The reports of the TO's death have been grossly exaggerated

[Jim Prather]

Caveats before I reply to this: I am a HUGE 3O fan and was/am an ardent supporter of CPJ. My favorite part of this board used to be Longestday(?)s video review of the play calling and @ilovetheoption breakdowns.

When CPJ retired, my first impulse was to hire Monken, Coach N, Bohannon, or one of the CPJ disciples to run the program. After talking with some friends who are high School football coaches, I was convinced this was not a very good idea. CPJ was, to use your analogy, a grandmaster of his offense. Not just a grandmaster, but the 20 time reigning world champion grandmaster. NOONE knew that offense better than he did, and none of his disciples are anywhere near as close to being as good as he is at it. If GT was still a 7 win team with upside under CPJ, chances are we'd be a borderline bowl team with limited upside under any other COJ disciple. CPJ excelled in adapting even with in drives and his coaching tree isn't to that level. Now, while a lot of us would take being a borderline bowl team with limited upside right now, we would have howled if the new coach had come in and had a 5 win season. Since we couldn't get the same level of coaching talent, a new offensive scheme was required.

Caveat: I do NOT think that we considered this in our move away from the 3O, rather I believe boosters were simply tired of the "option."

The next thing my coaching friends told me was that OL was going to be the longest pole in the tent and replacing, developing, and deploying a functioning ol with proper depth was a work of several years. The most charitable answer I got was 3-4 years at the earliest, more likely 5-6. So far, this has proven to be eerily accurate.

I was also told then that they were extremely surprised we hired a defensive guy to rebuild a team who's offense was going to require a drastic rebuild, and then put that rebuild into the hands of an OC with no P5 experience. I tried to give CDP a lot of grace (after all, his first coaching gig was at my Alma Mater) but it was fairly clear after year two he was in WAY over his head.

Finally, Ilovetheoption said it best. We made a gamble that we could leverage recruiting in the ATL and southeast to run a more NFL like offense and compete. So far that's been a bust. Recruiting is improved (rankings don't tell the whole story there) but even that improvement has shown how little it does without development and proper deployment of talent. I don't think the experiment HAS to be a failure, but I don't think a defensive oriented coach is going to fix our issues. We need an offensive mind to come in here and start deploying our talent properly. Whether that's with a scheme or simply tempo is immaterial, we need dedicated help on that side of the ball.

This was the main reason why I thought we should have gone after Willie Fritz. While he has not set the world on fire at Tulane, he would have know exactly what he was getting into after taking over an identical situation at Ga Southern and doing a spectacular job there. Even if he was not the long term solution, he would have smoothed the transition considerably.

 

[JacketFan137]

If discussion about the 3O irritates you, might I suggest you not read a thread titled The Reports of the TO's Death Have Been Grossly Exaggerated...

oh lol i don’t mind at all. if anything this is the only true discussion on the board right now since every other thread is basically the fire collins waiting room. i was just joking cause normally the second there’s any push back on the option discussions it’s normally met with “but collins is 3-9!” as if that is the doomed fate of any non option lead team.

 

[CEB]

well, the constant carping about CPJ and how me must run the 3O is also style preference.

reading this thread would have you believe that we were national champs every other year during the last regime. We had some really good years, but we had some stinkers too.

currently, we are having some really whopper sized stinkers.

romantically jonesing for CPJ and his offensive scheme, and having our memories dull the rough edges, ain't helping out of the mess we're in now.

I am still looking for that thread. Sounds intriguing.

 

[MountainBuzzMan]

the REAL issue was that kids weren't flocking to GT to play the TO, dismal defenses (PJ churned thru DCs), and shrinking attendances. We'd become nationally irrelevant after 2014 and were viewed as having a gimmicky offense.

Bringing the TO back wouldn't fix any of those. And no, the current regime isn't the answer.

Oh, because NOW they are flocking to play for GT since we went away from it? Variants of this would lead to winning games again and that would increase attendance and better recruiting. Just call it something else.

So much false confirmation bias on this board

 

[Randy Carson]

looking at it like this is a defeatist attitude and shows me that you just have a bias for the option. there’s no reason georgia tech is incapable of doing what wakeforest has done. plenty of other schools have turned things around with similar constraints in budget and fan support.

we need to hire the best coach we can get period. regardless of scheme or anything else. if they run the option so be it, but idk i think you are painting up this advantage to be much more significant than it is

Nope. I have a bias for being realistic.

If we can find another Dave Clawson and win 6-10 games every year, I'll be a happy pupp...er, Yellow Jacket.

My concern is that the NIL and transfer portal have changed the landscape, and that smaller schools like Tech, Wake, Duke, etc. are going to find themselves perennially looking up at the big <ahem> dogs.

 

[JacketFan137]

Nope. I have a bias for being realistic.

If we can find another Dave Clawson and win 6-10 games every year, I'll be a happy pupp...er, Yellow Jacket.

My concern is that the NIL and transfer portal have changed the landscape, and that smaller schools like Tech, Wake, Duke, etc. are going to find themselves perennially looking up at the big <ahem> dogs.

we’ve been perennially looking up for about a decade now. aside from a miracle run in 2014 the gap between us and the national champion has been tremendous. that’s not even about the option or who our coach is that’s just reality for us and probably ~110/124 FBS teams

if our guys are getting poached by big schools then so be it. they at least had to put good film out there to draw the interest so we’ll see some benefit. plus i’m not even so sure that the whole “we should run the option to duck NIL transfers” is even a sound theory. aside from linemen not being good enough for any other system, running the option doesn’t really protect us from anybody packing up and transferring. we would be just as likely to lose a good edge rusher, corner, WR, rb, etc. i already mentioned it else where but you don’t think a waller, smelter, bebe, dwyer, justin thomas or someone else couldn’t have leveraged a good season with paul into a big school transfer in todays game? guys like tevin and taquon wouldn’t have moved but they weren’t that caliber of player to begin with

 

[CEB]

if our guys are getting poached by big schools then so be it. they at least had to put good film out there to draw the interest so we’ll see some benefit. plus i’m not even so sure that the whole “we should run the option to duck NIL transfers” is even a sound theory. aside from linemen not being good enough for any other system, running the option doesn’t really protect us from anybody packing up and transferring.

Well, I posed that as what I thought was an interesting question... it stands to reason that if we’re recruiting different guys, there’s less chance those guys get poached... I don’t think I escalated to “another reason” to run the option and certainly not to the level of “sound theory,” but carry on!

 

[GTjunkie]

just need someone to remind us that collins sucks and has gone 3-9 every year and this thread will have officially completed the lifecycle of a swarm thread

You just did

 

[BleedGoldNWhite21]

In ten years, maybe someone like Monken has become a true option guru and I’d be open to him coming. Paul Johnson was my favorite Tech football coach in my lifetime and I do think he could have averaged 9-10 wins a season with the same backing Collins has gotten, but he is so far and away ahead of everyone else with the TO that I don’t thinks a poor man’s Paul Johnson is that compelling of a hire. Like others have said, we averaged 7 wins a season with some really great highs with the GOAT TO coach. What’s are ceiling with another TO coach? It can’t be as high. I don’t think any of his disciples have established themselves enough alone at this time for them to succeed similarly(or better) here. Monken is the only one I think has real potential, but I don’t think he’s there yet.

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Monken is the only one I think has real potential, but I don’t think he’s there yet.

When it's all said and done, I would bet that Bohannon will be the best of the CPJ tree.

 

[RickStromFan]

Oh, because NOW they are flocking to play for GT since we went away from it? Variants of this would lead to winning games again and that would increase attendance and better recruiting. Just call it something else.

So much false confirmation bias on this board

Attendance was dropping over CPJ's last few years as was recruiting. Even the great seasons of '09, '14, and '16 didn't result in any improvement in recruiting, else CPJ would've had a better QB to work with than Taquon Marshall.

Talk about revisionist history!

 

[wrmathis]

Attendance was dropping over CPJ's last few years as was recruiting. Even the great seasons of '09, '14, and '16 didn't result in any improvement in recruiting, else CPJ would've had a better QB to work with than Taquon Marshall.

Talk about revisionist history!

Attendance across the board for CFB has been dropping. Hasn’t just been a Tech thing.

 

[JacketFan137]

Well, I posed that as what I thought was an interesting question... it stands to reason that if we’re recruiting different guys, there’s less chance those guys get poached... I don’t think I escalated to “another reason” to run the option and certainly not to the level of “sound theory,” but carry on!

i wasn’t responding to you though so i’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Attendance was dropping over CPJ's last few years as was recruiting. Even the great seasons of '09, '14, and '16 didn't result in any improvement in recruiting, else CPJ would've had a better QB to work with than Taquon Marshall.

Talk about revisionist history!

Jaylend Ratliffe was a gut punch, but Yates would have been amazing in the O had CPJ stayed.

 

[Gold1]

Hate the Triple Option

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

Hate the Triple Option

 

[FlatsLander]

Attendance was dropping over CPJ's last few years as was recruiting. Even the great seasons of '09, '14, and '16 didn't result in any improvement in recruiting, else CPJ would've had a better QB to work with than Taquon Marshall.

Talk about revisionist history!

If you go back and look at the QB pipeline for the late CPJ years, there was a lot of unfortunate circumstances. The biggest being Jaylend Ratliffe's extremely unfortunate injury before he got to play here. He would have been a freshman in 2014, and more than ready to take over when JT left. Add to that, Matthew Jordan ending his career before the 2017 season, Jay Jones being ineligible, Christian Campbell breaking his hand, Lucas Johnson being frequently injured.

The BBacks were similarly snakebitten.

 

[InsideLB]

The next thing my coaching friends told me was that OL was going to be the longest pole in the tent and replacing, developing, and deploying a functioning ol with proper depth was a work of several years. The most charitable answer I got was 3-4 years at the earliest, more likely 5-6. So far, this has proven to be eerily accurate.

This is realistic.

Too bad rest of the program inspires zero condidence.

 

[Jim Prather]

Jaylend Ratliffe was a gut punch, but Yates would have been amazing in the O had CPJ stayed.

Possibly, but I think he would have had a hard time beating out Tobias Oliver. Oliver didn't have as good of an arm, but, man, he was special with the ball in his hands.

 

[FlatsLander]

This is realistic.

Too bad rest of the program inspires zero condidence.

Except for the addition of the transfer portal.