VT Fumble Comparison

dressedcheeseside

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It's the same thing as a 5 man front, so you would attack it the same way as you would if the defense just lined up that way rather than blitzing to it. The BIG difference and advantage to the defense is that it puts a super-fast guy trying to squirt through that hole rather than a big ugly trying to power through it. So, we've got to attack speed with speed. We've got to have an OT out there with the ability, training, and tenacity to take that guy out. Chamberlain couldn't do it last year. Can he do it this year? I think he's getting better. I also think he's got the ability with his quickness. He just needs more training to recognize early and know what angle to take to cut him off. And, he needs the DESIRE - to have the mindset, "We win this game if I make this block. I'm going to hurt this guy. He's never going to want to come through here again and Bud Foster will regret calling this defense again." CPJ and CMS can help with the first part and CDM can help with the second. :)

Also, that blitzer has to be shaken of his confidence of the snap count timing. One extra millisecond of hesitation on his part can be the difference in a big play for us or them. Seems like we're working on that too with the no-huddle, motion of AB then reset, and going on a different count. All good things.
I'll buy the timing strategy. As for the 'we need a better OT', if that's what we're hanging our hat on, we're screwed. I doubt any other OT we've ever had at GT makes that play and it's because of three things: 1) the guy blitzing is faster, as you pointed out, 2) the splits are huge and 3) the blitzer is not only lining up against air, he's in his DT's back pocket he's so close to him. Angle and leverage is all in his favor (and speed, too, but I already said that.)

What's the rule about adjusting the OL spacing once they're all in stance? Can we just tighten up the gaps if they do that? Other teams actually stand up the entire OL and look to the sidelines.

What about checking away from that side and having the B back track straight to him and knock his block off? That would make him think twice.
 

vamosjackets

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I'll buy the timing strategy. As for the 'we need a better OT', if that's what we're hanging our hat on, we're screwed. I doubt any other OT we've ever had at GT makes that play and it's because of three things: 1) the guy blitzing is faster, as you pointed out, 2) the splits are huge and 3) the blitzer is not only lining up against air, he's in his DT's back pocket he's so close to him. Angle and leverage is all in his favor (and speed, too, but I already said that.)

What's the rule about adjusting the OL spacing once they're all in stance? Can we just tighten up the gaps if they do that? Other teams actually stand up the entire OL and look to the sidelines.

What about checking away from that side and having the B back track straight to him and knock his block off? That would make him think twice.
This is still a risk/reward thing for the defense. Why not put a bunch of fast guys on the DL who can all shoot the gaps that fast, and just stand them all up as blitzers? Because then the OL could just maul you straight up and we could run dive or even QB sneak for 7 yards a pop. That blitz isn't going to be good for every play-call our offense has. If we run straight dive, we should be good. If we run jet sweep we should be good. Trap could be very good. If we run TO we should be ok. It's really hurt us on a counter or a speed option where the QB has to do some footwork before the play gets started. Those types of plays became a much bigger part of our offense last year with Vad because that's what he was better at than the TO.

But, the OT still has the angle on the blitzer. It's an easy block as the OT just cracks down on him, and the timing thing is important because the OT knows the count and the blitzer shouldn't. Even in the VT clip, the VT guy gets cracked down and driven to the ground, but he got his hand in there and slapped the ball out in the process. Vad actually was able to avoid him, just lost the ball. It was a great play by the VT guy, but also lucky. I don't think it's going to be a chronic problem for us going forward.
 

pckl300

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One thing I realized, with JT's elusiveness and quick feet, this defensive scheme might get neutralized entirely. It would be interesting to see what happens.
 

dressedcheeseside

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This is still a risk/reward thing for the defense. Why not put a bunch of fast guys on the DL who can all shoot the gaps that fast, and just stand them all up as blitzers? Because then the OL could just maul you straight up and we could run dive or even QB sneak for 7 yards a pop. That blitz isn't going to be good for every play-call our offense has. If we run straight dive, we should be good. If we run jet sweep we should be good. Trap could be very good. If we run TO we should be ok. It's really hurt us on a counter or a speed option where the QB has to do some footwork before the play gets started. Those types of plays became a much bigger part of our offense last year with Vad because that's what he was better at than the TO.

But, the OT still has the angle on the blitzer. It's an easy block as the OT just cracks down on him, and the timing thing is important because the OT knows the count and the blitzer shouldn't. Even in the VT clip, the VT guy gets cracked down and driven to the ground, but he got his hand in there and slapped the ball out in the process. Vad actually was able to avoid him, just lost the ball. It was a great play by the VT guy, but also lucky. I don't think it's going to be a chronic problem for us going forward.
Thanks, I feel better.
 

Boomergump

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The more I think about this, the mid-line seems like a great counter punch to this kind of defensive play. You would just read at the MESH like a cross charge on the TO. The normal read is the DT but the blitzer is right next to him. If the read is keep, have the BB smash the blitzer with a full head of steam. Then you still have the motion AB leading the charge into the play side gap. Maybe that is why it was such a successful play in the spring game. In any case, I think Vasmos is right. The actual fumble play in the VT game was as much about lack of protecting the football as it was bad blocking. I think we will handle this much better in the future. In the spring game, the wet ball slowed down every center exchange with the QB being extra careful just to hang on to the ball. The timing of many a play was thrown off by this.

In a more general sense, I want us to become a much better team at disguising, not only snap counts, but our intentions on an offensive play. There is little doubt in my mind, from watching a lot of tape of last season, that some (more well coached) defenses are tipped off by some of our body language and cadences. I don't know exactly what these tip offs are, but I am convinced they are there and readable to teams who know what they are looking for. It could be the timing of motion ABs, it could be where OLs are looking or leaning trying to get a jump, given their wide splits and the ground they have to cover. We need to regain some deception. At times it felt like we were trying to play baseball when the other team has stolen the signs. If our kids know what these tip offs are, they can disguise them better and keep Ds honest.
 

dressedcheeseside

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The more I think about this, the mid-line seems like a great counter punch to this kind of defensive play. You would just read at the MESH like a cross charge on the TO. The normal read is the DT but the blitzer is right next to him. If the read is keep, have the BB smash the blitzer with a full head of steam. Then you still have the motion AB leading the charge into the play side gap. Maybe that is why it was such a successful play in the spring game. In any case, I think Vasmos is right. The actual fumble play in the VT game was as much about lack of protecting the football as it was bad blocking. I think we will handle this much better in the future. In the spring game, the wet ball slowed down every center exchange with the QB being extra careful just to hang on to the ball. The timing of many a play was thrown off by this.

In a more general sense, I want us to become a much better team at disguising, not only snap counts, but our intentions on an offensive play. There is little doubt in my mind, from watching a lot of tape of last season, that some (more well coached) defenses are tipped off by some of our body language and cadences. I don't know exactly what these tip offs are, but I am convinced they are there and readable to teams who know what they are looking for. It could be the timing of motion ABs, it could be where OLs are looking or leaning trying to get a jump, given their wide splits and the ground they have to cover. We need to regain some deception. At times it felt like we were trying to play baseball when the other team has stolen the signs. If our kids know what these tip offs are, they can disguise them better and keep Ds honest.
Good post, it raises some good questions for CPJ. Too bad the first coaches show is so far away and none of the reporters are keen saavy enough to ask these types of questions.
 

Longestday

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I could not find a midline to the LB blitzing side. I did find a 3TO on the QB keep that went where a midline might go on the LB blitz side.

 

AE 87

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I could not find a midline to the LB blitzing side. I did find a 3TO on the QB keep that went where a midline might go on the LB blitz side.


I think that's a called QB keeper off triple-option motion. It looks to me like Laskey isn't really looking to mesh but rather to go up and make a block. If you look at the DL, the typical mesh key, he stays home waiting to take the QB, but Tim doesn't give.. Also, the RT blocks down on the blitzing LB rather than going up to the next level as he would in a typical triple option. The lane that opens up off-tackle for the QB is no accident. It looks to me like CPJ is scheming to take advantage of Justin's speed.
 

Longestday

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If you look close, Byerly is bobbling the snap (maybe due to the pressure he sees coming). Byerly knows he has got to get out of the way of the blizing LB. Laskey is getting good at "reading" the QB and moves past (he does start with the BB mesh arms). The pitch man is looking at the QB and seems to want the pitch. The DE shadows outside the QB and forces the inside move (this should have been a BB give given the DE).

This is a 3rd and 9. In previous 3TO, the safety would come flying in and make the tackle. In this case the safety is playing back expecting a pass due to the 3rd and 9 yards left.

The DE is the give read on the BB and Golden would have been the pitch. Notice Golden is not blocked.
 
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