Conference Realignment

[CEB]

The ACC isn’t going to disappear. It is not that the ACC is falling in comparison to others, it’s that others are accelerating ahead. Those are very different dynamics.

Tech was in the Southern Conference and left it to form the SEC. It left the ACC to become independent. It was on the outside looking and and wasting away. It tried to get back into the SEC but was rebuffed. Still, even as late as the 1990’s, the gap between spend per player in the SEC was higher, but it wasn’t obscenely higher. Today it is.

What differentiated the ACC from others 40 years ago was basketball dominance. That is gone. FSU and Miami were supposed to elevate the conference and they did, until both football programs went dormant. The ACC would be in a very different space if the FSU and Miami of the 1990’s had maintained their football reputations. Neither did.

Today, the game of athletics is entertainment and media drives it now. Kim King spoke to this 30 years ago and summed it up … “Tech doesn’t have the resources to win a Natty today, but it does have the resources to be a consistent Top 25.”

None of this is new. It’s been evolving for at least 30 years, but like most things, it’s accelerating. But, if South Alabama or Tulane or Cincinnati can field competitive teams, so can GT. I’m kinda excited about playing Stanford, and Cal and looking forward to the future.

I agree with all of this; excellent points. The ACC is certainly being outpaced. What I think most find frustrating (and deem it regression) is what seems to be a matter of fact approach. ACC desires to maintain “slow and steady,” when others have rushed ahead. The ACC feels like it has become very conservative and a “follower” rather than innovative and leading.
I do think the ACC is much stronger than most believe, but with perception the way it is, it would take only a couple of schools to get squirrelly to set dominoes in motion. Hopefully the silent majority of the ACC is strong because FSU zealots are sowing lots of discord

 

[stinger78]

IMO, a conference has to be very careful how it positions itself in all this. I see no guarantee that the big money will continue ad infinitum. Signs are already evident that the system is stressed. It may be better at this point to be a close follower rather than leader.

 

[forensicbuzz]

With the direction TV $$ is going, I'm not sure when the SEC and B1G renegotiate their next contracts ('30 and '34) if the value of the contracts won't be less than they are now. If that is so, the ACC may have the higher-paying contract (for at least a couple of years).

 

[SunBum]

You know, if FSU is bound and determined to get the heck out of the ACC, no matter the cost and they're going to go whether it's this year, next year or 203x, I guess it behooves the rest of us that they get their panties in such a wad that they'll foot the cost now so that the we get something out of the deal (whatever percentage of the exit fee and GOR penalties).

Meanwhile Clemson and UNC...

 

[Vespidae]

I agree with all of this; excellent points. The ACC is certainly being outpaced. What I think most find frustrating (and deem it regression) is what seems to be a matter of fact approach. ACC desires to maintain “slow and steady,” when others have rushed ahead. The ACC feels like it has become very conservative and a “follower” rather than innovative and leading.
I do think the ACC is much stronger than most believe, but with perception the way it is, it would take only a couple of schools to get squirrelly to set dominoes in motion. Hopefully the silent majority of the ACC is strong because FSU zealots are sowing lots of discord

This is only my opinion from a strategy point of view. The third player in almost any stable industry is the most innovative. They have to be ... otherwise, they slowly lose market share because the larger players can offer the same value for less by spreading over a wider market.

The SEC (since that is everyone's favorite whipping boy) has behind the scenes rules/guidelines/suggestions to deliver a consistent, conference-wide product of entertainment. The athletic departments are intertwined to the point that it's like different hotel brands all under the IHG or Marriott label. Spend rates, investment rates, etc ... are all organized conference wide.

The ACC, to my knowledge, doesn't do this and neither do many others. They let each school do their own thing rather than work as a conference to secure a more competitive position. Everyone complains about the SEC but this is exactly what they have been doing for decades. Rinse and repeat.

The ACC needs to find innovations that make for a better game day experience, a product consumers want, supported by technology that people use. Cashless concessions, expedited entry lines for season ticket holders, special VIP promos, etc are all part of the total fan experience. I was a big supporter for simply faster games because attention span for many has reduced significantly. Stadium sight lines have been re-engineered and many SEC (and other schools) have redeveloped their facilities to accommodate the demand. None of the ACC schools have (to my knowledge).

I could go on and on. I don't think the ACC is as inept as many claim, but they do appear to be simply trying to follow the B1G or SEC instead of being the innovator. Which is what they should do.

Again, just my opinion.

 

[CEB]

You know, if FSU is bound and determined to get the heck out of the ACC, no matter the cost and they're going to go whether it's this year, next year or 203x, I guess it behooves the rest of us that they get their panties in such a wad that they'll foot the cost now so that the we get something out of the deal (whatever percentage of the exit fee and GOR penalties).

Meanwhile Clemson and UNC...

There is no coming back for them and the “one bad apple” axiom is screaming for us to make sure the check cashes and show them the door!

 

[CEB]

This is only my opinion from a strategy point of view. The third player in almost any stable industry is the most innovative. They have to be ... otherwise, they slowly lose market share because the larger players can offer the same value for less by spreading over a wider market.

The SEC (since that is everyone's favorite whipping boy) has behind the scenes rules/guidelines/suggestions to deliver a consistent, conference-wide product of entertainment. The athletic departments are intertwined to the point that it's like different hotel brands all under the IHG or Marriott label. Spend rates, investment rates, etc ... are all organized conference wide.

The ACC, to my knowledge, doesn't do this and neither do many others. They let each school do their own thing rather than work as a conference to secure a more competitive position. Everyone complains about the SEC but this is exactly what they have been doing for decades. Rinse and repeat.

The ACC needs to find innovations that make for a better game day experience, a product consumers want, supported by technology that people use. Cashless concessions, expedited entry lines for season ticket holders, special VIP promos, etc are all part of the total fan experience. I was a big supporter for simply faster games because attention span for many has reduced significantly. Stadium sight lines have been re-engineered and many SEC (and other schools) have redeveloped their facilities to accommodate the demand. None of the ACC schools have (to my knowledge).

I could go on and on. I don't think the ACC is as inept as many claim, but they do appear to be simply trying to follow the B1G or SEC instead of being the innovator. Which is what they should do.

Again, just my opinion.

A very valid opinion at that. I am hoping you’re right and I am looking forward to whatever innovation bomb the ACC drops on college athletics.

When history looks back on civilization’s greatest achievements I hope to find the ACC on the list somewhere between the wheel and sliced bread.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

The song remains the same…

Many college sports fans (and many within the ACC) are still accepting it. @SOWEGA Jacket is one of many. This board (several of us at least) is part of a very small and likely shrinking minority of folks who don’t see the inevitable decline (or dissolution) of the ACC. Not to say it won’t happen, or it can’t happen, but that it shouldn’t happen. The ACC will not crumble with FSU’s departure. That is FSU pounding their chest and spewing Internet propaganda. It won’t crumble if FSU and one to two other schools depart either. It will crumble when (if) the middle third of the conference panics and begins making desperate decisions.
To your overarching point, the ACC needs to get its s#** together, advocate for itself, and shore up the 12 or so schools that are not going to get full shares from the BIG or SEC.

Yep. We keep waiting for the ACC to get off the starting line when it comes to getting its act together.

 

[slugboy]

This is only my opinion from a strategy point of view. The third player in almost any stable industry is the most innovative. They have to be ... otherwise, they slowly lose market share because the larger players can offer the same value for less by spreading over a wider market.

The SEC (since that is everyone's favorite whipping boy) has behind the scenes rules/guidelines/suggestions to deliver a consistent, conference-wide product of entertainment. The athletic departments are intertwined to the point that it's like different hotel brands all under the IHG or Marriott label. Spend rates, investment rates, etc ... are all organized conference wide.

The ACC, to my knowledge, doesn't do this and neither do many others. They let each school do their own thing rather than work as a conference to secure a more competitive position. Everyone complains about the SEC but this is exactly what they have been doing for decades. Rinse and repeat.

The ACC needs to find innovations that make for a better game day experience, a product consumers want, supported by technology that people use. Cashless concessions, expedited entry lines for season ticket holders, special VIP promos, etc are all part of the total fan experience. I was a big supporter for simply faster games because attention span for many has reduced significantly. Stadium sight lines have been re-engineered and many SEC (and other schools) have redeveloped their facilities to accommodate the demand. None of the ACC schools have (to my knowledge).

I could go on and on. I don't think the ACC is as inept as many claim, but they do appear to be simply trying to follow the B1G or SEC instead of being the innovator. Which is what they should do.

Again, just my opinion.

With what the Big 12 is doing in basketball, maybe they show signs of being innovative—or willing to be innovative.

I’d hope our ESPN partners would be open to the ACC trying new ideas. I think they’re even involved with the current iteration of the XFL.

 

[TechPhi97]

This is what I see as well. Say F$U and Clemson somehow both jump. Who does the ACC add to replace them? I’d probably start with OK State and Kansas. We’d not be replacing Dook and UVA, we’d be replacing two ACC academic bottom feeders. Those might even be academic upgrades. Kansas definitely helps basketball and OK State has put some good baseball teams on the diamond in addition to solid football. That would be an interesting swap.

Yep, I think OK State, Kansas and maybe Houston are the top targets. Probably looking for broader geographic groupings and big TV markets. Houston gives you a totally different market within Texas.

 

[orientalnc]

This is what I see as well. Say F$U and Clemson somehow both jump. Who does the ACC add to replace them? I’d probably start with OK State and Kansas. We’d not be replacing Dook and UVA, we’d be replacing two ACC academic bottom feeders. Those might even be academic upgrades. Kansas definitely helps basketball and OK State has put some good baseball teams on the diamond in addition to solid football. That would be an interesting swap.

How about Cal, Stanford and SMU?

 

[CEB]

How about Cal, Stanford and SMU?

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

For some reason, I am excited that Stanford is now in our conference. I wish we played them this year

 

[WreckinGT]

Yep, I think OK State, Kansas and maybe Houston are the top targets. Probably looking for broader geographic groupings and big TV markets. Houston gives you a totally different market within Texas.

Im honestly not sure what is making you guys think that teams in the Big 12 will want to move to the ACC.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Im honestly not sure what is making you guys think that teams in the Big 12 will want to move to the ACC.

The fact that teams in the ACC make more money from their TV contract than the Big-12?

 

[WreckinGT]

The fact that teams in the ACC make more money from their TV contract than the Big-12?

Currently yes. By about 9 million per team. The Big 12 gets to renegotiate this 5 years before the ACC gets to renegotiate their contract which would most likely bring it closer if not above. Is that amount of money worth the current instability of going to the ACC and leaving your current rivals? We don't even have assurance yet that ESPN will keep paying us post 2027. What does ESPN do with that option if FSU, Clemson, and others decide to leave?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Currently yes. By about 9 million per team. The Big 12 gets to renegotiate this 5 years before the ACC gets to renegotiate their contract which would most likely bring it closer if not above. Is that amount of money worth the current instability of going to the ACC and leaving your current rivals? We don't even have assurance yet that ESPN will keep paying us post 2027. What does ESPN do with that option if FSU, Clemson, and others decide to leave?

Considering the PAC-12 when it still included USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon Couldn't get a deal as good as the ACC it's highly doubtful a Big-12 sans Texas and Oklahoma approach what we have.

As far as the option with ESPN, unless we lose this lawsuit with FSU and a bunch of teams depart which is highly unlikely, then ESPN would be foolish not to exercise the option.

 

[UgaBlows]

Yep, I think OK State, Kansas and maybe Houston are the top targets. Probably looking for broader geographic groupings and big TV markets. Houston gives you a totally different market within Texas.

Those schools would have to pay the big12 a buyout and are under a GOR also, how could the ACC go after them and why would they even want to go to the ACC?

 

[stinger78]

Im honestly not sure what is making you guys think that teams in the Big 12 will want to move to the ACC.

Same reason teams in the ACC are looking to move to the SEC/B1G?

 

[stinger78]

Considering the PAC-12 when it still included USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon Couldn't get a deal as good as the ACC it's highly doubtful a Big-12 sans Texas and Oklahoma approach what we have.

As far as the option with ESPN, unless we lose this lawsuit with FSU and a bunch of teams depart which is highly unlikely, then ESPN would be foolish not to exercise the option.

The ACC is not a conference with football cache’ but the conference hate here is palpable with many. It might be helpful to walk back to 1978 and relive how the ACC saved our bacon when a UGAg-led SEC refused us with hat in hand.