CPJ interview - Nov 11

[Augusta_Jacket]

Missed assignments were always players fault never inferior coaching or scheme.

What's false about this statement? It would seem that a missed assignment is the very definition of the players fault. I mean, no coach teaches the OL to not block defenders, and you can't possibly judge that the play/scheme was doomed to fail when a missed assignment never gave it a chance to begin with.

More to your point, both coaches have certain styles of communicating that are off-putting to some in the fan base. Neither style is wrong, per se, but rather each is simply a reflection of the style of coach we hired. CGC will approach GT Football in a very different manner than CPJ, and that's ok. Hopefully he can replicate the successes of the CPJ era and limit the losing seasons. Time will tell what we have in CGC, and no amount of fan projection, good or bad, is going to change the future outcome.

 

[jgtengineer]

It's interesting - we were something like 25th defensively in 2008 and it just went downhill from there. Was that due to not getting another Michael Johnson/Derrick Morgan on campus? Practicing against the Option? Lack of recruiting due to the option or PJ? Bad scheming? Poor D coaching? Who knows - I just hope we're able to get it fixed. We didn't appear to be any better in year 1 of CGC. Hopefully we'll look back at 2019 as 'bottoming out'.

I hate to say this but i think it was due to three little letters that made it even harder to get those guys on campus. APR. You have to remember spread offenses weren't a big thing yet in 08 most people were still firing off the ball and hitting people and running out of the I or singleback (the FSU Singleback was really common and the blocking schemes weren't really that different) so until about 2011-2012 i'd say the negative recruiting of the option wasn't there. This is also around the time that the spread was the new hotness, the NFL was starting to incorporate some elements of it in their offenses and offensive holding was legalized for the most part.

The NFL arguments couldn't really be used against us yet either at this time because so far we had sent DL and backers to the nfl every year up until then and al groh getting hired should have continued that level of recruiting. The guy had a superbowl ring. So I think it has more to due with the supply. You have to remember we recruited several 4 stars that just didn't pan out during the 2010-2015 classes. Francis Kallon comes to mind on paper he had all the tools to be a Michael Johnson type player and just never really put it together as an example. CPJ didn't process people out often so a miss on a 4 star was a big hit to us we also did land TK with the old staff.

The truth is that the true NFL style DL that are required to run 3-4 and 4-3 base defenses are rather rare and get hoovered up by the alabama's and SEC schools often. Even Clemson recruits a slightly different type of DL (emphasizing speed above all else, they now get speed and size but venerbles will take speed over size any day) which is why the Gary patterson 4-1-6 (he calls it a 4-2-5 but usually TCU linebackers are in teh 220 range so its really like a 4-0-7 with ss's rolling into linebacker slots) or the 3-3-5 defense exists. Not only are these defenses good at nullifying the spread advantage of speed. They do run fills by blitzing on run downs in exotic packages which has the habit of blowing up play action/screens. and forcing turnovers. Ellis Johnson was a huge 3-3-5 guy at SCAR even with Clowney. Womack tried to do a little of that in 08 (we'd often start in a 4-3 base and go to 3-3-5 after the half) the problem was he wasn't very good at the 3-3-5 bit because that really requires a secondary guru to work out soe you don't end up with huge gaps in coverage.

I'll add that best on best really isn't all that common and in spring everyone works on themselves and maybe a little bit for other teams. We also did not have a ton of injuries in practice to DL so i guess that's another one for the cut blocks aren't that bad arguement. You know we did have one thing in 08 we didn't have any other time and that was a Senior running the scout team as a pro style QB in Booker. He only practiced liek 3 plays of our real offense. Makes me wonder if CPJ shouldn't have recruited a prostyle QB to be the scout QB with full disclosure that was what he was doing and maybe that would have helped our secondary.

 

[ElCidBUZZingFAN]

I wish they would interview him again and ask him how it was possible to leave tech in a worse spot when he left then it was when he got here.

That's stupid. 2 OBs for the first time in 50 years, 1 ACC championship first in 30 years, multiple ACC-CG appearances, etc.

I bet those very recent facts, trophies, and stories are a central part of the CGC sales pitch when he gets kids on campus and shows them the bells and whistles.


"We're not some wanna be championship level school. We can achieve at the highest levels of this sport here."

Is it only a Tech fan thing to take a dump on your own school's past achievements? Good Lord. This fanbase sucks sometimes.

 

[ScGold]

Hey I get that you feel the need to tear down our previous coach in order to build up our current one. CGC doesn't have the resume and doesn't (yet) seem to have the in-game coaching chops we were really hoping for. And there are reasonable criticisms to be had. No one disputes that CPJ never managed to field a consistent defense to go along with his top notch offense.
You don't have to wholesale make things up though. That is not a good look for you, or by proxy CGC...

I don't have to tear him. His numbers do it for me.

 

[ScGold]

That's stupid. 2 OBs for the first time in 50 years, 1 ACC championship first in 30 years, multiple ACC-CG appearances, etc.

I bet those very recent facts, trophies, and stories are a central part of the CGC sales pitch when he gets kids on campus and shows them the bells and whistles.


"We're not some wanna be championship level school. We can achieve at the highest levels of this sport here."

Is it only a Tech fan thing to take a dump on your own school's past achievements? Good Lord. This fanbase sucks sometimes.

Josh Nesbit vs our current roster? JD VS our current roster? 08 D vs 19 D LOL REALLY. Not only did he back into that roster, he didnt build on it! 08 had NFL talent at important positions. That cant be said about last years roster.

 

[ElCidBUZZingFAN]

Josh Nesbit vs our current roster? JD VS our current roster? 08 D vs 19 D LOL REALLY. Not only did he back into that roster, he didnt build on it! 08 had NFL talent at important positions. That cant be said about last years roster.

Do you think it's easier or harder for CGC to recruit to his main message of "come here and make special happen in the ATL" with or without those achievements within the past 10+ years?

What if he was trying to tell that story about getting back to success from the 1960s or decades before any of these kids were even born?

 

[ScGold]

I don't think I would ever be confused with the last coach. Almost positive.

What would you be confused with. I gave a couple of guesses. You walked into that one. Couldn't help it. Too easy.

 

[buzzmaniac]

Do you think it's easier or harder for CGC to recruit to his main message of "come here and make special happen in the ATL" with or without those achievements within the past 10+ years?

What if he was trying to tell that story about getting back to success from the 1960s or decades before any of these kids were even born?

My interpretation is the coach before CPJ could only achieve a 7-6 record with what Johnson inherited, while CPJ achieved the same record his final year with less talent.

 

[ElCidBUZZingFAN]

My interpretation is the coach before CPJ could only achieve a 7-6 record with what Johnson inherited, while CPJ achieved the same record his final year with less talent.

According to some of these dudes' logic, Bobby friggin Bowden left FSU only slightly better than he found it since he walked into a 5 win team and left a 7 win team behind.

Tech fans are some of the most miserable SOBs on the friggin planet.

 

[Deleted member 2897]

According to some of these dudes' logic, Bobby friggin Bowden left FSU only slightly better than he found it since he walked into a 5 win team and left a 7 win team behind.

Tech fans are some of the most miserable SOBs on the friggin planet.

SOME Tech fans are. Just go look on Facebook and Instagram on gameday when Georgia Tech posts videos and pictures about that its game day or at yellow jacket walk. Supposed Tech fans spew diarrhea all over it about how much we suck and everything else. The people who do that are miserable SOBs.

 

[ScGold]

Do you think it's easier or harder for CGC to recruit to his main message of "come here and make special happen in the ATL" with or without those achievements within the past 10+ years?

What if he was trying to tell that story about getting back to success from the 1960s or decades before any of these kids were even born?

Hes already debunked one myth that recruiting cant be done at a higher level. I have no doubt the defense will be a top 30 defense next year. Every recruit that has been interviewed after visiting with this staff came away saying great things. Almost giving a backhanded slap at the old staff. That's not me saying this. These are the PLAYERS saying this. Whether I like or not doesn't matter. I'm not playing for him. From the short time hes been here the ones that count are buying in to what hes selling. If you can't support that, then ur really a Johnson man and not a Tech man.

 

[ScGold]

My interpretation is the coach before CPJ could only achieve a 7-6 record with what Johnson inherited, while CPJ achieved the same record his final year with less talent.

Didnt paul end up with same winning percentage as his predecessor? What ur saying Gomer and paul are 7-6 coaches at the end of the day?

 

[Jim Prather]

Hes already debunked one myth that recruiting cant be done at a higher level. I have no doubt the defense will be a top 30 defense next year. Every recruit that has been interviewed after visiting with this staff came away saying great things. Almost giving a backhanded slap at the old staff. That's not me saying this. These are the PLAYERS saying this. Whether I like or not doesn't matter. I'm not playing for him. From the short time hes been here the ones that count are buying in to what hes selling. If you can't support that, then ur really a Johnson man and not a Tech man.

And here we have a classic example of an ad-hominem attack... "You can't be a Tech man if you don't agree with me so we should all disregard what you say" There is actually a very easy argument to counteract what he has said, but I leave it for you to see if you can figure it out.

 

[SteamWhistle]

That's stupid. 2 OBs for the first time in 50 years, 1 ACC championship first in 30 years, multiple ACC-CG appearances, etc.

I bet those very recent facts, trophies, and stories are a central part of the CGC sales pitch when he gets kids on campus and shows them the bells and whistles.


"We're not some wanna be championship level school. We can achieve at the highest levels of this sport here."

Is it only a Tech fan thing to take a dump on your own school's past achievements? Good Lord. This fanbase sucks sometimes.

So the team he left Collins is an orange bowl team? How can you fail to interpret what I was saying. Tech was is worse in 2019 then they were in 2007.

 

[Jim Prather]

Didnt paul end up with same winning percentage as his predecessor? What ur saying Gomer and paul are 7-6 coaches at the end of the day?

And here we have the fallacy of False equivalence - I am still waiting for a well reasoned argument from someone...

 

[ElCidBUZZingFAN]

So the team he left Collins is an orange bowl team? How can you fail to interpret what I was saying. Tech was is worse in 2019 then they were in 2007.

Again...your logic is dumb.

According to some of these dudes' logic, Bobby friggin Bowden left FSU only slightly better than he found it since he walked into a 5 win team and left a 7 win team behind.

Tech fans are some of the most miserable SOBs on the friggin planet.

 

[Jim Prather]

Again...your logic is dumb.

OK - your turn to get picked on Don't just say his logic is dumb.. Explain why it is dumb... For example: CPJ inherited a 7-6 team which lost its bowl game, and won 9 games the next year... CGC inherited a 7-6 team which lost its bowl game and won 3 games the next year.
Of course the next response will be ... but, but, but NFL players... At this point, there are several different arguments which can be made, but none of them are especially rigorous... I will leave that up to you

 

[smokey_wasp]

Again...your logic is dumb.

I think it would be fair to say he left the program in the same position he found it, record-wise, but a worse position than he found it, talent wise. In the meantime, he had a couple of impressive seasons. This needn't be controversial to either side of the debate.

 

[ElCidBUZZingFAN]

OK - your turn to get picked on Don't just say his logic is dumb.. Explain why it is dumb... CPJ inherited a 7-6 team which lost its bowl game, and won 9 games the next year... CGC inherited a 7-6 team which lost its bowl game and won 3 games the next year.
Of course the next response will be ... but, but, but NFL players... At this point, there are several different arguments which can be made, but none of them are especially rigorous... I will leave that up to you

The Bobby Bowden analogy explains my point. You don't just look at the beginning and the end point and then completely ignore what happened between them when assessing whether a coach elevated a program.

I think it would be fair to say he left the program in the same position he found it, record-wise, but a worse position than he found it, talent wise. In the meantime, he had a couple of impressive seasons. This needn't be controversial to either side of the debate.

You mean to tell me CGC doesn't use that recent history to tell his story of what this program can be? Of course, he does. It's such an easier sell to do so than if he had to go the route of - I'm building on a dream that you can't actually touch, feel, or see for yourself. But, trust me anyway.

For example, which is more powerful to kids as to what Collins envisions for this program - the Orange Bowl trophy from 2014 or the Sugar Bowl trophy from 1956? Because, as far as big name bowl wins, that's the gap in our trophy case. Speaking about the '09 ACC title or the '90 or '98 ("shared") one? Competing for 4 ACC titles in the past 10 years or competing for 2 ('06/'90) in the past 20 years before that? How about clips of BDS at night with it rocking and thumping Top 5 teams? CGC likes telling those stories, right? Well, since we beat 2 Top5 teams at home in the last 10 years and it was something like 40 years since that happened, there's another chapter to our recent past.

The story of our program has been made stronger over the past 10 years. The fact that's even a debate is sad.

 

[Jim Prather]

Better argument - bravo!