Nick Starkel

smokey_wasp

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There’s a lot of under selling our current qb’s. All we need is a guy who can complete swing passes, slants, bubble screens and the occasional downfield pass which are easier to master than the option game in my opinion.

Not underselling so much as it is uncertainty. I agree that the system we will run will be easier to learn than CPJ's, but it isn't so easy that you can put just anyone back there. It all just depends on what the staff thinks of our guys' High School film. I am not against rolling with what we have if the staff is comfortable with that, but I am fine with bringing in someone with more experience, too.
 

dressedcheeseside

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Not underselling so much as it is uncertainty. I agree that the system we will run will be easier to learn than CPJ's, but it isn't so easy that you can put just anyone back there. It all just depends on what the staff thinks of our guys' High School film. I am not against rolling with what we have if the staff is comfortable with that, but I am fine with bringing in someone with more experience, too.
I’d much rather bring in an effective ctive pass rusher than an extra qb at this point. It’s about roster management and pressing needs. There’s a more pressing need for DL, LB, heck just about anybody on defense.
 
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swarmer

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There’s a lot of under selling our current qb’s. All we need is a guy who can complete swing passes, slants, bubble screens and the occasional downfield pass which are easier to master than the option game in my opinion.

Disagree. They’ll have to learn a deeper playbook, understand defenses, learn audibles, recognize blitzes, read coverages. QB is a lot more than “needing someone to complete passes”, which isn’t a simple task in itself.
 

smokey_wasp

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I’d much rather bring in an effective ctive pass rusher than an extra qb at this point. It’s about roster management and pressing needs. There’s a more pressing need for DL, LB, heck just about anybody on defense.

We have other needs for sure. But I doubt we could find a DL, LB or OL on the transfer market who could make as much of a difference as a QB. That's the one position where you could see a 3 game swing or more depending on whether you have the right guy. If we already think we have that guy, great. If we don't, we should definitely look and kick the tires on these grad transfers.
 

4shotB

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There’s a lot of under selling our current qb’s. All we need is a guy who can complete swing passes, slants, bubble screens and the occasional downfield pass which are easier to master than the option game in my opinion.

I think this is a plus for moving away from CPJ's system frankly. There have been several true and RS FR play in the natty over the last several years. Seems like the TO was just too complex for a QB to master in a short period of time. I don't think we were ever going to see a guy make an impact in year 1 or 2.
 

jgtengineer

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Disagree. They’ll have to learn a deeper playbook, understand defenses, learn audibles, recognize blitzes, read coverages. QB is a lot more than “needing someone to complete passes”, which isn’t a simple task in itself.

Mate the CPJ playbook isn't less complex than the menu playbooks most teams use. The difference is the way its taught.

As for pass trees. Sicne CPJ's book is mostly PA and footwork to create throwign lanes to option routes (aka the hardest route to teach nfl recievers and why the patriots offense is so potent). The blocking schemes are also about to get really damn simple.

Lets take a flex pass

Spread 789 (simple play call right? so who does what? oh right you actually have to remember the series and your assignment based on position)

I don't know the actual call cpj used but in the version of the offense i ran this was a backside post frontside option favoring go (9) Backside A goes in twirl motion and runs a flare while the B back fills for a pulling guard setting for a boot seal on the end to create a running escape lane and the frontside A back runs a drag to pull the linebackers out of a slant lane should the corner bail and the receiver read slant. The QB has to perform a counter step to make the play look like either rocket or speed to the twirl a-back then sink to depth and read the 1 receiver or corner to know to throw the slant or go. If neither are there his next read is the rush lane to get 5 if that's stopped its the A-aback drag or the backside post (scramble release counter to estimated fire pressure which took away the rush lane)

In the offense we are likely going to.

Gun Ace Slider Xray Cross Yankee Z Motion

This is a similar play however we no longer have an option route. Also the receivers don't have to remember routes based on a number system. They just listen for key words. In this case assuming that recievers have a default route based on call order and whether or not they are actually in the play call. So for this one you have a gun ace set with a slot (11) the tightend blocks to flat escape, the X receiver is running a deep crossing route. the Y receiver is running a GO and the Z receiver is motioning from base to to the other side of the formation and likely running a drag or slant to clear for the flat. The Slider call tells the line they are sliding right. Much less to remember. The Qb's reads are in order of receiver call. He is suppose to read the Cross, then the go, then the Z and finally his safety is the tight end in the flat. He is doing this not off play action (or maybe off a built in play action with the running back but because they are in gun that means his eyes still read the safety. This is system that is used by the majority of spread teams. The reason being the individual assignments are easy to translate to play cards and run no huddle without communication issues. This may not even have a verbal call in such a system.

In reality the CPJ playbook is deeper with more variation on a smaller subset of plays. The normal Spread playbook is very shallow to facilitate speed. Variation is done with a variety of single use plays based off a core package ( most of them being zone read or inside zone)
 

jgtengineer

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I think this is a plus for moving away from CPJ's system frankly. There have been several true and RS FR play in the natty over the last several years. Seems like the TO was just too complex for a QB to master in a short period of time. I don't think we were ever going to see a guy make an impact in year 1 or 2.

I actually agree with this. Years ago more kids were actually running CPJ's system at the highshool level (hence the high school offense statements) but the reality is that the majority fo high schools since about 2008 have gone to the clemson style gun spread. Because it allows them to get their best athlete in space and is less line play intensive. Option play is complex in its simplicity. In spread systems raw athleticism can make up for bad decisions much easier.
 

dressedcheeseside

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I think this is a plus for moving away from CPJ's system frankly. There have been several true and RS FR play in the natty over the last several years. Seems like the TO was just too complex for a QB to master in a short period of time. I don't think we were ever going to see a guy make an impact in year 1 or 2.
And those dudes were 4 and five stars And they were protected by 4 and five star OL’s and they were handing off to 4 and five star runningbacks and throwing to 4 and five star wide receiver’s.
 

iceeater1969

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And those dudes were 4 and five stars And they were protected by 4 and five star OL’s and they were handing off to 4 and five star runningbacks and throwing to 4 and five star wide receiver’s.
And we all agree we will not beat the really good teams . It does not preclude us from being pretty darn good. His point was the kids in hs play this type offense and have been successful as freshmen.
 

gtstinger776

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I’m a fan of bringing in a transfer such as Starkel not because our current QBs aren’t capable, but because it optically signals to the outside what we’re trying to change. A guy like Starkel who has started meaningful games at A&M IMO sends a strong signal to recruits and others that we are capable of sourcing relevant talent. Right now, no outsiders really place any credibility in our QBs - who were all recruited for the TO. Starkel shouldn’t be handed anything, and he should have to beat our current QBs for the job. Whether he wins the starting job is irrelevant. A SEC QB transferring to GT signals relevance.
 

swarmer

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Frankly, that’s all crap they had to do before with the option but it was more intense with the option.

Our passing schemes were mostly 2 receiver routes, and against primarily the same coverage every game. We never threw to the backside wr, and almost never had check downs.

Our qb never adjusted based on blitz looks.

We never audibled, only flipped play direction of run plays based on the count.

Most options looks were called from the sideline, were rarely ran any true triple. Plays like qb sweep, and goal line keepers are the first plays you learn In pop Warner.

He’ll we didn’t even run no huddle effectively
 

Animal02

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I think this is a plus for moving away from CPJ's system frankly. There have been several true and RS FR play in the natty over the last several years. Seems like the TO was just too complex for a QB to master in a short period of time. I don't think we were ever going to see a guy make an impact in year 1 or 2.
I disagree and agree. I don't think it was complexity....Look at what Jet did as a sophomore. I watched parts of the OB a couple of weeks ago and the speed of how it was run was incredible. I do think though it is time as well, but because Defenses seemed to be forcing the QB keep ( whether intentional or not), which over time wears on the QB both during the game and season. The A and B backs could rotate for fresh legs....the QB was the constant. Without a serious passing attack.....the QB was destined to get dinged time and again.
 

iceeater1969

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I disagree and agree. I don't think it was complexity....Look at what Jet did as a sophomore. I watched parts of the OB a couple of weeks ago and the speed of how it was run was incredible. I do think though it is time as well, but because Defenses seemed to be forcing the QB keep ( whether intentional or not), which over time wears on the QB both during the game and season. The A and B backs could rotate for fresh legs....the QB was the constant. Without a serious passing attack.....the QB was destined to get dinged time and again.
Rewatch the 18 uva game and u will see that good interior dl play had changed from hitting runner to tackle to hitting to slow down. Best game by gt in 18.

The ol dl technique battles will be shifted to the wr db. Before the qb had to make line calls w the ol. The ol had to communicate and adjust w defense. Now this will be qb to wr.
The db s will try to disguise so the qb and wr are confused. This is why o.j ut o will struggle UNLESS WE CAN RUN THE BALL.

I'd give Starkel a try if he will come to gt
 

iceeater1969

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I would, too.

However, it looks like Nick is down to Ark or FSU, and is close to making a decision, per recent reports.

Really looking forward to spring practice.
Fsu could be running the air raid
Chad Morris - Ark head coach is a very well respected from Texas - Dallas area
NICK is from Dallas fort worth area Argyle.
U have picked two very logical schools.
 

RickStromFan

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Disagree. They’ll have to learn a deeper playbook, understand defenses, learn audibles, recognize blitzes, read coverages. QB is a lot more than “needing someone to complete passes”, which isn’t a simple task in itself.

as we saw the past 2 seasons!
 
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