How Important is Recruiting?

[tmhunter52]

No, we just fired a head cheerleader posing as a football coach.

I see a Mod communication in your future…

 

[JacketFan137]

I see a Mod communication in your future…

 

[cpf2001]

[…]


There are lots of ways that CEO’s hire badly. There are lots of ways that head coaches hire bad assistants. A good head coach should hire good assistants, but that in no way means that the top guy should mainly be a recruiter.

Yes, Friedgen was exposed to recruiting. It wasn’t his specialty. FBS is populated with a lot of successful head coaches who hire people who recruit better than they do.
That’s the point. There’s proof of successful coaches who aren’t great recruiters, but they’re great head coaches. The head coach does not have to be a great recruiter to have a great team or hire great recruiters to work for him.

I think we’re fairly away from where I started now - I said “My concern with “the coach doesn’t have to be the head recruiter” is that I think if you take that too far, you get a coach who isn’t even qualified to judge the abilities of the staff. “ I don’t think the coach has to be head recruiter, I just would prefer someone who knows what it looks like at a program that is successful at the P5 level.

This is my concern with a Chadwell more than with a Mullen or with a OBrien type. Yes, you can hire people without knowing the job in and out yourself, but it’s certainly harder. The biggest things that I’ve seen be helpful in that situation are personal networks, boards of directors, and investors, and the latter two don’t apply here - so if I’m an AD I imagine I’d be interested in the coach’s connections, especially for someone coming from a school that doesn’t recruit the same level.

 

[Heisman's Ghost]

It’s like a three legged stool. Recruiting and coaching are two of the legs.

Recruiting, coaching, and player development which is increasingly difficult in an age of portal transfers and coaching turnover. IIWII

 

[ramblin_man]

It is amazing to me that today even in the tailspin and HC vacancy that we have a solid Brookwood WR committed to GT. That tells me a few things. GT is still a desirable destination for certain athletes who place value on what a degree from GT can offer. Second, it’s impressive that the coaches are still out there on the recruiting trail letting football players know that there are lots of opportunities to play ball here early and have an immediate impact on the direction of the future of our football team.
Third, it’s impressive that the AD has given the green light to send our “real offers” to players not knowing what the preferences of the new incoming coaches will be. Forth, will the incoming football staff honor these offers or will they pull them and send out all new ones post hiring. Fifth, we need to get a HC hired/announced before we miss the December early signing period. However I suppose losing one or a few signatures of athletes during the early period is a very small concession if we take a little bit longer to double check our candidate pool and make a better hire as opposed to a knee jerk “hire now” mentality to appease the Dec early signing period.

 

[SoMsJacket]

Recruiting is 50% of the equation.
Coaching 30%
Development 20%

Winning the game comes down to beating the player across from you on a consistent basis. It's not rocket science, thou our fanbase tries to define it as such.

 

[slugboy]

I see a Mod communication in your future…

Dude, I'm glad he's gone. Collins is probably not even a bad person--he got his dream job and wasn't suited for it and couldn't or didn't grow into it and left behind a huge mess.

I wish he would have voluntarily left before last season with a reduced buyout, but I wouldn't have cut my buyout in half if I were him--I have a family and who would light a pile of more money than you'd ever seen rather than keep it for your family?

I just don't want US to be jerks to people--coaches or athletes. Even to the other people on this board.

 

[roadkill]

It is amazing to me that today even in the tailspin and HC vacancy that we have a solid Brookwood WR committed to GT. That tells me a few things. GT is still a desirable destination for certain athletes who place value on what a degree from GT can offer. Second, it’s impressive that the coaches are still out there on the recruiting trail letting football players know that there are lots of opportunities to play ball here early and have an immediate impact on the direction of the future of our football team.
Third, it’s impressive that the AD has given the green light to send our “real offers” to players not knowing what the preferences of the new incoming coaches will be. Forth, will the incoming football staff honor these offers or will they pull them and send out all new ones post hiring. Fifth, we need to get a HC hired/announced before we miss the December early signing period. However I suppose losing one or a few signatures of athletes during the early period is a very small concession if we take a little bit longer to double check our candidate pool and make a better hire as opposed to a knee jerk “hire now” mentality to appease the Dec early signing period.

The Rivals article about the Brookwood WR commit is more evidence that, whoever we end up with as HC, I hope we retain KW.

 

[JacketFan137]

The Rivals article about the Brookwood WR commit is more evidence that, whoever we end up with as HC, I hope we retain KW.

any head coach that comes in here if they do not retain KW i will be pretty upset

 

[leatherneckjacket]

any head coach that comes in here if they do not retain KW i will be pretty upset

I would add Tillman to that list. The work he has done with the DBs is incredible.

 

[SteamWhistle]

GT was VERY close to making the CFP in 2014.

Don’t think we were “Very” close. Wouldn’t say we were actually that close at all. We weren’t even a top 10 team heading into the FSU game, a team that snuck in at 4. Also undefeated teams got left out of the playoff that year. A team with a Duke loss was not getting in over 1 loss teams and a undefeated TCU.

 

[roadkill]

Don’t think we were “Very” close. Wouldn’t say we were actually that close at all. We weren’t even a top 10 team heading into the FSU game, a team that snuck in at 4. Also undefeated teams got left out of the playoff that year. A team with a Duke loss was not getting in over 1 loss teams and a undefeated TCU.

I suppose there's an argument to be made that winning the ACC over FSU (and we came close) that year would have gotten us close to consideration as ACC champs. We would have had a pretty good resume with wins over some highly-ranked teams including the prior year's national champs. I agree though, it still would probably have not been enough given our two losses.

 

[yellajacket20]

I think that Collins played the recruiting ranking game. The class rankings only take into account the number of commits and their ratings. It does nothing to take into account need among positions or place greater weight to the relative importance among the positions. It seemed like a huge percentage of our highly rated players were DB's and WR's and not so much among the OL and DL.

I think we need a HC that can evaluate talent. Not just when it comes to recruiting and identifying who we should bring onto the team, but also one that can make decisions on playing time and the proper position for guys to play based their skills.

 

[JacketFan137]

I think that Collins played the recruiting ranking game. The class rankings only take into account the number of commits and their ratings. It does nothing to take into account need among positions or place greater weight to the relative importance among the positions. It seemed like a huge percentage of our highly rated players were DB's and WR's and not so much among the OL and DL.

I think we need a HC that can evaluate talent. Not just when it comes to recruiting and identifying who we should bring onto the team, but also one that can make decisions on playing time and the proper position for guys to play based their skills.

even though they are raking in 4/5* talent, uga and bama have actually seen some 3* players end up being phenomenal for them. so not only are they taking all the blue chips, they are also either scouting well and finding diamonds in the rough or just developing players at a better rate than we did. that’s all part of the recruiting process too

 

[Deleted member 6494]

even though they are raking in 4/5* talent, uga and bama have actually seen some 3* players end up being phenomenal for them. so not only are they taking all the blue chips, they are also either scouting well and finding diamonds in the rough or just developing players at a better rate than we did. that’s all part of the recruiting process too

Good teams always start with good coaches, they win big in their entrance jobs and mold their game around the talent they possess. It does not take long for an AD in a higher conference to note his ability to win.

He is promoted to a higher conference, has better players, and other High School players notices his winning habits, thus his recruiting increases somewhat. He continues to win big in this new conference, and the big dog eats the little dogs. He is promoted to the next level and continues to win with the better athletes from that level.

He has begun to be noticed as a winner everywhere he goes. His recruiting also increases because players want to play for a winning coach. Because of his coaching prowess, good players tend to want to play for him and his recruiting continues to flourish.

It always starts with a good coach and the recruiting will follow suit. Jimbo Fisher had the best recruiting year ever for all years of recruiting last year, yet his team is 3-6 for this year. Collins actually increased the quality of recruits to a degree but did not know how to use them.

 

[JacketFan137]

Good teams always start with good coaches, they win big in their entrance jobs and mold their game around the talent they possess. It does not take long for an AD in a higher conference to note his ability to win.

He is promoted to a higher conference, has better players, and other High School players notices his winning habits, thus his recruiting increases somewhat. He continues to win big in this new conference, and the big dog eats the little dogs. He is promoted to the next level and continues to win with the better athletes from that level.

He has begun to be noticed as a winner everywhere he goes. His recruiting also increases because players want to play for a winning coach. Because of his coaching prowess, good players tend to want to play for him and his recruiting continues to flourish.

It always starts with a good coach and the recruiting will follow suit. Jimbo Fisher had the best recruiting year ever for all years of recruiting last year, yet his team is 3-6 for this year. Collins actually increased the quality of recruits to a degree but did not know how to use them.

in jimbo’s case you often don’t see the fruits of the touted recruiting class until a year or 2 in. at the end of the day even if guys are phenomenal athletes in high school they are still freshman and probably need 10-20 pounds added on, need to get a little stronger and have to acclimate to a faster game.

if jimbo stays and the class doesn’t hit the portal it wouldn’t surprise me if suddenly the team is just great and everyone acts like jimbo changed a million things to turn it around

 

[Ibeeballin]

The most important part of CFB

 

[EE95_curse EMAG!]

To be clear, the folks who dinged UGA on recruiting were mostly UGA fans who complained about their inability to win the big game and also beat Bama which often stood in their way. The feeling was that they needed another bump up in recruiting to go from winning 10 games a season to winning championships. I don’t have the detailed stats, but the general feeling was their primary weaknesses were in OL/DL. Bear in mind we’re talking about going from 4 stars to five stars.

I was only able to go back to 2010 when I looked at 247 composite rankings history, but Richt’s classes were 11, 7, 9, 12, 8, and 6. No top 5’s. Smart’s have been ranked 6, 3, 1, 2, 1, 4, and 3. That’s a significant improvement considering the rarified air that they already were in.

I’m not arguing that Smart isn’t a better game-day coach than Richt, but considering he has measurably improved recruiting and also gotten an even greater commitment from the school in terms of staff salaries, etc., he has done more with more. Most years his O-lines and D-lines have generally been regarded as top five or even top 1-3.

All this just circles back to the original point I was responding to, which was that having the appropriate recruiting focus on positions of need was more important than simply looking at class rank.

Agreed that Kirby improved recruiting, but Richt was a good recruiter that kept pace with all the prior coaches and even improved on them. The difference between ranked 5th and 10th is maybe one less 4-star player (3 star instead). Kirby is a Saban-esque god, so comparing Richt to Kirby is a bit heavy-handed.

Again, no one I know complained about recruiting under Richt. What they complained about was running the ball when they should be passing, passing when they should be running, trick plays when they should be bulldozing, bubble screens for lost yardage, playing prevent defense when blitzing has owned the opposing team all game, etc. Richt had no feel for game flow or exploiting teams weanesses.

Now, if Richt were to be hired after Kirby and had those recruiting classes, then yeah, they would THEN complain about recruiting (the next UGA coach will have that issue no matter how well they recruit).

 

[JacketOff]

Agreed that Kirby improved recruiting, but Richt was a good recruiter that kept pace with all the prior coaches and even improved on them. The difference between ranked 5th and 10th is maybe one less 4-star player (3 star instead). Kirby is a Saban-esque god, so comparing Richt to Kirby is a bit heavy-handed.

Again, no one I know complained about recruiting under Richt. What they complained about was running the ball when they should be passing, passing when they should be running, trick plays when they should be bulldozing, bubble screens for lost yardage, playing prevent defense when blitzing has owned the opposing team all game, etc. Richt had no feel for game flow or exploiting teams weanesses.

Now, if Richt were to be hired after Kirby and had those recruiting classes, then yeah, they would THEN complain about recruiting (the next UGA coach will have that issue no matter how well they recruit).

I think most of this entire comment is just a bunch of hooplah.

Kirby is a good coach, his teams play with discipline and rarely make boneheaded mistakes. But the reason UGA went from being a pretender to a powerhouse has almost nothing to do with his coaching abilities, and everything to do with UGA’s spending on football skyrocketing. If Richt had been given the resources Kirby has, he would’ve played for and won Nattys too.

UGA was tired of not getting the job done, so they pulled all the stops and committed fully to becoming the best college football program in the country. Seems like it’s working out well for them. At this point, as long as college football exists in its current state, UGA will continue to be the best program in the country. There are only 2 schools in the country who I think maybe, maybe, can get to their level. That’s USC and Texas, and neither one of them are close to that right now. But there’s enough money and talent in both of those places that if they ever get it figured out again, they could be dangerous.

Ironically as UGA’s football spending was skyrocketing, Tech’s was shrinking. That’s how we ended up where we are today. With UGA at the top of the pyramid, and Tech buried in the tomb beneath it.

 

[roadkill]

Agreed that Kirby improved recruiting, but Richt was a good recruiter that kept pace with all the prior coaches and even improved on them. The difference between ranked 5th and 10th is maybe one less 4-star player (3 star instead). Kirby is a Saban-esque god, so comparing Richt to Kirby is a bit heavy-handed.

Again, no one I know complained about recruiting under Richt. What they complained about was running the ball when they should be passing, passing when they should be running, trick plays when they should be bulldozing, bubble screens for lost yardage, playing prevent defense when blitzing has owned the opposing team all game, etc. Richt had no feel for game flow or exploiting teams weanesses.

Now, if Richt were to be hired after Kirby and had those recruiting classes, then yeah, they would THEN complain about recruiting (the next UGA coach will have that issue no matter how well they recruit).

Since this thread is about recruiting impact and your posts minimized it as a difference-maker in UGA’s recent improvement, I feel it’s worthwhile to look deeper since we have actual data to support the discussion.

Previous posters have given us the Rivals average recruiting rankings for Richt. I computed this for Smart as well and compared his 7-year tenure with Richt’s most recent 7-years (which is most relevant since that includes the period when I saw the complaints over his recruiting).

Richt Ave Rank: 9 (source is wrmathis post above)

Smart Ave Rank: 3.3

Since your comments also minimized the difference in the count of highly ranked players between a five and ten ranking, I compared that as well, again using Rivals.

	Smart	Smart	Richt	Richt
	5*	4*	5*	4*
2022	5	16
2021	2	13
2020	5	14
2019	3	15
2018	8	15
2017	2	14
2016	3	10
2015			2	11
2014			1	12
2013			0	16
2012			2	6
2011			2	12
2010			0	9
2009			1	14
Ave	4.0	13.9	1.1	11.4

Overall, Smart has averaged nearly 3 additional 5-stars per year and 2.5 additional 4-stars. In the context of Richt’s baseline of 1.1 5-stars per year, that is a very significant improvement in elite players on the team.

Again, not arguing who is the best game-day coach. As others have said, UGA’s improvement has as much to do with the overall commitment level of the school as anything else. But my point here is that Smart's recruiting improvement is a significant component and the raw data supports that. My other original point was that recruiting at positions of most need, such as OL/DL, is an equally important aspect of recruiting.