alot. it's numbers are largely puffed up due to a handful of outlier games against awful defenses. Without significant help from the defense or ST it was basically unable to score more than 21 pts against any solid defense. It's ypp and ypg against P5 opponents are better than only the 2015 year. GT's defense this year was arguably the worst of Johnson's tenure - worst ypp allowed, worst 3 down conversion allowed - basically its only saving grace was TO's.

I would take 7-5 next season right now, because frankly I don't think the program was headed in an overly positive direction, I think it was just treading water. GT is sub .500 against Coastal teams over the last 5 years (5th best winning % in Coastal games amongst 7 teams), it is sub .500 against P5 teams during that same period and actually extending back the last 9 years (48-52, i'm including BYU and ND as P5 teams). Using T-FR QB playing in the playoffs is also a red herring. Those were the top ranked QB's in their classes - GT has nothing remotely approaching that. It has some good young talent that is going to need time to improve both their skills and gain experience.

Those selling this as being a complete rebuild are also off. Other than 2015 this team has been competitive, though missing 2 bowls in 3 years was not a great look. If GT was to drop to 2-3-4 wins that would start to worry me. There is enough here imo to be competitive with Coastal teams from day 1, though probably not talented enough to win the Coastal (something GT hasn't done in the last 4 years). If GT was to win 8 next year I don't think that would be a miraculous job by Collins, just a very good one.

Johnson isn't retiring and leaving this program in the toilet - he is also not leaving it in the penthouse. He is leaving it as a very mediocre P5 program with so-so talent (not the big influx of talent that Johnson was able to inherit). It loses 5 starters on offense and 7 on defense from its last few games, so while there isn't a huge SR class, it is almost all in starting positions. There is very little 'proven' talent coming back.

I've always been a pragmatist and one who believes in looking hard at the numbers. To me looking at the results, looking at what is coming back, looking at the last 1/2 decade this has been a mediocre program that doesn't feel like it is likely to improve from that in 1 or 2 years. i think it takes at least 3 to start getting above the baseline we are at now. Whether Collins will be the coach to do that I have no idea, I hope he does, but we will only know that after 3-4 years imo. Anything before that is likely to be false positives or false negatives.

 

[knoxjacket]

Considering the previous coach didn’t get fired I don’t see any reason expectations should be any higher on CGC. That being said we should:

1) unless the coastal changes we should be competing for the title. The division is trash.

2) beat bad uga teams. I don’t expect us to beat ones like they had from 02-07 or the past two years, but when they are unranked we have to beat them.

3) don’t lose to crap OOC teams (MTSU, Kansas, Tennessee, USF, BYU, etc)

4) I’ll give a pass on year one but as long as we are in the coastal and play 2-3 crap teams OOC we shouldn’t have losing records.

 

[lv20gt]

Those selling this as being a complete rebuild are also off. Other than 2015 this team has been competitive, though missing 2 bowls in 3 years was not a great look.

What aspect of the team are we not rebuilding? We are certainly rebuilding the defense and completely changing offensive schemes.

 

[ibeattetris]

What aspect of the team are we not rebuilding? We are certainly rebuilding the defense and completely changing offensive schemes.

A rebuild is taking a historic 2-10 team and trying to make them consistently bowl eligible. CGC is taking a consistently bowl eligible team and changing the offense. The sky isn't falling. I am glad CGC isn't as negative about our team as some of our posters. The dude exudes positivity, try to keep up with Juice

Edit: or hell, a rebuild is Pastner coming in and being told it's acceptable if he doesn't win an ACC game. No one is telling CGC it's okay to 0-6 in the coastal.

 

[lv20gt]

A rebuild is taking a historic 2-10 team and trying to make them consistently bowl eligible. CGC is taking a consistently bowl eligible team and changing the offense. The sky isn't falling. I am glad CGC isn't as negative about our team as some of our posters. The dude exudes positivity, try to keep up with Juice

Edit: or hell, a rebuild is Pastner coming in and being told it's acceptable if he doesn't win an ACC game. No one is telling CGC it's okay to 0-6 in the coastal.

So what aspects of the team are we not rebuilding? We've basically spent the last decade building the program entirely around the offensive scheme, and it was the one thing that was mostly keeping us bowl eligible, when we were. Now that we are changing that...

 

[Animal02]

So what aspects of the team are we not rebuilding? We've basically spent the last decade building the program entirely around the offensive scheme, and it was the one thing that was mostly keeping us bowl eligible, when we were. Now that we are changing that...

So are you saying it is acceptable to be sub .500 for the next couple of years?

 

[deeznats]

So are you saying it is acceptable to be sub .500 for the next couple of years?

It's not acceptable, but when you consider we played Alcorn St and Bowling Green this year and barely finished above .500, it seems within the realm of possibility.

Personally, I hope we show immediate improvement. But I'll be happy if the program shows progress including better defense, better recruiting, ability to do more than run the ball, more fan engagement, better media relations, etc

 

[lv20gt]

So are you saying it is acceptable to be sub .500 for the next couple of years?

I'm asking what aspects of the team are we not rebuilding?

 

[ibeattetris]

It's not acceptable, but when you consider we played Alcorn St and Bowling Green this year and barely finished above .500, it seems within the realm of possibility.

Personally, I hope we show immediate improvement. But I'll be happy if the program shows progress including better defense, better recruiting, ability to do more than run the ball, more fan engagement, better media relations, etc

We have Temple, Citadel, and USF next year. I expected us to beat USF this year and I expect us to beat them next. I was severely disappointed in CPJ and our team for that loss, I will not be pleased (though I'd be more okay with is) if CGC fails to. So there is three wins.

I expect us to go at least 3-3 in the coastal because that is the low bar that I find acceptable. We've done at least that good for decades, and we have a team that went 4-2 in this same group last time. That takes us to 6.

From UGA and Clemson I'd be tickled pink if we found it in us to take one, but I don't expect it.

That leaves NC State. They lose their NFL qb and I expect them to regress. I still think they give us a struggle.

That has us 6-6 with a bowl game to get us to 7. I expect 7. I will accept 5-7 if the losses make sense or even 3-9 if we catch the injury bug (2015 ). My expectation remains 7+ wins.

Anyone who thinks we will do worse can try to explain their reasoning. I am all ears.