Media Selects GT to Win Coastal; JT Picked 3rd for Preseason MVP

[dressedcheeseside]

I'm not one of those guys, but I imagine it has something to do with the perception that our offensive skill positions are "plug and play", while Clemson's losses are in the trenches. If our losses were as significant as theirs in the trenches, I think a lot of our fans would be singing a different tune.

I'm not so sure the value difference between "skill" guys and "trench" guys is all that much, especially considering how we use our skill guys. We rely heavily on precise execution at high speed of perfectly timed blocks, most of which occur in space against very agile defenders. We also rely on our skill players' ability to recognize and execute changes made by JT at the LOS.

At the very least, we will be very vanilla for a time before CPJ feels comfortable expanding the play calling.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

You could even go as far as to say Jabari could be the number one pick in an up coming draft "based off of potential."

Fair point. Teams like Clemson are always looked at in terms of their potential. Tech is always looked as having nothing but vexing question marks whenever new players are asked to step up. It is absolutely a double standard.

I personally don't mind it because I think it can be a motivator for Tech but I do marvel sometimes that there are people who are getting paid way more than they are worth to act like experts and say stupid things about the relative strength of teams.

 

[GaTech4ever]

I'm not so sure the value difference between "skill" guys and "trench" guys is all that much, especially considering how we use our skill guys. We rely heavily on precise execution at high speed of perfectly timed blocks, most of which occur in space against very agile defenders. We also rely on our skill players' ability to recognize and execute changes made by JT at the LOS.

At the very least, we will be very vanilla for a time before CPJ feels comfortable expanding the play calling.

I agree completely. I just think that's the perception, and the reason why some fans are more confident we can survive our losses than Clemson can.

The perception may not be reality, but if some of our fans believe that the value difference is that significant, then I don't think it's a huge stretch for them to think Clemson will have more trouble replacing their losses than GT.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

ASSIST YARDS. THATS IT. *disappears with play-by-play box scores and a calculator*

Something tells me we have had this conversation before. Tosses versus short passes in the flats, dump passes versus pitches, reading the mesh versus having a called give to a fullback.... here we go.

Yes, JT is the most valuable player in the league. This is a no-brainer to me and that is not just homerism talking. I cannot think of any other offensive player in the conference whose presence adds so much to the success quotient of a team or whose loss would be as substantial a blow to the team. (shudder goes down spine after having his last words sink in.)

 

[GTNavyNuke]

Wow, we got picked to win Coastal overwhelmingly. So people have to b*tch that Clemson and FSU are picked so much better than we are.

Guess what. Over the last five years, Clemson and FSU have been a lot better overall than we have. I'll do the exact stats later. But the voters discount a one year flash in the pan. That is what we have been for the last 50 years. https://gtswarm.com/threads/111-years-of-gt-football.6986/ (At some point I'll update the JHowell Power Ranking stats, but till last year we have been pretty pedestrian.)

We need to win like FSU and Clemson consistently to get picked above them.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I agree completely. I just think that's the perception, and the reason why some fans are more confident we can survive our losses than Clemson can.

The perception may not be reality, but if some of our fans believe that the value difference is that significant, then I don't think it's a huge stretch for them to think Clemson will have more trouble replacing their losses than GT.

Does it have to be either / or?

I can only speak for myself but I get tired of all the hand wringing about who Tech has lost (the same players that the previous year many were pointing to as proof that Tech could not recruit) and then a corollary statement that somehow Clemson has not lost any one of any real significance. I just don't think you can have it both ways.

Clemson and FSU both lost a bus load of starting players. Are they capable of reloading? Sure. But it is not a foregone conclusion, just like it is not a forgone conclusion (as some around here act like) that Tech is going to have a major set back in performance this year because of everyone that was lost.

End of rant.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I'm not so sure the value difference between "skill" guys and "trench" guys is all that much, especially considering how we use our skill guys. We rely heavily on precise execution at high speed of perfectly timed blocks, most of which occur in space against very agile defenders. We also rely on our skill players' ability to recognize and execute changes made by JT at the LOS.

At the very least, we will be very vanilla for a time before CPJ feels comfortable expanding the play calling.

For what it is worth, CPJ spoke today about the most significant thing being that we have a good offensive line with good depth. He said he was confident that with that in place the skill players would do fine.

 

[Captain killem]

Factory and MONEY schools will always get more recognition than an academic institution. It's a fact like it or not. I prefer we remain the underdogs and show our intestinal fortitude at the end.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Guess what. Over the last five years, Clemson and FSU have been a lot better overall than we have.

Not sure who does not know this.

I suspect that there are multiple conversations going on here depending on who one thinks is arguing with whom. I for one am glad that Tech got picked to win things for a change. Hopefully, as CPJ said, maybe the pundits are finally going to be right for a change. Now we need to earn it.

My beef is only with those who discount the heavy losses in personnel suffered by both Clemson and FSU while magnifying the departing players for Tech and the holes that will need to be filled. To me, at least on paper, I would rather be replacing running backs and wide receivers than be replacing a quarterback or half your starting roster or an entire offensive line or most of your defense or significant coaching staff. Again, at least on paper, it is not even close to an even trade.

I get the argument that from past history of success, or having highly rated recruiting classes, some feel that Clemson and FSU will not experience much of a hurdle in maintaining high performance. But past success is never a guarantee on future performance and it just may be that Tech has finally stockpiled the kind of players who can also be the next man up. If those two points have any validity at all then Tech's roster losses are not nearly as significant.

 

[slugboy]

Say what you want about Watson, but I was relieved when he went out of last year's game.

 

[iceeater1969]

In past we were clearly not in same level with fsu abd clemson.
We have our first 5 star qb for the spread option. Last year he made the year magical.
This year IMO coach will have him pass more and win acc mvp.
As for clemson -last year those defensive guys had the option defense down pat. With a new group of defenders - we will dominate.
Fsu without DCOOK makes me optimistic of a decisive win.
After these 2 big wjns ===No more under dog crap for many a year.

If we recruit a couple of 5 star DT's to join the nucleus we have then 2016 will be unbelievably magical and jet will receive mvp all American q b a n d higher award.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

....... Now we need to earn it. ......

+1. I know you said a lot else, but this sums it up for me. As CPJ says, "I don't want to be given it, I want to take it." (or something like that). We weren't even in the conversation last year but that doesn't mean squat when the game starts.

 

[TechPhi97]

We need to aim higher as a football program. We need the 4* and 5* kids that have heart, attitude, and team chemistry. Unfortunately most Tech fans call out 4 & 5 star kids for not being "character" simply because we can't land them and they choose to go to a power.

I want to see the day where we get those kids and the other fanbases are the ones moaning.

Long story short: blue chippers aren't all prima donnas. We need to be landing them just like Notre Dame lands them, and we simply have not been able to do it.

We could win titles with this coaching staff if we could recruit better. I know I'm beating a dead horse, and I absolutely love our players no matter 1* or 3*, but we could recruit better.

That's BS. We don't think all 5 stars are orima donnas and we would love to have all that would come here.

 

[TheGridironGeek]

Point one - its not "team chemistry" but ego/respect/intelligence. As in, there are five star guys that are smart, listen to the coaches, and show a team first attitude. That's what we want. There are a lot more guys out there who have poor character and couldn't into GT. Poster was saying we would love to get the "good" kids out there who are also good at football.

Point two - We've won 1 Orange Bowl in 50 years. No, we aren't a power.

Point three - I've heard kids that choose to go elsewhere and the response sometimes is "well, he couldn't have cut it here anyways"

Point four - We aren't talking about Notre Dame having great recruits compared to everyone else. Notre Dame, like us, Stanford, Duke, etc., have a lot of restrictions placed on them. They do a great job recruiting with those resctrictions.

1. You got me there. Cheap to troll what was basically bad grammar. Still, I feel that such shallow slogans don't help anything. Every program is trying for good chemistry.

2. GT is a yearly contender to win a Power 5 conference in D1, in other words they compete strongly at the top level of the top level.

3. Fans rationalize & try to stay optimistic but all in all the GT base is very respectful of recruits, won or lost. No need to hash out again the intelligence of this board compared to FSU or Clemson forums, I would just sound like I'm flattering people.

4. Jesuits care about football more than just about anything. My opinion is if ND could recruit 5-star Jocky McTouchdown from Reed & Rite HS more often, they would, in spite of any lack of academic capacity. I can't prove that but for instance they were okay with Brady Quinn, one of the least intelligent/mature athletes I've ever seen. I imagine he studied about as hard at Notre Dame as a garden slug on tranquilizers.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

.......I imagine he studied about as hard at Notre Dame as a garden slug on tranquilizers.

Thanks, I needed that laugh. "Art and Letters" would be "Dirt and Flowers"?

 

[PBR549]

Wow, we got picked to win Coastal overwhelmingly. So people have to b*tch that Clemson and FSU are picked so much better than we are.

Guess what. Over the last five years, Clemson and FSU have been a lot better overall than we have. I'll do the exact stats later. But the voters discount a one year flash in the pan. That is what we have been for the last 50 years. https://gtswarm.com/threads/111-years-of-gt-football.6986/ (At some point I'll update the JHowell Power Ranking stats, but till last year we have been pretty pedestrian.)

We need to win like FSU and Clemson consistently to get picked above them.

I think we are 3-2 versus Clemson over the last 5 years so they haven't been better than us.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

No need to hash out again the intelligence of this board compared to FSU or Clemson forums, I would just sound like I'm flattering people.

Oh, go ahead, I'm all ears.

 

[tech_wreck47]

Not sure if someone posted this already, but here's a video of cpj and if you scroll down you will see one with Thomas.

http://www.theacc.com/video/geot

 

[TheGridironGeek]

Something tells me we have had this conversation before. Tosses versus short passes in the flats, dump passes versus pitches, reading the mesh versus having a called give to a fullback.... here we go.

I'm only in favor of counting Triple-O pitches as assist yards. Not only is it too difficult to always know when a fullback play was called vs. the QB making an option-give, but giving to the B-back in the Flexbone is comparable to Read-O gives from the shotgun. Not that the QB isn't valuable as a decoy on those plays but it seems impossible to quantify. Even I-Formation QB's make a pass-fake after a handoff, which is more effective when you've got a good passing arm. So it's not like option QB's are the only ones with a decoy-based intangible that doesn't show up in the stats. That's everyone.

(In the NFL would "assist yards" on give-reads help fans understand the true value of a QB like Wilson or Newton? Sure, but once again unless you know what the coaches are telling the QB to do it's often impossible to distinguish a give-read from a called play in the Pistol or Shotgun.)

Also there is no reason to count Rocket Sweep as assist yards for the QB because it's a simple called play to the A-back.

But (if I understand the CPJ offense correctly) an option pitch is rarely, if ever, a called play. It's a read by the QB and often harder to execute than a short pass. There is no reason a QB should suffer statistically by making precise, daring pitches instead of keeping the ball.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Also there is no reason to count Rocket Sweep as assist yards for the QB because it's a simple called play to the A-back.

To play devil's advocate on this one, some would say that it is no difference that a called swing pass, which a quarterback gets credit for. But I agree with essentially everything you have said.