Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

cthenrys

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i mean we literally were competitive against every team that didn’t play ny6 this year. just couldn’t find the wins. we’ve been over this countless times and you continue to ignore it lol

i wish we stuck with the option after losing to duke 4/5 of johnson’s last 5 years. also loved watching us not get across the 50 against clemson until garbage time. that was great football.

the option and paul’s offense was basically done. it was time to move on. collins was the wrong hire. both things can be true.
Gather them morale victories and cherish em.... We recovered two onsides kicks to keep from being blown out of the house by UVA. Miami kept trying to give the game away and we couldn't even take the gift. If you think we were competitive against BC, then good on you... We lost our last 6 and looked like s**t doing it, but keep polishing that turd....
 

JacketFan137

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Gather them morale victories and cherish em.... We recovered two onsides kicks to keep from being blown out of the house by UVA. Miami kept trying to give the game away and we couldn't even take the gift. If you think we were competitive against BC, then good on you... We lost our last 6 and looked like s**t doing it, but keep polishing that turd....
“we made plays to make the game close against UVA but they don’t count cause i don’t like that!”

BC we had some QB play that would make reggie ball look like lamar jackson in comparison. sims wins that game

not polishing a turd i’m just saying that we aren’t as far off as some of the nancies on this page who want to pretend we are as they wallow and cry in their own misery for months and months this off-season.

like i have said in many threads: if collins is ousted in the next 5 minutes i won’t bat an eye and will go to sleep happy. i just think this situation is a lot more salvageable than people realize
 

JacketFan137

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No one acts like we were good in 2015, 2017, or 2018. We were firmly in the bad to mediocre category those three years. We WERE good in 2016.

Back it up or quit making **** up, posters like you ruin this forum.
calm down my man lol

2016 we didn’t even finish ranked although we were probably one of the first teams left out. we were hardly a special team though

and people literally say all the time they want to go back to the option. doesn’t take a deep dive to get there
 

cthenrys

Ramblin' Wreck
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942
Location
Highland Village, TX
“we made plays to make the game close against UVA but they don’t count cause i don’t like that!”

BC we had some QB play that would make reggie ball look like lamar jackson in comparison. sims wins that game

not polishing a turd i’m just saying that we aren’t as far off as some of the nancies on this page who want to pretend we are as they wallow and cry in their own misery for months and months this off-season.

like i have said in many threads: if collins is ousted in the next 5 minutes i won’t bat an eye and will go to sleep happy. i just think this situation is a lot more salvageable than people realize
my man... F+ rankings (I have no marriage to this ranking service but it's one that I could find for all years - am sure there are others)

2015 - 50
2016 - 45
2017 - 38
2018 - 61
2019 - 110
2020 - 89
2021 - 95

Seems pretty clear we have taken a pretty strong nose dive. We weren't a perennial top 30 team but also not a perennial bottom 30 team. We were not a competitive team last year and we showed no real evidence of a team about to turn the corner.
 

tmhunter52

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I think this is spot on. Another Moneyball quote sums this up nicely ...

“We’re not gonna compete with these teams that have big budgets. We’re gonna work with the constraints that we have and you’re gonna get out and do the best job that you can, recruiting new players. We’re not gonna pay 17 million dollars a year to players.” – Stephen Scott
Just daydreaming here. I wonder what Coach Long could do with two (or three) dual threat QBs in the backfield at the same time on occasion? It could be run and shoot, run and shoot and/or run and shoot! Maybe something new… LOL!
 

JacketFan137

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2,536
my man... F+ rankings (I have no marriage to this ranking service but it's one that I could find for all years - am sure there are others)

2015 - 50
2016 - 45
2017 - 38
2018 - 61
2019 - 110
2020 - 89
2021 - 95

Seems pretty clear we have taken a pretty strong nose dive. We weren't a perennial top 30 team but also not a perennial bottom 30 team. We were not a competitive team last year and we showed no real evidence of a team about to turn the corner.
definitely a step back but ultimately 50> is pretty much the same thing.

again, we were also a competitive team in every game but the NY6 teams and to deny this at this point is just blatantly ignoring reality in front of you in order to pursue your own personal narrative. these are still losses so at the end of the day it doesn’t mean much but please try to somewhat contextualize things before making these sweeping statements
 

WreckinGT

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my man... F+ rankings (I have no marriage to this ranking service but it's one that I could find for all years - am sure there are others)

2015 - 50
2016 - 45
2017 - 38
2018 - 61
2019 - 110
2020 - 89
2021 - 95

Seems pretty clear we have taken a pretty strong nose dive. We weren't a perennial top 30 team but also not a perennial bottom 30 team. We were not a competitive team last year and we showed no real evidence of a team about to turn the corner.
This is supported in FEI rankings as well which have fallen off a cliff. The most concerning thing to me is just how poorly we performed last year. Our ranking dropped or stayed level in nearly every offensive and defensive category from 2020. Plus punting went from 1st to 90th. It was a bit of a disaster statistically when things should have been improving.
 

cthenrys

Ramblin' Wreck
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942
Location
Highland Village, TX
definitely a step back but ultimately 50> is pretty much the same thing.

again, we were also a competitive team in every game but the NY6 teams and to deny this at this point is just blatantly ignoring reality in front of you in order to pursue your own personal narrative. these are still losses so at the end of the day it doesn’t mean much but please try to somewhat contextualize things before making these sweeping statements
No it's not.... 50 is not 110 or 95. C'mon man. We've literally been one of the worst P5 teams in the country under CGC with no sign of getting better (other than your eye test, I guess).
 

takethepoints

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be careful with that part about it working for a while. the TO cult loves to defend it like the last 4 years of it were the pinnacle of football
Well … perhaps the last six years, yes. I haven't seen anything like 2014 since the Joe ham days. I hope I'll see another year like that, but I'm not encouraged at present. May I be wrong!!
 

JacketFan137

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2,536
No it's not.... 50 is not 110 or 95. C'mon man. We've literally been one of the worst P5 teams in the country under CGC with no sign of getting better (other than your eye test, I guess).
the margins between the teams in the 50s and us is not that great. that’s what i’m trying to say. we were in competitive games with a lot of the teams above us.

we played poorly absolutely no doubt but i’m just saying the ship is not fully submerged yet. whether it’s collins or someone else i will continue to believe there is a possibility to turn this around going forward.

the defense i think is also very fixable and that was the thing we got dinged the most by far on in advanced metrics. hoping to see some improvement there. would be great if some other people would actually support the team too!
 

takethepoints

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5,930
It still works at some level - academies- but only seems to work if there is not a significant difference in athletes. Rules were changed to make blocking more difficult while at the same time relaxing holding for pass blocking.
I had no problem with us running it under PJ but I was also critical that we needed to pass more to keep defenses more honest. It is tough to recruit for it as well.
If I may, it wasn't a matter of keeping Ds honest. The option did that until the very end. Passing was useful as a surprise element; that's why we had such a large YPC. I think this was a problem for some of our QBs - Nesbitt, in particular. Paul had the QB he was waiting for to replace Thomas in Yates, but decided to resign instead.

Oh, and it wasn't "… relaxing holding for pass blocking." It was allowing holding for pass blocking. Blatant holding too boot. You have to almost tackle an opponent to be called for it these days. Which means, of course, that DLs do get tackled all the time without the OLs being called for it. It's Italian soccer.
 

cthenrys

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
942
Location
Highland Village, TX
the margins between the teams in the 50s and us is not that great. that’s what i’m trying to say. we were in competitive games with a lot of the teams above us.

we played poorly absolutely no doubt but i’m just saying the ship is not fully submerged yet. whether it’s collins or someone else i will continue to believe there is a possibility to turn this around going forward.

the defense i think is also very fixable and that was the thing we got dinged the most by far on in advanced metrics. hoping to see some improvement there. would be great if some other people would actually support the team too!
I'm with you on the hoping part. We all hope that we are better, but telling us all how things weren't all that much better before the last three years is just wrong. They were much, much better than what we have seen - this has been literally as bad as it could get. We cannot be worse.

Agree that the defense is fixable. The shame of it is we have the same DC who for some reason is still on staff. I think we are all scratching our heads at that decision by the HC - one of many.
 

JacketFan137

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If I may, it wasn't a matter of keeping Ds honest. The option did that until the very end. Passing was useful as a surprise element; that's why we had such a large YPC. I think this was a problem for some of our QBs - Nesbitt, in particular. Paul had the QB he was waiting for to replace Thomas in Yates, but decided to resign instead.

Oh, and it wasn't "… relaxing holding for pass blocking." It was allowing holding for pass blocking. Blatant holding too boot. You have to almost tackle an opponent to be called for it these days. Which means, of course, that DLs do get tackled all the time without the OLs being called for it. It's Italian soccer.
i have a lot of questions about yates ability in the system. he wasn’t very big, was a slow runner and couldn’t read the mesh very well in our offense. idk if he would have faired a whole lot better in paul’s offense.

based on yates current offers from the portal i think it might have been a struggle to run the offense and we likely would have just rolled on with our other QBs like Graham and oliver
 

takethepoints

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5,930
You can keep "Moneyballing". But, the thing about Moneyball is that it's like a weird combination of value investing and arbitrage--a bargain in 2022 can be overpriced in 2023. It's a constant re-evaluation of your strategies every year to find where you can get bargains that others are overlooking, and it gets harder every year because most everyone is looking for bargains.
This is the crux of the problem. Way, way too many football programs in our position don't do this. We used to do it, Kansas State used to do it, Wake does it today. It is true that the top 15 or so programs don't need to do this; better athletes cancel all schemes used against them. (Usually, at least.) But Tech isn't in that place and can't afford to think that something as conventional as "better recruiting" is going to get us where we want to be. Like the clip says, "If we think like the Yankees in here, we'll lose to them out there."

My biggest problem with out present staff is that I've seen precious little of this kind of thinking so far. Perhaps Long can start it again. I hope so.
 

Northeast Stinger

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“we made plays to make the game close against UVA but they don’t count cause i don’t like that!”

BC we had some QB play that would make reggie ball look like lamar jackson in comparison. sims wins that game

not polishing a turd i’m just saying that we aren’t as far off as some of the nancies on this page who want to pretend we are as they wallow and cry in their own misery for months and months this off-season.

like i have said in many threads: if collins is ousted in the next 5 minutes i won’t bat an eye and will go to sleep happy. i just think this situation is a lot more salvageable than people realize
Wait a minute, hold on now. You are seriously going to sit there and argue that Collin’s teams were more competitive than Johnson’s 😳?!!!

I’m not ready to say that the flexbone was done for good. Even under Dodd Tech had stretches of down years. These things ALWAYS eventually go into a down cycle at Tech but then can turn around. The problem with Collins is we have seen no evidence so far that he can turn things around. At least with Johnson we knew he was a winner.

Speaking of negative nancies, that’s why CPJ left because it was no longer fun and I have to believe some of that was people being irrational about his offense year after year. When I watch the NFL playoffs this year I noticed some plays right out of the Johnson playbook. But don’t tell the hate the triple option crowd.
 

WreckinGT

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the margins between the teams in the 50s and us is not that great. that’s what i’m trying to say. we were in competitive games with a lot of the teams above us.

we played poorly absolutely no doubt but i’m just saying the ship is not fully submerged yet. whether it’s collins or someone else i will continue to believe there is a possibility to turn this around going forward.

the defense i think is also very fixable and that was the thing we got dinged the most by far on in advanced metrics. hoping to see some improvement there. would be great if some other people would actually support the team too!
From the list above its pretty easy to compare the 2015 team to the 2021 team. They ended up with the same record but not nearly the same path to it. The 2015 team lost 9 games by a combined 82 points. The 2021 team lost 9 games by a combined 169 points. The 2015 team beat a 10 win top 15 team. The 2021 team didn't beat a team with a winning record. The 2015 team didn't lose any game by three TDs. The 2021 team lost three by 30+ points. That seems like a big difference. Most importantly, the 2015 team jumped up to 9 wins the next season. How are you feeling about getting to 9 wins next year?
 

cthenrys

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
942
Location
Highland Village, TX
Wait a minute, hold on now. You are seriously going to sit there and argue that Collin’s teams were more competitive than Johnson’s 😳?!!!

I’m not ready to say that the flexbone was done for good. Even under Dodd Tech had stretches of down years. These things ALWAYS eventually go into a down cycle at Tech but then can turn around. The problem with Collins is we have seen no evidence so far that he can turn things around. At least with Johnson we knew he was a winner.

Speaking of negative nancies, that’s why CPJ left because it was no longer fun and I have to believe some of that was people being irrational about his offense year after year. When I watch the NFL playoffs this year I noticed some plays right out of the Johnson playbook. But don’t tell the hate the triple option crowd.
Yep. That's what he's trying to convince us... the same team that was incredibly lucky to get a third win at Duke is about as good as we were under CPJ. I mean once your out of the top 50, they're all the same right ?

The extent to which people will go to explain away the last three years is really dumbfounding.... We still have not won back to back games in three years.
 

Northeast Stinger

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From the list above its pretty easy to compare the 2015 team to the 2021 team. They ended up with the same record but not nearly the same path to it. The 2015 team lost 9 games by a combined 82 points. The 2021 team lost 9 games by a combined 169 points. The 2015 team beat a 10 win top 15 team. The 2021 team didn't beat a team with a winning record. The 2015 team didn't lose any game by three TDs. The 2021 team lost three by 30+ points. That seems like a big difference. Most importantly, the 2015 team jumped up to 9 wins the next season. How are you feeling about getting to 9 wins next year?
Thank you for the reality check.
 
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