Coaching Carousel 6 - You can't make everyone happy. You are not bacon.

RamblinRed

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Larry Brown says hello. Nuggets, Nets, then Kansas, then back to an NBA successful career.
didn't stay in college very long though (I guess you could say he never stayed anywhere very long) and went back to the NBA fairly quickly.
 

RamblinRed

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6 yrs bruh. Not exactly a one night stand like you intimated.
He spent 5 yrs at Kansas (83-84, 84-85, 85-86, 86-87, 87-88) and 4 at SMU. You can add the 2 yrs at UCLA as well. But that is 11 years out of a over 40 yr coaching career
I just see him as a pro coach that dabbled in college from time to time. He was successful in college, he just did not choose to stay in it very long.

5 yrs is not that long of a time at any school. That's a pretty standard gig before a move is made for a bad coach (and he wasn't a bad coach he was a very good coach.)
 

Milwaukee

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He spent 5 yrs at Kansas (83-84, 84-85, 85-86, 86-87, 87-88) and 4 at SMU. You can add the 2 yrs at UCLA as well. But that is 11 years out of a over 40 yr coaching career
I just see him as a pro coach that dabbled in college from time to time. He was successful in college, he just did not choose to stay in it very long.

5 yrs is not that long of a time at any school. That's a pretty standard gig before a move is made for a bad coach (and he wasn't a bad coach he was a very good coach.)
😂 really?? That’s your hill? 😂 5-6yrs is a pit stop? Stop it.
 

RamblinRed

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😂 really?? That’s your hill? 😂 5-6yrs is a pit stop? Stop it.
Yeah it is. If you are successful at a really high major, you stay a decade or more. How many coaches leave a top of a line P5 job after 5 years when they have been successful.

His entire career he never stayed more than 6 yrs at any job (Sixsers). He just always seemed to have a strong sense of wanderlust to me.
 

Milwaukee

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Yeah it is. If you are successful at a really high major, you stay a decade or more. How many coaches leave a top of a line P5 job after 5 years when they have been successful.

His entire career he never stayed more than 6 yrs at any job (Sixsers). He just always seemed to have a strong sense of wanderlust to me.
Wow lol. Let’s talk about reaches 😂
 

tbglover

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Yeah it is. If you are successful at a really high major, you stay a decade or more. How many coaches leave a top of a line P5 job after 5 years when they have been successful.

His entire career he never stayed more than 6 yrs at any job (Sixsers). He just always seemed to have a strong sense of wanderlust to me.
So if Larry Brown has never stayed anywhere more than 6 years then him being somewhere 4 or 5 years is a long time for him not a short tenure. He has plenty of short tenures including his time at UCLA.
 

kg01

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Mike Woodson was a good NBA coach. Was certainly good enough that he should've been given more than the two shots he got. He led the Knicks to 50+ wins and their only playoff series win in about 20+ years.

He won like 12 games his first year with a tanking Hawks team and ultimately led the same core group to multiple playoff years. It's a shame he was relegated to asst coach when other dregs kept getting job after job.

He'll succeed at IN only if he embraces the differences in the college job the way Ewing seems to have done at Georgetown. If he does, this will be a good hire. But that's a huge if.
 

slugboy

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He won like 12 games his first year with a tanking Hawks team and ultimately led the same core group to multiple playoff years. It's a shame he was relegated to asst coach when other dregs kept getting job after job.

The Spirit Group Hawks weren’t tanking; they were trying to build a “long and lean” team based mostly off wingspan. They were a hot mess with a terrible front office.
They drafted Sheldon Williams with a lottery pick. Josh Childress played in Greece to get away from the team. They got massively better when Larry Drew took over coaching, and more so under Budenholzer.
Woodson did have to overcome one of the worst GMs in Hawks history, though
 

kg01

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The Spirit Group Hawks weren’t tanking; they were trying to build a “long and lean” team based mostly off wingspan. They were a hot mess with a terrible front office.
They drafted Sheldon Williams with a lottery pick. Josh Childress played in Greece to get away from the team. They got massively better when Larry Drew took over coaching, and more so under Budenholzer.
Woodson did have to overcome one of the worst GMs in Hawks history, though

First of all, curse you for bringing back bad memories. I thought we were friends? 😢

I guess I should elaborate. The A$G Hawks had bottomed out when Woodson got there. So tanking vs not-tanking is kind of in the eye of the beholder.

Not only did they draft Sheldon Williams, they telegraphed to the entire league they were going to do so. So, instead of trading down and gaining assets like a good GM would do, they played their hand weeks prior to the draft and totally blew things. As if taking him wasn't fool enough.

Childress left for more money than any NBA team was willing to pay him. There's a reason that move was the effective end of his career.

And I dispute that they got better under Drew. I'd say the tide was moving in that direction anyway. Drew was just the happy recipient after a coaching change (which was due).

I'd also say the front office got massively better by the time Drew got there, thus the direction of the team did as well. Budenholzer was another step up from there ... until he was given GM duties *shudders*
 

dtm1997

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First of all, curse you for bringing back bad memories. I thought we were friends? 😢

I guess I should elaborate. The A$G Hawks had bottomed out when Woodson got there. So tanking vs not-tanking is kind of in the eye of the beholder.

Not only did they draft Sheldon Williams, they telegraphed to the entire league they were going to do so. So, instead of trading down and gaining assets like a good GM would do, they played their hand weeks prior to the draft and totally blew things. As if taking him wasn't fool enough.

Childress left for more money than any NBA team was willing to pay him. There's a reason that move was the effective end of his career.

And I dispute that they got better under Drew. I'd say the tide was moving in that direction anyway. Drew was just the happy recipient after a coaching change (which was due).

I'd also say the front office got massively better by the time Drew got there, thus the direction of the team did as well. Budenholzer was another step up from there ... until he was given GM duties *shudders*
LOL! I used to see BIlly Knight at GT games. Always had a big bag of popcorn. No notebook to take notes on players. Seemed to love popcorn though.
 

slugboy

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First of all, curse you for bringing back bad memories. I thought we were friends? 😢

I guess I should elaborate. The A$G Hawks had bottomed out when Woodson got there. So tanking vs not-tanking is kind of in the eye of the beholder.

Not only did they draft Sheldon Williams, they telegraphed to the entire league they were going to do so. So, instead of trading down and gaining assets like a good GM would do, they played their hand weeks prior to the draft and totally blew things. As if taking him wasn't fool enough.

Childress left for more money than any NBA team was willing to pay him. There's a reason that move was the effective end of his career.

And I dispute that they got better under Drew. I'd say the tide was moving in that direction anyway. Drew was just the happy recipient after a coaching change (which was due).

I'd also say the front office got massively better by the time Drew got there, thus the direction of the team did as well. Budenholzer was another step up from there ... until he was given GM duties *shudders*
I should look on YouTube for videos of Josh Smith hoisting up 3’s if you’re feeling nostalgic.

We discussed Larry Brown coaching in the 80’s. In that era, recruiting was hard, but it’s not as brutal as it is now. You’d have a 5* for three years. Woodson is going to be under pressure to recruit one or more star players to Indiana every year. As far as I know, he’s never recruited, and the Indiana fans are expecting Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Gonzaga-level recruiting SOON.

Woodson needs to find 20 hours a week to see all the Nike circuit games, plus coach. He’ll need killer assistants, at least.
 

GT_EE78

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Woodson is likely a popular pick due to the Knight legacy.
no experience at college recruiting is a concern and where much effort will need to focus.
yup- the hotseat will come faster there if he's not successful
 

kg01

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I should look on YouTube for videos of Josh Smith hoisting up 3’s if you’re feeling nostalgic.

We discussed Larry Brown coaching in the 80’s. In that era, recruiting was hard, but it’s not as brutal as it is now. You’d have a 5* for three years. Woodson is going to be under pressure to recruit one or more star players to Indiana every year. As far as I know, he’s never recruited, and the Indiana fans are expecting Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Gonzaga-level recruiting SOON.

Woodson needs to find 20 hours a week to see all the Nike circuit games, plus coach. He’ll need killer assistants, at least.

Now I know you hate me. If you really want to blow your mind though, consider two things:

1. Compare Smith's percentages and shot selection to the stuff some guys are doing in the NBA today. You'll find that both are comparable to some dudes that are considered "good" shooters. To be clear, I'm not saying Smith is or was a good shooter. I'm saying the bar has slid way down.

2. Listen to Warriors people discuss their defense and roster building. You'll find the principles they built on were the same as those Billy Knight touted. Again, to be clear, I'm not saying Knight was a good GM or anything. Just that it's interesting to see a successful iteration of it work yet no one remembers Knight saying the same stuff years before.

I totally agree on Woodson's path to success at IU. He's got a lot of work ahead of him. For their sake, I hope he recognizes it.
 
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