Mostly “Fire Geoff Collins”, some reminiscing, maybe bourbon or other distractions

[Techster]

Since often CPJ is brought up in this thread I want to add a little snippet. Johnson was offered the chance to head coach Georgia Southern (who just hired Clay Helton) he chose to remain retired. I think that should put to rest any weird speculation he didn't retire on his own.

On another note, CPJ has said unless he gets an offer from a "special" program, he is going to remain retired. By no means is GT a "factory level" program, but I think CPJ saw enough towards the end of coaching at GT that he knows what comes with coaching a program on the P5 level. I'm not referring to the on field stuff...I believe that's what CPJ enjoyed the most. It's all of the politics with the administration and the donors that wore on CPJ. This isn't CPJ specific, because it happens to every coach at the P5 level, but CPJ was just tired of having to battle for raises for his assistants, getting money to expand support staff, and getting other things to help his team. If you listened to CPJ, there was a money issue in terms of support, and a LOT of that had to do with certain ADs trying to "starve out" CPJ (see: AD Sasquatch). CPJ was REALLY close to quitting from what I've heard, but Sasquatch left for Purdue, and TStan was hired just in time. TStan was able to get CPJ more money, but there was a faction of donors that refused to give any more money until CPJ was gone because they wanted a fresh start. Some of those donors continue to bad mouth CPJ to this day from what I've been told. If you listened to some of what CPJ said to the media, and post retirement, it was aimed at certain donors who continue to downplay what CPJ did here.

Although I thought it was time for GT to turn the page and have a new guy with new ideas come in, I thought it was a shame CPJ didn't get to go out the way he deserved. I'm still waiting for them to announce a day to honor CPJ and what he did for GT during his decade here. The longer it goes by that we don't have a special day for CPJ, the more I shake my head. I get that it's still raw and the new staff may bristle at the old coach being honored when the new regime is still trying to find their way, but CPJ did some REALLY great things here. I say it all the time, some of the best GT football moments for me came during the CPJ years.

On another note, those who keep taking potshots at CGC have lost the plot. This isn't a CPJ or CGC thing. It's a GT thing. I promise you CPJ would be first in line to say that he wants what's best for GT. So should the fans. When you root for CGC to fail, you are rooting for GT to fail. I think it's more than fair to criticize the on the field stuff, but some of this other stuff in unbecoming. We don't need to insult CPJ to make CGC look good, or vice versa.

 

[bobongo]

Yep. I’ve thought about this article quite a bit the last few weeks.

Now to be fair, the season isn’t over. They still could feasibly get to five (six with a miracle in South Bend), but it ain’t looking good.

Still hoping for 5 wins.

 

[jgtengineer]

While I do think He made the decision.........there is no correlation to the two events.......he could easily have been forced out, and in the last three years decided he doesn't need the hassle

Its more if there were any school out there he'd come back to to coach it be that one if he felt he still needed to prove something. But it also goes to show something crazy Southern basically hired Helton because they couldn't get PJ to come out of retirement and are about to try the exact same experiment as us only with a coach that is probably a bit more proven than Collins having coached for 4 seasons as a sole head coach and one pretty much the whole season after Sarks canning. He also amassed a 46-24 record with several conference championship appearances. So we will get to see if a broken roster full of option talent can be molded to be competitive there using pretty much the same methods (though helton went tot he school of kiffen offense.) vs hwo geoff's tried to do it here.

 

[Animal02]

On another note, CPJ has said unless he gets an offer from a "special" program, he is going to remain retired. By no means is GT a "factory level" program, but I think CPJ saw enough towards the end of coaching at GT that he knows what comes with coaching a program on the P5 level. I'm not referring to the on field stuff...I believe that's what CPJ enjoyed the most. It's all of the politics with the administration and the donors that wore on CPJ. This isn't CPJ specific, because it happens to every coach at the P5 level, but CPJ was just tired of having to battle for raises for his assistants, getting money to expand support staff, and getting other things to help his team. If you listened to CPJ, there was a money issue in terms of support, and a LOT of that had to do with certain ADs trying to "starve out" CPJ (see: AD Sasquatch). CPJ was REALLY close to quitting from what I've heard, but Sasquatch left for Purdue, and TStan was hired just in time. TStan was able to get CPJ more money, but there was a faction of donors that refused to give any more money until CPJ was gone because they wanted a fresh start. Some of those donors continue to bad mouth CPJ to this day from what I've been told. If you listened to some of what CPJ said to the media, and post retirement, it was aimed at certain donors who continue to downplay what CPJ did here.

Although I thought it was time for GT to turn the page and have a new guy with new ideas come in, I thought it was a shame CPJ didn't get to go out the way he deserved. I'm still waiting for them to announce a day to honor CPJ and what he did for GT during his decade here. The longer it goes by that we don't have a special day for CPJ, the more I shake my head. I get that it's still raw and the new staff may bristle at the old coach being honored when the new regime is still trying to find their way, but CPJ did some REALLY great things here. I say it all the time, some of the best GT football moments for me came during the CPJ years.

On another note, those who keep taking potshots at CGC have lost the plot. This isn't a CPJ or CGC thing. It's a GT thing. I promise you CPJ would be first in line to say that he wants what's best for GT. So should the fans. When you root for CGC to fail, you are rooting for GT to fail. I think it's more than fair to criticize the on the field stuff, but some of this other stuff in unbecoming. We don't need to insult CPJ to make CGC look good, or vice versa.

I agree with much of what you said.....but GC has brought much of this on himself.....between the passive aggressive swipes at CPJ, the chest thumping abot what a great job e will do, the BS talk of being elite while losing to far lesser teams, the willingness to through away multiple seasons to do things "his way" and then the flipping off of the fan base................has turned a lot of people to believing that the sooner he is gone, the better it will be for GT.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

What sets me off is our own fanbase negative recruiting us. I’ve seen plenty of people on social media—and here on GTSwarm—repeating the same tired tropes as our detractors, playing sock-puppet to the likes of Cutcliffe.

Happened a bunch under PJ’s tenure, and undoubtedly made a tough recruiting hill even steeper. At the end of it all, sure—high school students were saying they didn’t want to play for PJ’s system…because some people spent a decade planting that seed in their mind. And by “some people” I mean our own fans.

I didn’t like seeing that then, and I don’t like seeing it now. There are too many fonts on this board who—despite having what may be decent concerns (that I tend to agree with) about Collins—are grousing in a way that tears down our program by feeding the negative recruiting paradigm.

Stop it, all of you! GTpdm has spoken.

EXACTLY

 

[Northeast Stinger]

It is not just the negative recruits.....how about Tevon being booed from the stands because he was starting ahead of Vlad. Or posters here actively advocating "processing" players when CG was hired.

Wish we had a “truth and reconciliation commission” to drain all this past poison from our system.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Mr. Bear, it appears that you are relatively new to this site. First of all, welcome. Secondly, the divided fan base is not a new phenomenon. If you had been around then you would know it dates all the way back to the Coach Gailey years. We are torn equally between our hatred of our coaches and our fellow Tech fans.

Divided fan base really started to heat up the day Dodd retired.

 

[RyanS12]

I was a fan of the Collins hire. Still am. And I loved what Paul did too but I felt it was time for a change.
We needed someone young and tied to the city to try and get some non GT alum like myself into BDS on Saturdays. (Basically make GT cool) But with the way things are going, I’m starting to think this was a “budget” hire.
Not many would want to take on this transition, unless you were an option coach and we went out and got someone young, energetic and ready to recruit, with the GT AA knowing if it failed, the transition to the next staff would be a lot smoother because of the kids brought in over the last few cycles could fit into a similar type system.

Like I said, I think this hire was more of a way out of the Option system and Into what college football is now, with a very good chance of this staff failing on the W/L side of things but knowing the cupboard won’t be bare for the next staff if it gets to that point. I personally hope it doesn’t, I’d like to see the money put into a better staff and recruiting budgets but if this continues into next year, it’s time to move on.

Another thing that bothers me is the fans not wanting to donate and buy season tickets. Basically boycotting. We can’t afford to do that at a school this size and limited budget. That hurts a lot more than helping. That can get a point across at a Michigan or Uga, Tx AM, Oregon, Ohio St types because money isn’t an issue and there’s plenty of people waiting in line for those seats. At Tech, we can’t fill a stadium with our own fans when we’re ranked! This thinking has always been *** backwards to me.

 

[Animal02]

I was a fan of the Collins hire. Still am. And I loved what Paul did too but I felt it was time for a change.
We needed someone young and tied to the city to try and get some non GT alum like myself into BDS on Saturdays. (Basically make GT cool) But with the way things are going, I’m starting to think this was a “budget” hire.
Not many would want to take on this transition, unless you were an option coach and we went out and got someone young, energetic and ready to recruit, with the GT AA knowing if it failed, the transition to the next staff would be a lot smoother because of the kids brought in over the last few cycles could fit into a similar type system.

Like I said, I think this hire was more of a way out of the Option system and Into what college football is now, with a very good chance of this staff failing on the W/L side of things but knowing the cupboard won’t be bare for the next staff if it gets to that point. I personally hope it doesn’t, I’d like to see the money put into a better staff and recruiting budgets but if this continues into next year, it’s time to move on.

Another thing that bothers me is the fans not wanting to donate and buy season tickets. Basically boycotting. We can’t afford to do that at a school this size and limited budget. That hurts a lot more than helping. That can get a point across at a Michigan or Uga, Tx AM, Oregon, Ohio St types because money isn’t an issue and there’s plenty of people waiting in line for those seats. At Tech, we can’t fill a stadium with our own fans when we’re ranked! This thinking has always been *** backwards to me.

What Tech had was traditions, lots of history, everything from the Wreck, to the Whistle, to the band playing the Bud song. Tech is also naturally conservative and nerdy because of the narrow curriculum. The ham handed "making it cool" papered over a lot of that in favor of rap crap, dancing one the side line etc etc. It was trying to stuff a square peg in a round hole just like he did with his "transition" of the team. It shows his self awareness is at the bottom, and it is turning more people off than on....and compounded by his ineptness on the sidelines.

The cupboard was never bare......it was just Collins tried to make ham salad when all there was chicken in the fridge.

Then there is the question of just what college football is now. The mentality of trying to be just like the factories is an even bigger mistake than putting corporate seats behind the opposing bench. CPJ allowed himself to get pigeon holed by his detractors. So yes, it was time to move away from the pure option, and maybe over time be something different. (Have seen But throwing away seasons....and the acceptance of some of the fan base to doing so......is beyond absurd. Couple this crap with some of the other things the Institute has recently done make me question if I want to support it at all.

 

[RyanS12]

What Tech had was traditions, lots of history, everything from the Wreck, to the Whistle, to the band playing the Bud song. Tech is also naturally conservative and nerdy because of the narrow curriculum. The ham handed "making it cool" papered over a lot of that in favor of rap crap, dancing one the side line etc etc. It was trying to stuff a square peg in a round hole just like he did with his "transition" of the team. It shows his self awareness is at the bottom, and it is turning more people off than on....and compounded by his ineptness on the sidelines.

The cupboard was never bare......it was just Collins tried to make ham salad when all there was chicken in the fridge.

Then there is the question of just what college football is now. The mentality of trying to be just like the factories is an even bigger mistake than putting corporate seats behind the opposing bench. CPJ allowed himself to get pigeon holed by his detractors. So yes, it was time to move away from the pure option, and maybe over time be something different. (Have seen But throwing away seasons....and the acceptance of some of the fan base to doing so......is beyond absurd. Couple this crap with some of the other things the Institute has recently done make me question if I want to support it at all.

The cool factor is an attempt to get a tok get fan base. I’m 44 do I’ve seen great, good and bad. I’m in the middle of the “tradition” and “cool” demographic. We have a glaring gap in the yonder fans. From what Ive seen, I feel like I’m on the younger end of the fanbase. And I’m 44! I get done if the stuff comes off corny and over done but if we can’t get teenagers or early 20 sidewalk fans soon we won’t have any in 20 years. We need to hit the younger city and state groups. Now I didn’t go to tech but the times I go to games, I can see that the students aren’t ones that know much about football. They come to hang out but the enthusiasm isn’t there and that goes back 5-10 years. Winning 100% helps but selling a product does too. That’s what we hired. A salesman with the hopes he can coach the kids he’s recruiting. I’m not as put off on the stuff he’s doing as you have been from the start. (Not a knock on you one bit) but it’s time to put up or shut up. I’m ready to win and win now. And hopefully we can meet up at a big game or a bowl game again in the near future!

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

A really good coach takes the talent he has and puts them in the best position to win. Round hole, round peg thing.

 

[GoJacketsInRaleigh]

A really good coach takes the talent he has and puts them in the best position to win. Round hole, round peg thing.

If he's trying to win a particular season yes but if he's trying to build a program then it doesn't always work that way.

 

[BuzzStone]

If he's trying to win a particular season yes but if he's trying to build a program then it doesn't always work that way.

Yes the way we are doing it is to have 3-6 years of regression in order to try to start progressing.

 

[UgaBlows]

I was a fan of the Collins hire. Still am. And I loved what Paul did too but I felt it was time for a change.
We needed someone young and tied to the city to try and get some non GT alum like myself into BDS on Saturdays. (Basically make GT cool) But with the way things are going, I’m starting to think this was a “budget” hire.
Not many would want to take on this transition, unless you were an option coach and we went out and got someone young, energetic and ready to recruit, with the GT AA knowing if it failed, the transition to the next staff would be a lot smoother because of the kids brought in over the last few cycles could fit into a similar type system.

Like I said, I think this hire was more of a way out of the Option system and Into what college football is now, with a very good chance of this staff failing on the W/L side of things but knowing the cupboard won’t be bare for the next staff if it gets to that point. I personally hope it doesn’t, I’d like to see the money put into a better staff and recruiting budgets but if this continues into next year, it’s time to move on.

Another thing that bothers me is the fans not wanting to donate and buy season tickets. Basically boycotting. We can’t afford to do that at a school this size and limited budget. That hurts a lot more than helping. That can get a point across at a Michigan or Uga, Tx AM, Oregon, Ohio St types because money isn’t an issue and there’s plenty of people waiting in line for those seats. At Tech, we can’t fill a stadium with our own fans when we’re ranked! This thinking has always been *** backwards to me.

Boycotting and cutting off the money flow is how we lose our FB program, or wind up in a lower division

 

[MWBATL]

Boycotting and cutting off the money flow is how we lose our FB program, or wind up in a lower division

Going 3-9 year after year and being so disingenuous with the public (used car salesman mentality) accomplishes the same thing.

I suppose the question is which route gets us back quicker. Suffering through a poor choice for head coach for another 3-4 years? Or trying to make an emphatic statement that might force a change in 2 years?

 

[UgaBlows]

Going 3-9 year after year and being so disingenuous with the public (used car salesman mentality) accomplishes the same thing.

I suppose the question is which route gets us back quicker. Suffering through a poor choice for head coach for another 3-4 years? Or trying to make an emphatic statement that might force a change in 2 years?

I understand where your coming from, i just don’t think it’s going to accomplish what you think it will. Imho It’s the road to ruin to starve our program of money and support and then fire the coach (Who we can’t afford to fire) We will be beyond broke at that point and who the hell do you think would want this job after that and how would we pay them? Unless there are some big-money alums out there who are willing to pony up big $$$ to pay off CGC and then even more $$$$ to hire a better coach then we are stuck. Personally i am going to keep supporting this team and coach and hope he turns it around. We absolutely are better this season than last, there IS improvement we are still losing which is incredibly disappointing to us all but the scores are closer. I really hoped we would make a bowl this season and with better defensive play we would have. I think there’s a great chance that Tstan raises some funds (prob working on it now) to improve our DC and possibly OL situation. We need a splash hire there to bring some hope back imo.

 

[wesgt123]

Seems lots on here are apathetic. Myself included. I’ve been fighting that feeling all season and the last two weeks were pretty much my breaking point.

I will watch but the instant we look like the same old same old, I will not hesitate to disengage.

Call it fairweather if you want. I just have a limit to my watching my favorite team be BAD week in and week out.

I don’t know what to think anymore.

Go jackets.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I understand where your coming from, i just don’t think it’s going to accomplish what you think it will. Imho It’s the road to ruin to starve our program of money and support and then fire the coach (Who we can’t afford to fire) We will be beyond broke at that point and who the hell do you think would want this job after that and how would we pay them? Unless there are some big-money alums out there who are willing to pony up big $$$ to pay off CGC and then even more $$$$ to hire a better coach then we are stuck. Personally i am going to keep supporting this team and coach and hope he turns it around. We absolutely are better this season than last, there IS improvement we are still losing which is incredibly disappointing to us all but the scores are closer. I really hoped we would make a bowl this season and with better defensive play we would have. I think there’s a great chance that Tstan raises some funds (prob working on it now) to improve our DC and possibly OL situation. We need a splash hire there to bring some hope back imo.

Splash hire sounds good.

 

[MWBATL]

I understand where your coming from, i just don’t think it’s going to accomplish what you think it will. Imho It’s the road to ruin to starve our program of money and support and then fire the coach (Who we can’t afford to fire) We will be beyond broke at that point and who the hell do you think would want this job after that and how would we pay them? Unless there are some big-money alums out there who are willing to pony up big $$$ to pay off CGC and then even more $$$$ to hire a better coach then we are stuck. Personally i am going to keep supporting this team and coach and hope he turns it around. We absolutely are better this season than last, there IS improvement we are still losing which is incredibly disappointing to us all but the scores are closer. I really hoped we would make a bowl this season and with better defensive play we would have. I think there’s a great chance that Tstan raises some funds (prob working on it now) to improve our DC and possibly OL situation. We need a splash hire there to bring some hope back imo.

And I understand your point. I guess I feel like it (eventually) worked getting Hewitt out, so I naturally turn to that approach. But more than that, I too have gotten somewhat apathetic. I am a season ticket holder who went to a total of two games this year, and did not stay past the middle of the third quarter in either game. I cannot stomach this brand of football. I believe we will lose so many of our fan base (like me) with 3-4 more years of this that we may be irretrievably lost by then.

I am all for doing something to make it work. And I hope it does. My wife and I have already been discussing what to do about our season tickets next year. We haven't decided to cancel. Yet. But we haven't decided to renew either. Hearing more blah-blah form this coach about how we are improving does NOT help matters. He is either blind or a bigger lier than most politicians. Either of those just makes him look worse.

 

[zzzboy25]

If he's trying to win a particular season yes but if he's trying to build a program then it doesn't always work that way.

Good coaches ...coach up the players they have...In a perfect, you could start from scratch. I.E..Tom Brady...He wasn't highly recruited but look what they did with him. When coaches say, I need my players to win..that's a deflection...Because every coach could say that, then every team should WIN!!