Coronavirus Thread

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GTNavyNuke

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So now police officers are empowered to throw people in jail for not wearing masks. This will end well during a Defund The Police movement.
https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/03/which-deamany-black-men-fear-wearing-mask-more-than-coronavirus/

Missing a "not" as in now end well? Or just justifiable sarcasm?

In any event, after a really ****ty week, I don't need a bar to drink. Trying to get work done and maintain operations in the Navy is full of opportunities right now. The best reason we are getting things done is we have good military (not political) leadership.

Had anyone read all the 324 pages so far? I've read maybe 20%.

Peace.
 

RonJohn

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Yep, I guarantee you that you compare a 30 year old and a 70 year old with the same health issue (Let’s say 40 pounds overweight as an example) and the 70 year old is at a much more significant risk of adverse health effects from COVID-19.

But if you compare two people who are 40 lbs overweight, the 70 year old is more likely to have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and Type 2 diabetes than the 30 year old is to have any of those issues.
 

Deleted member 2897

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But if you compare two people who are 40 lbs overweight, the 70 year old is more likely to have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and Type 2 diabetes than the 30 year old is to have any of those issues.

Then I think you would need to compare them to someone with those issues at a younger age. That’s basically what the CDC said today - all things being equal, it’s not age that’s a risk factor, it’s the underlying health issues.
 

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On the lag in death reporting.



I think the lag in deaths should be 2-3+ weeks after hospitalizations. We are at 915 in S.C. now, up from 400 a month ago. We had 1 death statewide today. But we are only 2-3 weeks past the spike in TESTS...not hospitalizations yet. I’d say in 1 week we’ll know on deaths.
 

RonJohn

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Then I think you would need to compare them to someone with those issues at a younger age. That’s basically what the CDC said today - all things being equal, it’s not age that’s a risk factor, it’s the underlying health issues.

That is my take. My response was originally to your statement that the CDC's statement was bizarre.
 

LibertyTurns

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Met with the hospital, Health Dept folks, etc and no change to the overall guidance other than masks are (were) coming and somethings were going to be shutdown again (must have got head’s up about DeSantis shuttering the bars again).

Everyone wanted to know about the increase in cases & what it means. Here’s what they said in order of priority on why the numbers are going up:

a. Additional testing, they’ve raised testing by almost 300% in the past 2-3 weeks (That number seemed more like 250% to me but maybe he had non public data)
b. Higher percentage of people are positive #2. Gone from about 6% to 10+%. Need some medical explanation of “lite positive” because I really don’t understand other than it’s asymptomatic people are ringing the bell & they say that type’s “ok”???? These people are often associates of other people that have tested positive & are feeling well with no reason to have been tested otherwise.
c. Hot spots are getting hotter, ie Dade, Broward & Palm Beach & they are spiking the numbers. Better managed areas Hillsborough, Orange, Duval not as bad. They’ve done a poor job “down there” and it is what it is.
d. People that would have stayed at home & avoided the hospital are now coming in for tests because the fear of dying visiting hospitals & clinics for tests are reducing. Those people the disease would have come & gone and never been counted
e. The lack of fear of running out of tests means they can test young, possible “lite positives” where they wouldn’t before.
f. They are testing the nursing homes more but that’s dropping off week over week now as they don’t re-test positives.
g. Warmer weather is sending people in doors and closer quarters is providing an incubator like environment as people are packed in
h. Relaxing of social distancing, particularly in “c” above. The better managed cities have done better.

Now this is counter to the hysteria in the news but the death rate is not quite plummeting but the “lite positives” are not going to die or be hospitalized and they’re the majority of positives so the rate is going to decrease.

Driving towards herd immunity is speeding up, like big time. The thought this was going to die out was a hope. They are no where near being overwhelmed at the hospital so if it keeps going like this they’re fine.

Stay home if you’re old, health poor, etc, others wear masks, wash your hand, etc. Same guidance as before.
 

GTNavyNuke

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I think the lag in deaths should be 2-3+ weeks after hospitalizations. We are at 915 in S.C. now, up from 400 a month ago. We had 1 death statewide today. But we are only 2-3 weeks past the spike in TESTS...not hospitalizations yet. I’d say in 1 week we’ll know on deaths.

I just checked the Friday data. Decreasing deaths % of COVID deaths to total deaths as of two weeks ago.

I think it's going to be at least 3-4 weeks before we see the increase (from death certificates being filed and registered). One other aspect of future death rates is that the treatment in hospitals should be becoming more effective at preventing deaths.

Just remember (not directed at @bwelbo), if you hate wearing masks, you'll hate a CPAP more and a ventilator even more. You don't want to get sick from this virus because it will kick your *** although it is not likely to kill you.
 

ncjacket79

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Yea exactly - when you turn 55 or 65 or whatever, there is nothing magical that suddenly makes you extremely vulnerable. But the death rates for the elderly are undeniable. 80% of our deaths are found in 15% of the population (> 65). The mortality rates of those people once they get the disease are sky high, compared to about 0 for younger people.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/need-extra-precautions/older-adults.html

It just seems hilariously bizarre to look at this data and these charts and say age is not a risk factor. I guarantee you if you compare a 30 year old obese person to a 70 year old obese person both with COVID-19 that the hospitalization and mortality rates are wildly different.
As has been said the older you get the more health conditions in general you have. It makes perfect sense that those conditions are more of an indicator than simply age. Now when you add the two or also makes sense that the risk is higher than for a younger person but just being
old absent any underlying conditions would probably reduce your risk significantly
 

forensicbuzz

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Met with the hospital, Health Dept folks, etc and no change to the overall guidance other than masks are (were) coming and somethings were going to be shutdown again (must have got head’s up about DeSantis shuttering the bars again).

Everyone wanted to know about the increase in cases & what it means. Here’s what they said in order of priority on why the numbers are going up:

a. Additional testing, they’ve raised testing by almost 300% in the past 2-3 weeks (That number seemed more like 250% to me but maybe he had non public data)
b. Higher percentage of people are positive #2. Gone from about 6% to 10+%. Need some medical explanation of “lite positive” because I really don’t understand other than it’s asymptomatic people are ringing the bell & they say that type’s “ok”???? These people are often associates of other people that have tested positive & are feeling well with no reason to have been tested otherwise.
c. Hot spots are getting hotter, ie Dade, Broward & Palm Beach & they are spiking the numbers. Better managed areas Hillsborough, Orange, Duval not as bad. They’ve done a poor job “down there” and it is what it is.
d. People that would have stayed at home & avoided the hospital are now coming in for tests because the fear of dying visiting hospitals & clinics for tests are reducing. Those people the disease would have come & gone and never been counted
e. The lack of fear of running out of tests means they can test young, possible “lite positives” where they wouldn’t before.
f. They are testing the nursing homes more but that’s dropping off week over week now as they don’t re-test positives.
g. Warmer weather is sending people in doors and closer quarters is providing an incubator like environment as people are packed in
h. Relaxing of social distancing, particularly in “c” above. The better managed cities have done better.

Now this is counter to the hysteria in the news but the death rate is not quite plummeting but the “lite positives” are not going to die or be hospitalized and they’re the majority of positives so the rate is going to decrease.

Driving towards herd immunity is speeding up, like big time. The thought this was going to die out was a hope. They are no where near being overwhelmed at the hospital so if it keeps going like this they’re fine.

Stay home if you’re old, health poor, etc, others wear masks, wash your hand, etc. Same guidance as before.
I don't think they've decided if you could become reinfected and if so what that meant. There may be no such thing as herd immunity with this.
 

RamblinRed

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Met with the hospital, Health Dept folks, etc and no change to the overall guidance other than masks are (were) coming and somethings were going to be shutdown again (must have got head’s up about DeSantis shuttering the bars again).

Everyone wanted to know about the increase in cases & what it means. Here’s what they said in order of priority on why the numbers are going up:

a. Additional testing, they’ve raised testing by almost 300% in the past 2-3 weeks (That number seemed more like 250% to me but maybe he had non public data)
b. Higher percentage of people are positive #2. Gone from about 6% to 10+%. Need some medical explanation of “lite positive” because I really don’t understand other than it’s asymptomatic people are ringing the bell & they say that type’s “ok”???? These people are often associates of other people that have tested positive & are feeling well with no reason to have been tested otherwise.
c. Hot spots are getting hotter, ie Dade, Broward & Palm Beach & they are spiking the numbers. Better managed areas Hillsborough, Orange, Duval not as bad. They’ve done a poor job “down there” and it is what it is.
d. People that would have stayed at home & avoided the hospital are now coming in for tests because the fear of dying visiting hospitals & clinics for tests are reducing. Those people the disease would have come & gone and never been counted
e. The lack of fear of running out of tests means they can test young, possible “lite positives” where they wouldn’t before.
f. They are testing the nursing homes more but that’s dropping off week over week now as they don’t re-test positives.
g. Warmer weather is sending people in doors and closer quarters is providing an incubator like environment as people are packed in
h. Relaxing of social distancing, particularly in “c” above. The better managed cities have done better.

Now this is counter to the hysteria in the news but the death rate is not quite plummeting but the “lite positives” are not going to die or be hospitalized and they’re the majority of positives so the rate is going to decrease.

Driving towards herd immunity is speeding up, like big time. The thought this was going to die out was a hope. They are no where near being overwhelmed at the hospital so if it keeps going like this they’re fine.

Stay home if you’re old, health poor, etc, others wear masks, wash your hand, etc. Same guidance as before.

Good information. Hospitals tend to be fine until they aren't. You watch the trends and everything goes along ok and then it tends to explode. It will obviously depend upon how much it gets into the older population. I could see the delay being longer since it is starting more in younger populations. But it also helps that treatments in hospitals are much better now - saw a chart this evening from England where the death rate in hospitals has dropped over 75% from what is was back in March.
here is the FL specific chart for COVID information on deaths, cases, testing, testing % with 7 day averages (you may have to pick Florida)
https://public.tableau.com/profile/ckelly2528#!/vizhome/COVIDDashboard-Public/Introduction

Testing has increased recently, though if you use a 7-day rolling avg its only gone up about 13% in the last 3 weeks. (33,716 Jume 26 vs 29,793 for June 9). if you use just the raw number of the current day and the day 3 weeks ago the increase is about 200%, but that is not considered a good statistical way to measure the change. Too much day to day variation in totals and potential data dumps mean you need to use a multi-day avg to help smooth all that out.
Cases have risen to a 7 day avg of 4,745 from 1,222 (388% increase)
The positive test percentage has risen from 4.1% to 14.1%.
Fortunately deaths are still relatively flat going from an avg of 34 on 6/9 to 38 today.

FL is also tough because they don't publicly make their hospitalizations available, though this tableau workbook has that info from the state. Keep in mind the FL changed how they count ICU beds middle of this week. If a person is in an ICU bed but not using ICU services than they are not counting that bed as utilized.
https://public.tableau.com/profile/ckelly2528#!/vizhome/COVIDDashboard-Public/Introduction
Note that while Miami-Dade and Broward are getting hit harder in terms of cases, in terms of hospital beds Orange County is in a worse position currently. That will probably change if the cases continue to look as they do.
Orange Co has 17.72% of ICU beds still available (56), while Miami-Dade has 26.08% available (256) and Broward has 16.81% (79) and Palm Beach has 23.72% (97). At a state level FL is showing 21.32% of ICU beds still available. (1,290). Pinellas and Hillsborough around Tamps are both showing about 15-16% of ICU beds available.

I agree that the guidance remains the same. Key is for hopsitalizations not to spike like they did in TX and AZ. If it does that then hospitals will fill quick, if not then they should be ok.
The issue is that what happens in the next 10-14 days they basically have no control over, that is going to be due to whatever happened the last 2-3 weeks. What we do now will impact what things look like 2-3 maybe 4 weeks from now, not the next 7-10 days.
 

RamblinRed

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Some evening updates.
Harris Co, TX (Houston) sent out a Public Safety Alert tonight telling all residents to stay at home except for essential activities.


United States is one country whose citizens, along with Russia, Brazil and others that will be barred from traveling to the European Union.


I've also heard that Australia will ban travellers from most countries other than New Zealand, some Pacific Islands and a few East Asian nations that will be in a travel bubble for the rest of 2020.

Jefferson Co, AL (Birmingham) has issued a face mask ordinance. Anyone over 8 must wear a mask in all businesses and venues. Public Transportation as well. Not required outdoors unless you are in a group greater than 10
https://www.wvtm13.com/article/jefferson-county-health-department-gives-covid-19-update/32983389#

It also looks like theaters are basically dead for the forseeable future. Warner Brothers has moved Tenet and Disney has moved Mulan out of their July dates and into later in August. Until theaters are opened in NYC and LA it is unlikely any large movies would try to open and neither looks like they are going to open their theaters soon.
 

Techster

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Just remember (not directed at @bwelbo), if you hate wearing masks, you'll hate a CPAP more and a ventilator even more. You don't want to get sick from this virus because it will kick your *** although it is not likely to kill you.

There's a lot of runaway between catching the virus and dying. I'm not sure some grasp that. Not just in terms of one's health, but in terms of the economic and emotional impact.
 

GT_EE78

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But if you compare two people who are 40 lbs overweight, the 70 year old is more likely to have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and Type 2 diabetes than the 30 year old is to have any of those issues.
true, the question is which ones matter with respect to this chinese virus.
 

Deleted member 2897

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I just checked the Friday data. Decreasing deaths % of COVID deaths to total deaths as of two weeks ago.

I think it's going to be at least 3-4 weeks before we see the increase (from death certificates being filed and registered). One other aspect of future death rates is that the treatment in hospitals should be becoming more effective at preventing deaths.

Just remember (not directed at @bwelbo), if you hate wearing masks, you'll hate a CPAP more and a ventilator even more. You don't want to get sick from this virus because it will kick your *** although it is not likely to kill you.

Real time deaths (Johns Hopkins, what you read on the news) should be 3-5 weeks after cases Announced. Death certificate filings seem to be mostly close about 2 weeks after that.

My wife says the same thing - if you hate wearing a mask, you’ll really hate wearing a ventilator.
 

Deleted member 2897

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Met with the hospital, Health Dept folks, etc and no change to the overall guidance other than masks are (were) coming and somethings were going to be shutdown again (must have got head’s up about DeSantis shuttering the bars again).

Everyone wanted to know about the increase in cases & what it means. Here’s what they said in order of priority on why the numbers are going up:

a. Additional testing, they’ve raised testing by almost 300% in the past 2-3 weeks (That number seemed more like 250% to me but maybe he had non public data)
b. Higher percentage of people are positive #2. Gone from about 6% to 10+%. Need some medical explanation of “lite positive” because I really don’t understand other than it’s asymptomatic people are ringing the bell & they say that type’s “ok”???? These people are often associates of other people that have tested positive & are feeling well with no reason to have been tested otherwise.
c. Hot spots are getting hotter, ie Dade, Broward & Palm Beach & they are spiking the numbers. Better managed areas Hillsborough, Orange, Duval not as bad. They’ve done a poor job “down there” and it is what it is.
d. People that would have stayed at home & avoided the hospital are now coming in for tests because the fear of dying visiting hospitals & clinics for tests are reducing. Those people the disease would have come & gone and never been counted
e. The lack of fear of running out of tests means they can test young, possible “lite positives” where they wouldn’t before.
f. They are testing the nursing homes more but that’s dropping off week over week now as they don’t re-test positives.
g. Warmer weather is sending people in doors and closer quarters is providing an incubator like environment as people are packed in
h. Relaxing of social distancing, particularly in “c” above. The better managed cities have done better.

Now this is counter to the hysteria in the news but the death rate is not quite plummeting but the “lite positives” are not going to die or be hospitalized and they’re the majority of positives so the rate is going to decrease.

Driving towards herd immunity is speeding up, like big time. The thought this was going to die out was a hope. They are no where near being overwhelmed at the hospital so if it keeps going like this they’re fine.

Stay home if you’re old, health poor, etc, others wear masks, wash your hand, etc. Same guidance as before.

Tup a bunch of young people getting it really isn’t an issue. What worries me is even cases for those over 40 have more than doubled in the last few weeks. Hospitalizations are way up. If it’s not elderly but maybe people on their 40s, we can still come out okay. But I doubt that’s what it is. I hope to be wrong, but we will start to find out in about 7-14 days I think.
 
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