Jay Jones has an arm

[Deleted member 2897]

For reference, the guy he threw to (Ty Hill) I believe was the fastest at the NFL combine year before last with a 4.24 in the 40 yard dash (JT ran low to mid 4.3s at GT Pro Day by comparison). That's what he meant when he said it was literally impossible to out throw him. He'll just run as fast as he needs to catch whatever you've thrown. Pretty cool group of guys to work out with!

 

[Techster]

The strawman arguments on here are ridiculous, reaching epic proportions.

-Nobody said Jay Jones was a superhero, or the presumptive starter. So some of ya'll should quit arguing a point nobody made in the first place, those argument get filed immediately in the "no **** Sherlock" file.
-Nobody is dissing Mathew Jordan (our probable starter)
-Everything from the coaches has been positive about all the QB, and that's an "open race".

Many of you should take threads like this as precisely what they are, people excited about a young talent on the team. You can simultaneously be excited about young players while also recognizing that they still have quite a bit to learn.

In closing, Jay looks like a great athlete. Will he start? Maybe not, but the fact that we don't have a "starter" named by our coaching staff may be an indication of the level of talent we have at QB. IMO, this is a great thing and no slight on any SA or their family members on this board. So everyone should calm down, we're in good hands at QB, nobody is "hero worshipping" or "crowning" anyone, or calling for people to start over other people. This is the offseason.

Your strawman argument is a strawman argument!!!

 

[LongforDodd]

I think the field at the indoor facility is 60-65 yards long.

Thanks. That's not the picture I saw but this one is better.

 

[AE 87]

The strawman arguments on here are ridiculous, reaching epic proportions.

-Nobody said Jay Jones was a superhero, or the presumptive starter. So some of ya'll should quit arguing a point nobody made in the first place, those argument get filed immediately in the "no **** Sherlock" file.
-Nobody is dissing Mathew Jordan (our probable starter)
-Everything from the coaches has been positive about all the QB, and that's an "open race".

Many of you should take threads like this as precisely what they are, people excited about a young talent on the team. You can simultaneously be excited about young players while also recognizing that they still have quite a bit to learn.

In closing, Jay looks like a great athlete. Will he start? Maybe not, but the fact that we don't have a "starter" named by our coaching staff may be an indication of the level of talent we have at QB. IMO, this is a great thing and no slight on any SA or their family members on this board. So everyone should calm down, we're in good hands at QB, nobody is "hero worshipping" or "crowning" anyone, or calling for people to start over other people. This is the offseason.

1) You are absolutely right in describing the reaction.

2) There is a logical explanation. All statements convey meaning at 3 levels.

a) The first is the meaning of the words in their grammatical context.
b) The second is the significance of this meaning (eg that JJ has an arm conveys the meaning that he can open up our long passing game)
c) The third level is reading the reason for the statement. If you tell your wife that your secretary wore a nice sweater, her first question may not be who made it and where did she get it. She may be more concerned about why you noticed etc.​

So, when someone starts a thread about a QB, we should not be surprised when people react to an inferred meaning at level 3.

 

[alentrekin]

Right, which neatly implies that some are "married" to or in some cases the actual family of MJ. No problem there, but it's not everyone's position.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

Your strawman argument is a strawman argument!!!

You just launched a red herring

1) You are absolutely right in describing the reaction.

2) There is a logical explanation. All statements convey meaning at 3 levels.

a) The first is the meaning of the words in their grammatical context.
b) The second is the significance of this meaning (eg that JJ has an arm conveys the meaning that he can open up our long passing game)
c) The third level is reading the reason for the statement. If you tell your wife that your secretary wore a nice sweater, her first question may not be who made it and where did she get it. She may be more concerned about why you noticed etc.​

So, when someone starts a thread about a QB, we should not be surprised when people react to an inferred meaning at level 3.

So, all you fruitcakes, why are you all noticing how strong his arms are?

 

[Whiskey_Clear]

I was looking at his broad shoulders

 

[SteamWhistle]

I want an Elite ATH under center, PERIOD. I see people talk about wanting a "Ballhandler, Experienced Guy" and it just makes me cringe. It's a Truck vs a Ferrari, when things break down I want a guy who can make a play. Talent takes over and wins games some times, and in all honesty that's the most important thing in our offense. I know everyone loves talking about "Death Marches" but we haven't been a "Death March" team. We are a big play offense and that's what we should be. Some many great individual plays in 2016, our talent shined bright when it mattered most.

 

[dressedcheeseside]

I want an Elite ATH under center, PERIOD. I see people talk about wanting a "Ballhandler, Experienced Guy" and it just makes me cringe. It's a Truck vs a Ferrari, when things break down I want a guy who can make a play. Talent takes over and wins games some times, and in all honesty that's the most important thing in our offense. I know everyone loves talking about "Death Marches" but we haven't been a "Death March" team. We are a big play offense and that's what we should be. Some many great individual plays in 2016, our talent shined bright when it mattered most.

The quickest way to losses caused by the offense are turnovers. The second biggest is qb's running backwards and getting sacked for big losses because they used to get away with that s*** in high school. This is why CPJ values ball security and good decision making above all else. If these two parameters are met, of course, we all want the Ferrari. Besides that, I think you're selling our other qb's short by calling them trucks.

Also, don't undervalue the power running game from the qb spot. It's something we've seen before to great success, but not in a long time.

 

[deeeznutz]

I want an Elite ATH under center, PERIOD. I see people talk about wanting a "Ballhandler, Experienced Guy" and it just makes me cringe. It's a Truck vs a Ferrari, when things break down I want a guy who can make a play. Talent takes over and wins games some times, and in all honesty that's the most important thing in our offense. I know everyone loves talking about "Death Marches" but we haven't been a "Death March" team. We are a big play offense and that's what we should be. Some many great individual plays in 2016, our talent shined bright when it mattered most.

I honestly feel like all our QBs are elite athletes in some respects. What Matthew Jordan might lack in speed/elusiveness he makes up for with his power running ability (for all JTs elite speed and agility, he was nobody's idea of a pile mover and regularly got swapped out for TB in goal line situations). We flat out only recruit elite athletes to play QB, and those who don't work out get moved elsewhere.

 

[Techster]

CPJ does not recruit unathletic SAs for QB. In fact, our QBs may just be in the top 10% of "athletes" on the team. They are the "Ferrari" of football players if you will. How do I know this? Well, most every QB we've recruited has ended up playing big roles at other positions if they didn't transfer out: Synjyn Days (QB/AB/BB), Dennis Andrews (QB/AB), Demond Smith (QB/S), Taquan Marshall (QB/AB), Matthew Jordan (QB/AB/WR), David Sims (QB/BB)...I'm sure I'm missing someone.

I'd say, of all the positions on the team, QB recruits have probably been the most productive recruits we've signed. Even the guys who transfered produced for us on the field (Jaybo Shaw, Vad Lee). Heck, the least athletic QB we've had running our offense was probably the best QB in terms being a technician for our offense...he was just unfortunate to play with a historically bad defense.

MJ is about as athletic as anyone on the team. Is he the fastest or quickest? No. Does he have a cannon for an arm? No. But ask VT if he was fast enough to beat their vaunted Bud Foster defense. MJ could play multiple positions for us, and CPJ has asked him to do exactly that before. He's earned QB1 on the field, and not on the messageboards. You have to respect that. If you have elite speed or have a great passing game, but you can't run our offense, those skills mean nothing. That was why Vad was never able to fully unseat Tevin.

If JJ or LJ or Taquan wins QB1, it's because they will have earned it by making plays and running our offense the way CPJ wants it run.

 

[tech_wreck47]

I think the reason people are so excited about Jay Jones, including myself is because of what he brings to the table. He has the ability to be a JT but bigger and therefore he can run the midline and more stuff up the middle. Imo he is the only QB on the roster that has all these things combined, a big arm, extremely elusive, tremendous speed, can run up the middle and whatever else you can think about that you would want a QB in our system to have. Those attributes make up the "perfect" QB for our system imo. Now of course he will have to be good at decision making, and that's still to be seen from us the fans. But if he does get the decision making part down he has pretty much all the attributes you want in a QB for us, and I'm not sure you can say that about the other guys. Please don't take this as a hit at the other QB's. I think they are all good at what they do. Jordan is good at power football, LJ has a good arm and speed, Marshall has speed and is elusive, so I think we can win with all these guys, but I think Jones brings something to the table that the rest don't have, and most football players in general don't have.

 

[potatohead]

1) You are absolutely right in describing the reaction.

2) There is a logical explanation. All statements convey meaning at 3 levels.

a) The first is the meaning of the words in their grammatical context.
b) The second is the significance of this meaning (eg that JJ has an arm conveys the meaning that he can open up our long passing game)
c) The third level is reading the reason for the statement. If you tell your wife that your secretary wore a nice sweater, her first question may not be who made it and where did she get it. She may be more concerned about why you noticed etc.​

So, when someone starts a thread about a QB, we should not be surprised when people react to an inferred meaning at level 3.

my secretary's job isn't to wear a sweater. Jay Jones is a qb and a qb with a good arm is relevant to discuss and something worth noticing.

 

[Milwaukee]

Imo he is the only QB on the roster that has all these things combined, a big arm, extremely elusive, tremendous speed, can run up the middle

✔✔✔

 

[AE 87]

my secretary's job isn't to wear a sweater. Jay Jones is a qb and a qb with a good arm is relevant to discuss and something worth noticing.

Missed the point. I'm on your side.

 

[ilovetheoption]

I think the reason people are so excited about Jay Jones, including myself is because of what he brings to the table. He has the ability to be a JT but bigger and therefore he can run the midline and more stuff up the middle. Imo he is the only QB on the roster that has all these things combined, a big arm, extremely elusive, tremendous speed, can run up the middle and whatever else you can think about that you would want a QB in our system to have. Those attributes make up the "perfect" QB for our system imo. Now of course he will have to be good at decision making, and that's still to be seen from us the fans. But if he does get the decision making part down he has pretty much all the attributes you want in a QB for us, and I'm not sure you can say that about the other guys. Please don't take this as a hit at the other QB's. I think they are all good at what they do. Jordan is good at power football, LJ has a good arm and speed, Marshall has speed and is elusive, so I think we can win with all these guys, but I think Jones brings something to the table that the rest don't have, and most football players in general don't have.

I also wonder about the accuracy of jones arm. That's my big worry about him, is I saw him airmail some pretty elementary throws in the spring game, and yeah that's not the only input, but it's all we've seen of him, and I saw what I saw. A strong arm is relatively unimportant compared to an accurate arm.

 

[RyanS12]

56 more days.......... 56 more......

 

[tech_wreck47]

I also wonder about the accuracy of jones arm. That's my big worry about him, is I saw him airmail some pretty elementary throws in the spring game, and yeah that's not the only input, but it's all we've seen of him, and I saw what I saw. A strong arm is relatively unimportant compared to an accurate arm.

I would also like to see more of his arm, but imo I really think the spring game wasn't very telling of the accuracy of his arm. I think it was one of the a backs that said he throws the best ball, which translates to accuracy, arm strength, etc. this is high school highlights which go out the window to an extent when you get to college, but it definitely shows that he had touch. The first and third throws were beautiful.

 

[Techster]

A strong arm is relatively unimportant compared to an accurate arm.

This. Nesbitt had a CANON for an arm, probably the strongest arm of any QB that's played under CPJ. He was not very accurate. Synjyn had a CANON as well. Dude literally hit the wall behind the benches more than he hit the receivers. Accuracy and the ability to anticipate throws in windows are far more important than arm strength.

The ability to make reads in our offense, decision making, and toughness will always be the top traits for QBs in our offense. Given where we want to go as an offense overall as defenses have evolved to defend us, the ability for our QBs to make defenses pay with their arms when the opportunity is there is becoming important as well. Like I mentioned before, we don't have to be Air Raid and have a QB chuck it all over the field all the time, but the ability for our QBs to make the throws when the opportunity arises is a must now. We can't be one dimensional and expect to win games against the better teams. THAT is what made JeT special in this offense. That's what separated him from Nesbitt, Tevin, and even Vad. If any of MJ/Taquan/Jay/Lucas want to approach JeT in productivity, it won't just be with their legs.

 

[Techster]

I would also like to see more of his arm, but imo I really think the spring game wasn't very telling of the accuracy of his arm. I think it was one of the a backs that said he throws the best ball, which translates to accuracy, arm strength, etc. this is high school highlights which go out the window to an extent when you get to college, but it definitely shows that he had touch. The first and third throws were beautiful.

IMO, his three throws starting at the 1:28 mark, the throw at the 2:25 mark, the throw at 2:38 mark, the throw at the 2:52 mark (really good if you like anticipation and throwing to a small window), throw at the 5:01 mark (nice patience waiting for a passing lane to develop) were more college level throws than the throws you alluded to. These throws were in the rythym of the offense where he read the defense and threw with some anticipation, and showed the patience to let the routes develop. The throws you alluded more times than not will get him sacked at this level, and it was more him and his WRs out athleting HS competition.

Jay has throwing ability, and that was the highlight reel that changed my opinion of him being a true dual threat on this level. Wasn't so much about chucking it down field and letting his WRs out athlete the HS DBs. JeT was REALLY good at anticipating throws with his WRs, and the back shoulder throws he made were beauties. Some of that is working with his WRs, but you have to be accurate as well.