DL could be really, really good

[dhbartlett12]

PJ, Vic, and Tre call BS on that theory

D.J. White too. He's a meany out there!

 

[gtalltheway]

One of my oldest friends, an actual GT grad no less, but kind of a passing football fan, once shared his opinion of our defensive woes.It is that because of a mix of various circumstances and interests, GT does not attract the kind of player a good defense needs. That is the mean, nasty and ill-tempered kid who goes out there to hurt people. He figures the qualities that make a player suited for that made for a bad GT fit. I figured it was kind of elitist but sometimes I wonder if he was on to something. That was after Groh was fired, and as Johnson would say, it still is what it is. I hope we are both wrong, because it makes for hard Saturdays when the offense has to score every time it gets the ball.

I think we have more kids on the team that are like that actually it's just a matter of if they play to that ability or not these other teams have it because they are getting the top recruits in the nation so I think we have that attitude we just need to play to it more and like the other guys said we have some that are showing it

 

[dressedcheeseside]

You can be a great defensive player w/o trying to hurt people. We've had them in the past: Michael Johnson, Vance Walker, Darryl Richard, Morgan Burnett, Derrick Morgan, etc.

 

[TheGridironGeek]

One of my oldest friends, an actual GT grad no less, but kind of a passing football fan, once shared his opinion of our defensive woes.It is that because of a mix of various circumstances and interests, GT does not attract the kind of player a good defense needs. That is the mean, nasty and ill-tempered kid who goes out there to hurt people. He figures the qualities that make a player suited for that made for a bad GT fit. I figured it was kind of elitist but sometimes I wonder if he was on to something. That was after Groh was fired, and as Johnson would say, it still is what it is. I hope we are both wrong, because it makes for hard Saturdays when the offense has to score every time it gets the ball.

Merlin Olsen? Michael Strahan? You don't have to be an off-the-field bully (or an idiot) to be a great QB hunter.

 

[TheGridironGeek]

I think we have more kids on the team that are like that actually it's just a matter of if they play to that ability or not these other teams have it because they are getting the top recruits in the nation so I think we have that attitude we just need to play to it more and like the other guys said we have some that are showing it

That's true. A defense naturally looks mean & marauding when they're making plays and stuffing the opponent. When they're giving up a long drive for a touchdown, any displays of machismo are just going to make them look stupid anyway.

People are funny when they say "I want team X to have an aggressive defense this year!" Translated, that means they want a good defense this year. They might envision seeing a LB crash through the line on a blitz, and kill the entire opposing backfield. But a sack/TFL etc is a goal, not a strategy. If there was a play in the playbook called "Sack the QB," DC's would call it all the time.

 

[TheGridironGeek]

A few thoughts on the GT defense in general --

1. 2014 was a step forward for Tech's defense. Hell or high water, they stopped more athletic offenses at crucial moments. Clemson. Georgia. MSU. Against comparable athletes, the '14 defense often shined. No, it wasn't consistent or pretty, and the bad weeks are pretty bad. But with a young/returning bunch it's not taboo to look at the positives.

The ceiling is higher for Tech's defense now. I think everyone can agree there.

2. Can't overlook the turnover ratio. It wasn't just luck.

3. CTR has done a pretty fine job. Tech's real "disadvantage" on D is that a nearly unstoppable offense constantly puts them in position to play, and contend against, bigger and faster football teams, setting up the defense to be judged by how it plays vs. Florida State (a much more athletic/talented team) vs say, Pittsburgh or Virginia (probably more or less equally athletic as Tech).

Roof's counter to a consistently tough schedule has been to get his defense to hang around/force TO's and penalties. It's working, because with a great ball-control offense, extra possessions are gold.

4. The man probably wouldn't be stupid enough to blitz Virginia Tech's 8-foot-10 QB, twenty yards out of winning field goal range with 12 seconds left. That makes the change at DC worth it for no other reason.

 

[Boomergump]

A couple of comments:

FSU "came to play" or "had their best game of the year" because we had the weakest pass rush they had faced. JW had a ton of time and never got pushed off his mark. That guy will crush you under those circumstances. It was as simple as that in my mind. The kid made mistakes all year, but they were normally attributed to trying to do too much in the face of pressure.

I firmly believe, we were a pash rush away from being an undefeated national champion last season. That makes it sound like we are close, and maybe we are, but the most likely scenario is that it will take a little time to, once again, develop a legit pass rush. Hopefully, by the time it happens, we will still be riding this enormous offensive wave.

Our defense has some glaring issues personnel-wise, but you know what, CTR and staff got as much out of those guys as could ever be expected last year. Those guys played very well together as a unit. That is good coaching. They studied film and were very opportunistic reacting to opponent tendencies. That is good coaching. They tackled better than they have in years. That is good coaching.

I disagree with the sentiment that GT turns off the type of recruit that is good for defense i.e. "mean and nasty". Most athletes who are mean and nasty in terms of disposition away from the field aren't nearly as tough when things get difficult on the field. I have seen this over and over again coaching and in the Marines. Many times, guys you would never suspect, turn out to be the toughest SOBs when the crap hits the fan. If a guy is too nasty a person to consider GT, because of the civil culture that characterizes our football program, then he will probably not be all that tough anyway. We do face recruiting obstacles, but I don't think failing to find players with the requisite level of nastiness is one of them.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

One of my oldest friends, an actual GT grad no less, but kind of a passing football fan, once shared his opinion of our defensive woes.It is that because of a mix of various circumstances and interests, GT does not attract the kind of player a good defense needs. That is the mean, nasty and ill-tempered kid who goes out there to hurt people. He figures the qualities that make a player suited for that made for a bad GT fit. I figured it was kind of elitist but sometimes I wonder if he was on to something. That was after Groh was fired, and as Johnson would say, it still is what it is. I hope we are both wrong, because it makes for hard Saturdays when the offense has to score every time it gets the ball.

I have had a similar but somewhat different theory for several years.
I remember reading something years ago involving pro scouts, which may be dated now, for sure. But one pro scout said that the psychological testing on linemen, when it was correct, seemed to be mirrored in how they keep their lockers. To over simplify, offensive linemen like to keep their lockers more neat and orderly. Defensive linemen tended to keep messier lockers reflecting a psychology that likes to create chaos in the well ordered plans of others. There was more to it than that but in essence the ideal defensive player likes to tear down what others are attempting to build, take people down who are too up on their high horse, and generally try to show that the best laid plans of the high and mighty can all crumble like dust.

Anyway, if any of that is remotely true, I wonder about the profile of a Tech student who likes to build things and make them work and the ideal defensive player who likes to tear things apart and create chaos out of life's orders.

Like I said, this was an article from a very long time ago so it may no longer be valid. The article also said that defensive players were more prone to depression than their offensive counterparts.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

FSU "came to play" or "had their best game of the year" because we had the weakest pass rush they had faced. JW had a ton of time and never got pushed off his mark. That guy will crush you under those circumstances. It was as simple as that in my mind. The kid made mistakes all year, but they were normally attributed to trying to do too much in the face of pressure.

Fair enough. But I have to say some of the FSU games I watched, JW just took a while to get warmed up in the first half of games and some of those mistakes he made were unforced, like just not reading the coverage or throwing where he shouldn't.

 

[DCSS]

If a defensive player psychologically likes to tear things apart and create chaos, he would be the ideal management major.

 

[danny daniel]

Mean, nasty, and ill-tempered may be a helpful trait for a D player if properly disciplined and unselfishly behaved, but in my coaching and playing experience a D player needs to be a natural hitter who can move and likes it rough, needs to be able to find/follow the ball, and needs to be able to get off blocks (no patty-caking). A lot of good football players on O do not have all those characteristics but good D players will possess all three. If not a lot of good coaching will only make minor improvements in their performance. Paul Davis for example seems to have the required D traits + being disciplined and unselfish + a very good motor. Mean, nasty, and ill-tempered can be a +/_....depending.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

If a defensive player psychologically likes to tear things apart and create chaos, he would be the ideal management major.

 

[AE 87]

A couple of comments:

FSU "came to play" or "had their best game of the year" because we had the weakest pass rush they had faced. JW had a ton of time and never got pushed off his mark. That guy will crush you under those circumstances. It was as simple as that in my mind. The kid made mistakes all year, but they were normally attributed to trying to do too much in the face of pressure.

I firmly believe, we were a pash rush away from being an undefeated national champion last season. That makes it sound like we are close, and maybe we are, but the most likely scenario is that it will take a little time to, once again, develop a legit pass rush. Hopefully, by the time it happens, we will still be riding this enormous offensive wave.

Our defense has some glaring issues personnel-wise, but you know what, CTR and staff got as much out of those guys as could ever be expected last year. Those guys played very well together as a unit. That is good coaching. They studied film and were very opportunistic reacting to opponent tendencies. That is good coaching. They tackled better than they have in years. That is good coaching.

I disagree with the sentiment that GT turns off the type of recruit that is good for defense i.e. "mean and nasty". Most athletes who are mean and nasty in terms of disposition away from the field aren't nearly as tough when things get difficult on the field. I have seen this over and over again coaching and in the Marines. Many times, guys you would never suspect, turn out to be the toughest SOBs when the crap hits the fan. If a guy is too nasty a person to consider GT, because of the civil culture that characterizes our football program, then he will probably not be all that tough anyway. We do face recruiting obstacles, but I don't think failing to find players with the requisite level of nastiness is one of them.

If #111 in pts/dr D is "as much as could ever be expected," then that doesn't say much for our talent.

 

[jwsavhGT]

If a defensive player psychologically likes to tear things apart and create chaos, he would be the ideal management major.

I was a management major!

 

[Longestday]

I know I don't know, but I will apply my logic to what I think...

Defensive talent has inputs:

• Athletic ability (natural balance, coordination, twitch)
• Physical Attributes (height, body type, etc)
• Intelligence (able to learn your role, your team members roles, eyes in the right place, know the correct pursuit angles)
• Technique (learning your trade and combining the previous 3 points above)
• Hunger (How badly you want to be good at what you do and improve)
• Will (motor or how badly you want to get to the ball even if you have to run far every play)
• Mean Streak (hunger to hit and collide.... not fight or argue or yell )

If you are low in one area, you can make up for the missing area by being exceptional in others.

 

[gtalltheway]

Merlin Olsen? Michael Strahan? You don't have to be an off-the-field bully (or an idiot) to be a great QB hunter.

I don't think he means they are trying to actually hurt but he mean they have a meanness about them and most of your big time d players have that about them but I do agree there are great football players out there that are not like that but I would dare to say there are more great players that have a mean streak

 

[DCSS]

You have to be able to turn it on and turn it off.

http://gifsoup.com

 

[Skeptic]

...

I firmly believe, we were a pash rush away from being an undefeated national champion last season. That makes it sound like we are close, and maybe we are, but the most likely scenario is that it will take a little time to, once again, develop a legit pass rush. Hopefully, by the time it happens, we will still be riding this enormous offensive wave. ...

I more or less agree we were close, maybe because I want to believe. Don't pretend to know enough to say it was the best offense around but if there was one better I'd like to see it. It was made better because it was at times exquisite to watch and at those times I wondered if even Johnson fully realized what he had out there. But here's the question: if we assume the pass rush was the problem -- and it surely was against FSU and MSU; it was particularly egregious against MSU because it seemed to me that guy was a middlin' quality QB with slow feet but a big arm -- how do we fix it? How does GT recruit those guys, by position? More than one question but here's another: can anything be done substantively before maybe the best option QB in the country graduates?

 

[Skeptic]

He's our coach in waiting...unofficially

Well, shouldn't we kinda wait until he has actually accomplished what he was hired to accomplish? Or until the coach we have is not doing this football thing anymore? Or figure whether a defensive coach is the way to go in an offensive world? Particularly one whose experience as head ball coach is not that eye popping.

 

[UgaBlows]

Lighten up there Francis