McCamish Maniacs
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GAMEDAY!!!
- Thread starter SteamWhistle
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I guess we could overlook the fact that Clemson has a potential First team All American Forward. I'd say a mid tier SEC team losing to a tournament team from the ACC is hardly an abandon ship type result.
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Disagree, the UGAg program should be disbanded.
Was just yankin yer chain, bro. And no that guy's not 1st team anything. Shldve stayed in the draft.
BeeRBee
Jolly Good Fellow
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I'll echo the positive comments about ball movement, effort, etc. Hopefully they can improve and gain confidence so that it doesn't fall apart when faced with ACC level defense.
It seemed to me that GT had a couple of good stretches in both halves when Heyward was in at the point. I could be mistaken, but they seemed to be playing faster. This is a credit to him, but also may just show the improvement that Justin can make.
Of course, I generally have no idea what I'm talking about.
It seemed to me that GT had a couple of good stretches in both halves when Heyward was in at the point. I could be mistaken, but they seemed to be playing faster. This is a credit to him, but also may just show the improvement that Justin can make.
Of course, I generally have no idea what I'm talking about.
coolhaji33
Jolly Good Fellow
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Add Heath and Jackson to this equation allowing them to play faster and more aggressively and we are actually competitive...able to compete..as I've said since the "hiring"..our personel isn't as bad as the "experts" think...our kids can play...and they all play hard and what looks to be in a very disciplined manner despite our youth and inexperience.Will we challenge for the ACC title...hell no...Will we be in middle of the pack...probably not.But will we be "in" games..absolutely.Stephens isn't the same player as mstranahan derogitively stated HE WAS...he stated that prior to Q nailing a big three and a deep two late...he's a "responsible" reliable SENIOR now...yes players develop and change overtime even late into there careers.
Jon Babul made a great point in the second half,Q...Lammers and AD,with there hands up,are an extremely long team...should be able to protect the rim...they need to defensive rebound for us to compete in ACC play..that's the concern for me.
As for the freshman...at half time I stated,in this thread,that Okogie will have the ability to "will" W's in a few years...he actually did most of that in the second half.He used his elite strength and athleticism to MAKE PLAYS...he gets to the hoop,powers by and finishes.With every gained minute of experience you'll see him continue to make a huge positive impact.Matthews looked aggressive offensively and is active defensively,he mixes it up and will only get better.As for Moore...being a freshman,it's harder for him to play perfect so to speak...he's got Alot on his plate...especially this year and now without Heath.He will gain "college" muscle and be a blur out there...getting into the lane,breaking defenders up off the dribble...he already changes direction and attacks like a vet.He just needs to get reps and add 5-10 lbs of muscle.Not quite the floor general that I see in Alvarado but explosive enough offensively too play alongside him next year when they go small and fast.
Lastly...I most excited over the play of AD...I thought he would be the sleeper...mentioned it many times in previous threads.He will become a game changing type player in years to come.I truly have seen few players his size(length) move like him.He's got tremendous instincts,footwork,speed and agility.He handles and passes well and can defend 5 positions...his jumper and touch overall is feathery...he won't score it this year like he will in his Jr. year but he'll give us a long active player who can block shots,defend 5 position...is a thoroughbred and handles the ball and passes as well as most guards.And he PLAYS HARD!!!I saw CJP refer to him as an NBA caliber defensive prospect...I felt that was possible this past summer,after last night I'm also convinced of that notion.
Very pleased with what I saw last night taking into account it was Tennessee Tech.#togetherweswarm
Jon Babul made a great point in the second half,Q...Lammers and AD,with there hands up,are an extremely long team...should be able to protect the rim...they need to defensive rebound for us to compete in ACC play..that's the concern for me.
As for the freshman...at half time I stated,in this thread,that Okogie will have the ability to "will" W's in a few years...he actually did most of that in the second half.He used his elite strength and athleticism to MAKE PLAYS...he gets to the hoop,powers by and finishes.With every gained minute of experience you'll see him continue to make a huge positive impact.Matthews looked aggressive offensively and is active defensively,he mixes it up and will only get better.As for Moore...being a freshman,it's harder for him to play perfect so to speak...he's got Alot on his plate...especially this year and now without Heath.He will gain "college" muscle and be a blur out there...getting into the lane,breaking defenders up off the dribble...he already changes direction and attacks like a vet.He just needs to get reps and add 5-10 lbs of muscle.Not quite the floor general that I see in Alvarado but explosive enough offensively too play alongside him next year when they go small and fast.
Lastly...I most excited over the play of AD...I thought he would be the sleeper...mentioned it many times in previous threads.He will become a game changing type player in years to come.I truly have seen few players his size(length) move like him.He's got tremendous instincts,footwork,speed and agility.He handles and passes well and can defend 5 positions...his jumper and touch overall is feathery...he won't score it this year like he will in his Jr. year but he'll give us a long active player who can block shots,defend 5 position...is a thoroughbred and handles the ball and passes as well as most guards.And he PLAYS HARD!!!I saw CJP refer to him as an NBA caliber defensive prospect...I felt that was possible this past summer,after last night I'm also convinced of that notion.
Very pleased with what I saw last night taking into account it was Tennessee Tech.#togetherweswarm
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My thoughts.
First off - nice to get the first win. Second, nothing I saw makes me rethink my feeling the ceiling is about 12 wins. Though i am feeling better that we may get to 10 wins - maybe 60-40 rather than 40-60.
Ball movement was better than last year and a number of times they made multiple good passes and then missed a shot. Spacing is better than last year (still alot of work to be done). There were times they didn't have a player within 10 ft of the basket. Really looking to create space.
Pastner made it clear in the post game that he though Lammers and Okogie could play much better than they did and that the pace isn't anywhere near where it needs to be yet. i did appreciate not looking clogged on offense.
Lammers - Continues his solid improvement. Nice array of moves and provides an anchor on defense. Still needs to be more aggressive - especially against smaller teams. one player we most can't afford to get in foul trouble or injured
Okogie - nice first game. Pretty aggressive on both ends (which cut his time due to first half fouls). Has second coming of MGH written all over him. Put some other good pieces around him and he is going to be a player. immediately came out in second half after sitting most of the first half and hit 2 quick buckets.
Moore - pleasant surprise. A little raw, but big and athletic. Upside is higher than i first thought. Would be perfect as an ACC level backup PG. Didn't show any ability or inclination to shoot from ouside so teams will start to gameplan that. But better than i expect. Had a few high athletic ability plays that showed the potential
Q - same ole Q. Can be so quiet - but hit a monster three late when GT needed one to close the door (Okogie followed up with his own). Clearly trying to be a leader. Brought the ball up the court more than i would have expected.
Matthews - not a bad first game as a FR. Hit our only 3 in the first half. Has a soft shot. Is never going to be a great defender as he lacks the footspeed that Moore and Okogie have. Still, has the potential to be a real scorer in a year or two. Good potential to work with and mold into a role player. His low release shot bothers me - why aren't kids taught to shoot high anymore.
Corey - Nice job. poised, made a couple of shots took care of the ball. Looked winded late in the game.
AD - another pleasant surprise. Very comfortable out on the court. His athleticism and wingspan give him the ability to turn into a really good defensive stopper type over time. Has a nice looking jumper but also tends to make really bad decisions on offense. A project with upside. I thought he might be one to transfer after a year but changed my mind a little. His build really fits in well with Pastner's plan.
Ogbonda - spelled Lammers a few min at a time. Good size and athleticism but otherwise did not stand out at all - looks like a project still.
McCormick - saw a few min of action. Going to be a huge liability on defense. Can't see anything but spot min when we are hunting for jumpers.
Price - barely got on the floor - already looks behind okogie and Matthews so play and develop the FR.
Didn't realize Tadric wasn't playing until about 7 min into the game when I all of the sudden thought - where is Tadric. Spent the entire game on the bike behind the bench. Hope he gets healthy soon. don't play him until he is really healthy.
once Heath and Tadric are available i'm thinking starting 5 will be Heath, Tadric, okogie. Q and Lammers with Moore, Matthews and AD as primary backups, Ogbonda getting a couple min to spell Lammers.
I don't think the GT's will play much at all and Corey may lose most of his time to Heath (I think they will try to get min for Moore each game since he is the most athletic guard and will want to develop him as much as they can).
TN Tech was a bad team but i'll take a win with our starting backcourt out.
First off - nice to get the first win. Second, nothing I saw makes me rethink my feeling the ceiling is about 12 wins. Though i am feeling better that we may get to 10 wins - maybe 60-40 rather than 40-60.
Ball movement was better than last year and a number of times they made multiple good passes and then missed a shot. Spacing is better than last year (still alot of work to be done). There were times they didn't have a player within 10 ft of the basket. Really looking to create space.
Pastner made it clear in the post game that he though Lammers and Okogie could play much better than they did and that the pace isn't anywhere near where it needs to be yet. i did appreciate not looking clogged on offense.
Lammers - Continues his solid improvement. Nice array of moves and provides an anchor on defense. Still needs to be more aggressive - especially against smaller teams. one player we most can't afford to get in foul trouble or injured
Okogie - nice first game. Pretty aggressive on both ends (which cut his time due to first half fouls). Has second coming of MGH written all over him. Put some other good pieces around him and he is going to be a player. immediately came out in second half after sitting most of the first half and hit 2 quick buckets.
Moore - pleasant surprise. A little raw, but big and athletic. Upside is higher than i first thought. Would be perfect as an ACC level backup PG. Didn't show any ability or inclination to shoot from ouside so teams will start to gameplan that. But better than i expect. Had a few high athletic ability plays that showed the potential
Q - same ole Q. Can be so quiet - but hit a monster three late when GT needed one to close the door (Okogie followed up with his own). Clearly trying to be a leader. Brought the ball up the court more than i would have expected.
Matthews - not a bad first game as a FR. Hit our only 3 in the first half. Has a soft shot. Is never going to be a great defender as he lacks the footspeed that Moore and Okogie have. Still, has the potential to be a real scorer in a year or two. Good potential to work with and mold into a role player. His low release shot bothers me - why aren't kids taught to shoot high anymore.
Corey - Nice job. poised, made a couple of shots took care of the ball. Looked winded late in the game.
AD - another pleasant surprise. Very comfortable out on the court. His athleticism and wingspan give him the ability to turn into a really good defensive stopper type over time. Has a nice looking jumper but also tends to make really bad decisions on offense. A project with upside. I thought he might be one to transfer after a year but changed my mind a little. His build really fits in well with Pastner's plan.
Ogbonda - spelled Lammers a few min at a time. Good size and athleticism but otherwise did not stand out at all - looks like a project still.
McCormick - saw a few min of action. Going to be a huge liability on defense. Can't see anything but spot min when we are hunting for jumpers.
Price - barely got on the floor - already looks behind okogie and Matthews so play and develop the FR.
Didn't realize Tadric wasn't playing until about 7 min into the game when I all of the sudden thought - where is Tadric. Spent the entire game on the bike behind the bench. Hope he gets healthy soon. don't play him until he is really healthy.
once Heath and Tadric are available i'm thinking starting 5 will be Heath, Tadric, okogie. Q and Lammers with Moore, Matthews and AD as primary backups, Ogbonda getting a couple min to spell Lammers.
I don't think the GT's will play much at all and Corey may lose most of his time to Heath (I think they will try to get min for Moore each game since he is the most athletic guard and will want to develop him as much as they can).
TN Tech was a bad team but i'll take a win with our starting backcourt out.
Ramblingon
Ramblin' Wreck
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Thanks, Red. Pretty accurate report. Really like Okogie from the get-go. He'll get a lot of minutes to develop this season. And I was big on Lammers last season. He's an ACC center.
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I agree with all of this, and would add a couple of thoughts.
McCormick and Price are not much more than walk-ons at this point. I am glad they are here because we may need them on nights when our starters are collecting fouls. But that seems to be the upside.
I missed seeing Ogbonda on the court last night, And, we need to keep the ball out of AD's hands on offense. He is a turnover machine.
Corey fits this system better than CBG's. Maybe he can actually contribute this year. That could prove to be important.
While I never thought our lineup was really great, Lammers, Okogie, Moore, and Q are legit players. We will see how the mix improves with TJ and Heath, but I am also rethinking my prediction.
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Well, so much for the UTC talk! tic
SteamWhistle
Helluva Engineer
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*Georgia
Haha. Yeah. Thought I was pretty smart for about the first 10 minutes.
UNCs ball movement was impressive. Justin Jackson looked good after the half.
Hell, Nate Britt made a 3. You know things are working when he's making shots
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Not much to take away based on the opponent, but I was pleased with the performance, especially the ball movement on offense
Lots of good commentary, but there were two players that stood out to me.
Josh Okogie:
- Way to make a splash.. 18 points and 5 boards in his first game. He will be our leader very soon!! Love his game.
- The young man is simply a beast. He's flat-out chiseled and already has grown-man strength. Not often you see a freshman that is physically ready for the ACC, but he is ready.
- There was one possession in particular at the beginning of the second half where he just out-muscled his man for position, grabbed the board and finished in traffic for an And-one.
- He's plays with a lot of fire, but he plays within himself...good shot selection, didn't try and force anything
Abdoulaye Gueye!
- Personally, I didn't think that he would have much of a role, but he could end up being a real weapon. At 6'9, he moves like a guard.
- He's an above average athlete and has very long arms. His mix of height/wingspan/athletic ability will make him a very good defender.
- Too many turnovers, but it was very first live-action in two years. It will take a couple of games for him to catch up with the speed again.
- He's comfortable with the baseline jumper, and I think that he will be able to take bigger guys off the dribble as he gets more comfortable.
Hopefully our guys can continue to gel and just focus on playing good basketball. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that there are a lot of teams out there with much more talent than us. That said, I can think of numerous examples of where more talented teams have gone down to teams that run good sets, play hard throughout, and get hot on occasion. Maybe with expectations so low from everyone, we can do the unthinkable and exceed them..!
Lots of good commentary, but there were two players that stood out to me.
Josh Okogie:
- Way to make a splash.. 18 points and 5 boards in his first game. He will be our leader very soon!! Love his game.
- The young man is simply a beast. He's flat-out chiseled and already has grown-man strength. Not often you see a freshman that is physically ready for the ACC, but he is ready.
- There was one possession in particular at the beginning of the second half where he just out-muscled his man for position, grabbed the board and finished in traffic for an And-one.
- He's plays with a lot of fire, but he plays within himself...good shot selection, didn't try and force anything
Abdoulaye Gueye!
- Personally, I didn't think that he would have much of a role, but he could end up being a real weapon. At 6'9, he moves like a guard.
- He's an above average athlete and has very long arms. His mix of height/wingspan/athletic ability will make him a very good defender.
- Too many turnovers, but it was very first live-action in two years. It will take a couple of games for him to catch up with the speed again.
- He's comfortable with the baseline jumper, and I think that he will be able to take bigger guys off the dribble as he gets more comfortable.
Hopefully our guys can continue to gel and just focus on playing good basketball. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that there are a lot of teams out there with much more talent than us. That said, I can think of numerous examples of where more talented teams have gone down to teams that run good sets, play hard throughout, and get hot on occasion. Maybe with expectations so low from everyone, we can do the unthinkable and exceed them..!
Agreed almost everywhere. I still have to watch the game again. My mind gets a bit jumbled worrying about getting the W I sometimes forget to pay attention to the things I want to see (off the ball movement, screens, defensive position etc)
I was pretty impressed with the freshman though. I think I'd already put my vote in for Moore to remain the starter and just ride it out. I like CMs touch. He's going to be a weapon in his career.
YlJacket
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I agree Okogie and Gueye are the 2 bright spots/ surprise players for me too. Red compared Okogie to MGH. Man I hope so but he does have the body and game to be a legit ACC player. Was hoping so but good to see it happening.
Gueye is the bigger surprise to me. Not what I expected as a redshirt. Much more athletic / live body than I was expecting. Not really a 3 so I expect he is going to play a lot of time at the 4 spot and may start as I think he did yesterday (little late to the game). He will likely move Q out to the 3 for a lot of his minutes meaning the zone we play is not just for a change of pace but could be our primary D against better teams. Hides Q and protects Lammers to a degree.
I also really expect CJP to start experimenting with Okogie, Josh and Tadrick on the perimeter with Lammers and Gueye. That is a much faster team and one that could better keep up with other teams when we try to run with them. Will exacerbate our rebounding issues so it ain't perfect by any sense but would make more sense for an uptempo spread attack.
Gueye is the bigger surprise to me. Not what I expected as a redshirt. Much more athletic / live body than I was expecting. Not really a 3 so I expect he is going to play a lot of time at the 4 spot and may start as I think he did yesterday (little late to the game). He will likely move Q out to the 3 for a lot of his minutes meaning the zone we play is not just for a change of pace but could be our primary D against better teams. Hides Q and protects Lammers to a degree.
I also really expect CJP to start experimenting with Okogie, Josh and Tadrick on the perimeter with Lammers and Gueye. That is a much faster team and one that could better keep up with other teams when we try to run with them. Will exacerbate our rebounding issues so it ain't perfect by any sense but would make more sense for an uptempo spread attack.