Post Game

Bruce Wayne

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,870
I am not saying we have, I am saying we should be able to occasionally
Because why? or How? To ever do so a team has to intentionally take more commits than open scholarship spots and thus weed players out by force. A team must also have a deep pocketed and well oiled bagman recruiting machine (according to that investigative journalist) since 100% of 5 stars and 80% of 4 stars take bribes in some form or fashion to influence their choice of college. Those are the top two requirements of getting a high recruiting ranking by the various sites.
 

COJacket

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
794
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
How do you anticipate a 75 yard run and how can a coach on a team that is behind in the score and needs to score a touchdown instruct a player to purposefully take a knee instead of scoring the TD? I mean really step back and consider watching a team actually do that.

I understand the sense that the offense could just "score at will" but truly there are just no guarantees. Smelter takes a knee and the next play from the 5 is a fumble scooped and scored on by UNC . . . you can't actually play or call a game thinking you "know" what is going to happen next.

I share the frustration of going, "ugh, no way the defense will actually stop them and win the game." But you know what. The Defense needed to find a way to do just that because that is how the game played out. I was saying the exact same thing in the Southern game and against VT: "No way the defense gets a stop." Especially Southern, and then we amazingly get the fumble and recover it.

All units on a team get chances to play a part in winning a ballgame. To win a game enough of all the individual unit's possessions have to be successful.
 

Bruce Wayne

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,870
CPJ needs to emphasize the defense, not just pass off the guys who don't work out on O!
Turnover on defensive staff impacts recruiting for the defense.

I am curious what the evidence that CPJ ignores or doesn't emphasize defense consists in? It would seem to just be results on D that could possibly make you say this, yet, how do the results prove the head coach improperly emphasizes it?

I suppose you might as well also list for us the guys "passed off" from the offense to the defense. It would be a very interesting list to ponder over; especially if you also list guys "passed off" from defense to offense who apparently simply did not work out on defense.

Again, coaching staff continuity on a unit (offense/defense) should have far more impact on commits and also the coaching and developmental results on a unit than any other factor. Right?
 

gtg936g

Helluva Engineer
Messages
2,142
Why? There's no evidence or history to support this thought.

The trend has been upward with added staffing the last two years. We need to continue to invest here, and focus on winning recruits. Get some more leeway to allow more exceptions.

In all honesty I think part of the uptick in recruiting is in part due to having a coaching staff that is not in a state of flux. I think we as fans/alum are too quick to cut and run. It takes time to build a program, especially at Tech. If you want a top tier program we are going to have to invest in a coaching staff for 10-15 years. Whether that coach is CPJ or not. "Fans" are too fickle in general and they they want to fire everyone after a loss. That is one reason why mediocrity reigns in the ACC.
 

RamblinCharger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,528
Location
Alabama
The trend has been upward with added staffing the last two years. We need to continue to invest here, and focus on winning recruits. Get some more leeway to allow more exceptions.

In all honesty I think part of the uptick in recruiting is in part due to having a coaching staff that is not in a state of flux. I think we as fans/alum are too quick to cut and run. It takes time to build a program, especially at Tech. If you want a top tier program we are going to have to invest in a coaching staff for 10-15 years. Whether that coach is CPJ or not. "Fans" are too fickle in general and they they want to fire everyone after a loss. That is one reason why mediocrity reigns in the ACC.
I agree. I just don't think Ted Roof is someone to stick with for the long haul. I really wish we could have gotten Ellis Johnson. He's made auburn much more sound in 2 years they still aren't great because they lost a bunch on the DL and their offense doesn't help them running up tempo but they are much more sound than we are. That's what bothers me. It's not the players they're just out of position or don't tackle with proper form. Really frustrating to watch.
 

RamblinCharger

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,528
Location
Alabama
The trend has been upward with added staffing the last two years. We need to continue to invest here, and focus on winning recruits. Get some more leeway to allow more exceptions.

In all honesty I think part of the uptick in recruiting is in part due to having a coaching staff that is not in a state of flux. I think we as fans/alum are too quick to cut and run. It takes time to build a program, especially at Tech. If you want a top tier program we are going to have to invest in a coaching staff for 10-15 years. Whether that coach is CPJ or not. "Fans" are too fickle in general and they they want to fire everyone after a loss. That is one reason why mediocrity reigns in the ACC.
I agree. I just don't think Ted Roof is someone to stick with for the long haul. I really wish we could have gotten Ellis Johnson. He's made auburn much more sound in 2 years they still aren't great because they lost a bunch on the DL and their offense doesn't help them running up tempo but they are much more sound than we are. That's what bothers me. It's not the players they're just out of position or don't tackle with proper form. Really frustrating to watch.
 

COJacket

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
794
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
I totally believe what Bruce wrote is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth (The Defense needed to find a way to do just that because that is how the game played out.) I cannot believe any of you think that the O is the problem. We just ran up 600 yards this week, close to 500 yards last week and if it wasn't for a couple of errors each week we win even w a very weak defense. JeT is just getting better and better, not just in running the TO but in his passing accuracy as well (he had pretty good numbers yesterday) and if the OL does not twitch on the touchdown call back, and that is all that it was just a twitch, we put up 4 more pts, and probably 2 more other points because we are kicking instead of going for two. The game is then tied at the end of regulation. If we stop them when they had 4th and 6, we win. IF if if .... But the fact is that we could not stop them just like they could not stop us and not many people have. Most of the time we stop ourselves on O when we do get stopped.

We lost 5 or 6 key players on the defense over the off season that would have made a HUGE difference for us (lost Justin Akin and Jimmie Kitchen, both of who were coming along nicely; PLUS JHD and Whitehead and then add in Robbins and Commisiong and that's a lot guys to be losing from your DL before camp even starts) And from where I sit those losses were not on the coaches. We should blitz more IMHO. We should NOT give them the cushion we do and gamble that they will fail to execute over the top. But this is not an offense problem. It is a defense problem and some of that problem will be addressed when we get some of this talent back (JHD and Whitehead especially) and our new recruits (very excited about Henderson, Glanton and Sellers) and our current freshman and sophomores gain more playing time. And some has to be once again addressed by PJ overriding the schemes Roof is coming up with and Roof coaching better D technique (tackling and DB positioning in particular).

Using the logic of many on this board, I guess Baylor should fire their coach since they gave up 40+ to WVA; Texas A&M should fire their coach - no offense and terrible defense the past couple of weeks; Bobby Ross would have been fired before he won us a NT; and the list goes on. For all of you that think we can get consistent top 20 recruiting classes, you are just not understanding what GT is today. Most of us on this board would probably not get into GT today. No coach has recruited that consistently since we left the SEC. You need to get out of the fantasy world you are living in and see what the Hill has made GT and the constraints they have put on CJ since he has been here. No way IMHO, O'Leary could recruit today like he did when he was here. Times have change. I am still in PJ's court. I love the recruiting class that he is putting together. I love his O for GT. It gives us a real chance to win against anyone. But man, I do want like the rest of you a D that can get even good O's off the field ever once in awhile, especially when we have them 3rd and long. I long for the day when we do have our opponent 3rd or 4th and long and I am confident in a stop instead of thinking "they have us right where they want us".
 

Bruce Wayne

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,870
The trend has been upward with added staffing the last two years. We need to continue to invest here, and focus on winning recruits. Get some more leeway to allow more exceptions.

In all honesty I think part of the uptick in recruiting is in part due to having a coaching staff that is not in a state of flux. I think we as fans/alum are too quick to cut and run. It takes time to build a program, especially at Tech. If you want a top tier program we are going to have to invest in a coaching staff for 10-15 years. Whether that coach is CPJ or not. "Fans" are too fickle in general and they they want to fire everyone after a loss. That is one reason why mediocrity reigns in the ACC.
I totally agree with this. I just think that "getting a top ten class" based on recruiting service rankings is a whole separate issue to what you say here. I am not convinced that those ranking systems are the best way for me to judge this particular program I am a fan of.
 
Messages
13,443
Location
Augusta, GA
I totally believe what Bruce wrote is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth (The Defense needed to find a way to do just that because that is how the game played out.) I cannot believe any of you think that the O is the problem. We just ran up 600 yards this week, close to 500 yards last week and if it wasn't for a couple of errors each week we win even w a very weak defense. JeT is just getting better and better, not just in running the TO but in his passing accuracy as well (he had pretty good numbers yesterday) and if the OL does not twitch on the touchdown call back, and that is all that it was just a twitch, we put up 4 more pts, and probably 2 more other points because we are kicking instead of going for two. The game is then tied at the end of regulation. If we stop them when they had 4th and 6, we win. IF if if .... But the fact is that we could not stop them just like they could not stop us and not many people have. Most of the time we stop ourselves on O when we do get stopped.

We lost 5 or 6 key players on the defense over the off season that would have made a HUGE difference for us (lost Justin Akin and Jimmie Kitchen, both of who were coming along nicely; PLUS JHD and Whitehead and then add in Robbins and Commisiong and that's a lot guys to be losing from your DL before camp even starts) And from where I sit those losses were not on the coaches. We should blitz more IMHO. We should NOT give them the cushion we do and gamble that they will fail to execute over the top. But this is not an offense problem. It is a defense problem and some of that problem will be addressed when we get some of this talent back (JHD and Whitehead especially) and our new recruits (very excited about Henderson, Glanton and Sellers) and our current freshman and sophomores gain more playing time. And some has to be once again addressed by PJ overriding the schemes Roof is coming up with and Roof coaching better D technique (tackling and DB positioning in particular).

Using the logic of many on this board, I guess Baylor should fire their coach since they gave up 40+ to WVA; Texas A&M should fire their coach - no offense and terrible defense the past couple of weeks; Bobby Ross would have been fired before he won us a NT; and the list goes on. For all of you that think we can get consistent top 20 recruiting classes, you are just not understanding what GT is today. Most of us on this board would probably not get into GT today. No coach has recruited that consistently since we left the SEC. You need to get out of the fantasy world you are living in and see what the Hill has made GT and the constraints they have put on CJ since he has been here. No way IMHO, O'Leary could recruit today like he did when he was here. Times have change. I am still in PJ's court. I love the recruiting class that he is putting together. I love his O for GT. It gives us a real chance to win against anyone. But man, I do want like the rest of you a D that can get even good O's off the field ever once in awhile, especially when we have them 3rd and long. I long for the day when we do have our opponent 3rd or 4th and long and I am confident in a stop instead of thinking "they have us right where they want us".
EXCELLENT post....HIGH ON COMMON SENSE, which seems to be lacking in many posts on all message boards and blog sites. Thanks!!!
 

worthco jacket

Georgia Tech Fan
Messages
79
Location
Albany, Georgia
Did anyone see the diptards on espnu after the game saying that defenses have started figuring out our option offense and that is why we are losing now?? No you idiots it's because we play no defense. What in the hell
Really? Figured out the triple option? Hmm. 600 yards of total offense begs to differ. Tell you what. Let one of them play corner or outside linebacker and have Smelter or Waller steam roll their *** and tell us if they got it figured out. When I was in high school in the 1970s most teams were running some variation of option. Split back veer, I back, wishbone you name it and let me tell you it was no fun playing corner and having some son of a ***** crack backing on you when you least expect it or watching that counter option come at you with a pulling guard. Le t them try figuring that one out.
 

MacDaddy2

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
415
Location
The Island of Relevancy
Then recruit better? When is the last time we have been a 3 win program for several seasons?

I am not saying keep CPJ or fire CPJ...Just saying you can't be afraid of that. If you aren't happy with the results then you have to do something to try and fix it instead of just status quo.

100 percent correct. We are the definition of insanity, continuing to do the same expecting different results
 

GTech63

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,145
Location
Flower Mound, TX (75022)
I for one am still quite pleased with the season based on the defections we faced on the dline. We frankly have done amazing record wise and I credit some extraordinary coaching that we have 5 wins. Our d is going to improve next year. Let's hope we can scrape together another win or 5! Very proud of the effort tonight on offense. We are basically even with all the other coastal teams. It's a weird year in that respect. It will be interesting to see it play out.
I can't say I am quite pleased but I don't believe the sky is falling. We lost two games by a total of 11 points. Both of which were winnable in the last minutes.

Duke had to play a mistake free game to beat us plus some major help from officials. UNC made some mistakes themselves that helped us stay up while our critical one cost us 4 points directly and was a difference maker.

As pointed out, our D was devastated with losses by graduation and by other attrition reasons. I believe we have a group of guys leaving all they have on the field. The biggest thing I am pissed about is playing so far off the receivers on D. That is what Al Groh did and his D looked like yesterday. Is this CPJ over riding CTR? Al Groh??

There are some other coaching issues I question and much of it is our blocking as well as tackling techniques./. UNC outside and down field blocking was good. They stayed on their feet and pushed.
I thought Perkins would be a back that could break away for some long runs of over 20. He hasn't been able to do that. Is this related to blocking down field? Seems we have regressed in this area.

I thought this was going to a much better year than has been forecast by sports writers. It still can be but I also see that we need to use the remainder of this year to build experience and "coach up" players for next year. Pitt is another critical test. We need that game and it won't be easy. Yesterday there were some good teams whose D was cut and quartered. The spread offenses of today with more quality QB becoming available that D can be a real challenge. But damn it play tighter coverage and make the receivers work for what they get.

I end by saying the O performance yesterday, while keeping up and being productive was also against a very bad D. I don't think Pitt D will be so easy.
 
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