Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[augustabuzz]

How short? Many will not play as freshmen.

Don't be surprised to see freshmen playing on the DL.

 

[stech81]

Don't be surprised to see freshmen playing on the DL.

It's not the players it's bad coaching or lack of coaching . This coaching staff can't make in game adjustments .

 

[ibeattetris]

I have no idea where to find 3 & out data, but the number of punts ought to be correlated to some degree.

You can use bcftoys for that

BCF Toys - 2021 OFEI Ratings

www.bcftoys.com

The "OFD" column is

First down rate (OFD) is the percentage of offensive drives that earn at least one first down.

, so 1 - OFD is the 3 and out rate.

First down rate:
2019: 0.504 (130)
2020: 0.658 (94)
2021: 0.714 (63)

2014: 0.864 (1)
2015: 0.711 (50)
2016: 0.694 (71)
2017: 0.667 (85)
2018: 0.768 (15)


There is another stat that is relevant, which is "punt per offensive score" which highlights the ratio of times we punt vs times we score.
Punt per score (lower is better)
2014: 0.4 (1)
2015: 1.0 (53)
2016: 0.8 (37)
2017: 1.1 (63)
2018: 0.6 (7)

2019: 3.0 (129)
2020: 1.3 (100)
2021: 1.0 (67)

 

[ibeattetris]

It would be interesting to add turnovers into that equation as well to get a total for each year. I would assume that we had fewer turnovers back then, but could be wrong.

We are ranked 33 in our turnover rate. I don't think its a key limiting factor for this team (though the timing of them has been poor).

 

[augustabuzz]

It's not the players it's bad coaching or lack of coaching . This coaching staff can't make in game adjustments .

Our DL coaching is top notch. Look somewhere else.

 

[bobongo]

Our DL coaching is top notch. Look somewhere else.

Our rushing defense has been pretty decent on the whole. Spotty at times, but the DL has gotten plenty enough stops to be effective. It's that horrible pass defense that's killing us. Third and long has become our worst down. We shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Not all of the coaching has been bad.

 

[g0lftime]

I can tell you that when a team is going good, they get a lot of sidewalk fans. Everywhere I go I see Gagger stuff this year. And Braves fans that can’t tell the difference between an out and a hit.

Do you ever notice that the better a team gets on a national level ( College or pro) the larger the decal gets on their car.

 

[stech81]

Our rushing defense has been pretty decent on the whole. Spotty at times, but the DL has gotten plenty enough stops to be effective. It's that horrible pass defense that's killing us. Third and long has become our worst down. We shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Not all of the coaching has been bad.

Do most agree our defense is bad , And we need a new DC . if you get a new DC ( which we won't) and you want a good DC than he needs the opportunity to pick his assistant coaches . if he interviews the ones we have and wants to keep them find. But the fact is and get use to it we will not get a new DC cause CGC wants a puppet he can make him do want he wants. All problems start and finish with CGC

Also we rank 91 in rushing defense if that is ok then well ....

 

[slugboy]

We are ranked 33 in our turnover rate. I don't think its a key limiting factor for this team (though the timing of them has been poor).

It would be interesting to add turnovers into that equation as well to get a total for each year. I would assume that we had fewer turnovers back then, but could be wrong.

If you go back 5 or so years, you still get turnovers. They’re fumbles, instead.
Time of possession would be something to look at.

 

[bobongo]

Also we rank 91 in rushing defense if that is ok then well ....

But how many tackles have been missed by the linebackers and secondary, leading to long runs? They could have gotten a little help back there. I misstated when I said our rushing defense has been decent, but I don't think that's on the DL. I think our DL has been quite decent on the whole.

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

It's a chicken and egg situation. The biggest reason for the decline in attendance everywhere is the fact that (almost) all games are televised. The biggest detriment to in-person atmosphere is the seemingly endless TV timeouts.

Many a time at BDS and especially at Florida Field I was barely restrained from bringing a gun and shooting that guy in the red hat. For some reason, it SEEMED like the timeouts were longer and more frequent at Florida games which may have been due to opposing coaches trying to slow down the "Fun and Gun". The Gator Bowl games with UGA were the absolute worst and was the one thing every fan agreed on. The sight of that guy coming on the field would elicit a near audible sigh from fans at the game.

 

[Pointer]

I thought I made the point I intended, but, to use your example, during the Johnson years of 2015-2018 we averaged about 4 punts per game. This year, through ten games, we are averaging 4.5 punts. Yes, it is certainly an increase, but the data do not support your point.

I have no idea where to find 3 & out data, but the number of punts ought to be correlated to some degree.

# of punts
2015 46
2016 47
2017 50
2018 35

2021 45

We have games coming up against much better defensive teams so we may punt 7-8 times in one or both of those games.

Yes but the possession time and number of turnovers makes a big difference as well.

 

[jojatk]

Do most agree our defense is bad , And we need a new DC . if you get a new DC ( which we won't) and you want a good DC than he needs the opportunity to pick his assistant coaches . if he interviews the ones we have and wants to keep them find. But the fact is and get use to it we will not get a new DC cause CGC wants a puppet he can make him do want he wants. All problems start and finish with CGC

Also we rank 91 in rushing defense if that is ok then well ....

What evidence is the "puppet" assertion based on? I haven't thought that the problem was Thacker being a "puppet" but rather he just isn't getting the job done. I have no idea one way or the other so that's why I'm asking. Frankly if Thacker were a puppet I'd be expecting our defense to play better because at least Collins has a decent history as a DC. So the fact that we are playing so poorly, to me, points in the opposite direction. But I care less about being right than about understanding the issues and hoping they get corrected.

Don't be surprised to see freshmen playing on the DL.

As for the DL, I would argue that it was the defensive position group that had the most challenging build when our new staff came in. I feel like, while we may not have been deep in the secondary and even at the LB position, we had some good athletes who could play. On the DL I felt like we were too small and had too few guys who could make a difference (not saying we had none, just saying we were VERY low on those guys). We already play a bunch of freshmen on the DL.

 

[BuzzStone]

I stand by what I said. If lack of wins keeps you from coming to the game when you would otherwise be there, then you are a fan of winning.

And I haven't seen anything close to "constantly **** on your fans"

I can appreciate a man that doubles down even when he knows he is beat.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

I can appreciate a man that doubles down even when he knows he is beat.

Standing on principle isn't doubling down. I realize most of this world doesn't value loyalty like I do, but that doesn't mean I will compromise the value of the principle to fit in with people I disagree with.

If you believe loyalty is conditional, then we will just have to disagree.

 

[BuzzStone]

Standing on principle isn't doubling down. I realize most of this world doesn't value loyalty like I do, but that doesn't mean I will compromise the value of the principle to fit in with people I disagree with.

If you believe loyalty is conditional, then we will just have to disagree.

You keep making baseless claims. No one in this thread other than you has said loyalty is conditional. My attendance is. I am still a fan. I won't sell my GT gear and support the mutts. You are just making false claims trying to prove a point that is just invalid.

 

[augustabuzz]

What evidence is the "puppet" assertion based on? I haven't thought that the problem was Thacker being a "puppet" but rather he just isn't getting the job done. I have no idea one way or the other so that's why I'm asking. Frankly if Thacker were a puppet I'd be expecting our defense to play better because at least Collins has a decent history as a DC. So the fact that we are playing so poorly, to me, points in the opposite direction. But I care less about being right than about understanding the issues and hoping they get corrected.


As for the DL, I would argue that it was the defensive position group that had the most challenging build when our new staff came in. I feel like, while we may not have been deep in the secondary and even at the LB position, we had some good athletes who could play. On the DL I felt like we were too small and had too few guys who could make a difference (not saying we had none, just saying we were VERY low on those guys). We already play a bunch of freshmen on the DL.

Did you notice the size of the incoming FR DL? Have you watched Tarber's film? What are you referring to with "puppet"?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

You keep making baseless claims. No one in this thread other than you has said loyalty is conditional. My attendance is. I am still a fan. I won't sell my GT gear and support the mutts. You are just making false claims trying to prove a point that is just invalid.

Reread the posts. To whit:

If you don't win, then constantly **** on your fans, how could a real fan continue to financially support that? I will not be making the drive from SC until something changes.

I will take some winning, some improvement, some acting like you care, but something has to change.

No. At the end of the day football is entertainment. If it stops being entertaining then people stop attending. That doesn’t make them bad fans, that makes them people that realize that life is short, and spending half your weekend doing something that has a net negative effect on your life is a poor decision.

All of these are examples of conditional loyalty.

 

[slugboy]

Do most agree our defense is bad , And we need a new DC . if you get a new DC ( which we won't) and you want a good DC than he needs the opportunity to pick his assistant coaches . if he interviews the ones we have and wants to keep them find. But the fact is and get use to it we will not get a new DC cause CGC wants a puppet he can make him do want he wants. All problems start and finish with CGC

Also we rank 91 in rushing defense if that is ok then well ....

• Do most agree our defense is bad? Oh, yeah, it's bad.
• And we need a new DC? Maybe. We know the defense is bad. We know there are missed assignments and missed tackles and problems in coverage. Does it get better if we replace Thacker? He might be the cause of our problems, but he might not be. Maybe there's a problem with a couple of assistants. I've seen a lot of turnover at DC--especially at GT--not solve anything. We need to change something, and probably several somethings, but we should change the right things, and none of us in the stands knows what the cause actually is. We just see the results.
• if you get a new DC ( which we won't) and you want a good DC than he needs the opportunity to pick his assistant coaches . if he interviews the ones we have and wants to keep them find. But the fact is and get use to it we will not get a new DC cause CGC wants a puppet he can make him do want he wants. All problems start and finish with CGC So, the HC only hires two people-- the OC and the DC-- and they hire and manage everyone else? There should be some room in the middle there--the HC is in charge of building an entire team, and you want the offense and defense to fit together. Also, you're making a lot of assumptions there. Some of them may be true. I don't think all of them are, or it's as simple a fix as you try to lay out.

 

[stech81]

What evidence is the "puppet" assertion based on? I haven't thought that the problem was Thacker being a "puppet" but rather he just isn't getting the job done. I have no idea one way or the other so that's why I'm asking. Frankly if Thacker were a puppet I'd be expecting our defense to play better because at least Collins has a decent history as a DC.

Go back to the interviews when they first came to Tech. ( This is no word for word) but when asked he said that CGC helps him on defense. If sees something he don't like he will tell him.