Duke Postgame

[danny daniel]

It actually looks a lot like Orwin's safety. Ball partially out so not touchback, not completely out so not in play.

I thought that originally but after watching the replay I think the knee was down before the catch but came up before possession. Either situation was really close, even in slo-mo.

 

[Eli]

Yeah, because scrambling around our starting QB is both smart and repeatable. Why don't you STFU and go somewhere else?

Huh? guess when Lamar Jackson or deshaun Watson takes off on a broken down play Dabo and Petrino should be fired...Need I remind you of a team who made it to the national championship because of the quarterbacks ability to scramble and take over a gamea. Oh and he was the number one pick.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

Huh? guess when Lamar Jackson or deshaun Watson takes off on a broken down play Dabo and Petrino should be fired...Need I remind you of a team who made it to the national championship because of the quarterbacks ability to scramble and take over a gamea. Oh and he was the number one pick.

You apparently missed the word "repeatable". Or are you suggesting that we should run this broken-play QB scramble 20 times or so a game?

who said anything about anyone getting fired??? WTF is your problem?

 

[Eli]

You apparently missed the word "repeatable". Or are you suggesting that we should run this broken-play QB scramble 20 times or so a game?

who said anything about anyone getting fired??? WTF is your problem?

No when did I say that? I said when a play breaks down its good that we have a quarterback that can make plays like he did yesterday.

 

[JorgeJonas]

2 stops. Should we throw a party? Yay!!! We forced 2 punts, in a game. New record...... And, no there is no trade off for bad defense. We cannot sit back and pray the other team messes up.

Strawman. No, we shouldn't be thrilled with the defense, but they also stopped them twice on fourth down, got three turnovers, and forced two punts. That's seven stops. Still not perfect, and still plenty of room to improve, but at least let's be honest about the numbers.

 

[ilovetheoption]

Observations:

Offense:

The good
JT....'nuff said.
WRs with a good showing. No drops, tricky routes, winning balls. Jeune is evolving into a beast. Stewart is a vacuum cleaner in tight quarters with his hands.
Clinton Lynch being Clinton Lynch
Pass protection was pretty good. Duke is a good pass rushing team
Able to make Duke pay for (1) using gimmicks on D/being fancy

The bad
Never got in rhythm
Couldn't run it between the tackles

The ugly
The offense has struggled vs Pitt, Duke, and others in doing what should be our bread and butter: getting short yardage first downs. We are explosive and the offense is effective, but until we improve in this area we are hampered from being a dominant offense.

Defense:

The Good:
AJ Gray is coming on. He is starting to play fast and pops off the screen. Tackles with authority as well.
Brandt Mitchell is inconsistent and is sometimes in the wrong place, but when he gets it ironed out he'll be a good backer for us.
They kept fighting, and rallied a bit in the 4th quarter.
Did make some fourth down stops and force a couple of fumbles.

The Bad:
We can't defend the shotgun read option to save our arse.
Anything remotely eye-candyish destroys us.
When opponents go fast kills us
Third and long, third and short, doesn't matter. The drive will extend.
Simmons struggling against the run (hopefully learning).

The Ugly:
No pass rush. St. Amour had one sack when the whole world knew they were throwing. Beyond that barely a hurry. We made that Duke QB look like Dan Marino.
Very rare to see a DL win an individual battle on either runs or passes. We just do not get off blocks. There is no disruption of what the other team is trying to do.

STs

The Good
Specialists I thought had a good game. Rodwell with some nice punts, Butker hit the endzone reliably

The Bad
Other than the quick kick Duke didn't punt that I recall. Either stopped by turnovers or fourth down stops.

The Ugly
Kick returners either dancing around or not taking a touch back. I love JJ and hate that he got hurt but IMO if he hits it up in there hard, dives forward, and just gets what he can he likely doesn't fumble/get hurt.
Austin just stopped and danced around on the 10 yard line.
I understand that our KR unit doesn't block at all, so yes it's tough to be a return man in those circumstances. Coaches need to coach those guys to take a knee or fly forward in a straight line and get down.
And, if our defense is going to be this ineffective and we are going to have so many returns we need to fix this. Offense continually starting between the 10-15 yard line is just terrible.
I don't care how many starters you put on the unit, it is absolutely killing us. Coaches need to get this fixed. Is glaring.

Notes:
Adams doesn't play because when he's in there teams go fast so the D can't sub. If he's only good for 2 plays he's gassed and becomes a liability.

Regarding Roof and coaching vs talent:

I agree that in the final analysis that Roof ain't getting it done.

I do think if Roof's scheme were crap and this was the problem then PSU's D would have nose-dived when he took over instead of staying a top 35 D. You can say PSU's guys were already coached up so they stayed effective. That would point to a problem with teaching and developing our guys, or possibly putting them into a scheme where they can't succeed. You can argue the scheme he wants to run is not suited to our talent. I MIGHT buy that.

But I am not sure what would be suited for our talent when guys are not getting off blocks and running to the football. There is only so much you can do with smoke and mirrors. The falling for eye candy thing is troubling, but then again you have young, inexperienced guys playing behing a non-disruptive DL. You can't claim Roof's scheme is too complicated because it's been pretty vanilla. Probably to suit current personnel.

AJ Gray is the only player I can think of on our defense who is an impact, 1-8 type player, and he is just now developing. PJ Davis is productive, but has some limitations with respect to size and pass coverage. Plus he's been out the last two weeks. Corey Griffin, Pat Gamble, K-Free, and Rook play hard and will rise up at times and make a play. But overall for our D it's just too infrequent. Young talent running around in the secondary...I like 'em but with no pass rush they aren't going to look great.

On passing downs QBs mostly don't even have to hurry. On runs we don't win the LOS often enough. I don't see a Gotsis, Attaochu, senior year Dieke or Cummings, Michael Johnson, etc. I don't see a Keith Brooking, Wheeler, etc. Sure some of our guys could develop into NFL linemen. But who is first, second, or third team all-ACC RIGHT NOW.

I looked at who we had on paper before the season and said unless some guys develop into impact guys we aren't going to be a good defense. It's not suprising to me that it has come to pass.

Good post. This one made me think, and maybe reevaluate roof a little.

 

[BuzzKillington]

Note from the game: if JT doesn't under throw BS, it would have been a "house call"

Really? Is everything okay in your life?

 

[ilovetheoption]

You apparently missed the word "repeatable". Or are you suggesting that we should run this broken-play QB scramble 20 times or so a game?

who said anything about anyone getting fired??? WTF is your problem?

I mean, sort of? One of the benefits of recruiting a dual threat qb is because they can make something out of nothing with some consistency. we run sprintouts with the idea un mind that if nobody is open, jt can tuck it and make something happen with his feet.

Teams have to prepare like its a repeatable thing. the fact that hes done it a bunch of times in his career mean that it is, at least to some degree, repeatable.

 

[Vespidae]

How anyone can defend Roof at this point is beyond me. I'm sure Jerry will be along to tell us how fortunate we are to have ol Ted as our DC.

The way things are going, maybe Kirby will be available soon. The pressure is mounting on him, that's for sure.

 

[leftylover]

Really? Is everything okay in your life?

Absolutely! Thanks for asking

 

[iceeater1969]

your list is shorter, better if you answer.

We will know by time we get back from athens.
In your trading scenarios should Roof and pelton, etc be on the trading block as well ?
We just were schooled on defense by the worst acc team (0-4) . The 2 acc teams we have beaten have 1 and zero wins . We have 2 tough games remaining so the goal of getting out of cellar is not assured.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

Strawman. No, we shouldn't be thrilled with the defense, but they also stopped them twice on fourth down, got three turnovers, and forced two punts. That's seven stops. Still not perfect, and still plenty of room to improve, but at least let's be honest about the numbers.

And that magnifies the problem for us yesterday. The D did get those stops/turnovers, and then the O failed to take advantage of any of them.

 

[Boomergump]

A few more thoughts after watching about a quarter of the replay and having a day to digest:

We won. After having lost to DOOK the last two seasons, getting this win, however flawed, means something.

I am still unhappy about the body language of our players. Something is wrong.

For those of you mad at Roof, what would you do differently? I am not so sure blitzing all over the place and pressing with CBs is the way to go with our current personnel. If you press and blitz, you are pretty much guaranteed to get a ton of deep fade throws to WRs, dump offs to RBs, and or quick throws to TEs. At CB, we are not terribly fast nor long, which are the two most important characteristics when facing deep fades. Our LBS are not fast, nor are they long either, so when a TE releases..... You see what I am saying? If you get what you wish for, I am not sure you would like the results.

The Austin twins would be great, if we had a dominant DL with crazy penetration and a ton of QB hurries etc. Their strength is tackling and taking away slants etc. We don't have that with the current DL. If you force them to cover deep, for long periods, against fast and tall people, when the opposition QB can take his time....oh boy.

CTR has been dealt a tough hand. Possibly he could have played it better in past seasons, but this season? I am not so sure how I would go about planning for our current group. We are not fast, we are not physical up front, we are not long either along the boundary. Perhaps his game plans are not as bad as we all want to claim. We have some people who are coming along to address the shortcomings: LS and DW at CB, VA and TL at LB, and BA at DT. However, if they aren't quite ready, what is a DC to do?

JT is a pretty darned good passer.

Don't over-analyze DOOK forcing us out of what we like to do on offense. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the pitch. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the dive. So we weren't able to impose our will in some ways. We WERE able to take what they gave us and make them pay, which is the sign of a good offense. They made a choice to make JT beat them with his arm and his feet and he did just that.

 

[awbuzz]

The game play clock is 40 seconds, not 25.

You are correct, the default is 40 seconds, however it can be, and often is, set to 25 seconds. The key is "at the end of the play" as to when it starts. That includes "taking a knee".

Below are the details AND WHEN it gets adjusted to 25 seconds to start play. The below does not discuss the 10 second "run off" that is an option toward the end of each half.

The 40/25 Second Clock Operator will be instructed to:
1) Set the clock display to 25 seconds before the game and second half starts (first play is a kickoff).

2) For kickoff, start the 25-second clock when signaled to do so by the Referee.

3) The play clock will automatically reset to 40 seconds at the end of each play.

4) The covering official’s signal will designate when to start the play clock.

5) Start 40-second clock when the official signals:
a) The ball is dead in field of play: Play clock starts when covering official raises his arm or gives a wind signal if near the sideline.
b) Incomplete pass: Play clock starts when covering official signals incomplete pass.
c) Ball dead out of bounds: Play clock starts when covering official signals to stop the game clock.

6) Manually set the play clock to 25 seconds when any official signals to stop the game clock for: a penalty, a charged team timeout, media or injury timeout, measurement, change of possession, after any kick down, any score, first play of a quarter, or first play of a team’s series in overtime. Then start the play clock when the Referee next gives the wind the clock or ready for play signal.

7) The play clock will also be set to 25 seconds if signal to do so by the Referee (one hand pump above the head or the Referee’s ready for play signal). Under no circumstances should the play clock be reset to 25 seconds upon a signal by any official other than the referee. It is common practice for officials to communicate to the referee to "ask" if he wants to consider resetting by making the pumping signal. Resetting is the sole discretion of the referee.

8) Leave display at '00' seconds if there is a delay of game penalty called until the Referee has completed his signals to the press box after enforcing the delay of game penalty. After a delay of game penalty has been enforced, set play clock to 25 seconds.

9) If the 40-second count is interrupted or stopped due to a play clock problem, the referee shall stop the game clock and then give a signal (both palms open in an over-the-head pumping motion). This means that the play clock should be re-set to 40 seconds and started immediately.

10) If the 40-second clock is running and the ball is not ready to be snapped after 20 seconds into the count (it might be at 25 seconds now dependent upon league...), the referee shall call timeout and signal that the play clock be set to 25 seconds. When play is to be resumed, the referee will give the ready-for-play signal and the play clock will begin the 25-second count.

 

[Milwaukee]

A few more thoughts after watching about a quarter of the replay and having a day to digest:

We won. After having lost to DOOK the last two seasons, getting this win, however flawed, means something.

I am still unhappy about the body language of our players. Something is wrong.

For those of you mad at Roof, what would you do differently? I am not so sure blitzing all over the place and pressing with CBs is the way to go with our current personnel. If you press and blitz, you are pretty much guaranteed to get a ton of deep fade throws to WRs, dump offs to RBs, and or quick throws to TEs. At CB, we are not terribly fast nor long, which are the two most important characteristics when facing deep fades. Our LBS are not fast, nor are they long either, so when a TE releases..... You see what I am saying? If you get what you wish for, I am not sure you would like the results.

The Austin twins would be great, if we had a dominant DL with crazy penetration and a ton of QB hurries etc. Their strength is tackling and taking away slants etc. We don't have that with the current DL. If you force them to cover deep, for long periods, against fast and tall people, when the opposition QB can take his time....oh boy.

CTR has been dealt a tough hand. Possibly he could have played it better in past seasons, but this season? I am not so sure how I would go about planning for our current group. We are not fast, we are not physical up front, we are not long either along the boundary. Perhaps his game plans are not as bad as we all want to claim. We have some people who are coming along to address the shortcomings: LS and DW at CB, VA and TL at LB, and BA at DT. However, if they aren't quite ready, what is a DC to do?

JT is a pretty darned good passer.

Don't over-analyze DOOK forcing us out of what we like to do on offense. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the pitch. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the dive. So we weren't able to impose our will in some ways. We WERE able to take what they gave us and make them pay, which is the sign of a good offense. They made a choice to make JT beat them with his arm and his feet and he did just that.

So much this. People keep saying "we have so much talent on D, they were all offered P5 schollys...so Roof has no excuse". I don't give a damn who offered what, our talent deficiency is GLARING. It's the worst I've ever seen at Tech, to be honest.

#recruiting

 

[JorgeJonas]

And that magnifies the problem for us yesterday. The D did get those stops/turnovers, and then the O failed to take advantage of any of them.

I believe we scored off one of the turnovers on downs, but yeah, had we scored after their fumble on the first drive of the second half, the game is over. Still, though, Duke has (had?) a decent defense coming in and we put 38 points and 600 yards of offense on them. That's pretty encouraging.

Also, they had extra time to prepare. I'm old enough to remember when that was what we were told was a death knell to our offense.

 

[Boomergump]

DOOK was a top 20 defense coming into this game. DOOK was also a bottom 20 offense. TIFWIW.

 

[jandrews]

A few more thoughts after watching about a quarter of the replay and having a day to digest:

We won. After having lost to DOOK the last two seasons, getting this win, however flawed, means something.

I am still unhappy about the body language of our players. Something is wrong.

For those of you mad at Roof, what would you do differently? I am not so sure blitzing all over the place and pressing with CBs is the way to go with our current personnel. If you press and blitz, you are pretty much guaranteed to get a ton of deep fade throws to WRs, dump offs to RBs, and or quick throws to TEs. At CB, we are not terribly fast nor long, which are the two most important characteristics when facing deep fades. Our LBS are not fast, nor are they long either, so when a TE releases..... You see what I am saying? If you get what you wish for, I am not sure you would like the results.

The Austin twins would be great, if we had a dominant DL with crazy penetration and a ton of QB hurries etc. Their strength is tackling and taking away slants etc. We don't have that with the current DL. If you force them to cover deep, for long periods, against fast and tall people, when the opposition QB can take his time....oh boy.

CTR has been dealt a tough hand. Possibly he could have played it better in past seasons, but this season? I am not so sure how I would go about planning for our current group. We are not fast, we are not physical up front, we are not long either along the boundary. Perhaps his game plans are not as bad as we all want to claim. We have some people who are coming along to address the shortcomings: LS and DW at CB, VA and TL at LB, and BA at DT. However, if they aren't quite ready, what is a DC to do?

JT is a pretty darned good passer.

Don't over-analyze DOOK forcing us out of what we like to do on offense. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the pitch. So we didn't get a ton of yards off the dive. So we weren't able to impose our will in some ways. We WERE able to take what they gave us and make them pay, which is the sign of a good offense. They made a choice to make JT beat them with his arm and his feet and he did just that.

Great post I agree entirely. If we were worried about conditioning for BA best conditioning is during a game. He should of seen the field more during our low contested games like Mercer and Vanderbilt. From what I have seen year over year with Roof is he tries to get his scheme to hit the defense. We played a lot tighter to the line with Milton and White. He's trying to keep everything in front of our guys. Yesterday, Dukes QB got in rhythm and was roping some throws in tight windows.

 

[4shotB]

CTR has been dealt a tough hand. Possibly he could have played it better in past seasons, but this season? I am not so sure how I would go about planning for our current group. We are not fast, we are not physical up front, we are not long either along the boundary. Perhaps his game plans are not as bad as we all want to claim.

Thanks for the summary. I guess that leaves me with just two questions - he is in his 4th year and the HC is in his 9th here (give or take on both). Why has he been dealt a bad hand? (in other words, what is changing going forward to improve his hand? Some coaches can affect change in much shorter periods of time). The second - assuming the hand is bad - is he getting all that he can out of them? (or, in other words, could someone else do better with the same personnel?)

Let me be clear - i ask these questions for discussion purposes only. I like and respect our coaching staff and want them all to be succesful enough at Tech to retire here.

 

[awbuzz]

... We WERE able to take what they gave us and make them pay, which is the sign of a good offense. They made a choice to make JT beat them with his arm and his feet and he did just that.

Bottom line that is what offenses are supposed to do and we did (Kind of like them - Dook - throwing to that TE...)