Kaepernick

[AE 87]

I think the last one I saw was Washington Post. I will look for it.

But these statistics have been pretty consistent since I first saw them in a church newsletter 3 years ago. Lots of different studies I have seen have confirmed that over this time.

That's alright. It's an authority bluff until we have data to discuss.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Here you go. I confess I have not retained all the sources in my memory from the last few years because it is a settled issue for me after I read multiple sources all giving the same statistics. I just tend to remember the statistics now.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-by-police-yes-but-no/?utm_term=.75c5e0c724b2

 

[AE 87]

Here you go. I confess I have not retained all the sources in my memory from the last few years because it is a settled issue for me after I read multiple sources all giving the same statistics. I just tend to remember the statistics now.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-by-police-yes-but-no/?utm_term=.75c5e0c724b2

Thanks. I'll look at the stats and studies when I have more time. A quick read suggests they normalized fatalities to population but not crime rate.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Thanks. I'll look at the stats and studies when I have more time. A quick read suggests they normalized fatalities to population but not crime rate.

You're welcome. I was kind of surprised you were not familiar with all of this but happy to open a new avenue of inquiry for you.

 

[ATL1]

As someone who is in leadership with several organizations who frequently protest and if you haven't noticed studies protesters of the past. I'm fine with Kap.

It's a silent protest. He's putting his money up.

I'm trying to understand though, why a form of symbolism is more important than the respect and value of actual human beings?

 

[forensicbuzz]

Sometimes a symbol represents different things for different people. It's obvious that most Americans associate the National Anthem with what has made America a great country. Without waxing poetic, it's obvious to me that Kaepernick's protest has nothing to do with our military or the veterans who have fought [and lost their lives] is service of our country. To me, it's obvious that he is associating the National Anthem with the leadership and social/political policies that has failed a sector of our population. The reasons and responsibility for these failures is debateable, with vastly different perspectives, but really isn't relevant to this post.

From my observation of this situation, Kaepernick is quietly, and with respect for those around him, protesting a system he feels is broken. We all have the right and obligation to stand up (or kneel) against something we feel is unjust or wrong. I believe those who have expressed anger and venom are projecting their own feeling of what the National Anthem represents onto him. I would challenge us all to try to set aside what sitting through the National Anthem means to us individually, and try to look at his actions through his eyes. I don't agree that what he is doing proper, but neither do I believe he is attempting to disrespect our veterans.

My father was a Marine helicopter pilot in Viet Nam and I have a brother who just retired from the Air Force after 23 years service. I grew up singing the Marine Corps Hymn and many other patriotic songs as we took long trips. I was also taught to respect others' opinions and to always try to see things through another's eyes before judging them. We are all a collection of our individual experiences: not only are our experiences different, but the way those experiences have shaped us are different. Only by embracing those differences can we begin to understand each other.

 

[AE 87]

Sometimes a symbol represents different things for different people. It's obvious that most Americans associate the National Anthem with what has made America a great country. Without waxing poetic, it's obvious to me that Kaepernick's protest has nothing to do with our military or the veterans who have fought [and lost their lives] is service of our country. To me, it's obvious that he is associating the National Anthem with the leadership and social/political policies that has failed a sector of our population. The reasons and responsibility for these failures is debateable, with vastly different perspectives, but really isn't relevant to this post.

From my observation of this situation, Kaepernick is quietly, and with respect for those around him, protesting a system he feels is broken. We all have the right and obligation to stand up (or kneel) against something we feel is unjust or wrong. I believe those who have expressed anger and venom are projecting their own feeling of what the National Anthem represents onto him. I would challenge us all to try to set aside what sitting through the National Anthem means to us individually, and try to look at his actions through his eyes. I don't agree that what he is doing proper, but neither do I believe he is attempting to disrespect our veterans.

My father was a Marine helicopter pilot in Viet Nam and I have a brother who just retired from the Air Force after 23 years service. I grew up singing the Marine Corps Hymn and many other patriotic songs as we took long trips. I was also taught to respect others' opinions and to always try to see things through another's eyes before judging them. We are all a collection of our individual experiences: not only are our experiences different, but the way those experiences have shaped us are different. Only by embracing those differences can we begin to understand each other.

I'm sure the injured and those who had property damaged in Charlotte riots may not agree that propogating a false narrative is so benign.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I'm sure the injured and those who had property damaged in Charlotte riots may not agree that propogating a false narrative is so benign.

I don't remember anywhere in my post mentioning Charlotte or any other place where violence has occurred. If one is narrowminded, there's not much I can do to change that.

Just because you believe something to be a false narrative doesn't make it so. And before you go off on that comment, realize, I'm not commenting on whether it's a real or false narrative. Just because I am able to step back and recognize that my perspective isn't always the only perspective doesn't mean that I advocate someone else's opinion.

 

[AE 87]

I don't remember anywhere in my post mentioning Charlotte or any other place where violence has occurred. If one is narrowminded, there's not much I can do to change that.

Just because you believe something to be a false narrative doesn't make it so. And before you go off on that comment, realize, I'm not commenting on whether it's a real or false narrative. Just because I am able to step back and recognize that my perspective isn't always the only perspective doesn't mean that I advocate someone else's opinion.

No worries. However, you did choose to speak to the motivation of those who disagree with your position. I was reminding you that there was another reason for disagreeing with his action.

There has been published evidence that Soros spent millions to advance racial tensions. We are seeing the fruit of it in Charlotte.

 

[deeeznutz]

My biggest problem is not necessarily with the bad cops (because let's face it, in any group of people you will find some good and some bad), but with the good cops who allow the bad ones to get away with it through silence. Also, DAs should not be in charge of prosecuting police who are accused, it's a massive conflict of interest because those DAs rely on working closely with the police on every other case. I really feel if we can just start making the police accountable for their actions on duty you'd see a lot of problems go away.

 

[Peacone36]

My problem here is I see a lot of protesting but not a whole lot of examples. Bad cops? Sure I can concede that. 1-2% are probably dortbags. I can also say that in that profession the level of stress and probably fear is very high. I will also say that the public is manipulated (effectively btw) by the media.

Tell me how backup qb Collin Kap is oppressed with his free education, 100+ MM contract and ability to influence ESPNS lead every day. If anything he is a monument to illustrate how far this country has come since the times when minorities were actually suffering instead of suffering the imagined slights. I'm not saying it's all imagined, but I am saying that I work with hispanics for a living, and they don't have the greatest rep yet they don't do a whole lot of complaining. It's gotten to the point where I'm sometimes paranoid of being white just because I'm white and I have done nothing wrong. Is that right? No, it absolutely is not.

I blame this on the millennial generation which is by far the worst generation to ever set foot on the planet. Bleeding heart piss babies who have zero desire to actually work while wanting the newest overpriced iPhone to up their instagram rep.

 

[LibertyTurns]

I blame this on the millennial generation which is by far the worst generation to ever set foot on the planet. Bleeding heart piss babies who have zero desire to actually work while wanting the newest overpriced iPhone to up their instagram rep.

This isn't about of millennials staging some sort of uprising to protest social injustice like the Vietnam War or a civil rights uprising like MLK, etc inspired. This is a power play by the major power brokers to stay in power. Soros, Clinton, etc want to oppress the very people they are leading so they can mass power & accumulate large amounts of money so they can stay in charge. The Pubs have dropped their drawers and joined forces. Us little guys have no chance. They're organized, they have money & we don't. They create the oppressive policies, then they have effective amassed an incredibly efficient media machine to drive their message on top of it to point out where their oppressive policies didn't go far enough and now we need more. These people don't give a crap about the people they supposedly want to help. Look at their language in their "secret emails". It's all about keeping us in our place so they can retain theirs. Sickening & we're about to ask for 4 more years of it. "Tax the rich they say" but the rich aka Buffet pays less taxes than his secretary & that big Liberal gloats about it. One of many. He'll always pay less taxes because he helps write the rules so he can enrich himself. Who will pay for the additional oppression being heaped on us, the "little guys" that think these big POS politician sw actually care about the people. The alleged "adults in the room" the Republicans now look like 1980 Carter Democrats so nobody's watching the henhouse any more and the foxes are running around creating havoc. Face it, this country has no leadership. Period.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

"Tax the rich they say" but the rich aka Buffet pays less taxes than his secretary & that big Liberal gloats about it. One of many. He'll always pay less taxes because he helps write the rules so he can enrich himself.

You are factually wrong on this point. Buffet has never gloated about this. He has repeatedly pointed it out because he is in favor (as are many billionaires) in paying more in taxes. He thinks the rich are not paying their fair share and has lobbied (unsuccessfully) to change our tax laws to correct this.

 

[LibertyTurns]

This is just 1 of many sweetheart deals Buffet has brokered for himself. Keep smoking the good stuff- Buffett prances around supporting bad legislation that will never pass as a smokescreen when behind the scenes he's greasing palms to make millions more by avoiding the taxes he claims he "wants to pay". Gimme a break. He hates things that tax him just as much as everyone else and loves taxes on everyone else. Simply put, Liberals like him love spending other people's money. Now the Pubs have gotten the bug as well. Need a real conservative sea change otherwise we're all going to be in the crapper soon.



http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748703441404575206252252365076

 

[AE 87]

There is no law prohibiting people from paying more taxes.

Anybody who takes Buffett et al seriously should not be.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Article in WSJ said I had to subscribe to read it. Oh well, more click bait for people who think conservatives have not been running Wall Street for years. LOL.

 

[GTNavyNuke]

I've got no problem with Buffet - he is donating massive amounts of money. I guess he'd rather direct where it goes rather than give it to the Government. http://www.forbes.com/sites/chasewi...d-nearly-2-9-billion-to-charity/#72e009695489

But in the long run we are all dead and it doesn't matter how much you have when you die as long as you've been able to do largely what you want. It's how you've lived your life.

Concerning Kaepernick, I understand where he is coming from. I wish the flag weren't the peaceful means of protest being used but IIWII and the flag is only a symbol to me. As long as they don't burn it or defile it, fine. There is racism in the country. This week a black friend of my son's was stopped in Oklahoma for "lights". He said he was glad that he was on video chatting with his wife so that there was contact with the outside world. That is problem enough. He also said the policeman kept trying bait him but he just responded with many yes sirs and no sirs. He believes it was racism in action (Driving While Black) and supports Kaepernick's actions. I think the vast majority of the police officers are trying to do the right thing and are not racist; but it only takes a few. Oh yeah, not that it matters, but he is an Army helicopter pilot who has flown combat missions.

The latest where North Carolina may not release future available video footage of killings is going in the wrong direction IMHO. http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/25/us/charlotte-police-video/index.html We have too big of a problem to keep the videos out of public view given the abuses which have happened. My judgement is that on balance the public good of increasing confidence in the police (since I think the police are justified much of the time) outweighs the damage to the individual officers involved by prejudicing potential jurors. Just an opinion. Being a police officer is a lot like being the CO of a ship; you are responsible for what happens whether it is fair or not.

While I'm waxing poetic, I hope everyone votes even if it is for Donald Duck. A vote for Donald Duck is a vote that you don't like the choices on the ballot and there is nothing in our constitution that gives the Republicans or Democrats the luxury of being the only candidates. Too many people have given their lives for that right for any of us not to vote.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

A friend of mine who is African-American, has been stopped, not once but twice, for jogging in his own neighborhood. The first time it happened we joked about the new category of being stopped for JWB (jogging while black). The second time it happened they threw him up against the patrol care and hand cuffed him. Because he was a well known Methodist minister in town higher ups in authority were able to stop things before they got ugly. He was lucky.

My fear is that a lot of white people do not understand how common an experience this is for black people. I also regret that they seem to pass it off as no big deal whereas if it happened to them they would be outraged at the government and screaming to high heaven.

It is a telling double standard. If you are white you are allowed to complain that the country is going to hell in a hand basket. If you are black you are told to shut up and that this is a country that holds no one back and you should just be grateful to live here.

 

[AE 87]

A friend of mine who is African-American, has been stopped, not once but twice, for jogging in his own neighborhood. The first time it happened we joked about the new category of being stopped for JWB (jogging while black). The second time it happened they threw him up against the patrol care and hand cuffed him. Because he was a well known Methodist minister in town higher ups in authority were able to stop things before they got ugly. He was lucky.

My fear is that a lot of white people do not understand how common an experience this is for black people. I also regret that they seem to pass it off as no big deal whereas if it happened to them they would be outraged at the government and screaming to high heaven.

It is a telling double standard. If you are white you are allowed to complain that the country is going to hell in a hand basket. If you are black you are told to shut up and that this is a country that holds no one back and you should just be grateful to live here.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

I have no idea what that had to do with anything that was being talked about.