Conference Realignment

[stinger78]

TFG deserves credit for trying to rebrand GT as "Atlanta's team", which makes sense if you're trying to grow the fanbase and market size. One little problem was that people want to be associated with a winner, and we didn't deliver. Now we have to overcome several years of "ugly football" as @slugboy stated.

I still believe that we can garner some decent incremental fanbase growth if we continue to promote the team locally while sustaining 7 to 10 wins a season and frequently getting ranked. We need to be viewed as at least a competitor to some of the more elite teams, even if not elite ourselves. The only time we've been able to do that consistently (more than 2 years in a row) since the Dodd teams of the 50's was with the O'Leary run. Hopefully Key is the right coach for this.

Yeah, you know, I do get that, but I was always a bit skeptical. GA Tech is just not the type of place that will appeal to a broad group of people. I do think that we could have a broader local appeal, particularly to the highly educated transplants - even as a second team. I have a hard time believing that the generational southerners (some might call them rednecks, but I don't think that's necessarily correct) might suddenly become fans of GA Tech. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my feeling on the matter, FWIW. Again, I do think that we can broaden our local support as there are many who are not generational southerners now in the ATL area.

 

[roadkill]

Yeah, you know, I do get that, but I was always a bit skeptical. GA Tech is just not the type of place that will appeal to a broad group of people. I do think that we could have a broader local appeal, particularly to the highly educated transplants - even as a second team. I have a hard time believing that the generational southerners (some might call them rednecks, but I don't think that's necessarily correct) might suddenly become fans of GA Tech. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my feeling on the matter, FWIW. Again, I do think that we can broaden our local support as there are many who are not generational southerners now in the ATL area.

That was my thinking as well. Thus the Atlanta connection, not the entire state. I think there are a lot of non-Atlantan Georgians who are not only default uga fans, but view GT as elitist. That's very difficult to overcome.

 

[forensicbuzz]

I agree with you. The problem is viewership. And that’s why we don’t often get featured. Vandy has the same problem.

A 4-4 LSU team vs a 6-3 TAMU team will always out pull an 8-0 Vandy or Tech team. Market size and enthusiasm matters.

This is only true if we're playing a VMI or a weak Wake Forest/Duke. If we're 8-0 playing any of those teams I put in parentheses above, we'll be playing ahead of a 4-4 LSU team. Your SEC bias is showing again.

 

[Vespidae]

That was my thinking as well. Thus the Atlanta connection, not the entire state. I think there are a lot of non-Atlantan Georgians who are not only default uga fans, but view GT as elitist. That's very difficult to overcome.

To be fair, this was true 75 years ago.

 

[Vespidae]

This is only true if we're playing a VMI or a weak Wake Forest/Duke. If we're 8-0 playing any of those teams I put in parentheses above, we'll be playing ahead of a 4-4 LSU team. Your SEC bias is showing again.

No. I simply checked the viewership data. I notice you never include any. I wonder why?

 

[RamblinRed]

Interview with Brett McMurphy on a B12 station about FSU and Clemson.
He basically says neither the SEC or B1G are interested in either - especially FSU. Says that 100% of the B1G people he has talked to, don't want FSU. SEC only wants schools in new contiguous states.
He also mentions that there isn't really much more money available for college athletic content. It has mostly been spent.
They ask him about FSU and B12. He says that FSU has no interest in B12 - has always been looking at the P2. Also said he did not think FSU (and potentially Clemson) going to B12 would significantly increase the B12 media package. Might be worth a few million dollars more, but wouldn't come close to getting them to P2 level.

He says that neither the SEC or B1G is interested in expanding right now.



While he never explicitly says it, it feels clear that as long as UNC and UVA want the ACC to survive it is likely to survive. They are the schools that the P2 would likely be most interested in at a future date.

 

[Northeast Stinger]

Interview with Brett McMurphy on a B12 station about FSU and Clemson.
He basically says neither the SEC or B1G are interested in either - especially FSU. Says that 100% of the B1G people he has talked to, don't want FSU. SEC only wants schools in new contiguous states.
He also mentions that there isn't really much more money available for college athletic content. It has mostly been spent.
They ask him about FSU and B12. He says that FSU has no interest in B12 - has always been looking at the P2. Also said he did not think FSU (and potentially Clemson) going to B12 would significantly increase the B12 media package. Might be worth a few million dollars more, but wouldn't come close to getting them to P2 level.

He says that neither the SEC or B1G is interested in expanding right now.



While he never explicitly says it, it feels clear that as long as UNC and UVA want the ACC to survive it is likely to survive. They are the schools that the P2 would likely be most interested in at a future date.

Obvious now that you point it out but FSU going to the P2 would be far more lucrative. A real jujitsu move.

 

[RonJohn]

Interview with Brett McMurphy on a B12 station about FSU and Clemson.
He basically says neither the SEC or B1G are interested in either - especially FSU. Says that 100% of the B1G people he has talked to, don't want FSU. SEC only wants schools in new contiguous states.
He also mentions that there isn't really much more money available for college athletic content. It has mostly been spent.
They ask him about FSU and B12. He says that FSU has no interest in B12 - has always been looking at the P2. Also said he did not think FSU (and potentially Clemson) going to B12 would significantly increase the B12 media package. Might be worth a few million dollars more, but wouldn't come close to getting them to P2 level.

He says that neither the SEC or B1G is interested in expanding right now.



While he never explicitly says it, it feels clear that as long as UNC and UVA want the ACC to survive it is likely to survive. They are the schools that the P2 would likely be most interested in at a future date.

Another thing he said was kind of funny. He said that there have been several teams that have changed conferences, and many teams that have moved from G5 conferences to P4 conferences. He then said, "There is a right way to do it, and there is the way FSU is doing it."

 

[roadkill]

To be fair, this was true 75 years ago.

Yes. I don't hold out hope that we can ever return to the 1950s when GT was the hottest ticket in town. But aside from our own alums, Atlantans are the most accessible target for expanding our fanbase. It's not uncommon even for transplants who already have a favorite team to adopt the local team as their second favorite.

 

[orientalnc]

 

[RonJohn]

Just my opinion: A breakaway is inevitable. The NCAA is trying to placate to prevent it, but at best will only end up delaying it. There will be a completely separate association of 60-80 schools. Whether that is football only, or if all of the other sports break away also is the big question.

 

[orientalnc]

Just my opinion: A breakaway is inevitable. The NCAA is trying to placate to prevent it, but at best will only end up delaying it. There will be a completely separate association of 60-80 schools. Whether that is football only, or if all of the other sports break away also is the big question.

I understand your point, but UConn will be in whatever becomes the top basketball structure. Same with Gonzaga.

 

[roadkill]

I agree with you. The problem is viewership. And that’s why we don’t often get featured. Vandy has the same problem.

A 4-4 LSU team vs a 6-3 TAMU team will always out pull an 8-0 Vandy or Tech team. Market size and enthusiasm matters.

I'm not questioning your conclusion, but I would appreciate a link to the data. Apologies if you've posted it previously.

 

[RonJohn]

I understand your point, but UConn will be in whatever becomes the top basketball structure. Same with Gonzaga.

Which goes to my "big question". I think it is possible that in ten years that the top 60-80 schools conduct football outside of the NCAA, but other sports inside the NCAA. It is also possible that they completely break away. If the top teams completely break away the NCAA tournament would take a large hit because the most popular schools would no longer participate in the top revenue of the NCAA. I think the NCAA would push hard to keep as much inside the NCAA as possible, even if it means losing football completely from the P4. I don't think basketball would be enough to get UConn and Gonzaga in the big conference.

 

[roadkill]

Just my opinion: A breakaway is inevitable. The NCAA is trying to placate to prevent it, but at best will only end up delaying it. There will be a completely separate association of 60-80 schools. Whether that is football only, or if all of the other sports break away also is the big question.

I understand your point, but UConn will be in whatever becomes the top basketball structure. Same with Gonzaga.

I don't think NCAA MBB has as many urgent reasons for a new governance structure as does P4 football. They have some, and may get a new structure, but that's not what seems to be getting the attention lately.

 

[WreckinGT]

Interview with Brett McMurphy on a B12 station about FSU and Clemson.
He basically says neither the SEC or B1G are interested in either - especially FSU. Says that 100% of the B1G people he has talked to, don't want FSU. SEC only wants schools in new contiguous states.
He also mentions that there isn't really much more money available for college athletic content. It has mostly been spent.
They ask him about FSU and B12. He says that FSU has no interest in B12 - has always been looking at the P2. Also said he did not think FSU (and potentially Clemson) going to B12 would significantly increase the B12 media package. Might be worth a few million dollars more, but wouldn't come close to getting them to P2 level.

He says that neither the SEC or B1G is interested in expanding right now.



While he never explicitly says it, it feels clear that as long as UNC and UVA want the ACC to survive it is likely to survive. They are the schools that the P2 would likely be most interested in at a future date.

From an article by Dennis Dodd on August of 2022:

After the anxiety caused last week regarding further Big Ten expansion, industry sources have indicated the Big Ten is no longer as interested in adding California, Oregon, Stanford and Washington.

I trust in the reporting by industry guys like Dodd and McMurphy, but I think sometimes they are used as well.

 

[roadkill]

Just my opinion: A breakaway is inevitable. The NCAA is trying to placate to prevent it, but at best will only end up delaying it. There will be a completely separate association of 60-80 schools. Whether that is football only, or if all of the other sports break away also is the big question.

I understand your point, but UConn will be in whatever becomes the top basketball structure. Same with Gonzaga.

I don't think NCAA MBB has as many urgent reasons for a new governance structure as does P4 football. They have some, and may get a new structure, but that's not what seems to be getting the attention lately. Separate governance just for football has been proposed for a number of years, going back at least to the Knight Commission's 2020 recommendation.

 

[RonJohn]

From an article by Dennis Dodd on August of 2022:

I trust in the reporting by industry guys like Dodd and McMurphy, but I think sometimes they are used as well.

There is a difference in those kinds of discussions and the discussions about FSU. McMurphy says that 100% of people he has talked to (University presidents, athletic directors, Big10 officials), do not want to add FSU. That isn't a -- we are not planning further expansion at this point -- kind of statement. It is a -- FSU is extremely non-attractive kind of statement. I saw a Josh Pate video in which he said that he talked to a Big10 president who told him flat out that FSU will not be joining the Big10. Another interesting thing that Pate said is that fans see viewership and matchups as the ONLY thing to drive conference expansion. An example he gave was FSU to the SEC so people can see matchups like FSU-Oklahoma. He said that the "suits" in the offices don't care about that like the fans do. They have an entirely different set of criteria that fans have no interest in.

 

[T-Bone Burdell]

While he never explicitly says it, it feels clear that as long as UNC and UVA want the ACC to survive it is likely to survive. They are the schools that the P2 would likely be most interested in at a future date.

I've seen uva mentioned more than once as some sort of desirable linchpin.
What am I missing about uva that makes them so attractive in re: to sports?

 

[MWBATL]

They have an entirely different set of criteria that fans have no interest in.

Did he elaborate on their criteria?