Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[UgaBlows]

Who exactly is Rev IbeeBallin?

A former GT LB (And a damned good one) and Rivals writer

 

[bke1984]

Where does GT stand today? That’s the million-dollar question. Undoubtedly, the easy answer is 3-7, soon to be 3-9. It’s easy to completely dismiss all progress in the effort to tar and feather the coaching staff. If, however, you’re willing to put down your pitchforks for a minute, I think we might be closer to turning the corner than we think.

When CPJ retired, my immediate reaction was that we needed to hire Monken or Coach N to come in and run the option. To me, the option had become part of Techs identity. People who followed football knew Tech was always a dangerous game BECAUSE of the option. It seemed like the safest route would be to simply pick a CPJ disciple and turn over the keys. Plug and Chug. 6–7-win seasons with a chance for a 9–10-win season every few years. That didn’t happen, and the more I thought about it, the better I felt about it.

Monken and Coach N are great coaches, but they are not CPJ. Hiring either one of them would have been a big step down from CPJ. Johnson was the true master of his offense. Monken and Coach N are good, but not that good. There’s also the fact that the pool of coaches in that offense is small. Finding replacements if the initial hire didn’t pan out wouldn’t be easy. The right answer is that we needed to rip the band-aid off and change the offense.

Now that GT had determined to change offenses, it was up to TStan to find a replacement. At the time, there weren’t many big names looking for a job, and to be frank, we probably couldn’t have afforded a big name anyways. It took TStan raiding the rainy-day fund to pay for the current coaching staff. There is also the very real fact that few coaches out there wanted anything to do with this rebuild. They knew it would be hard and coaches understand how fickle even a faithful fan base can be. TStan needed someone who was not only willing to come to GT but was willing to risk their future by taking on a massive rebuild. I was honestly surprised that Collins agreed. He was, at the time, among the hottest of the young new coaches being mentioned for any number of openings. Yet to GT he came, and for many, he was a breath of fresh air.

Here is where I confess, I was not a fan of Geoff Collins being hired at GT. I wanted Tony Elliott, but he elected to stay at Clemson. After the first few months, I was not a Collins fan. I found his underhand remarks about the old offense to be tiresome and borderline offensive, and I found, (and still find), his overuse of “elite” and “effort” to cheapen the meaning of the words. I cautioned then that his used car salesman persona would come back to bite him if he didn’t produce wins early. That has proven to be true. His “money down” and “juice crew” do not resonate with me. As I am in my mid 40’s, I just brushed this off as me getting older and not being in tune with the new cultural zeitgeist. I am aware, however, that I do not have to be a fan of the coach as a person. Barring moral failure issues, a coach’s personality does not have to align with mine for me to support him.

Collins has shown himself to be an excellent recruiter, and our talent level is increasing dramatically. I still have questions as to how far top 25 recruiting will take us when we play 4-6 teams every year who recruit in the top 15 on average, but there is no doubt we are recruiting at a level previously unseen on the flats. Given a couple more recruiting classes to build proper depth and class separation, I think he will have the level of talent necessary to make a run in the Coastal.

The real question is can he and his staff coach them into a winning team? For many of you, the answer is already a hard no, and I understand that. Given the record over the last three years, it’s easy to understand why a frustrated fanbase is ready to run the coaching staff out of town. I am not so sure we can accurately and fairly answer that question in the negative yet. Our offense, which was the hardest part to change, is showing signs of real improvement from 2019. We have good QB play from Sims, though he is still young and prone to mistakes. We have good to great WR play, and the best all around RB in the nation. Our OL, which was the biggest hurdle in the change, is still a work in progress, and is still the millstone around our neck. In my opinion, we are 1-2 years away from having the OL be the asset we need them to be. We should see major improvement next year, and by 2023 it should be forming into a well-oiled unit.

Special teams have seen massive improvement. We no longer fear field goals, we are putting kickoffs into the end zone, and our new punter is impressive for a freshman. There’s work to be done on the punt coverage and return units, but overall, we are vastly improved there.

The biggest failures for this staff have been in the following three areas: defense, penalties, and game/clock management.

Penalties are a killer, and in 2019 and 2020 could somewhat be excused due to a young team learning a completely new offense as well as a defense that is weary from being on the field all the time making mistakes. In 2021, we were promised that this was an area of focus, and initially, we saw progress. The last few games have seen a regression to stupid penalties again. While an occasional false start is understandable for an OL in training, the defensive penalties are simply inexcusable. While the coach cannot control how a defender acts on the field, this is an area that needs to be cleaned up immediately.

Game and clock management has likewise been atrocious. Having to burn timeouts because of confusion between the sideline and the QB has cost us. Not burning timeouts when we need to is another head scratcher. Questionable calls late in games are understandable for a new coach, and let’s all remember, Collins is only in year 5 as a HC. He is still learning. While it’s disconcerting to watch it happen to us, I remember when Dabo was a new HC he was often lambasted for poor game and clock management. This is another area that can be overcome.

Finally, we come to the defense, which I believe is the biggest issue we have as a team. I cannot in any way understand how Collins, who was a three-time Broyles award nominee as a defensive assistant coach, could allow our defense to get this bad. We are regressing as a defense, and that’s concerning. While I rarely if ever call for a coach to be fired, I see no scenario where Thacker comes back next season. If he does, I see a short future for CGC at GT.

So, to summarize, Georgia Tech football is approaching the crossroads. Collins needs to successfully navigate the next year and a half or else we will have a new coach and will likely set back the rebuilding process by at least another year or two. Can he get us there? I think he can. It will take wholesale changes to the defense, but that’s probably the easiest of the units to fix. Will he? That’s the question I can’t answer. The one thing I am sure of is we will all get to see him try in 2022. Let’s hope for the best.

My feelings have generally aligned with yours up until about the middle of this year. We differ in a few areas at this point.

I for one have a hard time excusing the game management stuff. This is a guy who has been around football for decades, and the clock management and timeout stuff is something that most avid football fans understand well enough to run circles around him right now. If he doesn’t have it figured out at this point then I’m not sure he ever will.

I also have a hard time seeing the progress in our offense. I think the majority of it can be attributed to a couple special players, which the staff deserves credit for. But even with the explosive plays our offense fails miserably in a few key metrics - first downs, red zone TDs, namely. I wish I could find 3 and out stats just to see where we are at, but I’m guessing it’s near the bottom of the NCAA. Leaning on the poor O line play is a convenient excuse at this time that is becoming a harder argument to support. We are a worse run team today than we were two years ago. That is concerning. It’s easy to point to the run heavy nature of our previous offense and say this should be the case, but given the difference in blocking schemes I don’t think that argument holds up. We also seemingly call plays at random or use statistics to decide plays without factoring in past performance of our team or even those same plays within the game we are currently playing. Mid game adjustments on the offensive side of the ball are non existent.

I don’t really want to talk about the defense.

But what frustrates me most is that we seem to have gotten worse as the season went on in pretty much every facet of the game. Defense is the most noticeable, but you mentioned penalties, and hell even our improved kicking game failed us when we needed it on Saturday.

I just don’t feel like it’s as simple as a few plays here or there. For example, if we stop BC I think we still lose 31-30 because we likely wouldn’t have been able to pick up a first down. If we make the XP we almost certainly lose with the new OT rules and our inability to convert. So basically all of those things need to get better just to get us to 5-6 wins. Then what?

I do agree that he’s here another year though, so we will see what happens. If we replace the DC I will renew season tickets and be there to see what happens. If he comes back then this thing is a runaway train bound for a bad ending and I will be watching from home for the first time in 24 years.

 

[Pointer]

To be fair, we're not getting blown off the field like we did his first 2 years as often. This year it has only been the Pitt game, although the next 2 games have "ugly" potential. I'm hoping that the team is close enough that a coordinator change can help the defence enough give the team confidence to learn how to win next year. Yes, in spite of some of the odd coaching decisions.

Again, acc down year has more to do with this then anything else.

 

[augustabuzz]

The Virginia game was pretty bad. Not exactly blown off the field, but the score doesn’t represent how they handled us. We were down 21 with less than four minutes to play and needed the onside to cut it to one score - then another onside to really have a chance at winning the game. 9 times out of 10 that game ends in a two score loss, so I don’t want to hang my hat on that one as us playing a one score game.

And yet, there we were on the last play of the game with a chance to tie. The game lasts 60 minutes and everyone of them count.

 

[stech81]

Any chance that CGC is Catholic and ND would want him after the game.

 

[bobongo]

Any chance that CGC is Catholic and ND would want him after the game.

Might be some chance of the former, but the latter would require a Papal Intercession.

 

[bke1984]

And yet, there we were on the last play of the game with a chance to tie. The game lasts 60 minutes and everyone of them count.

Yeah, in spite of not doing something right. First, we didn’t get the stop. Second, the moment the BC QB crossed the line to gain everyone should have moved out of the way to let him score. But we actually tried to tackle him. Our only hope at that point was for them to score so we could have a chance to score and tie.

Then yeah, we had the chance. And what did we do? We moved the ball 10 yards before completely falling apart. At crunch time.

The TEAM does not know how to win. We look lost when it matters. The coach leads the team and is ultimately responsible.

 

[UgaBlows]

Again, acc down year has more to do with this then anything else.

Clemson is down, everyone else is roughly the same imo

 

[augustabuzz]

Yeah, in spite of not doing something right. First, we didn’t get the stop. Second, the moment the BC QB crossed the line to gain everyone should have moved out of the way to let him score. But we actually tried to tackle him. Our only hope at that point was for them to score so we could have a chance to score and tie.

Then yeah, we had the chance. And what did we do? We moved the ball 10 yards before completely falling apart. At crunch time.

The TEAM does not know how to win. We look lost when it matters. The coach leads the team and is ultimately responsible.

I was responding to the post about the UVA game.

 

[SOWEGA Jacket]

My feelings have generally aligned with yours up until about the middle of this year. We differ in a few areas at this point.

I for one have a hard time excusing the game management stuff. This is a guy who has been around football for decades, and the clock management and timeout stuff is something that most avid football fans understand well enough to run circles around him right now. If he doesn’t have it figured out at this point then I’m not sure he ever will.

I also have a hard time seeing the progress in our offense. I think the majority of it can be attributed to a couple special players, which the staff deserves credit for. But even with the explosive plays our offense fails miserably in a few key metrics - first downs, red zone TDs, namely. I wish I could find 3 and out stats just to see where we are at, but I’m guessing it’s near the bottom of the NCAA. Leaning on the poor O line play is a convenient excuse at this time that is becoming a harder argument to support. We are a worse run team today than we were two years ago. That is concerning. It’s easy to point to the run heavy nature of our previous offense and say this should be the case, but given the difference in blocking schemes I don’t think that argument holds up. We also seemingly call plays at random or use statistics to decide plays without factoring in past performance of our team or even those same plays within the game we are currently playing. Mid game adjustments on the offensive side of the ball are non existent.

I don’t really want to talk about the defense.

But what frustrates me most is that we seem to have gotten worse as the season went on in pretty much every facet of the game. Defense is the most noticeable, but you mentioned penalties, and hell even our improved kicking game failed us when we needed it on Saturday.

I just don’t feel like it’s as simple as a few plays here or there. For example, if we stop BC I think we still lose 31-30 because we likely wouldn’t have been able to pick up a first down. If we make the XP we almost certainly lose with the new OT rules and our inability to convert. So basically all of those things need to get better just to get us to 5-6 wins. Then what?

I do agree that he’s here another year though, so we will see what happens. If we replace the DC I will renew season tickets and be there to see what happens. If he comes back then this thing is a runaway train bound for a bad ending and I will be watching from home for the first time in 24 years.

This is where I fall. Right now has nothing to do with CPJ or Elliott or Monken. It has nothing to do with a play here or there or a turnover. It has nothing to do with recruiting. It has nothing to do with year 1 or year 2. It has to do with the coaching. I’ve stated I now judge Collins on 60:00 to 0:00. I actually don’t mind the marketing and some of the rah rah stuff. But that doesn’t matter. What we’ve seen in year 3 from 60:00 to 0:00 is a total failure of coaching. Period. You bring in another coach and this team has the players to win 7-8 games. What we’ve seen in 3 years of his coaching can’t be fixed. He is what he is. Our only decision is how much do we want to pay in buyout?

 

[Pointer]

Guys I just found the fine print on this season's campaign. It all makes so much sense. He got us good.

Spoiler: Win 21

 

[GTcanWINagain]

My feelings have generally aligned with yours up until about the middle of this year. We differ in a few areas at this point.

I for one have a hard time excusing the game management stuff. This is a guy who has been around football for decades, and the clock management and timeout stuff is something that most avid football fans understand well enough to run circles around him right now. If he doesn’t have it figured out at this point then I’m not sure he ever will.

I also have a hard time seeing the progress in our offense. I think the majority of it can be attributed to a couple special players, which the staff deserves credit for. But even with the explosive plays our offense fails miserably in a few key metrics - first downs, red zone TDs, namely. I wish I could find 3 and out stats just to see where we are at, but I’m guessing it’s near the bottom of the NCAA. Leaning on the poor O line play is a convenient excuse at this time that is becoming a harder argument to support. We are a worse run team today than we were two years ago. That is concerning. It’s easy to point to the run heavy nature of our previous offense and say this should be the case, but given the difference in blocking schemes I don’t think that argument holds up. We also seemingly call plays at random or use statistics to decide plays without factoring in past performance of our team or even those same plays within the game we are currently playing. Mid game adjustments on the offensive side of the ball are non existent.

I don’t really want to talk about the defense.

But what frustrates me most is that we seem to have gotten worse as the season went on in pretty much every facet of the game. Defense is the most noticeable, but you mentioned penalties, and hell even our improved kicking game failed us when we needed it on Saturday.

I just don’t feel like it’s as simple as a few plays here or there. For example, if we stop BC I think we still lose 31-30 because we likely wouldn’t have been able to pick up a first down. If we make the XP we almost certainly lose with the new OT rules and our inability to convert. So basically all of those things need to get better just to get us to 5-6 wins. Then what?

I do agree that he’s here another year though, so we will see what happens. If we replace the DC I will renew season tickets and be there to see what happens. If he comes back then this thing is a runaway train bound for a bad ending and I will be watching from home for the first time in 24 years.

I ditto your decision on season ticket renewal. This is 32 years for me. I am 99% sure that I am letting my Club Seats go and may just grab some nosebleed seats in case it gets interesting at some point next year. However, I am not going to drop extra $$$ for better seats to bad football. No one - family or friends - want to watch GT play (& usually lose) as there has been nothing prominently on the line for 7 years now since the Orange Bowl. At least I got to see Dak get manhandled by the Jackets!

 

[Techster]

This may come as a surprise but I agree that golf and baseball have been our most successful programs for a long time. I follow our baseball program as much as a ten hour drive will allow. The women's programs needed to catch up and TStan did that by hiring new coaches who have taken them to the next level. Volleyball and basketball are currently ranked in the top 25. If you want to ignore that fact, I can say nothing to change your mind. When Pastner's future looked dim, TStan stood by him when lots of people thought GT should let him go, with cause.

I am not happy with the losses the football team is piling up and I agree that Collins has been a disappointment thus far. Maybe TStan will have to make a tough financial decision about Collins' future very soon. But, the success or failure of the football team is not the only thing the AD is responsible for. If you look across the board there is a well functioning and successful athletic association. Remaining angry at our AD for making the decision to hire Collins when we do not know the circumstances is pointless anger.

In what world and in what posts does it seem like I'm angry at TStan? All I did was point out that some of our programs have been doing well regardless of what AD is was at the helm and somehow that translated to my being angry at TStan? That's a quite a leap to make, but OK. I literally commended him for hiring a great women's basketball coach...but keep ignoring that because I didn't comment on women's volleyball being top 25 as well. I made another statement "TStan will get to make the next football HC hire because he's earned enough capital with donors and most fans..." that insinuates TStan is doing a good job in other areas that he'll get a pass on CGC if it doesn't work out. I'm not trying to be mean, but it seems you're stretching a bit in trying to make a point I've made if you actually read what I wrote.

The fact is, the non revenue sports programs at GT have always had success...and you can say their success has been more consistent than our men's "revenue" programs. That's the men's and women's side. That's across several ADs. That's not a slight to TStan, that's just a fact.

 

[Bonaire41]

This is where I fall. Right now has nothing to do with CPJ or Elliott or Monken. It has nothing to do with a play here or there or a turnover. It has nothing to do with recruiting. It has nothing to do with year 1 or year 2. It has to do with the coaching. I’ve stated I now judge Collins on 60:00 to 0:00. I actually don’t mind the marketing and some of the rah rah stuff. But that doesn’t matter. What we’ve seen in year 3 from 60:00 to 0:00 is a total failure of coaching. Period. You bring in another coach and this team has the players to win 7-8 games. What we’ve seen in 3 years of his coaching can’t be fixed. He is what he is. Our only decision is how much do we want to pay in buyout?

All of our coaches are to blame. It’s Collins Thacker Key Choice Coleman Burton Knight P nut Popovich Dixion Wieshian and strength coach. U realize that position coaches does most of the coaching. The fact is we have mostly young coaches on this staff and other than Collins and key we have very little experience coaching on a power five level and that’s mostly part of the problem. Others experienced coaches are at scheming us and our coaches are not experienced to adjust to it.

 

[Jetdrive3]

It is my belief that some quality former head coaches might be willing to look at the players in place and committed and be willing to right the ship. Hmmm, A chance to properly utilize Gibbs( etc.) and correctly be able to tout getting Gibbs to NY as a Heisman finalist? The caveat is that a coach must be confident in his abilities to recruit coaches that can replace him. An important trait of a leader in sports, business, military etc is a willingness to risk the abyss of growth! It remains to be seen here. The current OC and DC are no threat!

 

[Techster]

All of our coaches are to blame. It’s Collins Thacker Key Choice Coleman Burton Knight P nut Popovich Dixion Wieshian and strength coach. U realize that position coaches does most of the coaching. The fact is we have mostly young coaches on this staff and other than Collins and key we have very little experience coaching on a power five level and that’s mostly part of the problem. Others experienced coaches are at scheming us and our coaches are not experienced to adjust to it.

You leave Tashard Choice out of it. If he was in charge of the program, we'd have multiple 4 star players battling for playing time at every position and we'd be undefeated!

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

Clemson is down, everyone else is roughly the same imo

From last year or the last 3-4 years? VT is definitely down. FSU is down since their good coach left for the SEC (Maybe it is more about coaching than recruiting ). Pitt and WF are significantly up. Duke keeps getting worse (That's Good!). GT is down the most of any team in the ACC. The ACC is much worse now than 3-4 years ago. Not much sameness going on IMO

 

[Bonaire41]

You leave Tashard Choice out of it. If he was in charge of the program, we'd have multiple 4 star players battling for playing time at every position and we'd be undefeated!

I like choice and like a few others on the staff but just saying he like some of the others lacks the coaching experience right now. There taking their lumps right now but when they get more in game experience on a power 5 level coaches they will better understand how to adjust too them. We need to realize the coaches are learning just like the players are. The players know that and that’s why they have not quit on the staff yet.

 

[GTcanWINagain]

Assuming we lose the next two, CGC's 9 wins in 36 games will tie Coach Alexander's 7 wins in 28 games 1929-1931.

Well, not quite. We had a couple of tie games in 30 & 31. Plus, Alexander won the National Championship in 1928.

We're living through the worst head coaching 3 yr record in Tech history.

Thanks to Stansbury not being proactive and doing a brilliant Homer Rice move…

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

You leave Tashard Choice out of it. If he was in charge of the program, we'd have multiple 4 star players battling for playing time at every position and we'd be undefeated!

I have watched the DE's and it seems like Marco Coleman is doing a decent job as well. Outside LB's I have not focused on so I am not sure how they are doing.