Conference Realignment

[4shotB]

FSU has been rumored to the B1G for years now. If you look at what they're doing academically, it gives life to the rumors: B1G told FSU that their market and brand were attractive, but it would be hard to get the B1G Presidents to approve of the move because their academics did not align with the rest of the B1G. Lo and behold, FSU has been working hard to improve their academics and are setting up to apply to become an member of AAU.

Wow....the tail is wagging the dog in a positive manner it appears. It reminds me of the long ago quote from the president of Oklahoma, who said "he wanted to build a school that the football team can be proud of" back sometime in the 50's. history does indeed repeat itself.

 

[Techster]

Wow....the tail is wagging the dog in a positive manner it appears. It reminds me of the long ago quote from the president of Oklahoma, who said "he wanted to build a school that the football team can be proud of" back sometime in the 50's. history does indeed repeat itself.

I think in this case it's a win-win. FSU is doing something that will improve their brand academically, while positioning themselves to massively enrich their sports program. If anything, it's showing how academics and athletics can have a beneficial symbiotic relationship.

FWIW, I think GT is starting to see that as well. It all has to do with leadership. GT's President is looking like he's seeing the ENTIRE picture, unlike some past leaders.

 

[TooTall]

I personally don't think the GOR is a bad thing. It's the horrible deal with E$PN that is holding us back. If we can add ND to the conference full time, or any other school, wouldn't that require the contracts be redone and then they can be brought up to par with the other 2?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

So, 12 schools are required to change the bylaws and get out of the GOR. Yeah, it's hard to imagine 12 schools wanting to do that, which would mean they would all have a guaranteed landing place in a better conference. The ACC isn't going anywhere for a while, and we should be thankful for that. Hopefully, as 2036 approaches and time draws nigh, we'll be better positioned to land in the B1G.

The bolded part especially...

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

I personally don't think the GOR is a bad thing. It's the horrible deal with E$PN that is holding us back. If we can add ND to the conference full time, or any other school, wouldn't that require the contracts be redone and then they can be brought up to par with the other 2?

Yes and no. Addition of ND would get us very close to par, but is unlikely atm. Addition of other schools would trigger a renegotiation, but there aren't enough schools of high TV value left, outside of ND, that can truly get us to financially par with the big dogs. It would, however, get us a lot closer.

 

[stinger 1957]

Lots of reference in that GoR to "the ESPN Agreement", I wonder what exactly the terms of that agreement are. E.g. are there tricks open to ESPN to initiate a dissolution of that agreement, and would that then eliminate yielding the rights as necessary to "perform the contractual obligations of the conference"?

But I still think then nuclear scenario of "there's just not an ACC anymore" is more likely than some sort of lawyerball around the GOR, unless dissolving the conference is basically impossible in the bylaws. E.g. could Wake Forest, say, force everyone else to stick around even if the vote to stay together was only them?

Your second para I'm guessing you're right, dissolution is the route that will be taken rather than something around the GOR. Regarding ESPN they have said they want their investment back in the ACC network, saw that sometime back. If the schools can all come together and work this out that obviously works the best.

 

[Richard7125]

Your second para I'm guessing you're right, dissolution is the route that will be taken rather than something around the GOR. Regarding ESPN they have said they want their investment back in the ACC network, saw that sometime back. If the schools can all come together and work this out that obviously works the best.

Hmmm. I wonder if the Big12 will still be around if either Texas or Oklahoma left. I wonder if the Pac12 will still be around if USC or UCLA ever left.

 

[tmhunter52]

To any of you bankruptcy lawyers out there, could the GTAA file a Chapter 11 petition to reorganize, withdraw from the ACC and shed its obligations under the GOR?

 

[Augusta_Jacket]

To any of you bankruptcy lawyers out there, could the GTAA file a Chapter 11 petition to reorganize, withdraw from the ACC and shed its obligations under the GOR?

No.

I'm not a bankruptcy lawyer, but this question has an obvious answer. Chapter 11 has to be settled in the best interests of the creditors, to which we would have to assume the ACC would be considered a creditor. It is not in the ACC's best interests for a team to leave.

 

[RonJohn]

To any of you bankruptcy lawyers out there, could the GTAA file a Chapter 11 petition to reorganize, withdraw from the ACC and shed its obligations under the GOR?

Also not a bankruptcy lawyer (or any kind of lawyer). Bankruptcy is set up to allow companies or people either default and go under, or reorganize and make a reasonable effort to pay off debts. The GOR is not a debt. It is an assignment of an asset to another entity. I believe bankruptcy usually allows you to shed obligations that you owe to other people. I don't see how any part of a bankruptcy would allow an entity to claw back assets that it already assigned to other entities.

As an analogy: If someone buys a car on a loan, bankruptcy could allow them to keep the car and not repay the loan. (depending on exceptions the creditor debtor is allowed to keep) However, if you sold a car for cash, bankruptcy would not allow you to retake the car and keep the cash. GT does not own the media rights for sports programming until after 2036. Even if the GTAA successfully filed for bankruptcy to avoid paying the buyout fee for the conference, it would not be able to retrieve assets that it already paid or assigned to other parties.

EDITED: with strikethrough for a mistake.

 

[stinger 1957]

Hmmm. I wonder if the Big12 will still be around if either Texas or Oklahoma left. I wonder if the Pac12 will still be around if USC or UCLA ever left.

I'm not sure what you are driving at with this, but if 8 teams have places to go and vote to dissolve the ACC then I have to assume yes the ACC folds. There is no GOR cost/penalty if the conference dissolves, but again I'm not sure what you are trying to say.

 

[cpf2001]

Hmmm. I wonder if the Big12 will still be around if either Texas or Oklahoma left. I wonder if the Pac12 will still be around if USC or UCLA ever left.

Texas/OU and USC/UCLA didn't have crazy long GORs to worry about. That's where the GOR helps a school like GT. Clemson/FSU want out of the ACC? Gotta finagle some back-room dealings to make it worth their while for most of the other schools too. So if anything happens to the ACC, it'll all happen at once. So GT can't leave on its own, but it also can't get left behind by just a couple of others.

 

[RonJohn]

I'm not sure what you are driving at with this, but if 8 teams have places to go and vote to dissolve the ACC then I have to assume yes the ACC folds. There is no GOR cost/penalty if the conference dissolves, but again I'm not sure what you are trying to say.

Where do you get that 8 teams can dissolve the ACC?

 

[Richard7125]

I'm not sure what you are driving at with this, but if 8 teams have places to go and vote to dissolve the ACC then I have to assume yes the ACC folds. There is no GOR cost/penalty if the conference dissolves, but again I'm not sure what you are trying to say.

Where do you think 8 teams would go? Certainly not the SEC and Big10.

 

[stinger 1957]

I think in this case it's a win-win. FSU is doing something that will improve their brand academically, while positioning themselves to massively enrich their sports program. If anything, it's showing how academics and athletics can have a beneficial symbiotic relationship.

FWIW, I think GT is starting to see that as well. It all has to do with leadership. GT's President is looking like he's seeing the ENTIRE picture, unlike some past leaders.

I think you're right but maybe even bigger motivation is what the Big schools do with their research grants. Seems, according to the Ohio State Pres, that the Big Schools share and work with each other in their research projects and grants and that is bigtime motivation to the people working in Academia. $ in the faculty pockets. As they say, money talks.

 

[stinger 1957]

Where do you think 8 teams would go? Certainly not the SEC and Big10.

Where have you been, all of this has been discussed for a while now, you must have just dropped in. So I'm not going to go through it all.

 

[forensicbuzz]

Looking at the GOR, Wake would own the broadcast and media rights of all of the teams that left. Wake would not get any revenue that the other teams were able to get from a new conference. However, those schools would not own the media and broadcast rights to their games, so they wouldn't bring new income to the new conference.

If 15 of the 16 teams decided to leave, it would probably happen by disbanding the conference which would likely invalidate some of the requirements of the GOR. ESPN would have to be on board with it, and at least 12 of the teams would have to vote to change the bylaws.

Just my opinion, I don't see anything happening until sometime close to 2036. Maybe a group of 3 super conferences is made. To make a change to the ACC, you would need ESPN and at least 12 members agreeing. The SEC doesn't have room for 12 new members, and ESPN isn't going to vote to strengthen the Big 10. The 2016 ACC GOR was implemented precisely to ensure that ACC teams were not picked away by other conferences. It is doing exactly what all of the ACC members intended for it to do when they signed it.

I highly doubt the ESPN contract is as iron-clad as the GOR contract. Contracts are meant to be broken; I'm sure a team of really good lawyers could figure out how to get the ACC out of the ESPN deal well prior to 2036. It's the GOR that is the sticking point. ESPN does not have the leverage nor the cash to control college athletics like they did 8-10 years ago.

 

[bhoffman123]

How real is this discussion? Is this likely, imminent, or just a thought exercise? I haven't seen anything near this substantial of a discussion in other channels. Whats driving it?

 

[UgaBlows]

I highly doubt the ESPN contract is as iron-clad as the GOR contract. Contracts are meant to be broken; I'm sure a team of really good lawyers could figure out how to get the ACC out of the ESPN deal well prior to 2036. It's the GOR that is the sticking point. ESPN does not have the leverage nor the cash to control college athletics like they did 8-10 years ago.

The premature breakup of the ACC only happens if ESPN and Fox want it to happen- they will be the behind the scenes architects. Currently the ACC is a bargain for espn, but maybe the money gap continually makes the product worse until the viewership numbers tank?

 

[UgaBlows]

How real is this discussion? Is this likely, imminent, or just a thought exercise? I haven't seen anything near this substantial of a discussion in other channels. Whats driving it?

It’s the offseason...