Look for more guys to play this week

[vamosjackets]

we lost alot on DL but only one was a starter IIRC JHD....Stargel was starter all through Spring.

lets not cry in our wheaties too much. The d stinks for many reasons other than attrition. But its a convenient out for some and there is no doubt it hurt Depth. But the starters were the starters at the end of spring.

Its also true that at the end of spring, with that starting DL, IMO the coaches had their head up their arse.

We lost 6 out of the top 8 on the DL. Kitchen, Akins, Commisiong, Robbins, JHD, and Whitehead. The only starter we have currently starting who would've definitely started had we not lost those is Gotsis. It's very likely the other 3 starters would've come out of the "lost" group. Robbins was penciled in as the starter at DE coming out of last season. JHD and Whitehead would've been the others competing for the top 2 spots. So, at DE we're not down to our 2nd string, we're down to our 3rd string. At DT, Gotsis had a starting spot locked up, but the other spot was wide open. In a competition with Green, Kitchen, Akins, and Commissiong, would you put your money on Green or the rest of the field? Much more likely that one of the other guys would've started. Kitchen got more time than Green as a backup DT last year. Akins and Commissiong had been talked up by the coaches as being the real deal. So, at DT we've still got 1 starter and 1 primary backup, but we're missing a starter and 2 primary backups, so we've got what would've been 3rd stringers playing a lot of snaps. We're seeing guys playing these positions (starters and backups at both positions) who not only would've been backups instead of starters but guys who very likely wouldn't have seen the field at all.

Next year DE will likely be much improved, but DT will likely be just as bad.

No doubt in my mind that our DL (starters and backups) and thus our entire defense would be totally different without that bombshell of attrition that fell on that position. Not even Flunkgate I hit one position as hard as DL got hit in Flunkgate II.

 

[33jacket]

We lost 6 out of the top 8 on the DL. Kitchen, Akins, Commisiong, Robbins, JHD, and Whitehead. The only starter we have currently starting who would've definitely started had we not lost those is Gotsis. It's very likely the other 3 starters would've come out of the "lost" group. Robbins was penciled in as the starter at DE coming out of last season. JHD and Whitehead would've been the others competing for the top 2 spots. So, at DE we're not down to our 2nd string, we're down to our 3rd string. At DT, Gotsis had a starting spot locked up, but the other spot was wide open. In a competition with Green, Kitchen, Akins, and Commissiong, would you put your money on Green or the rest of the field? Much more likely that one of the other guys would've started. Kitchen got more time than Green as a backup DT last year. Akins and Commissiong had been talked up by the coaches as being the real deal. So, at DT we've still got 1 starter and 1 primary backup, but we're missing a starter and 2 primary backups, so we've got what would've been 3rd stringers playing a lot of snaps. We're seeing guys playing these positions (starters and backups at both positions) who not only would've been backups instead of starters but guys who very likely wouldn't have seen the field at all.

Next year DE will likely be much improved, but DT will likely be just as bad.

No doubt in my mind that our DL (starters and backups) and thus our entire defense would be totally different without that bombshell of attrition that fell on that position. Not even Flunkgate I hit one position as hard as DL got hit in Flunkgate II.

Green was injured last year. None of those guys won out in spring. So i guess they would have won out in fall. The only starting position hit was De. Same as flungate one. We lost tony hargrove and hobie holiday. we also recruited better back then.

Either way roof has his head up his arse and paul called it out in the media stating the scheme needed to bring more. Validation on scheme. Standby for personnel.

 

[UgaBlows]

I actually think our DT's, Green and Gotsis would be fine (with quality bench help to keep them fresh).if we just had decent and/or experienced DE's

 

[Oldgoldandwhite]

At 5-2 currently, you are saying we're gonna go winless?

I hope we win the rest, but it could happen.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

The bowl streak is presently in jeopardy.

Care to recant? As I said Bull sh!t

 

[vamosjackets]

Green was injured last year. None of those guys won out in spring. So i guess they would have won out in fall. The only starting position hit was De. Same as flungate one. We lost tony hargrove and hobie holiday. we also recruited better back then.

Either way roof has his head up his arse and paul called it out in the media stating the scheme needed to bring more. Validation on scheme. Standby for personnel.

As I said, I would bet on the field of Commissiong, Atkins, and Kitchen rather than Green for winning the starting spot (remember Stargel had a starting spot coming out of spring too), not to mention the actual competition and quality depth loss. But, yes the biggest impact was DE.

BTW, we didn't lose hobie holiday to flunkgate, he was gone a year before that. We lost hargrove, lawston (both at DE I believe, but only hargrove a starter), Kengi Mcnair a probable starter at LB, LaKeldrick Bridges, a probable starter at WR, our best looking RB (can't remember his name at the moment), Travis Parker who was a starter at DE. But, we had Bowers Wilkinson to move down to DE and Eric Henderson, so we were still stout at DE ... that's kind of like what we would've had with JHD and Freeman if we'd only lost Whitehead and Robbins. That alone could've been enough to get us over the hump in our 2 losses.

Also, you're kind of contradicting yourself. If our recruiting was better back then, was that the reason we had better results (rather than Roof's head being in a less than ideal area of his body)?

 

[33jacket]

As I said, I would bet on the field of Commissiong, Atkins, and Kitchen rather than Green for winning the starting spot (remember Stargel had a starting spot coming out of spring too), not to mention the actual competition and quality depth loss. But, yes the biggest impact was DE.

BTW, we didn't lose hobie holiday to flunkgate, he was gone a year before that. We lost hargrove, lawston (both at DE I believe, but only hargrove a starter), Kengi Mcnair a probable starter at LB, LaKeldrick Bridges, a probable starter at WR, our best looking RB (can't remember his name at the moment), Travis Parker who was a starter at DE. But, we had Bowers Wilkinson to move down to DE and Eric Henderson, so we were still stout at DE ... that's kind of like what we would've had with JHD and Freeman if we'd only lost Whitehead and Robbins. That alone could've been enough to get us over the hump in our 2 losses.

Also, you're kind of contradicting yourself. If our recruiting was better back then, was that the reason we had better results (rather than Roof's head being in a less than ideal area of his body)?

our recruiting was better back then, in finding players that fit a good system. Our recruiting now, although the rankings are equal, is not as good on top of being in a dumpster fire system. I am not contradicting myself at all. We have a crappy system with a crappy DC with poorly scouted talent. Back then, we had a good system, with a good DC and well scouted talent despite their rankings. Our ranked recruited back then was below what it is now. But they fit our system, were developed, and scouted well.

and flunkgate 1 was way worse on the DL than this offseason. hargrove was a sure fire starter. None of those guys above were. Travis was a starter. We had to put a LB to DE; whom made it to the NFL as a LB. And henderson was an unknown if you recall, but thankfully due to decent recruiting under GOL he became great. Yet despite all those losses on that DL, that D was still top 40. Why? Good system. Good coach, well scouted talent. If you also recall we started a freshman DT that year named Wrotto we were so thin.

The difference between then and now, is you are talking about backups and unknowns now, back then they were starters we lost. Kitchen was no good. Didn't crack the depth chart and wouldn't have...they other two still didn't crack the first team maybe in the future, but end of spring didn't. Which says to me, they weren't showing any better than uh uh uh Stargel. LOL

bottom line. Roof runs a bad scheme now, and did way back when and there is no way out of this with him at DC unless we can recruit SEC talent. Don't hold your breath. We need a more creative scheme with the talent we can get at GT. This teams talent today at GT is better than 118 in the NCAA on D. Yet that is our status....its on Roof as much as Paul and the players lack of accountability

 

[wuzjrbuzz]

As I said, I would bet on the field of Commissiong, Atkins, and Kitchen rather than Green for winning the starting spot (remember Stargel had a starting spot coming out of spring too), not to mention the actual competition and quality depth loss. But, yes the biggest impact was DE.

BTW, we didn't lose hobie holiday to flunkgate, he was gone a year before that. We lost hargrove, lawston (both at DE I believe, but only hargrove a starter), Kengi Mcnair a probable starter at LB, LaKeldrick Bridges, a probable starter at WR, our best looking RB (can't remember his name at the moment), Travis Parker who was a starter at DE. But, we had Bowers Wilkinson to move down to DE and Eric Henderson, so we were still stout at DE ... that's kind of like what we would've had with JHD and Freeman if we'd only lost Whitehead and Robbins. That alone could've been enough to get us over the hump in our 2 losses.

Also, you're kind of contradicting yourself. If our recruiting was better back then, was that the reason we had better results (rather than Roof's head being in a less than ideal area of his body)?

I believe the running back was Michael Sampson. Also lost Hollings, but he was coming off that serious knee injury.

 

[vamosjackets]

our recruiting was better back then, in finding players that fit a good system. Our recruiting now, although the rankings are equal, is not as good on top of being in a dumpster fire system. I am not contradicting myself at all. We have a crappy system with a crappy DC with poorly scouted talent. Back then, we had a good system, with a good DC and well scouted talent despite their rankings. Our ranked recruited back then was below what it is now. But they fit our system, were developed, and scouted well.

and flunkgate 1 was way worse on the DL than this offseason. hargrove was a sure fire starter. None of those guys above were. Travis was a starter. We had to put a LB to DE; whom made it to the NFL as a LB. And henderson was an unknown if you recall, but thankfully due to decent recruiting under GOL he became great. Yet despite all those losses on that DL, that D was still top 40. Why? Good system. Good coach, well scouted talent. If you also recall we started a freshman DT that year named Wrotto we were so thin.

The difference between then and now, is you are talking about backups and unknowns now, back then they were starters we lost. Kitchen was no good. Didn't crack the depth chart and wouldn't have...they other two still didn't crack the first team maybe in the future, but end of spring didn't. Which says to me, they weren't showing any better than uh uh uh Stargel. LOL

bottom line. Roof runs a bad scheme now, and did way back when and there is no way out of this with him at DC unless we can recruit SEC talent. Don't hold your breath. We need a more creative scheme with the talent we can get at GT. This teams talent today at GT is better than 118 in the NCAA on D. Yet that is our status....its on Roof as much as Paul and the players lack of accountability

I think you make some good points in this post and may be ultimately right. But, it gets really hard to get the right answer when you're dealing with multiple variables (in math as in life). Is it the players or is it the coach? That's often the conundrum for an AD and he should never say both. If he thinks it's the players, then he's got to try to figure out how why that's the case and whether another coach could get better players (and coach them just as well or better); if the coach isn't the problem, then to get rid of the coach would probably take the program backward rather than forward. If he thinks it's the coach, then change him. I've seen an AD (in college basketball) bring in a new coach and that coach then proceeded to get rid of all of the players except a couple and bring in a bunch of players from their old team. To me that's wrong. If the problem is the coach, why get rid of the players too? That coach then went on to create an absolute dumpster fire, whereas before the program had been decent/good.

To summarize, if we had better players back then, then there's really no way to know whether the problem is the players or the coach unless you just see ineptness with your own eyes. We can't evaluate that because we're not seeing the defensive coaching. CPJ can see it, and I don't think he sees Roof the same way he saw Wommack and Groh. There's no doubt in my mind we have one of the worst DL's in college football personnel wise right now, and I know the reason for that ... we saw it this off-season ... that isn't coaching. So, it makes it harder for me to accurately criticize the defensive coaching when I know they inherited a major personnel issue. That's too many variables to get the right answer for me.

I do think Roof will improve the defense over the next 2 years because I've seen him do better when he has something to work with. But, I will say that I'm with you on missing the creativity in Tenuta's scheme and the way that it can make up for some talent issues we will face at GT. So, to me, the jury is still out on Roof, and I'm not ready to say one way or the other.