Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[Heisman's Ghost]

Rant warning:

A few years ago our former AD inferred that we should not expect to be uga or Bama or Clemson. That we should be content with 6-7 win seasons. Some of you were indignant. Right now we have a bunch of people longing for 7 win seasons to return. Those of you who shouted to the wind that we replace Chan Gailey, and then Paul Johnson, got your wish. Now you are wanting GT to eat another contract and hire someone else that you are likely to hate in 3-4 years. At some point it gets tiresome to hear. I am very disappointed with what I see on the field, but I have to live with the results or go elsewhere. To some extent it is easy for me. I am primarily a basketball guy. And I have fallen in love with a bunch of tall women on our volleyball team.

End (for now) of rant.

Anyone that thinks Coach Collins is going to be fired anytime in the near future is misinformed as to the realities of this program. Sure, LSU can fire a coach a couple of years removed from a national title, so can Florida dismiss a proven 8 or 9 game a season winner for perceived recruiting failures, and certainly just about any number of well heeled football factories dismiss a million dollar coach with a huge buyout for any reason BUT Georgia Tech does not do business like that. Well, not unless the coach's name happens to be Bill Lewis but that's another story.

 

[Vespidae]

I get that a lot of people enjoy talking about clothing, uniforms, catch phrases, et al. The evidence indicates that I am the "one off" on this and I am okay with that. Venting however is (imo) a waste of time. I think the program would benefit more if the same energy from were focused on problem solving. That (imo) is more valuable and interesting than the sweatshirt the coach wore to his presser. Again I really don't expect many to agree with my view point on this.

In theory, I agree with you. But you can't problem solve without a shared understanding of the problem and an absence of data. Neither Geoff nor TStan communicate with measures and milestones ... they speak in vague tones and honestly, we have no idea what TStan is or isn't happy with.

We simply don't know. What we do know is that Geoff's suit is two sizes too small.

 

[AlabamaBuzz]

Got a good night's sleep. I agree with the following points:

• CGC is obviously in over his head
• CGC seems to be more concerned about being loved by his "family", the team and coaches, than he does about winning (I believe he is far from a disciplinarian)
• CGC is not a good decision-maker consistently in game situations
• CGC is a better marketeer/salesman/recruiter than a "leader" of men
• Recruiting, at some point, will be impacted by what is happening on Saturdays
• GT is in a supremely difficult position, although there is enough money to change directions, if those with the $$ decide they want to do it
• We probably won't give up on CGC until year 5
• GT needs a practical, smart, tough HC who can, along with a great staff of innovators, out think the opponents' staff
• Fans/Alums are tired and in despair - less butts in seats is the obvious proof of that

My fear is that because the ACC is so bad, we will win 5=6 games next year, and this will buy CGC another 2-3 years. With that said, if that 5-6 wins somehow means the corner is being turned, of course, I would be happy. But, we will know when we play the best teams whether we are really turning the corner or not. We will also know by the number of poor coaching decisions through the season. We will also know by the improvement of the individual players. We will also know if the recruiting is staying where it must stay for this experiment to have limited success. (top 30) Without a few high end big nasties on the D-line, we are never going to be a 9-10 win team again, and that is true no matter the coach, unless we have some offensive system (I don't care which one) that can outscore good teams.

 

[Animal02]

Anyone that thinks Coach Collins is going to be fired anytime in the near future is misinformed as to the realities of this program. Sure, LSU can fire a coach a couple of years removed from a national title, so can Florida dismiss a proven 8 or 9 game a season winner for perceived recruiting failures, and certainly just about any number of well heeled football factories dismiss a million dollar coach with a huge buyout for any reason BUT Georgia Tech does not do business like that. Well, not unless the coach's name happens to be Bill Lewis but that's another story.

The only out is that GC is smart enough to see the writing on the wall.....that it would be better for him to jump ship to a lesser position and be employed for another 15-20 as opposed to holding out in the belief he can turn things, and risking never working over "recruiter" level in college ball.

 

[bke1984]

Well, not unless the coach's name happens to be Bill Lewis but that's another story.

Is it really that different? Can’t win, now hearing rumblings of players thinking he can’t coach? Sounds a hell of a lot like things did in 1995 doesn’t it?

 

[Jacket4Life]

Id bring Tenuta back as DC. But that's just me.

 

[bobongo]

Got a good night's sleep. I agree with the following points:

• CGC is obviously in over his head
• CGC seems to be more concerned about being loved by his "family", the team and coaches, than he does about winning (I believe he is far from a disciplinarian)
• CGC is not a good decision-maker consistently in game situations
• CGC is a better marketeer/salesman/recruiter than a "leader" of men
• Recruiting, at some point, will be impacted by what is happening on Saturdays
• GT is in a supremely difficult position, although there is enough money to change directions, if those with the $$ decide they want to do it
• We probably won't give up on CGC until year 5
• GT needs a practical, smart, tough HC who can, along with a great staff of innovators, out think the opponents' staff
• Fans/Alums are tired and in despair - less butts in seats is the obvious proof of that

My fear is that because the ACC is so bad, we will win 5=6 games next year, and this will buy CGC another 2-3 years. With that said, if that 5-6 wins somehow means the corner is being turned, of course, I would be happy. But, we will know when we play the best teams whether we are really turning the corner or not. We will also know by the number of poor coaching decisions through the season. We will also know by the improvement of the individual players. We will also know if the recruiting is staying where it must stay for this experiment to have limited success. (top 30) Without a few high end big nasties on the D-line, we are never going to be a 9-10 win team again, and that is true no matter the coach, unless we have some offensive system (I don't care which one) that can outscore good teams.

5 or 6 wins next year won't buy CGC another 2 or 3 years. That's what it was hoped we'd win this year. Next year's trajectory puts him at 7 wins, at least. At any rate, he'll be here next year so all we can do is hope for the best. I'm not confident, and hope is hanging by a thread.

 

[bobongo]

Id bring Tenuta back as DC. But that's just me.

Yeah.

 

[orientalnc]

Is it really that different? Can’t win, now hearing rumblings of players thinking he can’t coach? Sounds a hell of a lot like things did in 1995 doesn’t it?

Before I accept this as fact, I want to hear something more reliable than "rumblings" on a fan forum thread focused on firing the head coach. Maybe it's 100% true, but losing seasons can be the catalyst for negative comments that are based solely on personal feelings. If player morale is a real issue, Tstan and others will hear it and react to it.

In the mean time, the Volleybees are playing this afternoon at O'Keefe and the GTMBB is playing at McCamish.

 

[MWBATL]

Before I accept this as fact, I want to hear something more reliable than "rumblings" on a fan forum thread focused on firing the head coach. Maybe it's 100% true, but losing seasons can be the catalyst for negative comments that are based solely on personal feelings. If player morale is a real issue, Tstan and others will hear it and react to it.

True. And we will never hear about it except in rumblings on a fan forum. For those of us starved for information about what is going in inside the program and searching for a ray of hope, it is something to hold onto....

 

[bobongo]

Tech will never consistently compete with the factories, trying to be just like the factories. Being in downtown Atlanta is not the edge that the GC fans think it is.
The unique offense, the selling of the education to the 97% that will never make it in the NFL were the right direction. I have always thought that nationwide recruiting was another avenue.....but that takes $$$$.

I used to think we had to recruit nationally, but I've been pleasantly surprised by the recruiting, most of it local.
The coaching, however, has been a Halloween nightmare. I agree that we can't compete with the factories being just like them, but we can do a helluvalot better than this.

 

[bke1984]

GTMBB is playing at McCamish.

This season can’t get here soon enough.

But for now all my energy is on trick or treating with little ones and pouring my fandom into the Braves tonight.

 

[DavidStandingBear]

We are closer to being a service academy in 2021 than anyone in the top 10. That is for sure. I don’t think we could beat 2 of the academies this year. We might compete with Navy.

It will never be 1963 again, and most likely, never be 1990 again. I believed when Rad hired CPJ, he made a wonderfully self-aware decision. It seemed to be forward thinking, knowing where big boy CF was headed. It is sad to know he never got the all-in support that might have made the difference. Really tells you how good he actually is with the results he did get.

Now, we have decided to try and compete with the luxury factories although we have a football shack budget, not even taking into account we are a STEM school. Without a special head coach and staff, we are in for many, many lean years. I believe what we are seeing now will become closer to the norm, with a 6-7 win season the max we can hope for.

Yes in the glory days we were pretty much a service academy with our navy rotc program in the 40s and 50s but the 60s changed that. In the 40s all? students were navy rotc.

 

[DavidStandingBear]

We are closer to being a service academy in 2021 than anyone in the top 10. That is for sure. I don’t think we could beat 2 of the academies this year. We might compete with Navy.

It will never be 1963 again, and most likely, never be 1990 again. I believed when Rad hired CPJ, he made a wonderfully self-aware decision. It seemed to be forward thinking, knowing where big boy CF was headed. It is sad to know he never got the all-in support that might have made the difference. Really tells you how good he actually is with the results he did get.

Now, we have decided to try and compete with the luxury factories although we have a football shack budget, not even taking into account we are a STEM school. Without a special head coach and staff, we are in for many, many lean years. I believe what we are seeing now will become closer to the norm, with a 6-7 win season the max we can hope for.

Yes in the glory days we were pretty much a service academy with our navy rotc program in the 40s and 50s but the 60s changed that. In the 40s all? students were navy rotc.

Things half to change!!!!

well said

 

[DavidStandingBear]

Well, he is a good salesman, and just having a lot of $$ doesn’t make you wise automatically.

Well he dresses like a good salesman anyway

Agree, but I think the AD made his own bed and had to lie in it. Everyone had to be all in on this grand new experiment for it to work and that included jumping in on every aspect of the hype train.

Many on this site were skeptical but wanted to at least give this experiment a chance so they tolerated an unseemly and unprofessional amount of CPJ bashing.

The problem is where do we go from here. The new car smell has worn off and we have discovered we have over paid for a vehicle that didn’t have all the features we were promised. A new paint job won’t do it but how much of the engine needs changing? Or do we go back to the factory for a new model off the line that isn’t a lemon?

Sunk cost/loss is also a challenge for some of us. I STILL want CGC to succeed. But does my very yearning for this success put me in denial about what I am seeing on the field?

It's never about the personalities That's a smokescreen. It's about the bottom line. If you look at our past 3 coaches, there has been a large % of the fanbase who have turned on them. Gailey? Too bland. Johnson? Too surly. Collins? Too gimmicky. I am sure that you remember the vast amount of energy wasted on those debates when CCG and CPJ were here.

Johnson when he was winning and beating the Dawgs? Straight shooter, tell it like it is kind of guy. Cremins when he was an annual top 10-15 program? "Silver Haired Whacko". At the end of his career people were ssaying he lost focus, was distracted, wasn't keeping up with the game.

Collins could come out this week and do his best Saban/Bellicik (sp?) impersonation at his presser. It wouldn't matter if we get beat at Miami.

I can understand criticisms pertaining to strategies or X's and O's. But when people start going off the rails about what is said/not said, clothing, mannerisms, etc. I don't really care for that. Why? It is superficial and does nothing to move things forward. Coaches should be judged on their bottom line solely. Right now, I (and most everyone else) have serious concerns based on what I see. But i don't care what he chooses to wear or what he says in his pressers. Just win or at least convince me that things are moving forward at an adequate rate. Actually I see improvement from years 1 to 3. However the trend line slope is not very steep. Or at least not steep enough now to make us all feel good about the future.

 

[Skeptic]

... The new car smell has worn off and we have discovered we have over paid for a vehicle that didn’t have all the features we were promised. A new paint job won’t do it but how much of the engine needs changing? Or do we go back to the factory for a new model off the line that isn’t a lemon?

You have a way with words, my friend. Now, if you could coach a bit...

 

[DavidStandingBear]

"what he says at his pressers" ... what was it that he said about the fans in his latest presser?

 

[DavidStandingBear]

I have been going to games since the 70s and a season ticket holder for over 30 years. I liked the CPJ era and am a big fan of him, but was in full support of TS for hiring CGC. It seemed at the time that it was a way to energize the fan base, increase attendance and help us go to the next level. CGC got me excited about the new recruits that were coming in and things looked great. But it has become apparent that there is poor coaching at so many different levels that have been pointed out ad nauseum on here for the past year or so. And one of the reasons I supported him...to boost attendance.... has failed. Our crowds now are noticeably smaller that they were under CPJ or any coach I can remember. Of course that is because fans want to win and that ain’t happening. And unfortunately, the schedule is not getting any easier.
But look on the bright side, “the players are elite, they understand the culture and they play at a high level each and every play”...

yes but as CGC says we have to play other elite teams every week! .... so coaching will be our only advantage?

 

[JPaul]

Won't happen this year or even next year. Coach Collins has a big decision to make: Yates or Sims? Sims has the bigger arm, is a better runner and better athlete but Yates MOVES the team and makes far quicker decisions. He can do what he wants as coach but if it were me, I would play Yates until his limitations start to show up which they didn't that drive. He showed in high school that he was a winner and he is showing it tonight. Good enough for me.

I agree wholeheartedly. If we have to sit there and watch a ‘team’ fiddle-fumble the game away, at least we can watch different players and maybe different coaches give it a try.

 

[DavidStandingBear]

Anyone that thinks Coach Collins is going to be fired anytime in the near future is misinformed as to the realities of this program. Sure, LSU can fire a coach a couple of years removed from a national title, so can Florida dismiss a proven 8 or 9 game a season winner for perceived recruiting failures, and certainly just about any number of well heeled football factories dismiss a million dollar coach with a huge buyout for any reason BUT Georgia Tech does not do business like that. Well, not unless the coach's name happens to be Bill Lewis but that's another story.

Well in 3 or 4 years he may evolve into being as good coach. We intentionally went for a coach that had no track record or relevant experience to speak of. So we're a coaching developmental program.