Coronavirus Thread

[Deleted member 2897]

I think the larger unspoken problem here is the damage that mitigation is doing to our society and to large numbers of people within it.

Getting sick is not that big a deal. There, I said it. Dying is a big deal. But getting sick really isn't. The idea hat a young person might get sick shouldn't frighten everyone. The fact that they become a carrier and might infect the few people who are seriously at risk is, but that can be successfully mitigated without disrupting (or destroying) whole swaths of existing society.

The media make money off of sowing fear and disinformation so in some respects I cannot blame them. The folks who believe that and unwaveringly peddle the same fear, unbalanced by the consequences, are the ones who do more harm than good.

Too many people will die because of depression and suicide when mental health services are shut down. Too many people are putting off medical procedures that should not be put off and in years ot come we will be reading about spikes in cancer deaths because of this pandemics scare tactics that are keeping people from even visiting hospitals.

Think about *that* for minute. Or two.

Exactly. Dr Fauci and other really smart people are droning on and on about how cases will increase if we open back up. Well who cares so long as the elderly and others at risk aren’t participating, thereby NOT leading to more hospitalizations. Then you’re talking about an average Flu season, which we’ve never cared about before.

 

[684Bee]

I don’t think you would have to force kids to play. You would have to force them not to play. The data shows that fit kids that age are as close to zero chance of an adverse health outcome as you can get. If your worry is there might be an undiagnosed AJ Gray out there, then we shouldn’t play football at all anyway. We play basketball right through the Flu season every year. And every year it rips through a good part of our team. This disease has no difference in risk to the Flu in that demographic.

This thing has really done a number on many people.

We are going to end up with about the same number of deaths as the Asian flu in the late 50’s, which some estimate killed 120,000 in the US and 1 to 2 million worldwide. The US population was much less then, so that’s equivalent to about 220,000 deaths now. The Hong Kong flu in the late 60’s was estimated at slightly less than the Asian flu in the US, killing about 180,000 on a population-adjusted basis.

The Asian flu ended up morphing into what later was the Hong Kong flu. The Hong Kong flu returned the next flu season and killed even more people. It remains today as a strain of seasonal flu.

These things are natural. They will keep happening. They do what they do, including killing people, even with a vaccine.

The problem is that now we’ve set a precedent for shutting down our country and allowing our freedom to be abridged.

 

[MWBATL]

The problem is that now we’ve set a precedent for shutting down our country and allowing our freedom to be abridged.

Exactly. We are running scared.

We are the elephant who has seen a mouse and backed up in fear, falling off the edge of the cliff all over.... a mouse.

 

[slugboy]

It confirmed what I suspected about outside areas being generally safer than enclosed spaces. There's a lot less chance of infection when exercise and recreation are done out-of-doors than there is in a gym.

I’ve read the Erin Bromage post and the Quillette article that inspired it and several others. For outdoor exercise, they’re talking about situations like joggers on the other side of the road from each other, well-spaced (more than 10’), and in short contact with each other. The amount of virus you’ll take up in that situation is small.

The reason I bring that up is I’ve seen outdoor parties in the park with 25 or so people, families setting up big get togethers in the park, and other activities where people are in close contact with each other for 45 minutes or an hour or so. That would have a lot of transmission. Some people have taken “outdoor activities are OK” without understanding the context.

Two of the big “superspreader” events have been curling and hockey. From what I understand, basketball and soccer should have the kind of issues (especially basketball).

Unfortunately, gyms are one of the areas, even with distancing, that should be high-risk.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

Any word on recoveries, hospitalizations, etc?

I found this article about it. 45 of the 60 got it (75%). 2 died and 3 are in the hospital according to the article.
https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-03-29/coronavirus-choir-outbreak

From a 2 hour choir practice. If they bring back football, they will need to test everyone maybe once a week until the vaccine is here.

 

[GCdaJuiceMan]

And then the twitter account with 1.5 million followers...

Shameful.

 

[4shotB]

The unequal enforcement of their policies there is the bigger problem. John doesn’t want political arguments on his site, and this is the easiest way for him to accomplish that.

I am not John and have not spoken to him personally on this issue, but if he really didn't want political arguments here on this site, wouldn't you agree that there is an even easier and far more obvious solution imo that would remove any question whatsoever of "unequal" moderation?

 

[GTRX7]

You say this like it's bad....Sweden has tried gambling on the herd immunity theory....and only in the long run (like in about 12 months) will we all know whether they were right...or wrong. But, either way, you are playing with peoples' lives....either way (which is something that is all too often forgotten, or not given sufficient prominence imho).

Yeah, that is just wrong. Those countries rates of new cases and deaths are low because they locked down earlier and harder. They now have sufficient testing, PPE, and we seem to be getting effective treatments, if not a vaccine for a while. None of those countries will get anywhere close to the death rate of Sweden, even in the long run. More than that, they are all now opening up as well, as new cases are so low and testing so high they can better track and quarantine additional spread. That means they will likely also have a better long term economic outcome than Sweden too.

Sweden literally has the 6th worst death rate (deaths per population) in the entire world (out of almost 200 countries) and it still hasn’t really started seeing any consistent decline yet. Sweden was the one that ended up playing with people’s lives.

 

[FredJacket]

For you Georgia folks following your state closer than I. I happened to just go look at Ga's C19 page for the 1st time. Aren't you guys approaching the 2 week mark on the governor 'reopening' the state? Granted the way they are reporting the data, the curve will likely be changing some. But doesn't it look like no spike / resurgence is occurring? Too early to tell?

https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

Yeah, that is just wrong. Those countries rates of new cases and deaths are low because they locked down earlier and harder. They now have sufficient testing, PPE, and we seem to be getting effective treatments, if not a vaccine for a while. None of those countries will get anywhere close to the death rate of Sweden, even in the long run. More than that, they are all now opening up as well, as new cases are so low and testing so high they can better track and quarantine additional spread. That means they will likely also have a better long term economic outcome than Sweden too.

Sweden literally has the 6th worst death rate (deaths per population) in the entire world (out of almost 200 countries) and it still hasn’t really started seeing any consistent decline yet. Sweden was the one that ended up playing with people’s lives.

Sweden's experiment could have been good if they had followed through with what they said. To protect those at risk. But they did not have PPE in their nursing homes and they did not protect the care givers so they exposed the elderly.

ie. the death rate is not from the experiment, it is from not protecting those at risk like they said originally.

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

For you Georgia folks following your state closer than I. I happened to just go look at Ga's C19 page for the 1st time. Aren't you guys approaching the 2 week mark on the governor 'reopening' the state? Granted the way they are reporting the data, the curve will likely be changing some. But doesn't it look like no spike / resurgence is occurring? Too early to tell?

https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report

Opposed to what the major news likes to report, people are not stupid, they are not mindless minions following their idiot leaders. Before the shelter in place order a lot of people were already doing it. Then when the open back up came, it is not like there was some wild horde of people hitting the streets because our beloved leader said to open up. Not picking on you, people are being cautious and trying to do what is smart

 

[Jacket4Life]

One thing this virus has done is remind my why I hate politics, and politicians.

 

[684Bee]

Opposed to what the major news likes to report, people are not stupid, they are not mindless minions following their idiot leaders. Before the shelter in place order a lot of people were already doing it. Then when the open back up came, it is not like there was some wild horde of people hitting the streets because our beloved leader said to open up. Not picking on you, people are being cautious and trying to do what is smart

Exactly.

 

[684Bee]

One thing this virus has done is remind my why I hate politics, and politicians.

Yes. I’d be ok with paying these folks more, if they would agree to do less and leave me alone. Here’s double your salary. Now, go have your fancy DC lunches and feel important, but otherwise leave the rest of us alone to actually be productive citizens.

 

[dtm1997]

View attachment 8307

And then the twitter account with 1.5 million followers...

View attachment 8308


Shameful.

Per their Instagram, The Cheetah is reopening on May 20th.

Not sure how that's feasible, but it appears to be happening.

 

[684Bee]

Per their Instagram, The Cheetah is reopening on May 20th.

Not sure how that's feasible, but it appears to be happening.

There’s plenty of men who’ve risked way more than a fever and a cough to see a nekkid woman. That’s what keeps the world going round.

Cue Peabo Bryson singing, “Tale* as old as time....”

*maybe should change tale to tail in this case.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I am not John and have not spoken to him personally on this issue, but if he really didn't want political arguments here on this site, wouldn't you agree that there is an even easier and far more obvious solution imo that would remove any question whatsoever of "unequal" moderation?

Well political arguments and unequal moderation are two different topics. He’s accomplished his goal of getting political arguing off the site. In terms of the moderation topic, IIWII. The last time I got a warning, it was for excessive arguing...for telling someone repeatedly to stop trying to pick fights. But you can’t argue by yourself and the other people in that argument had no repercussions. The previous warning I got to that one was when someone posted that all of the coronavirus victims were about to die anyway and we should go on about our lives – I called that person a selfish bastard and I got a warning for it...but they didn’t. I mean, I can see that one for me, but still. The warning before that someone was trying to pick a fight and I didn’t want to get in trouble for cursing, so I put a bunch of random jibberish asterisks instead...and got a warning. John said that was an implied threat LOL. He has told me before that other moderators came to my defense and convinced him to change his mind. IIWII. If you look at the current terms of the site, it’s not just personal attacks and trolling that are against the rules. You can be excessively argumentative, which I hadn’t really paid attention to until a couple weeks ago - and I’ve been guilty of that type of behavior at times and I own that admission. So that is my bad, and I am totally fine with adhering to that. But again, it is not uniformly enforced. IIWII. I used to not have anybody on ignore, and as of this morning I am up to like six or eight people. When people make provocative inflammatory argumentative statements, I can’t expect that they get in trouble for it, so I just have to move on now. IIWII.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

I found this article about it. 45 of the 60 got it (75%). 2 died and 3 are in the hospital according to the article.
https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-03-29/coronavirus-choir-outbreak

From a 2 hour choir practice. If they bring back football, they will need to test everyone maybe once a week until the vaccine is here.

I mean, the lady who died was 83 years old. CTE is infinitely more dangerous to 20-year old kids than the coronavirus.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I think the larger unspoken problem here is the damage that mitigation is doing to our society and to large numbers of people within it.

Getting sick is not that big a deal. There, I said it. Dying is a big deal. But getting sick really isn't. The idea hat a young person might get sick shouldn't frighten everyone. The fact that they become a carrier and might infect the few people who are seriously at risk is, but that can be successfully mitigated without disrupting (or destroying) whole swaths of existing society.

The media make money off of sowing fear and disinformation so in some respects I cannot blame them. The folks who believe that and unwaveringly peddle the same fear, unbalanced by the consequences, are the ones who do more harm than good.

Too many people will die because of depression and suicide when mental health services are shut down. Too many people are putting off medical procedures that should not be put off and in years ot come we will be reading about spikes in cancer deaths because of this pandemics scare tactics that are keeping people from even visiting hospitals.

Think about *that* for minute. Or two.

FDR's words that "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself" had never rung more true than it does today. We are being driven by and into fear by an unscrupulous, uncaring, often uninformed media, as well as certain politicians who benefit off our fears.

 

[Supersizethatorder-mutt]

I found this article about it. 45 of the 60 got it (75%). 2 died and 3 are in the hospital according to the article.
https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-03-29/coronavirus-choir-outbreak

From a 2 hour choir practice. If they bring back football, they will need to test everyone maybe once a week until the vaccine is here.

You said, "...they will need to test everyone maybe once a week until the vaccine is here." That potentially means until the end of time, because there is no guarantee that a successful vaccine will ever be developed. There are quite a few diseases for which vaccines have never been found, and that could possibly be the case here as well.