CPJ Press Conference #ALCNvsGT

TooTall

TooTall

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GT has 728 wins in 125 years.
CPJ has 182 wins in 20 years.
CPJ has won 25% of the ENTIRE win total of GT Football, in a 6th of the time.
Yes it's including other schools he coached at but still, it's a good sign that he knows what he's doing when it comes to coaching.
 

bke1984

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AE 87 said:
Because he doesn't believe it's an accurate way of assessing the program.

If we had 3 straight 5 win seasons with no injury problems, then it would be reflective of a change in the state of the program.

We won 9 games just the year before last. We had a gp5 game cancelled last year as well as losing several bad bounce games. It is simply not accurate to see a downturn in the program.

I know it's all the rage these days to twist facts to fit a preconceived notion, but let's not.
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So here's a fair way to look at it I think...there are currently 8 teams we play every year:

Clemson
Georgia
Pittsburgh
Miami
North Carolina
Duke
Virginia
Virginia Tech

Pittsburgh wasn't on this list until 2013, so every season prior to that had 7 teams except when we played Clemson twice in 2009.

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A few things stand out to me:

1. 2014 and 2015 are the exceptions rather than the rules
2. 2016 and 2017 are far more the norm
3. We've only had 3 seasons in 10 years with a winning record against the teams we play every year (2 .500 seasons and 5 losing seasons)

If we'd gone 6-6 in 2015 no one would be talking about a downturn. That said, point #3 above is pretty sad. 9-win seasons are great, but they aren't what they once were. 9 wins in 11 games is much different than 9 wins in 13 games.

Simply put, we have to play much better against our year in/year out opponents.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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AE 87 said:
For the record, what CPJ said was something like, "If you go back 50 years or however far you want to go back, the average year is 6 and 6, so if you win 8 or 9, that's pretty good."

Now, I interpreted his response as saying that if you look at GT historically, this is what you've got. I did not interpret him as saying that this is good enough or that we should be satisfied with that. Earlier when asked about his expectations for the year, he said that we're going out looking to win every game. He did not answer that question by saying, well, we'll be happy if we win more than six.

While I am sympathetic to the idea that CPJ should be more politic about selling our program thru the media, I've come to accept that that's not his style nor will it ever be. Regardless of what I'd like to see.

With that being said, let's look at the data.

Regular Season Results (unverified data source):
For the last 51 years, starting with Bud's first year in 1967, GT has won 319 games or a little more than 6/season (52.9%).
Since we entered the ACC in 1983, the last 35 seasons, we've won 238 games or 6.8 games/season (55.9%).
After Bobby Ross, for the last 26 seasons, we've won 179 games or 6.9 games/season (57.4%).
For the last 20 years, we've won 175 games or 7.25 games/season (59.4%).
Under CPJ for the last 10 seasons, we've won 76 games or 7.6 games/season (58.5%).

Now, these stats obviously don't include strength of schedule. They also include Bowl wins (but maybe not every year?). Some might object that CPJ's wins include more FCS games, and others might counter that the ACC is a tougher league than it was in the past. They also don't take into account flunk-gate wins or any change in APR (which I believed became more stringent in 2006) which may have impacted recruiting.

FWIW, I think that just as might hope for a different kind of response from our Head Coach, I think that we could hope for a more thoughtful response from our fanbase. Saying, "To have a coach choose to run down the program and say 6-6 is about what should be expected and anything beyond that is good just doesn’t cut it for me" in my opinion completely misrepresents what he was saying.

IIRC, he was not responding to the question of expectations for the coming year but measuring the status of the program and whether it's had a down turn over the last few years. In 2016, just the year before last, we won 9 games. Last year, we were just a few plays from winning 8 or 9 in an 11 game season. Over 50 years, we haven't been a perennial 9 or 10 win program, so we shouldn't react like the sky is falling when we don't reach that goal every year. However, that doesn't mean that we still don't do our darndest to reach that goal.

Also averaging 8 regular season wins over the last 20 years would mean winning 67% of 12 game seasons and 73% of 11 game seasons. As I've said, we've won 59.4% of our games (about 7 and 5 on average) over the last 20 years.
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Understand that this is well before the day of most posters but there were times during the late 70s and early 80s when Bill Curry would have killed to have 6 wins in a season not to mention the upgrades done in facilities. Believe me, our situation now is light years better than it has been in the past. If we really wanted to make Georgia Tech into an elite or near elite football factory it would be simple:

Step One: Completely do away with recruiting restrictions or academic requirements from The Hill.

Step Two: Increase recruiting budget by say three or four fold to include paying players and providing certain um "amenities" just like UGA and Alabama

Step Three: Get rid of the triple option and PJ and go all out with a coach with utterly no scruples and a win a t all cost mentality

Step Four: Embrace a top ten ranking in the Fulmer Cup

Step Five: Arrange payment of top caliber talent by bagmen willing to do the dirty work so that the coach can have plausible deniability

Step Six: Find out what is the latest gimmick being employed by Clemson and copy it.

Rinse and Repeat until desired objective is achieved.
 
TooTall

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Ok so let's put this into perspective. In current day, which is when CPJ spoke, 6 wins means you lose 6. 6-6. And since CPJ is averaging almost 7.5 wins a year at GT, we are better under him than we are historically.
 

Boaty1

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tech_wreck47 said:
Give one example of someone tearing down the program to defend CPJ?
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Anyone who has agreed we are a 6-6 program historically. Sorry but we are not a 500 program historically and over the last 2 decades we average 7.75 wins and 5.05 losses. I think a reasonable person would say 8 wins has been average over the last 2 decades.

It seems pretty clear to me he is trying to lower the standard for our program to make himself look better. Honestly I'm not sure how everyone is not seeing it that way.
 

Deleted member 2897

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Boaty1 said:
Anyone who has agreed we are a 6-6 program historically. Sorry but we are not a 500 program historically and over the last 2 decades we average 7.75 wins and 5.05 losses. I think a reasonable person would say 8 wins has been average over the last 2 decades.

It seems pretty clear to me he is trying to lower the standard for our program to make himself look better. Honestly I'm not sure how everyone is not seeing it that way.
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CPJ is in year 12. So if you're looking at how we've done over the last 2 decades, you're (I'm sure accidentally) heaping praise on CPJ. I mean, if you read what you just wrote, CPJ has moved us to an 8 win program instead of our program length and 50 year length 6 win legacy.

3 Coastal Championships, 2 Orange Bowl wins, 1 ACC Championship, and we're winning 8+ games at 4x the historical frequency.
 
tech_wreck47

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Boaty1 said:
Anyone who has agreed we are a 6-6 program historically. Sorry but we are not a 500 program historically and over the last 2 decades we average 7.75 wins and 5.05 losses. I think a reasonable person would say 8 wins has been average over the last 2 decades.

It seems pretty clear to me he is trying to lower the standard for our program to make himself look better. Honestly I'm not sure how everyone is not seeing it that way.
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Did you not read the break down someone did of us historically? We are a 5.8 win team historically. That’s a fact not an opinion. So once again when has someone torn down the program? Also even if we were an 8 win average team, someone throwing a random number of 6 around isnt a hit taken at the program.

Also when everyone is not seeing it the way you are seeing it, you might want to re-evaluate.
 

Boaty1

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tech_wreck47 said:
Did you not read the break down someone did of us historically? We are a 5.8 win team historically. That’s a fact not an opinion. So once again when has someone torn down the program? Also even if we were an 8 win average team, someone throwing a random number of 6 around isnt a hit taken at the program.

Also when everyone is not seeing it the way you are seeing it, you might want to re-evaluate.
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I see several people seeing it the way I see it. And honestly I'll trust my own perspective.

The fact is whether you break it down over a 10 year, 20 year, 50 year or 100 year period GT is not a 500 program as CPJ suggests. If you claim that we are a 500 program then you are undervaluing what we have accomplished. I'm baffled I have to defend the program when talking to GT fans but it does show the power of group think. Unfortunately we see it all too often in society today.
 
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